CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #7

[dotr]

1. You do not know where the soup was. PK has said nothing of the soup or an empty pot (when he wrote of the discovery).
2. IF soup then you do not know wether it was (still) hot.
3. If AG had been scalded with soup then LE surely first would have let announced.
4. If you had doused the dogs with the hot soup then you have made them more aggressive, probably not more.
5. For all 3 the soup pot would probably not enough to scald. It could have been thoroughly frightened only.
6. I do not know if there may be coincidence to someone that provides soup and another uses this soup for an attack.
7. Who provided the soup will not be so stupid and use for attack - that would be almost a confession.

That is what I think about.

Alright, no soup for me!

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Thanks to FromGermany for the reminder that PK did not go inside the house with LE.

So basically we have no idea what LE found inside the house!

Hmmmm.......

 

[Sillybilly]

Re-confirmation in LV's words that she delivered the soup was covered pretty recently.

And if we are to believe LV's claim that she thinks she was only in the house once, was the day she delivered soup the one time? If NOT, then the soup must have been handed to Audrey in the garage. So, was the soup found in the house or in the garage?

Also, PK indicated that the dogs were around him when he was doing yard work, and that when he visited with Audrey in the home, she would encourage the dogs to be nice to him. LV was the one who was afraid of the dogs, which could explain why the dogs were confined either inside the home (if the soup transaction took place in the garage) or inside their cages in the home if LV in fact was in the home on that day.

MOO

 

[dotr]

Occurred to me that the murder in the garage itself could be a clue.

First of all none of us strangely has suggested well at least I do not remember that Audrey could have been killed during one of her sit-outs in the garage. Can anyone run with this and see if it could fit with the EXACT location of her body? Seems her body was on the OPPOSITE side from the bench? One guess argument on bench Audrey a little freaked out says I am going out in my car per follows blow to head. Dogs: now a clue someone who did not like the dogs coming up to them still why caged not just in the house?

Coat on: garage still chilly if sitting out for a while in winter.

Hypothesis: perp knew Audrey let nobody in her house except P.K. so murder in the house would be a problem.

Hypothesis: LE idea of a lone drifter type means they do not check the house for fingerprints there should of course be VERY few sets of fingerprints basically Audrey P.K. the guy installing the oven etc. Huge error by LE here though I don't know perhaps they did do this.

I think two components (probably I do not know enough about the injuries) 1. blow on head to kill or knock out 2. rage shown with subsequent injuries.

"Lynn is coming over in a little while with soup" - that email is huge.

Need for a new Spectator article this time gently prodding LV and Audrey's friends P.K. coffee klatch the photographer the ex-husband - I think Wells articles are fine but really on the surface - time for some hard questioning somebody might remember something we know nothing about and old friend, flame, whatever.

rbbm A simple typo and that word can be read as soap...

 

[Chorley8]

My hunch is that the soup was not found but that LE did not think it important.
Just a guess.

But look that email if authentic it means that LV is the last person to see Audrey alive far as we know.

Very interesting she has never mentioned this as far as I know. Hang on aren't we on to something here? I remember LV talking about the post -Christmas visit. I don't remember her talking about the visit to take soup.

But when someone dies don't we usually remember last time we saw them?

I think Audrey's killer could be either gender.

1. email could be fake as has been discussed here killer already in house.
2. it has been noted in past the strange use of the phrase 'secondary infection' common with hospital workers.
3. the soup visit could be the murder visit
4. obviously soup as with the cake could be a pretext doesn't mean there is actual soup or an actual cake
5. there could have been a soup delivery but why didn't LV mention it (see above).


I think financial motive is paramount. I think the comments about Audrey doing handwriting analysis because of a fraudulent will are important as is the comments a poster here made about the will after showing it to a lawyer - looks suspicious.

 

[Chorley8]

Please someone with a clear head. How do the dates of 1. the first day P.K. was supposed to deliver cake and 2. the day L.V. was bringing soup line up?

 

[dotr]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/65566643/Audrey-Gleave-Murder

 

[dotr]

bbm,
http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2216816-audrey-s-story-continues/

" On the morning of Dec. 30, Phil said, he drove with his wife, Alex, from their apartment in west Hamilton to Quatrefoil, the restaurant where she worked. After dropping her off, he headed to Audrey's.

He turned his silver 2002 Hyundai Accent off Indian Trail into the driveway, past the small pond on the right and larger one on the left, and parked on the far side as he always did. He was bringing her some of her favourite cake. It was about 11 a.m."

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/65566643/Audrey-Gleave-Murder

Sorry for being a pain - but my computer doesn't want to open this link! :blushing:

Would some kind soul please provide a recap!!

Many thanks,
NSU

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Quoted from Chorly8:

<<< But when someone dies don't we usually remember last time we saw them? >>>



Yes, we do. And the circumstances (ie: it was raining), where we were when we heard the news (ie: in bed sleeping), what we were wearing, who told us the news, what we did in the next few minutes (ie: I phoned my husband).

:twocents:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

One last thing from me right now :blushing: :

I'm having difficulties believing the 'soup thing'. I'm tending to believe the cake delivery for the simple reason that LE would have found the cake.....somewhere. (Car, garage, driveway, somewhere near the body).

But the soup.......not so much!!

:waitasec:

 

[MsSherlock]

When looking for a statement about "blood in the home" I found this:

Thread #2, PK, post 425
"When I raised the door (garage) I saw Audrey lying on the floor............."

Thread #2, PK, post 582
"I did not go inside the house (with LE) .............."
_________________________________________________
What we should perhaps note:
PK wrote in the same post 582:
"I do find the timing of the vet visit to be an interesting open question ..."

Especially to NSU: "The perp is dead" would then fit?
_________________________________________________
The "blood in the home" I have not found yet. I remember that it was mentioned in connection with the cleaning action. I wondered and thought that I had probably not perfectly fitted and felt overwhelmed with all the information.

Interesting-if PK did not go into the home with LE, how did LE know things were missing? LV? who had been in the house only once before? Did PK ever mention anything about LV or anyone else coming to the crime scene after AG was found?

 

[Woodland]

Interesting-if PK did not go into the home with LE, how did LE know things were missing? LV? who had been in the house only once before? Did PK ever mention anything about LV or anyone else coming to the crime scene after AG was found?

Interesting observation MsSherlock - I looked for, but never found PK mentioning LV nor LV mentioning PK, as if they did not know one another.

The reason I find this memorable is a video clip of LV, PK and AK before the memorial service, standing together (in front of AG's residence?). LV and PK are standing very close speaking to one another almost in a conspiratorial manner, imo showing familiarity - AK is standing off to one side.

It didn't ring true to me that they did not know one another.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I agree with Woodland - it's not feasible that PK and LV were not known to each other. Even merely in conversations with AG:

LV : Who does your lawn work?
AG: A friend of mine named PK.

PK: (In an e-mail) Why can't I cut the lawn on Thursday?
AG: Because my friend LV will be visiting.

As keep saying........we're missing something huge here.......

:twocents:

 

[Deleted member 102539]

One last thing from me right now :blushing: :

I'm having difficulties believing the 'soup thing'. I'm tending to believe the cake delivery for the simple reason that LE would have found the cake.....somewhere. (Car, garage, driveway, somewhere near the body).

But the soup.......not so much!!

:waitasec:

As far as I know PK has again put the "Christstollen" back to his car after he had found AG.
Actually, we know from the soup only by email. Maybe this thing is really unimportant.
I also find it very strange: I'm so sick that other people have to cook for me a pot of soup and one day later even drive to the vet. As an good old friend, in that emergency he would have brought me the recipe/medicin to my home. This doesn't fit together I think?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I agree with Woodland - it's not feasible that PK and LV were not known to each other. Even merely in conversations with AG:

PK: (In an e-mail) Why can't I cut the lawn on Thursday?
AG: Because my friend LV will be visiting.

As keep saying........we're missing something huge here.......

:twocents:

LV and PK should probably never meet one another. Why PK can't cut the lawn while I'm sitting in the garage with my friend LV??? - Maybe because one person was allowed to enter the house and the other person was not?

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Regarding the vet:

We've had birds since 1990 and we've always had to take the bird(s) to the vet's office for minor things like nail clipping. Even the year I was suffering severe influenza! :scared:

And as far as medicines are concerned, we've also had to go to the vet's office to pick up the meds. And the vet (at that time until recently) lived across the street from us!

What I'm trying to say is that perhaps it's protocol that the meds are picked up by the pet owners themselves. Maybe for financial reasons - our vet runs the Visa through a computer and there's a permanent record that we paid and that the bird(s) are receiving the correct meds.

Just trying to make some sense of all this........

Oh, and our vet and I are friends. I have her e-mail and we keep in touch frequently. But still we have to get the meds at her office.

:twocents:

 

[dotr]

Looking for info about the timing of the vet visit, was reminded of the pet cemetery and Audrey's frequent visits there.
http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2182146-friends-remember-audrey-gleave/

" Police have described the murder as a random attack. There are unnamed items missing from the home.

Gleave&#8217;s two German Shepherds, Togi and Schatzen, were in a different area of the house than where Gleave&#8217;s body was found.

They were originally taken to animal control, but have been taken to a kennel where German Shepherds are bred. After being assessed, they will be adopted out.

&#8220;They won&#8217;t be euthanized,&#8221; said Gleave&#8217;s veterinarian, Dudley Collins, who knew her for 30 years and last saw her a couple of days before Christmas.

Dogs were very important in Gleave&#8217;s life, he said. She would visit the graves of former pets at the Ancaster Pet Cemetery every two or three weeks"



From same article.Bbm.
" Occasionally Vanstone would go out to Gleave&#8217;s home, she said.

Whether it was a snowstorm or heat wave, they would always sit outside on a bench and chat"

 

[Chorley8]

Wow it's taken us forever to get to this obvious point though it has been hinted at I remember writing about a 'small conspiracy" and 2SoccerMom rejoined that it would have come out in the open by now.

Of course it might not there is a big difference between sharing hundreds of thousands of dollars and going on with your life..... and getting life in prison.

I would like to know where Audrey got her dogs - the breeder etc.

I agree with Woodland - it's not feasible that PK and LV were not known to each other. Even merely in conversations with AG:

LV : Who does your lawn work?
AG: A friend of mine named PK.

PK: (In an e-mail) Why can't I cut the lawn on Thursday?
AG: Because my friend LV will be visiting.

As keep saying........we're missing something huge here.......

:twocents:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Quoted from dotr's post:

<<< Whether it was a snowstorm or heat wave, they would always sit outside on a bench and chat" >>>


OK, so this says LV was NEVER inside AG's house. Why then did LV say she's been inside the house ONCE?


Unless to cover her bases regarding trace evidence. AG is dead, so who can prove it was never, once or ten thousand times?

:twocents: