GUILTY CA - Erin Corwin, 19, pregnant, Twentynine Palms, 28 June 2014 - #11

[maskedwoman]

BBM I want to agree with you, I really do! But I remember going on a date one time with a guy I was a little bit iffy about already. Now that I've got more life experience and maturity I realize I NEVER EVER should have gotten into the car with him, but I did. What could it hurt, right? (yeah... naive!) 5 minutes later I was wishing I had told someone where we were going. 10 minutes later when he was hitting the dashboard of his car and yelling at me because I couldn't give a "good enough" answer why I "liked" him, I was scared. I made up some kind of fake reason that finally calmed him down and kept him calm enough that I got home safely, but it could've been different. I know it's a very different circumstance in a lot of ways, but I wasn't much younger than Erin when that happened. I wonder if Erin did have some kind of uneasy feeling in her gut that led her to be nervous, but not nervous enough to skip it entirely.

ETA: sorry I realized that sounded off a bit. I agree with you that you might not have done this MaskedWoman - I wasn't meaning to question what you'd do (sorry!). I was thinking of some really 'young and dumb' things that I did even though I consider myself relatively intelligent most of the time.

No worries at all. I understood what you meant. I think I was born with a well-developed "what if" reflex that kept me from doing very many "crazy" things in my life. Or I'm just a chicken, LOL.

 

[77DarkHorse7]

And no doubt, had the text not lead LE to CL, JC would have been in the cross hairs. LE always looks at the spouse first in a case of a missing person. JC would definitely have been the patsy and CL went on his merry way to AK.

You can get a log of where texts are sent to and from very quickly. As to who actually wrote the message, it sounds like she had a history of texts and calls with this friend regarding CL. Since LE clearly ruled out JC, I can't think of anyone else who would have sent them.

BBMs I guess, by your suggestion, maybe LE would have more information than what Seajay surmises. But, personally I think it's a weird kind of Catch-22. JMO. He He, guess what, I just noticed that Seajay pronounced backwards is JC, LOL.

 

[maskedwoman]

IMO I think CL underestimated a young woman's need to share the exciting things in her life with her closest girlfriend(s). Most young women text their friends a lot. And when I say a lot....I mean A LOT! I wouldn't be surprised if there was an entire timeline of her affair outlined in those text messages in the months leading up to her disappearance. I think Erin was merely communicating with her friend everything that CL had told her, not out of fear or concern but merely because her friend probably asked where he was taking her and Erin probably responded with the information CL had given her. MOO.

That's what I think, too. My daughter's entire life is in her texts to her best friend. If she had ANY concerns about her safety that day, I think she would have mentioned it to her friend. And if there was anything like that in her texts, I would expect that to be mentioned in the documents released so far, supporting why they needed the search warrants.

I also don't think CL actively tried to frame anybody else. I think he just wanted desperately to be rid of his problem and was totally unaware of this huge loose end that was going to hang him. The police were going to focus first on her husband, because they always do. JC even said that in his interview. LE did do that and he understood why they did it. But they would have gotten to CL anyway, because neighbors told LE of the affair. Having said that, I don't know what is required to obtain search warrants, so I don't know if they would have gotten everything they have today without the texts or not. Is anyone reading along that could help with the issue of search warrants?

 

[Hatfield]

Good question. For the most part, hard rock mines have fewer bad air problems than say coal mines. But they aren't being ventilated and you never know if there's been an historic fire or if there's rotting timber. So each team has a 4-gas monitor that checks the Oxygen level, CO (Carbon Monoxide), H2S (Hydrogen Sulfide) and HC (Hydrocarbons). We use a couple of units:

http://www.rkiinstruments.com/pages/gx2001.htm
http://us.msasafety.com/Portable-Ga...Multigas-Detector---MSHA/p/000080001600001017

Before we send someone down a hole, we like to lower one of these down if possible. In any event, we always _lower_ the first person down, rather than letting them rappel. This ensures that we can get them back out quickly if they get into trouble. We also have "self-rescuers" which are a one-use breathing apparatus that gives you about 30 minutes to escape. We don't always bring these - it depends on the situation.

Oh, and we also have 6 of these:
http://www.biopak240r.com/

The Biopaks are pretty interesting - theoretically, they give you 4 hours of completely self-contained life support, allowing you to walk, perform tasks, etc in an atmosphere that is incompatible with life. In reality, they are pretty cumbersome and feel a bit like suffocating slowly in a space suit. These were paid for by a state grant, and funds never materialized to allows us to train regularly with them. So we don't often use them.

Thank you so much for taking the time to share your knowledge with us. It is fascinating because I am sure others like me have never had the chance to go into a mine like you describe.

I read and reviewed one of the mine explorer links and it was amazing to me. Having the right equipment and going with other experienced people would be the only way to ever venture down into a mine. I am glad your information and those other good links always emphasize safety.

A long time ago, I had an experience rapelling that taught me to never try things on your own without the proper equipment and other experienced people. When I was in my teens, I had went on a guided rapelling trip and it was great. Then stupidly a few weeks later, me and some friends bought a rope, some D-rings, and a few straps and thought we could replicate the experience on our own. Bad idea and we learned a valuable lesson.

We jury rigged our own 3-point harness and setup a rappel rope off a small 50 foot overhang. Things went fine at first until all my weight shifted to the D-ring, and my bad home-made rigging made the D-ring spin and next thing I know all my weight was shifted to the rope only and not on the 3-point harness. My weight basically was passing through the D-ring in a single pass with no resistance to stop it. Luckily I had one end of the rope in my right hand and I was able to stop myself from going straight down. And very luckily I had just started over the cliff, so my buddies where able to pull me back up to the top.

That was it. We packed up our gear and never tried that stupid stunt again. A huge lesson learned that day. We were some of the lucky ones and learned our lesson without injury or death that day.

My lesson learned that day. Always go with experienced people and the right equipment on these types of outdoor excursions.

Anyway, thanks again for all the great information. It is fascinating.

 

[la2cabo]

I don't think we know the half of it.

I definitely agree with this. It seems there is much more to the story.

O/T ~ Heartgoesout: In my post 1008, please know I wasn't yelling at you with my bolded sentence. I was bolding the part I was responding to in the post. I'm sorry if it appeared any other way. That was not my intent.

 

[la2cabo]

The general area has been identified by the MSM. But the exact location has not been made public. It is not the wood-timbered shaft/headframe that was in a lot of the picture (that's the actual Rose of Peru Mine). Unfortunately, I can't share any details about which exact hole or what was found in/near it. The actual location had no distinguishing features and was not on the topo map. We found it as part of an exhaustive search.

Was it found with the help of Jon Corwin, Chris Lee or Nicole Lee? I completely understand it you're not able to answer this question but thought I'd try.

 

[m_brown]

wow! Many thanks!

The general area has been identified by the MSM. But the exact location has not been made public. It is not the wood-timbered shaft/headframe that was in a lot of the picture (that's the actual Rose of Peru Mine). Unfortunately, I can't share any details about which exact hole or what was found in/near it. The actual location had no distinguishing features and was not on the topo map. We found it as part of an exhaustive search.

 

[emt4526]

I read and reviewed one of the mine explorer links and it was amazing to me. Having the right equipment and going with other experienced people would be the only way to ever venture down into a mine. I am glad your information and those other good links always emphasize safety.

A long time ago, I had an experience rapelling that taught me to never try things on your own without the proper equipment and other experienced people. When I was in my teens, I had went on a guided rapelling trip and it was great. Then stupidly a few weeks later, me and some friends bought a rope, some D-rings, and a few straps and thought we could replicate the experience on our own. Bad idea and we learned a valuable lesson.

It is possible to safely improvise harnesses, anchors and rappel devices. We did it several times on this search. For example, my team had several near-vertical shafts to search on the Saturday we made the find. Unfortunately, none were next to a road where we could anchor to the vehicle and there are no trees there. For one, we tied webbing to two different bushes and equalized it. For another, we tied the rope to a rock and then had someone dig in and sit on it to prevent shifting. It's good to be flexible, but you need to understand the "why" before you do it. For a 1-person load, the forces are much smaller than when we have a litter with a patient and up to 2 attendants.

On the actual recovery, we had to deal with rockfall. So we built a special rope system that allowed us to focus the rope out into the center of the hole and keep our rescuer and ropes away from a loose, crumbly wall. In this case, it involved two Jeeps and 3 sets of people working the main line, belay and the redirect system.

 

[m_brown]

Can I ask this...I completely understand if you can't answer: were you there when the mine with Erin was discovered? What was your reaction? What was the reaction of the searchers and LE? I would imagine after such an exhaustive and difficult effort there would be some sort of satisfaction? But also sadness I wonder?

It is possible to safely improvise harnesses, anchors and rappel devices. We did it several times on this search. For example, my team had several near-vertical shafts to search on the Saturday we made the find. Unfortunately, none were next to a road where we could anchor to the vehicle and there are no trees there. For one, we tied webbing to two different bushes and equalized it. For another, we tied the rope to a rock and then had someone dig in and sit on it to prevent shifting. It's good to be flexible, but you need to understand the "why" before you do it. For a 1-person load, the forces are much smaller than when we have a litter with a patient and up to 2 attendants.

On the actual recovery, we had to deal with rockfall. So we built a special rope system that allowed us to focus the rope out into the center of the hole and keep our rescuer and ropes away from a loose, crumbly wall. In this case, it involved two Jeeps and 3 sets of people working the main line, belay and the redirect system.

 

[Meemaw12]

It is possible to safely improvise harnesses, anchors and rappel devices. We did it several times on this search. For example, my team had several near-vertical shafts to search on the Saturday we made the find. Unfortunately, none were next to a road where we could anchor to the vehicle and there are no trees there. For one, we tied webbing to two different bushes and equalized it. For another, we tied the rope to a rock and then had someone dig in and sit on it to prevent shifting. It's good to be flexible, but you need to understand the "why" before you do it. For a 1-person load, the forces are much smaller than when we have a litter with a patient and up to 2 attendants.

On the actual recovery, we had to deal with rockfall. So we built a special rope system that allowed us to focus the rope out into the center of the hole and keep our rescuer and ropes away from a loose, crumbly wall. In this case, it involved two Jeeps and 3 sets of people working the main line, belay and the redirect system.

My question has to do with Jeeps and tire inflation when exploring the area where you searched.

I read that inflation is a must when going in the area. Is this true? If so why? Would the average person know this? What could happen if tires were not inflated? Does the average person just get in a Jeep Cherokee and head into the area or would they research prior?


Thank you

 

[RSC]

I think even the stuff we know (some of which I consider rumor, but still discussed in MSM) is helpful here. MSM has discussed that other neighbors knew of the affair (I will try to find a link!). JC himself knew of the affair, and certainly told LE right away. Combine that with what I consider a MAJOR dumb move by CL: denying the affair entirely, then changing his story and saying they kissed--TO LE!

I'm sure JC would have been investigate thoroughly regardless. But texts aside, CL would have been near the top of their list from the get go. So would NL, for that matter.

BBMs I guess, by your suggestion, maybe LE would have more information than what Seajay surmises. But, personally I think it's a weird kind of Catch-22. JMO. He He, guess what, I just noticed that Seajay pronounced backwards is JC, LOL.

 

[RSC]

He probably could have even assumed they would come to him based on rumor--but his plan would be simply to deny it. THAT's where the texts really come in handy, IMO, aside from the obvious. Written statements from EC herself that the affair was happening and was intimate, which is a bit more solid than neighborly rumors.

That's what I think, too. My daughter's entire life is in her texts to her best friend. If she had ANY concerns about her safety that day, I think she would have mentioned it to her friend. And if there was anything like that in her texts, I would expect that to be mentioned in the documents released so far, supporting why they needed the search warrants.

I also don't think CL actively tried to frame anybody else. I think he just wanted desperately to be rid of his problem and was totally unaware of this huge loose end that was going to hang him. The police were going to focus first on her husband, because they always do. JC even said that in his interview. LE did do that and he understood why they did it. But they would have gotten to CL anyway, because neighbors told LE of the affair. Having said that, I don't know what is required to obtain search warrants, so I don't know if they would have gotten everything they have today without the texts or not. Is anyone reading along that could help with the issue of search warrants?

 

[RSC]

I did some really dumb outdoor expedition things back in the day as well, and am also lucky to have survived them
I definitely learned my lesson! (Then I decided to get some training, and led backcountry trips for the next 10 years!)

Thank you so much for taking the time to share your knowledge with us. It is fascinating because I am sure others like me have never had the chance to go into a mine like you describe.

I read and reviewed one of the mine explorer links and it was amazing to me. Having the right equipment and going with other experienced people would be the only way to ever venture down into a mine. I am glad your information and those other good links always emphasize safety.

A long time ago, I had an experience rapelling that taught me to never try things on your own without the proper equipment and other experienced people. When I was in my teens, I had went on a guided rapelling trip and it was great. Then stupidly a few weeks later, me and some friends bought a rope, some D-rings, and a few straps and thought we could replicate the experience on our own. Bad idea and we learned a valuable lesson.

We jury rigged our own 3-point harness and setup a rappel rope off a small 50 foot overhang. Things went fine at first until all my weight shifted to the D-ring, and my bad home-made rigging made the D-ring spin and next thing I know all my weight was shifted to the rope only and not on the 3-point harness. My weight basically was passing through the D-ring in a single pass with no resistance to stop it. Luckily I had one end of the rope in my right hand and I was able to stop myself from going straight down. And very luckily I had just started over the cliff, so my buddies where able to pull me back up to the top.

That was it. We packed up our gear and never tried that stupid stunt again. A huge lesson learned that day. We were some of the lucky ones and learned our lesson without injury or death that day.

My lesson learned that day. Always go with experienced people and the right equipment on these types of outdoor excursions.

Anyway, thanks again for all the great information. It is fascinating.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

They never actually said when this supposed internet search happened. For all I know it could have happened after she went missing. Maybe he suspected he knew who did it, and was concerned whether that person hid the body enough, or maybe he wanted to solve the crime himself. It was someone he cared about who disappeared, after all. thought bubble->{if someone killed her, I can find out who and be the hero. I'll start by looking for the body..... They'd want to get rid of it, how would they try to do that?} Search.

The arrest warrant says CL admitted to doing the search. I'm pretty sure he would have told them if he had done it as a way to try to solve the crime.

 

[roadrunnermt]

Is it possible that some of the evidence could have fallen down the shaft further than where Erin was found?

It is possible to safely improvise harnesses, anchors and rappel devices. We did it several times on this search. For example, my team had several near-vertical shafts to search on the Saturday we made the find. Unfortunately, none were next to a road where we could anchor to the vehicle and there are no trees there. For one, we tied webbing to two different bushes and equalized it. For another, we tied the rope to a rock and then had someone dig in and sit on it to prevent shifting. It's good to be flexible, but you need to understand the "why" before you do it. For a 1-person load, the forces are much smaller than when we have a litter with a patient and up to 2 attendants.

On the actual recovery, we had to deal with rockfall. So we built a special rope system that allowed us to focus the rope out into the center of the hole and keep our rescuer and ropes away from a loose, crumbly wall. In this case, it involved two Jeeps and 3 sets of people working the main line, belay and the redirect system.

 

[Eclipse33]

EXACTLY! Considering all we know is what's in one leaked warrant and one arrest warrant, it's obvious we know a small, teeny portion of what LE has found. We have no clue what other evidence they have. I'm sure it's substantial since they are talking DP.

Are either of these in the previous threads? If so, can you tell me where or provide a reference point?

 

[Hatfield]

I did some really dumb outdoor expedition things back in the day as well, and am also lucky to have survived them
I definitely learned my lesson! (Then I decided to get some training, and led backcountry trips for the next 10 years!)

OT
And that is the key. Doing it the right way.
I too did not let my early misadventure stop me from enjoying future rapelling trips. I just made sure to go with experienced people that knew what they were doing from that day forward.

I fell in love with rapelling and went on a few of the most amazing experiences of my life. One trip took us to a 150 foot overhang and the thrill of being able to use your feet to bounce back off the wall and then drop and control descent is totally amazing.

I loved it and even hope to go again some day. Nothing is more thrilling than to slowly walk backwards off a cliff as your weight transfers to your harness. It is just an amazing experience. In our guided trips, we had woman and young adults, and it was so fun to see everyone enjoy the experience.

I highly recommend it so long as people go with the right experienced people and right equipment.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

I mostly agree. I think the only 'fear' she showed was that it was kind of odd how the texted her friend about how far away they were going, but that could be taken numerous ways. I wish we could see both sides of the conversation.

I suspect it was something like this:
"C is so happy, we're going to spend Saturday together celebrating. He wants to take me to a place he goes hunting a couple hours away."
"What are you going to tell J?"
"He's working that day. C told me to tell him I was going to JTNP to scout out photo spots for when Mom comes. There's no cell reception there so J won't be expecting me to be calling or texting him while he's at work."

 

[MzOpinion8d]

I don't know, these texts seem too important to the case in my opinion. And I guess I have to be the one to say it:
.
How do we know that Erin was the one who actually sent these texts?
.
What with the proliferation of SMS spoofing services like www.sendanonymoussms.com/ and www.spoofmytextmessage.com/ It would be so easy to fake the second affair, IMO, were someone so inclined. (Please note, I had my on when I went to these sites so I don't know what will come up on someone else's browser.) Without her phone I don't see how they can be sure enough about the truthfulness of the information in the texts. But that's just me. JMO.

But they have her phone. And her phone records.

 

[Hatfield]

But they have her phone. And her phone records.

I agree that the phone records would prove that the text was not spoofed. Because if it was spoofed then the phone records of his phone would show he was the one that initiated sending the text rather than her phone sending the texts.

At least I think it would if I understand how spoofing works. I think what spoofing mainly does is change the "sender" to make it appear as a different sender's email address.

I think the phone records should show who sent what and when. Even if a spoofing site was used, there would have to be some initial communication from the original sendees phone I would think.

I maybe wrong about some of this so if anyone knows for sure how it works, it would be appreciated.