Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #4

[Knox]

*If* the parents TW/JW left 3 & 4 year old toddlers home alone sleeping (drugged), or otherwise, obviously there is something very wrong. It goes beyond just bad judgement, it is egregious behavior, and they have no business being parents, never mind adoptive and/or foster parents.
If it turns out to be the case that these tiny tots were left home alone and an accident happened causing them both to perish, IMO, it’s not a one-off case of bad judgement, it points to child neglect/abuse likely an ongoing issue in the home. No loving, well adjusted parent in their right mind, leaves their
3 & 4 year old toddlers home alone for several hours, for any reason. If it turns out to be the case that this is what happened, it would take a lot to convince me that it was just one time bad judgement on the parents part. And of course brings up the question if there were previous incidents of neglect/abuse of little O & O, how TW/JW would ever be allowed to foster/adopt in the first place? Abuse was hidden?? Not reported?? CPS fail??.... ????.....
Why no pleas for their boys?? Why no searching??? Smdh.
There’s a lot not adding up here.

All of the above IMHOO

IMO, because TW & JW are responsible. However it happened, the boys are gone.

I keep checking for updates from the extended family members who created that page. I wonder if we will hear from them soon, didn't they say a PI was going to be hired?

 

[fcavanaugh]

IMO, because TW & JW are responsible. However it happened, the boys are gone.

I keep checking for updates from the extended family members who created that page. I wonder if we will hear from them soon, didn't they say a PI was going to be hired?

ITA @Knox. Yes, I remember something about extended family mentioning hiring a
PI, but haven’t heard any recent updates as to status thereof.

IMHO

 

[Rachelj1]

IMO, because TW & JW are responsible. However it happened, the boys are gone.

I keep checking for updates from the extended family members who created that page. I wonder if we will hear from them soon, didn't they say a PI was going to be hired?

They said a team of investigators I believe ....

 

[Rachelj1]

The only victims here are O and O.
That’s my honest opinion .

 

[Rachelj1]

ITA @Knox. Yes, I remember something about extended family was going to hire a PI, but haven’t heard any recent updates as to status thereof.

IMHO

Well where are the private invigators? Are they on the downlow? My experience they normally make themselves known.

moo

 

[MsBetsy]

They said a team of investigators I believe ....

They said they were engaged with a team of private investigators and were also proactively supporting the official investigation. I don't know if the PI who spoke to the media was part of the "team". Normally they would not give any details to the media but they might communicate with LE about any evidence they find. Imo

 

[fcavanaugh]

Well where are the private invigators? Are they on the downlow? My experience they normally make themselves known.

moo

I’m not sure Rachel, wish I had the answer, as I said in my previous post, I’ve not read or heard any recent updates regarding PI status.

IMHO

 

[Lusitana]

The only victims here are O and O.
That’s my honest opinion .

And the other children. Poor kids, all of them.

 

[susiQ]

The training is inadequate especially because the children in foster care have such severe needs, most of them are behavioral and more training in trauma-informed parenting is essential. BUT most foster kids come with therapists, doctors, teachers, CASA workers, regional center workers, and a social worker...so a lot of the training is need-based and experiential which is horrible if you are a new foster parent hoping/expecting to parent neurotypical kiddo cause you are never gonna get one. Also, the children in foster care (not adopted) are visiting with their birth parents each week (usually three times a week for a case that is heading towards reunification, which most foster cases are) so the foster parent will also have the birth family's input as well. All of it can be overwhelming, but until adoption, there are many people involved in foster children's lives and so maybe that's why the training is so light...they get hands-on training with the kids.

I know from experience that it's hard to sit there and train without having real-life scenarios to work through, so as not to bog down the accreditation process they leave the training at a minimum just giving you enough. So if your toddler repeatedly smears feces on the wall, you know who to call, but not why it's happening or how to stop it...but knowing who to call is the first step to the rest of the answers. If your nine-year-old foster child is constantly running away...again, you need to call someone and work through the scenario...etc. I personally think they need at least 12 or more hours in trauma-informed parenting techniques because spending an entire day 24/7 with kids who are raging, destroying your property, and fighting you can be really tiring and parents need more resources and skills to work with these traumatized kids. Not all the kids are this bad all the time, but they can be. They've been removed from their families or have had several placements and have also endured abuse or neglect so they can be hard to handle sometimes, but not always...

Thank you for responding @musemoon and for the love and care you give. It is so sad knowing how many children are broken

 

[Bits777]

This is not really a complete thought but here is just something I have been thinking. What if O and O were at a babysitter and what if this babysitter had some past history of violence against children or something. JW and TW could have known this but left O and O in their care anyway. I am not implying that the babysitter did anything to the boys. Just thinking that if something accidental happened and the boys died JW and TW would have to cover tracks. They would need to concoct a story because they could not let it be known that they entrusted their boys to a babysitter with this history.
Sorry for the fragmented thoughts. Hope this makes sense to someone.

 

[susiQ]

I was born in 1994, I have tons of pictures from when I was a baby and a child. So, so, so many. My brother was born in 1987 and he has just as many if not more pictures from when he was a baby and a child.

Right now, we have a camera with us 24/7. And it fits on our pockets, when a parent doesn't have up to date pictures of their children, it always seems weird to me. And when the children in question are 3 and 4 years old, it's even weirder. I have a 3-year-old niece, she's always doing or saying something cute. She doesn't live with me, and I have soooooooo many pictures AND videos of her.

So yeah, I think it's a bit sad and odd that nobody was able to post recent pictures of Orson and Orrin. They are missing and they are little kids, I'm sure they didn't even look like those pictures anymore.

I suspect there were no recent pictures because these poor little boys, unfortunately, were nothing more than a pay check to the AP. Sad. MOO

 

[musemoon]

I suspect there were no recent pictures because these poor little boys, unfortunately, were nothing more than a pay check to the AP. Sad. MOO

I'm not disagreeing, perhaps the boys were just a paycheck to them, but what I don't get is why kill them/hurt them/get rid of them? If the adoptive parents did something intentional and were involved in their disappearance/death why would they get rid of the boys if they were a paycheck? You have to reapply for adoption assistance payments every two years, and part of that process is confirming that the child is still alive and in your care. The payments aren't arbitrary, if the child is not in your home, the payments will stop. You might be able to get away with hiding their disappearance for a little while, but DCFS will find out if they are no longer alive, it might take a while... but they will find out. (which is what we might be seeing now) This is what's confusing to me. It's so stupid (cruel, horrible etc) to abuse a child, but to do it while still on DCFS's radar? That is so crazy.

 

[MoeInVA]

I've never been a huge picture taker myself. A few trips to Woolworth's for a photoshoot but that's about it. School pictures once a year. Cell phones weren't around in the 80s when my boys were little though. Still of all the things to find strange to me this isn't one of them.

And maybe it suggest a lack (or lack of contact) with out of state family. Who else would photos be taken for?

Things have changed a lot!!
Even back them I am sure you would have a photo from the last year of a 3 year old. But today with cell phone cameras, lacking a photo of a 3 year old is a huge red flag. Massive. There is just no good explanation. Very distressing.

 

[MoeInVA]

They said they were engaged with a team of private investigators and were also proactively supporting the official investigation. I don't know if the PI who spoke to the media was part of the "team". Normally they would not give any details to the media but they might communicate with LE about any evidence they find. Imo

I work in PR and when I first read the family statement, this PI line jumped out at me: “engaged with”

that does not say “hired”. It’s noncommittal. It may mean they took a phone call from the shady pi guy who was on the case pro Bono apparently for media exposure. It may mean they just took a phone call. It’s PR blather. JMO.

 

[Seattle1]

I just have to ask. Does anyone else fine “12 hours of training” for foster parents rather inadequate?? JMHO.

I think it's probably a matter of perspective: what do the 12 hours involve, coupled with the other requirements cited by the spokesperson?

Couples become pregnant every day without any training whatsoever.

Marriage license? Driver's license? How many hours of training required and/or appropriate?

I understand that foster parents also have the ongoing support of the state agency. I think there must be legislation that determined this curriculum is satisfactory.

MOO

ETA: I think if a person is intent on evil, the amount of training completed will prove irrelevant.

I'm thinking about the pediatrician that held another pediatrician captive before murdering her and turning the gun on himself. This was an individual with a wealth of training, and that took a Hippocratic oath to first, do no harm.

On the day he took his gun to the clinic, nothing mattered.

 

[susiQ]

I'm not disagreeing, perhaps the boys were just a paycheck to them, but what I don't get is why kill them/hurt them/get rid of them? If the adoptive parents did something intentional and were involved in their disappearance/death why would they get rid of the boys if they were a paycheck? You have to reapply for adoption assistance payments every two years, and part of that process is confirming that the child is still alive and in your care. The payments aren't arbitrary, if the child is not in your home, the payments will stop. You might be able to get away with hiding their disappearance for a little while, but DCFS will find out if they are no longer alive, it might take a while... but they will find out. (which is what we might be seeing now) This is what's confusing to me. It's so stupid (cruel, horrible etc) to abuse a child, but to do it while still on DCFS's radar? That is so crazy.

I see your point. However, maybe the boys became too much work for them? Maybe they got abused too much and it led to their death? Maybe there was rank neglect that led to their death? Or, lower on my list, but not ruled out, selling them for a goodly price and hoping they could sell this “story” about an abduction. I hate thinking about any of these scenarios, it makes me ill. But, if they thought they could convince everyone of their innocence maybe they figured they could foster more children? And, if the boys have been missing since before 12/19/20, for how long have they been receiving $$ for them when they are long gone?
MOO

 

[PommyMommy]

FEB 2, 2021
Community vigil and prayer being held tonight for missing California City boys, Orrin and Orson West | KGET 17
NAACP Bakersfield is holding a community candlelight prayer and vigil tonight for Orrin and Orson West, the two boys who have been missing from California City for over a month.

The vigil and prayer event will be held at 7 p.m. at 1525 Lotus Lane.

[...]

Also see: Community vigil and prayer being held tonight for missing California City boys, Orrin and Orson West - California News Times

 

[PommyMommy]

Bio-cousin speaks in this video. The prayer service is at the Casa Loma Apts in Bakersfield.

FEB 2, 2021
Candlelight prayer held in Cal City for missing Orrin and Orson West

 

[LucyOso]

Curious, have they searched the lake in the park that's nearby? That's a pretty decent sized body of water. How about the desert around the area. Kids can be very fast and very curious. They can blindly follow and lead at the same time.

 

[mickey2942]

This is not really a complete thought but here is just something I have been thinking. What if O and O were at a babysitter and what if this babysitter had some past history of violence against children or something. JW and TW could have known this but left O and O in their care anyway. I am not implying that the babysitter did anything to the boys. Just thinking that if something accidental happened and the boys died JW and TW would have to cover tracks. They would need to concoct a story because they could not let it be known that they entrusted their boys to a babysitter with this history.
Sorry for the fragmented thoughts. Hope this makes sense to someone.

No way. I am pretty sure that the parents would have contacted authorities.