Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #23

[Hatfield]

From @ValFortney twitter account "7 folders of videos on #Garland computer: 1 about adult baby diapering; 1 about ADHD; 1 about fingerprinting; 1 about hypnosis."

Was DG diagnosed with ADHD?

Any speculation on why he would be curious/exploring hypnosis?

A few days ago the Defense objected to the relevence of some of the evidence and I do think the defense would have a valid objection to that again. I am surprised the defense has not used that objection more often.

 

[Bravo]

Many just fantasizing about revenge was enough. Until it wasn't.

 

[Krystine]

"garotte in use made me think very hard about how we all wondered how such a man could get 2 adults out of that house alive. Pure speculation on my part, but he had multiple images (1 image contained at least 20 inner images) of various ways to use it. "

Hi, Female, and thanks so much. I'm interested in the comment you made about the garotte, and how it could help get the 3 victims outside. What are you thinking about that?

 

[Hatfield]

I'm either frustrated by the reporting or frustrated by the Crown.

I'm not sure which?

I don't know. It's a difficult trial.

I know the Prosecution is trying to get context of how and where things were found but the thing that disappoints me the most is they had mentioned that DNA was sent off for testing and then we havent heard yet of what those results were.

I am sure at some point we are going to hear the experts talk about DNA and blood testing results but it seems to me they should have put those experts on right after they mention it was sent off for testing.

Proving the blood found in his truck belonged to the Likenesses is one of the most powerful things they have IMO and I dont think we have heard any experts yet prove whose blood it was.

I dont understand their approach.

 

[Sprigs]

I know the Prosecution is trying to get context of how and where things were found but the thing that disappoints me the most is they had mentioned that DNA was sent off for testing and then we havent heard yet of what those results were.

I am sure at some point we are going to hear the experts talk about DNA and blood testing results but it seems to me they should have put those experts on right after they mention it was sent off for testing.

Proving the blood found in his truck belonged to the Likenesses is one of the most powerful things they have IMO and I dont think we have heard any experts yet prove whose blood it was.

I dont understand their approach.

I think there was mention of the trial being 5 weeks long. In my view saving the most damaging proof until the end gives it the most punch and keeps this fresh in the minds of the jurors. As previously mentioned, there are a multitude of witnesses and having them come multiple times through the course of the trial impacts their ability to continue forensic work they are doing on other cases. I personally am impressed at the amount of evidence they did accumulate and have to present. This has been a long process - I often see members online with a join date of July 2014 and think they might be like me - I signed up to WS during NO's amber alert and hoped for a miracle to bring him back to his parents. Now I can only hope that justice is served and DG is convicted of the crimes I believe he is responsible for.

 

[deugirtni]

A few days ago the Defense objected to the relevence of some of the evidence and I do think the defense would have a valid objection to that again. I am surprised the defense has not used that objection more often.

Maybe they have, it doesn't seem that we are getting many tweets on what the defence cross exam is saying in most cases. Maybe the reporters are slow typists? It's hard to tweet live, for sure, a lot will be missed.

 

[otto]

That is what I cant believe the most. 7 years later and this guy is just now going to take action on him. It is so bizarre.

Besides them moving I wonder if there was something else that changed or something else that happened that caused him to snap. I suppose the moving may have been it but it is so bizarre because usually people will slowly get less mad at someone. For his rage to stay to the point he did what he did is bizarre.

Wonder if his mental illness was getting worse and worse over time and maybe contributed.

The business dispute happened between 2007-2009. His sister testified she noticed that Douglas held a grudge in 2010. He committed the murders in 2014. He spent approximately 3 years fantasizing about revenge.

 

[dogmatica]

You don't have to search long to find anything they've described. Google would give you hits using anything gore related as search terms and it doesn't take long to start going down that rabbit hole. There was an Edmonton based gore website that was in the news some years ago. Unfortunately this type of content is very easy to access.. or rather, unfortunately enough people are interested in seeing this that it exists

Right - Luka Magnotta vid.

 

[Hatfield]

I think there was mention of the trial being 5 weeks long. In my view saving the most damaging proof until the end gives it the most punch and keeps this fresh in the minds of the jurors. As previously mentioned, there are a multitude of witnesses and having them come multiple times through the course of the trial impacts their ability to continue forensic work they are doing on other cases. I personally am impressed at the amount of evidence they did accumulate and have to present. This has been a long process - I often see members online with a join date of July 2014 and think they might be like me - I signed up to WS during NO's amber alert and hoped for a miracle to bring him back to his parents. Now I can only hope that justice is served and DG is convicted of the crimes I believe he is responsible for.

Thanks. Yeah there is an awful lot of evidence to cover.

I just hope when they do bring on the DNA experts that they can remind the jury where the item was found and the significance of having the DNA on that particular item.

The danger with bringing on the DNA experts too long after talk about how the item was found is that the jury may forget why it was important in that particular spot or on that particular item.

In this case it may not matter as much and should be somewhat of a slam dunk once they can prove their DNA was anywhere on his truck or on anywhere on that farm because there was zero reason it should be there.

 

[Tealgrove]

A little off topic but worthy of thought. I wonder if there is anyone out there working on a book.

It's not that I want the gory details but I would really like to get the full story, with all the nuances of the trial, and trying to put the whole thing in order. It may be the only way we manage to put all the pieces of the puzzle together in the end.

Douglas Garland is a case study. For me personally, I really want to get into his head. I know that a trial doesn't need to do that and won't really be doing that, but it's just something that interests me the most. Why and how and then how did it really play out.

MOO

 

[kritafo]

so is Female going to be at the court house today

 

[otto]

A little off topic but worthy of thought. I wonder if there is anyone out there working on a book.

It's not that I want the gory details but I would really like to get the full story, with all the nuances of the trial, and trying to put the whole thing in order. It may be the only way we manage to put all the pieces of the puzzle together in the end.

Douglas Garland is a case study. For me personally, I really want to get into his head. I know that a trial doesn't need to do that and won't really be doing that, but it's just something that interests me the most. Why and how and then how did it really play out.

MOO

One day, Garland went down the rabbit hole of revenge. He could never again find his way out. A fraction of what he experienced in his self-made rabbit hole of hell is documented on the hard drive. Obsessively fixating on a perceived wrong, combined with an inability to take socially appropriate action, left him in a fantasy world that I wouldn't want to visit or even view from a distance.

 

[Hatfield]

I was curious how the jury handled it and if there would be tears. I have to admit at the end of today i was disturbed but i didn't think it was as bad as the judge set it up to be. I wasn't sure if that was just because something was lost it the tweets though.

I imagine for the families it was much harder though. To see those images and then think that the same things may have happened to your loved ones.

Re BBM
I thought the exact same thing.

Your post is a great post and touched on some things that are important.

Everyone handles rough evidence at trials differently and I got a sense this judge may be more sensitive than most judges. Or it could be that the worst is yet to come so maybe we have not seen the half of it yet.

Since we cover lots of trials here at WS we have seen some really rough cases and after awhile I suppose some of us get desensitized.

You are right too that being there at the trial is more powerful too and of course for any family members it would be much rougher.

Everyone will be handling the testimony and evidence differently.

 

[Tealgrove]

One day, Garland went down the rabbit hole of revenge. He could never again find his way out. A fraction of what he experienced in his self-made rabbit hole of hell is documented on the hard drive. Obsessively fixating on a perceived wrong, combined with an inability to take socially appropriate action, left him in a fantasy world that I wouldn't want to visit or even view from a distance.

Excellent explanation. Thank you.

 

[dogmatica]

One day, Garland went down the rabbit hole of revenge. He could never again find his way out. A fraction of what he experienced in his self-made rabbit hole of hell is documented on the hard drive. Obsessively fixating on a perceived wrong, combined with an inability to take socially appropriate action, left him in a fantasy world that I wouldn't want to visit or even view from a distance.

It also seems though that he extracted pleasure from this - it doesn't seem to be just pure rage fuelled by a sense of being wronged. This guy is a sadist. Not just some normal dude pushed so far that he snapped. This guy is twisted and gets his jollies causing pain and suffering. The "grudge" was simply an excuse to act these twisted fantasies out. MOO.

 

[Tealgrove]

It also seems though that he extracted pleasure from this - it doesn't seem to be just pure rage fuelled by a sense of being wronged. This guy is a sadist. Not just some normal dude pushed so far that he snapped. This guy is twisted and gets his jollies causing pain and suffering. The "grudge" was simply an excuse to act these twisted fantasies out. MOO.

It appears that way for sure since he incorporated Kathy Liknes into his scenario. Her part in his plan is one of the things I keep rolling around in my head. Did he use her JUST to get to Alvin or....did he have fantasies about her and decided that he'd kill two birds with one stone?

So much to think about.

 

[KMouse]

I am trying to figure out the relevance of the fetish photos and how they tie into the murders. Thoughts?

 

[JadeSLeuth]

I think there was mention of the trial being 5 weeks long. In my view saving the most damaging proof until the end gives it the most punch and keeps this fresh in the minds of the jurors. As previously mentioned, there are a multitude of witnesses and having them come multiple times through the course of the trial impacts their ability to continue forensic work they are doing on other cases. I personally am impressed at the amount of evidence they did accumulate and have to present. This has been a long process - I often see members online with a join date of July 2014 and think they might be like me - I signed up to WS during NO's amber alert and hoped for a miracle to bring him back to his parents. Now I can only hope that justice is served and DG is convicted of the crimes I believe he is responsible for.

BBM - Nathan brought me here too.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

A little off topic but worthy of thought. I wonder if there is anyone out there working on a book.

It's not that I want the gory details but I would really like to get the full story, with all the nuances of the trial, and trying to put the whole thing in order. It may be the only way we manage to put all the pieces of the puzzle together in the end.

Douglas Garland is a case study. For me personally, I really want to get into his head. I know that a trial doesn't need to do that and won't really be doing that, but it's just something that interests me the most. Why and how and then how did it really play out.

MOO

BBM - I suspect there are several books in progress.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

so is Female going to be at the court house today

It sounded that way