Found Deceased CA - Rachel Nguyen, 20, & Joseph Orbeso, 21, Joshua Tree Nat'l Park, 27 July 2017 #2

[Yvettea]

I never found anything online that showed it is legal in California for a friend to shoot their friend in order to end their suffering.

 

[thekarmabus]

What would cause someone to choose “ shoot me”? I don’t have that answer. Terminal cancer patients take weeks in the end to get to that point ( I work with hospice). Even in the inevitable people will rise until the pain outweighs the unknown. We may never know their last days or moments . Does it matter at this point? Both are gone. Our curiosity vs the grief of those left will never compare . Any factual findings will not change the ending. The family seems to be content with a mercy death. I feel it’s their wish to let it be . May they find peace and I hope people will allow them to do so.


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[Whiskers16]

I never found anything online that showed it is legal in California for a friend to shoot their friend in order to end their suffering.

but no one is going to charge a deceased man with breaking the law.

 

[Elainera]

What would cause someone to choose “ shoot me”? I don’t have that answer. Terminal cancer patients take weeks in the end to get to that point ( I work with hospice). Even in the inevitable people will rise until the pain outweighs the unknown. We may never know their last days or moments . Does it matter at this point? Both are gone. Our curiosity vs the grief of those left will never compare . Any factual findings will not change the ending. The family seems to be content with a mercy death. I feel it’s their wish to let it be . May they find peace and I hope people will allow them to do so.


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bbm Intense suffering can get you there. When the pain and agony is so much that nothing else in your life matters anymore, just to get out of this hell. I've been there after major surgery when the painkillers they gave me did not work for me and I felt my body was on fire. I would not have objected if someone had shot me that day. The only wish I had was to die and be released from the agony. (On the second day, they figured out to give me a different painkiller that finally worked and I got better.) So yes I can definitely understand someone saying, this is too much, I can't take it anymore, I want to go.

Could it be that Rachel wasn't even conscious anymore from her head injury? I hope we will get to hear the autopsy findings.

 

[Elainera]

Thank you for sharing Jordan.marie12. I have no doubt this was a mercy killing/suicide.

May they both Rest in Peace. And God Bless you too.

 

[Ironside]

I once read about a guy who got dropped off by a plane into the wilderness of Alaska. For some reason he never organised to be collected and his diary showed he regretted that. A plane once did fly over him but he accidentally gave the ok signal. He ended up killing himself in his tent with a gun as he knew he wouldn't survive the winter. I thought of him when I read about these two.


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[Whiskers16]

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[KaaBoom]

I can't remember if a timeline of the weather for the day they went missing has ever been posted, but I just put one together. It looks like the weather would have been reasonably pleasant when they started out. It would have been about 82 °F when they started. Within two hours the temperature would have been 90.°F. In five hours it would have been in the triple digits. They could have probably walked pretty far in the first hours before it got too hot, to continue.

5:56 AM 81.0 °F (Low temperature for the day.)
6:45 AM Rachel Nguyen and Joseph Orbeso entered the park.
6:56 AM 82.9 °F
7:56 AM 86.0 °F
8:56 AM 90.0 °F
9:56 AM 95.0 °F
10:56 AM 98.1 °F
11:56 AM 100.0 °F
12:56 PM 100.9 °F
1:56 PM 102.0 °F
2:56 PM 105.1 °F (Hight temperature for the day was 106.0 °F)
3:56 PM 105.1 °F
4:00 PM A ping from Orbeso’s cellphone was recorded from within the park.
4:56 PM 105.1 °F
5:56 PM 105.1 °F
6:56 PM 102.9 °F
7:56 PM 99.0 °F
8:56 PM 96.1 °F
9:56 PM 93.9 °F
10:56 PM 93.0 °F
11:56 PM 90.0 °F

Weather History for Twentynine Palms, CA _ Weather Underground

2 bodies found inside Joshua Tree National Park - LA Times

 

[Roadette]

I'm so sorry for your loss @Jordan.Marie. I believe most of us have thought this was a mercy situation for a bit now. Their friends and family have been in my prayers for awhile now. I really hope some nature enthusiasts have learnt the importance of preparation from their story. I, myself, have learned about satellite tracking accessories as a result of their horrible experience and intend to employ them going forward. Hopefully many lives are saved as a result of this happening to them.

 

[ecomango]

I'm glad you posted this, thanks. I read that Joseph's ping ended up triangulating to an area around Smith Water Canyon and that's on the opposite of Park Blvd. In 2010, Bill Ewasko went missing and his cell phone ping gave the location of the Smith Water Canyon area too. I know everyone worked really hard to find the couple, but I feel like with this knowledge and the way the cell phone towers ping via radius, they could have followed the radius and narrowed the search to the vicinity of Maze Loop and the North Trail and maybe could have found them within a 1000 ft buffer or so of the radius instead of used resources to search Smith Water Canyon. But we don't publicly know the radius of where the Joseph's cell phone ping was 9mi-10 mi? maybe we won't be able to find out. For Bill Ewasko, it was pinged within the 10.5 to 10.6 mile radius of the Verizon tower in 2010. I've attached a map that includes the parking lot, where they knew the JO and RN's tracks were, the trails, and Ewasko's 2010 cell ping radius. Guess I hope they consider it next time, though I hope there will never be a next time.

I can't remember if a timeline of the weather for the day they went missing has ever been posted, but I just put one together. It looks like the weather would have been reasonably pleasant when they started out. It would have been about 82 °F when they started. Within two hours the temperature would have been 90.°F. In five hours it would have been in the triple digits. They could have probably walked pretty far in the first hours before it got too hot, to continue.

5:56 AM 81.0 °F (Low temperature for the day.)
6:45 AM Rachel Nguyen and Joseph Orbeso entered the park.
6:56 AM 82.9 °F
7:56 AM 86.0 °F
8:56 AM 90.0 °F
9:56 AM 95.0 °F
10:56 AM 98.1 °F
11:56 AM 100.0 °F
12:56 PM 100.9 °F
1:56 PM 102.0 °F
2:56 PM 105.1 °F (Hight temperature for the day was 106.0 °F)
3:56 PM 105.1 °F
4:00 PM A ping from Orbeso’s cellphone was recorded from within the park.
4:56 PM 105.1 °F
5:56 PM 105.1 °F
6:56 PM 102.9 °F
7:56 PM 99.0 °F
8:56 PM 96.1 °F
9:56 PM 93.9 °F
10:56 PM 93.0 °F
11:56 PM 90.0 °F

Weather History for Twentynine Palms, CA _ Weather Underground

2 bodies found inside Joshua Tree National Park - LA Times

 

[Yvettea]

[FONT=.SF UI Display][FONT=.SFUIDisplay]An uncle of the woman found dead in Joshua Tree National Park reportedly said investigators believe her boyfriend may have killed her in a “sympathetic murder-suicide” after she suffered a head injury.

[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR]https...me-joshua-tree-hikers-20171022-story,amp.html

 

[lizardjustice]

One thing that is bothering me about the current state of known information on this case is the statements Joseph's family made about a potential stalker of Rachel, saying that's why Joseph had the gun. That statement is more suspicious to me than had he just carried his gun into the park as protection. The stalking information seems like information that may have been important when they first went missing. Clearly I don't think they were killed by a stalker, but the late information just raises suspicions to me.

 

[Ironside]

I'm so sorry for your loss @Jordan.Marie. I believe most of us have thought this was a mercy situation for a bit now. .

I'm so sorry too JordanMarie. I can't imagine what it must feel like to find websleuths because a friend is missing.

I usually stick to European cases and only searched for this thread after reading about the deaths in the UK media, any reports I read were sympathetic and certainly did not suggest there was anything suspicious about the circumstances. It's just so tragic and I too hope people learn from it.

 

[Jinkasaurus]

This case makes me think about Aron Ralston - the man who cut his arm off with a pocket knife after being stuck between rocks in a canyon for over 5 days. It would be interesting to hear his thoughts on this case.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aron_Ralston

His case is an example of an extreme someone would go to in order to survive.

 

[Vail]

What would cause someone to choose “ shoot me”?

I did some mushrooms once in Indio several years ago, and that was in April. It was over 100 while the sun was up and I was severely dehydrated and wanted to die. I'm not saying Rachel was on mushrooms, but even just injured, perhaps severely, suffering and then dying of dehydration with the additional stress of being lost and no one is coming, I think death starts looking like a good idea when it is offered to you as something so effortless.

I wonder if either of them thought to document any of this? I am curious what was found on their cell phones.

 

[Elainera]

I'm also very curious whether they took photos or taped part of their ordeal. Aron Ralston filmed himself a lot while stuck.

The autopsy report should tell us where exactly they were shot. It should be completed by now - are they gonna release it?

 

[bears10]

I'm also very curious whether they took photos or taped part of their ordeal. Aron Ralston filmed himself a lot while stuck.

The autopsy report should tell us where exactly they were shot. It should be completed by now - are they gonna release it?

Will a tox screening be performed as part of the autopsy? If so, that could take 3-4 weeks, possibly more.

 

[Elainera]

Will a tox screening be performed as part of the autopsy? If so, that could take 3-4 weeks, possibly more.

I would think they will do a tox screen if there's enough tissue left from which they can do it.
Don't they usually do this with blood? I doubt there's any blood left. :thinking: :dunno:

 

[Elainera]

I did some mushrooms once in Indio several years ago, and that was in April. It was over 100 while the sun was up and I was severely dehydrated and wanted to die. I'm not saying Rachel was on mushrooms, but even just injured, perhaps severely, suffering and then dying of dehydration with the additional stress of being lost and no one is coming, I think death starts looking like a good idea when it is offered to you as something so effortless.

I wonder if either of them thought to document any of this? I am curious what was found on their cell phones.

bbm Come to think of it, their phones should also have documented any additional attempts to power up or connect after the 4.30 pm ping on Friday, even if not successful, possibly giving a better timeline.

 

[Dixie811]

I hope their phones weren’t too badly damaged if there was indeed flash flooding where they were.