Canada - Connor, 6, & Noah Barthe, 4, killed by python, Campbellton, NB, 5 Aug 2013

[nao]

jmo - when the snake dropped from the ceiling, the 2 boys most probably jerked awake.

The snake would just react to the movement, if the boys were close together the snake was big enough to get them both at the same time, all the snake wants to do is stop the movement it would not realize there are 2 separate beings.
It most definatly would not constrict them separatley. There might not be a bite mark. Snakes usually lunge first, sometimes they miss, its not an important part of subduing the prey. The snake might mouth them after to check what it caught.
If the snake is excited, they just move so fast, they make mistakes. I fed mine freezer mice, the snake gets excited by the smell, but they wont take the feed unless theres movement, and that included my hand and arm, they can get very frenzied and aggressive when in hunt mode. moo

 

[Donjeta]

How far were the shopkeeper and his son sleeping? They didn't hear anything?

 

[matou]

How far were the shopkeeper and his son sleeping? They didn't hear anything?

He told Global News he didn’t hear a sound during the incident and only discovered the “horrific scene” when he went into his living room, where the two boys were sleeping, on Monday morning. At that point, Savoie said he saw the snake, pinned it down and put the reptile in a cage.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/08/06/...r-in-shock-after-python-kills-two-young-boys/

 

[tezi]

I think we have left Hinky Hollow and now are in Guilty Gulley territory.

He should be facing child neglect resulting in death charges at the very least here.

IMO

 

[matou]

Dave Rose, uncle of the mother of the boys, read a statement from the family that thanked the public for support but also asked for privacy as the family grieves.

Rose said Connor would have entered Grade 2 this year, while Noah was "extremely excited to join his big brother by starting kindergarten."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2013/08/06/nb-snake-boys-campbellton-mayor.html

 

[Steely Dan]

And how does this guy, Jean-Claude Savoie SEE the alleged hole in the ceiling before he turns on a light? But doesn't see the snake and two children until after he turns on a light!? This whole story just stinks more and more with every new detail!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...es-2-boys-5-7-sleep-New-Brunswick-Canada.html


"They were sleeping,' he said in an interview. But 'they didn't even open their eyes or nothing. I thought they were sleeping until I [saw] the hole in the ceiling. I turned the lights on and I [saw] this horrific scene.'

Why didn't Savoie rush to see if his son was ok? Instead he:

"Mr Savoie said that after finding the boys' bodies, he found the snake coiled in a hole nearby, held it down and put it in a cage."

How did he happen to know where this snake went to hide after he allegedly see's this 'horrific sight'? I thought he saw the snake strangling the two boys, that would be horrific. BUT then his story goes from seeing a hole in the ceiling to turning on a light only to see a horrific site to finding this huge snake in some hole nearby, then held it down and put it in a cage!?

By the way, why was Savoie checking on these two boys at 6.30am ? Did he check on his own son? Why weren't the two boys and his son sleeping together ? Where is the mother of his son? How old is his son?

There's no way that these two boys slept through all this and never made a sound! As for Savoie's fb, I don't even want to see it. When I saw his photo in one of the articles, combined with his story, I had my own suspicions. I think these two boys were strangled to death, but not by this snake! I also have my suspicions as to why!

I hope we hear more today, and I'm so sorry these two children have died in such a hideous way.

BBM

Things I've wondered about too.

So it's clear:

African rock python involved in killing of young New Brunswick brothers was being kept in apartment, not the pet store below



Oh, and that wasn't noisy. Shafts are made of metal, no?

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...runswick-brothers-may-be-illegal-in-province/

If a shaft was made of rubber one would think it would make noise.

If this actually happened the way it's being portrayed it would be a one in a billion happening according to what I've seen in the articles. (The odds are my uneducated calculation)

I think it's possible he gave the kids a sedative to make them sleep and may have overdosed them by accident.

The whole thing seems too odd to be the way it's being told.

 

[Miss_Diana]

The autopsies should reveal everything. I would think that a snake would kill it's prey by squeezing it's body, not neck (articles mention strangulation).

I agree with this ... the autopsy should show, if they were 'crushed' or died in another manner. I would think that their chests (ribs, etc.) would be broken and crushed, and perhaps also their necks. UGH ... hate to write that.

 

[wfgodot]

Daily Mail's latest update, lots of pictures plus a video and the article here:

Revealed: How 16ft python escaped through hole in enclosure and strangled sleeping
brothers, 4 and 6, as heartbroken family describes boys' final happy hours before tragedy

• Noah and Connor Barthe were sleeping when an African rock python in a nearby room escaped its cage through a small hole in the ceiling
• It slithered through a ventilation shaft, which collapsed as the snake moved across the living room, where the boys were sleeping
• A criminal investigation has been launched but no charges so far
• Officials said African rock pythons are not allowed in the province
• Boys spent final day playing with friends and visiting farm

 

[Miss_Diana]

jmo - the snake was chasing a rodent scent thru the ceiling, it may of struck at something and popped a hole in the ceiling or just its weight caused a collapse. If the snake is excited anything that moves they'll have a go at, and they are not tidy in constricting, they will just try and subdue all movement.

The boys would probably have a startled movement when the snake landed, the snake would just react to the movement.
It would of been very quick, the snake would hold and keep coiling till movement ceased.

I had smaller snakes but it was quite the learning curve. i learnt to ball my hand up into a fist if i wanted to handle them when there was feed around, and then let them scent me, otherwise some of the more enthusiastic feeders would go after my hand, they would release once they realized their mistake.

And some were very intent on escape, they would push at their enclosures looking for weakness or mistakes. i had one that figured out how to open the sliding glass of its enclosure, though none of the others of its variety even tried. Mine maxed at 6ft. Also the snake, being domesticated, would relate human scent to food source. moo

BBM: that was my thought also, it may not have poked the hole, it may have fallen through, from it's weight alone. MOO

 

[Snoopster]

Oh my! After a lovely few days away in lake country, this is what I see. It just seems too strange to me!

Yes, it could have 'simply' been and escaped snake...but the circumstances are just to weird for me. Something isn't right here!

If the snake was hungry wouldn't it have 'just' gone after one of the boys?? I sure hope they do a thorough autopsy!

The circumstances of this terrible situation are just so over the top that I find them difficult to believe. Just sayin'.

 

[AzPistonsGirl]

I am just reading all of your posts with my mouth hanging open. There are just no words. I am on the fence as to what really happened, but at the very least, it is negligence to the nth degree.

Thanks to NOA and others who (seem to) have experience with snakes or retiles like these and can offer additional info for basic snake questions.

 

[wfgodot]

So. Python gets out of cage via hole, shinnies up into ventilation system, crawls through it across ceiling, a portion of which collapses. If the snake (iirc, weighing about a hundred pounds) and part of the vent had fallen directly on the boys, would this have been enough in itself to kill them?

 

[Solitaryone]

He told Global News he didn’t hear a sound during the incident and only discovered the “horrific scene” when he went into his living room, where the two boys were sleeping, on Monday morning. At that point, Savoie said he saw the snake, pinned it down and put the reptile in a cage.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/08/06/...r-in-shock-after-python-kills-two-young-boys/

I was just wondering this too! Savoie goes to check up on the two children at 6:30am. I had wondered WHY he felt the need to check on them, but makes no mention of checking his own son. He never said he was woken by any noise, so why did he need to check on these two boys so early in the morning? And the article doesn't state Savoie was sleeping during "the incident", just that he "didn't hear a sound during the incident."

And this:

"Asked why anyone in the apartment didn’t appear to have heard anything, Tremblay said that was still under investigation.

“It’s something the investigators are going to talk to people about and we are not there yet,” he said."

Savoie's story just does not make sense. What really happened here?

 

[AzPistonsGirl]

what kind of ventilation system was this anyway? How can something that may weigh 100lbs break through the duct tube thingy and the drywall? Really? Snakes move slowly, deliberatly, with constant contact with the floor (or surface). Seems so illogical.

And why was the cage in a place where the snake could shimmy into the ventilation system? My ventilation system is totally inaccessible unless you want to access it, KWIM.

 

[gitana1]

Had to quote this! This is just so scary! Why would anyone have these reptiles as pets? These reptiles are not meant to be pets! This video just gives me the creeps big time!

Well, a lot of people are fascinated by reptiles and exotic fish, etc. I'm more into animals with skin and fur but to each his own.

jmo - when the snake dropped from the ceiling, the 2 boys most probably jerked awake.

The snake would just react to the movement, if the boys were close together the snake was big enough to get them both at the same time, all the snake wants to do is stop the movement it would not realize there are 2 separate beings.
It most definatly would not constrict them separatley. There might not be a bite mark. Snakes usually lunge first, sometimes they miss, its not an important part of subduing the prey. The snake might mouth them after to check what it caught.
If the snake is excited, they just move so fast, they make mistakes. I fed mine freezer mice, the snake gets excited by the smell, but they wont take the feed unless theres movement, and that included my hand and arm, they can get very frenzied and aggressive when in hunt mode. moo

Don't you think the boys would keep trying to move if a big snake was squeezing them? You said they won't take the feed unless there is movement. I'm confused. If he was squeezing them and they struggled wouldn't it try to eat them? Or bite? Have you ever known a snake to suffocate its prey and then leave it for later? Or are you saying that this snake could have constricted both boys to death, and even after all that time, realize its mistake and leave them alone without trying to eat them? What about all the articles we have read about snake attacks which state they would strike first or try to eat the human after suffocating them? The cases of suffocation pretty much all included attempts at eating the humans involved except in the case when someones was standing nearby and watched the suffocation (and presumably got the snake off before it began to eat).

I think it is possible that these little boys were killed by the snake but if they had no bite or compression marks, well, then no way!

 

[Tulessa]

2 children dead after large snake escapes n.b. Urban zoo. (cbc.ca)


eta: Thread title notwithstanding, more recent reports have said the snake
was a python; also, the initially reported "urban zoo" is now called a pet store

omg!

 

[gitana1]

I was just wondering this too! Savoie goes to check up on the two children at 6:30am. I had wondered WHY he felt the need to check on them, but makes no mention of checking his own son. He never said he was woken by any noise, so why did he need to check on these two boys so early in the morning? And the article doesn't state Savoie was sleeping during "the incident", just that he "didn't hear a sound during the incident."

And this:

"Asked why anyone in the apartment didn’t appear to have heard anything, Tremblay said that was still under investigation.

“It’s something the investigators are going to talk to people about and we are not there yet,” he said."

Savoie's story just does not make sense. What really happened here?

Savoie checking on the boys at 6:30 a.m. is not a problem to me at all. That's what a responsible parent/adult does and just because there is no mention of him also checking on his son doesn;t mean he didn't or wasn't going to. I just don't think "Oh, and then I checked on my own son" would be pertinent to the story most media want to publish.

In too many cases, parents are seen as hinky for not checking on their kids until very late. I think it's natural to check on the kids under your care when you first get up or get up to pee or whatever.

No, what makes this story stink is not that for me.

Not hearing anything does seem odd but maybe that's what woke him up? Maybe he had been drinking the night before and was deeply sleeping so it took him awhile?

I;m also bothered by the statement that the boys never woke up or even opened their eyes while the snake killed them. But there could be a language translation issue there. Also, seeing a gaping hole in the ceiling may be possible without turning on the lights first. He may have seen debris all over the boys and naturally looked up, saw the hole and switched on the lights. (Sunrise is at 6:10 a.m. there, at this time of the year: http://time.unitarium.com/sunrise/152910).

For me, whether or not there were bite or compression marks on their bodies (not just necks) is the clincher. If those exist, I will believe this was an improbable, crazy accident due to a negligent owner. If not, well, something will be very rotten.

 

[Tulessa]

I am sorry, But snakes need to be outlawed as pets. My son wanted one when he came home from Japan and I told him *Not in my house*!!

 

[Solitaryone]

I am sorry, But snakes need to be outlawed as pets. My son wanted one when he came home from Japan and I told him *Not in my house*!!

I agree, I think certain kinds of snakes are outlawed as pets. Didn't one of the articles say that this kind of snake was outlawed in Canada?

ETA:Here it says regarding the law and this type snake:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...es-2-boys-5-7-sleep-New-Brunswick-Canada.html

"A New Brunswick government official, Steven Benteau, said African rock pythons are not allowed under the Exotic Wildlife Regulation.

'It is illegal for anyone to keep any exotic species that is not listed in the regulation unless they have a permit from the Department of Natural Resources,' he said.

"'If such an animal is found, it will be confiscated and the person who possesses the animal can be charged under the Fish and Wildlife Act.'

 

[Tulessa]

I agree, I think certain kinds of snakes are outlawed as pets. Didn't one of the articles say that this kind of snake was outlawed in Canada?

Yes and they are unbalancing Florida's wildlife. They are killing off the natural species. People buy them, then turn them loose when they can't handle them. Florida is having a lot of trouble with tropical snake explosions! We have to keep our system balanced! Sorry, Cherokee rant off. :blushing: