GUILTY Canada - Kienan Hebert, 3, Sparwood BC, 7 Sept 2011 - #1

[SnoopyDoobyDoo]

Maybe he got into the house but "lured" them instead of grabbing them, in case the child started crying

That would be consistent with his previous charges, when he was overheard trying to lure the foster child in 2007. Either he lured Kienan or he got fed up and physically snatched him after the first failed attempt.

 

[KMouse]

Yes..what you said. I think he either got there in his car, or a stolen 4-wheeler or boat he had stashed.

I fully agree with all the posters who have commented on this issue.

Now knowing Hopley tried to lure another child makes me fully believe that he had his lair all set up somewhere first.

Something that is bugging me is where the heck is the car? Searches are being done by air. If the car was abandoned it would be seen.

That's why the people that are going out and checking parkland and cabins etc. are going to be crucial.

 

[Bravo]

This is just heartbreaking. I check in here often. Thank You all for the updates. Praying Kienan is found soon.

 

[Peazzzer]

I am thinking the car is under a canopy of trees? That style car is small enough to park anywhere! The thought of the conversation w his mother just makes me sick, never mind the fact that this creep has the history of scoping his victims family and routine. The failed abduction attempt the same night makes me retch! I am praying this baby boy is found alive!

 

[matou]

I think people should be looking out for chimney smoke and/or firepit smoke, in case he has a cabin or spot where he needs to cook with fire. I agree that he likely had an ATV stashed somewhere, one he stole. He would need a portable tank of gas for the ATV.

 

[jwbear]

I pray for the safe return of little Kienan, our system sucks here. It seems every couple years we hear about another predator who should have never seen the light of day reoffending over and over. Remember Peter Whitmore?

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20060803/whitmore_chronology_060803/

I hope he is home safe and sound ASAP!

 

[nao]

Quote elepher50#449 Another attempted abduction of another child the same night that Kienan was taken .... good Lord give me strength.

No kidding, tiny town, an attempted abduction and then a missing child, thats not normal
thats a set up road blocks, move quickly situation. Did they get finger prints, anything from first case. Are they truly sure Randall Hopley has Kienan.?
They should have a BSTS - better safe than sorry system- i feel so sorry for the person that caused the ferry to return - what difference does it make if an Amber Alert goes up quick-it can be cancelled just as quickly.

 

[KMouse]

I am thinking the car is under a canopy of trees? That style car is small enough to park anywhere! The thought of the conversation w his mother just makes me sick, never mind the fact that this creep has the history of scoping his victims family and routine. The failed abduction attempt the same night makes me retch! I am praying this baby boy is found alive!

Every piece of property with outbuildings, every cabin, every campsite needs to be checked. Cabins these days can be quite fancy and have large sheds and garages. That car is stashed somewhere.
I don't think Hopley is on the move with a quad or the car. I think he's holed up in his nest. I wonder how much food and water etc. he has.

No stone unturned. As far as this goes it sounds like the police and the groups of searchers are doing a fantastic job. Hopley couldn't have gotten too far. Especially if he had his lair all decked out...he would have had to have been making trips with his supplies.

 

[Flossie JMO]

No offense to you and I feel your frustration because I'm also Canadian and am disgusted with how well we treat our criminals. I wouldn't hold my breath with anything changing.

I predict he will be captured, some doctor will find him insane, he'll be sent to some psych hospital for a few years and then out again.

Remember this? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/05/greyhound-bus-beheading-s_n_172224.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manit...ce-li-walks-mental-health-centre-selkirk.html


Sickening

hm, since you mentioned psych hospitals, remember Peter Woodcock?

---
"Woodcock killed his first victim, 6-year-old Wayne Mallette, at the CNE grounds on Sept. 16, 1956. Another boy was soon arrested and convicted of Mallette's murder and was serving time in a youth detention centre when Woodcock was finally caught.

His second victim was 9-year-old Gary Morris. Woodcock picked him up in Cabbagetown three weeks after Mallette's murder and strangled him at Cherry Beach. On Jan. 19, 1957, he killed Carole Voyce, 4, under the Bloor Viaduct. A very accurate police drawing of Woodcock, which ran on the front page of the Star, cracked the case.

Woodcock arrived in Penetang [Oak Ridge psych hospital for criminally insane] just as psychiatrists began trying to find ways to cure psychopathic offenders. In the 1960s and 1970s, he was fed LSD. He participated in something called "The Hundred Day Hate-In," where psychopaths were jammed into a room together to force them to develop empathy. He was given powerful drugs and lived in a giant, dark artificial womb for several days.

These treatments did not work. Woodcock was transferred to less restrictive institutions, eventually arriving at the Brockville Psychiatric Hospital. Staff indulged his passion for trains by taking him to the Smiths Falls Railway Museum, and took him to see Silence of the Lambs.

At the same time, Woodcock, who had legally changed his name to David Michael Krueger, had rekindled a relationship with Bruce Hamill, an Ottawa killer who had been released from Penetang and was working as a security guard at the Ottawa courthouse.Woodcock convinced Hamill an alien brotherhood would solve his problems if he helped kill another Brockville inmate, Dennis Kerr.

On July 13, 1991, Hamill went to a hardware store, bought a plumber's wrench, hatchet, knives and a sleeping bag, then went to the Brockville hospital and signed out Woodcock on his first publicly escorted day pass. They lured Kerr to a secluded spot and butchered him. "

woodcock passed away in 2010
http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario...al-killer-they-couldn-t-cure-dies-behind-bars

and

"Woodcock was apprehended for the murders in 1957, found not guilty by reason of insanity, and placed in Oak Ridge, an Ontario psychiatric facility located in Penetanguishene.[1][2] There, he legally changed his name.[1] Following the completion of a treatment program for Woodcock and other psychopathic individuals, he was deemed greatly improved, and sent to a medium-security hospital in Brockville, Ontario in 1991. There, Woodcock claims, he fell in love with fellow psychiatric patient Dennis Kerr, who rejected his sexual advances.[2] During the first hour of his first weekend pass in 35 years, Woodcock stabbed Kerr to death. Woodcock was being supervised on the pass by Bruce Hamill, a former patient who had killed an elderly Ottawa woman in 1977. Hamill was an accomplice in the Brockville murder, and both men were subsequently returned to Oak Ridge.[1] Woodcock has told how the treatment program served only to make him more adept at manipulating others.[2] Having spent 53 years in custody, the majority of that time at Oak Ridge, Woodcock died there on March 5, 2010, his 71st birthday.[1]"


VictimsWayne Mallette – seven-year-old boy lured into the deserted Toronto Exhibition grounds on September 15, 1956. Originally another teen, identified only as "Ronald Mowatt", was charged with the child's murder.
Gary Morris – nine-year-old boy lured to Cherry Beach on October 6, 1956.
Carole Voyce – four-year-old girl murdered by Woodcock on January 19, 1957 in a ravine under the Prince Edward Viaduct.
Dennis Kerr – psychiatric inmate murdered on July 13, 1991 with a knife and hatchet by Peter Woodcock with the help of a former inmate, Bruce Hamill.


Peter Woodcock - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[SnoopyDoobyDoo]

I'm having problems with video, but have the police confirmed when they were made aware of the first abduction attempt? It wouldn't make a difference to the investigation, but I would hate for the police to be getting blamed for not issuing a warning (in the middle of the night?), or not acting fast enough to catch Hopley before he had a chance to abduct Kienan, or whatever, when they didn't know about it until after.The possibilites range from "On the scene and investigating potential abduction, running background checks and coming up with Hopley's name and not immediately acting" to "Kid sees Hopley's face on the news and says 'That's the man from my bedroom last night' and investigation provides evidence of attempted abduction after Amber Alert was already issued." And that second option is freaking me right out, so I'll be stopping that train of thought at the nearest station.

 

[JeannieC]

I pray for the safe return of little Kienan, our system sucks here. It seems every couple years we hear about another predator who should have never seen the light of day reoffending over and over. Remember Peter Whitmore?

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20060803/whitmore_chronology_060803/

I hope he is home safe and sound ASAP!

Its not just your system. It everywhere. Our most precious gift seems to be the least protected. I guess that's not true either. Murders, rapist, child predators, child abusers, etc. they serve some time and come back to do it again. THIS IS OUR NEVER ENDING STORY!

 

[Snoopster]

Every piece of property with outbuildings, every cabin, every campsite needs to be checked. Cabins these days can be quite fancy and have large sheds and garages. That car is stashed somewhere.
I don't think Hopley is on the move with a quad or the car. I think he's holed up in his nest. I wonder how much food and water etc. he has.

No stone unturned. As far as this goes it sounds like the police and the groups of searchers are doing a fantastic job. Hopley couldn't have gotten too far. Especially if he had his lair all decked out...he would have had to have been making trips with his supplies.

BBM

I think you're bang on, KMouse.

 

[~n/t~]

Every piece of property with outbuildings, every cabin, every campsite needs to be checked. Cabins these days can be quite fancy and have large sheds and garages. That car is stashed somewhere.
I don't think Hopley is on the move with a quad or the car. I think he's holed up in his nest. I wonder how much food and water etc. he has.

No stone unturned. As far as this goes it sounds like the police and the groups of searchers are doing a fantastic job. Hopley couldn't have gotten too far. Especially if he had his lair all decked out...he would have had to have been making trips with his supplies.

I agree that he's probably holed up by now but his car is still not found. Where could he have "stashed" it? And if he did dump it somewhere, how did he get to his final destination? Walk with Kienan? Or is the car hidden in the woods somewhere?

This is so sad and frustrating. I want this precious baby to be found.

 

[KMouse]

I agree that he's probably holed up by now but his car is still not found. Where could he have "stashed" it? And if he did dump it somewhere, how did he get to his final destination? Walk with Kienan? Or is the car hidden in the woods somewhere?

This is so sad and frustrating. I want this precious baby to be found.

If the car is hidden in the woods somewhere then it has to be somewhere that is driveable KWIM? I wonder if this perp changed his MO from the last time when he was in a cabin. Just thinking out loud and going through possibilities in my head. These creeps come up with all kinds of ways that normal people like us can't think of....like having underground lairs etc. That's the part that scares me the most. That this perp has something sophisticated somewhere that he has been working on. I am hoping though that he went with what he knew and is in somebody's cabin.

The other part that scares me is these pedophile groups etc. online where these creeps get ideas from each other. Another poster mentioned it I believe and that sends shivers down my spine.

 

[JeannieC]

If the car is hidden in the woods somewhere then it has to be somewhere that is driveable KWIM? I wonder if this perp changed his MO from the last time when he was in a cabin. Just thinking out loud and going through possibilities in my head. These creeps come up with all kinds of ways that normal people like us can't think of....like having underground lairs etc. That's the part that scares me the most. That this perp has something sophisticated somewhere that he has been working on. I am hoping though that he went with what he knew and is in somebody's cabin.

The other part that scares me is these pedophile groups etc. online where these creeps get ideas from each other. Another poster mentioned it I believe and that sends shivers down my spine.[/QUOTE]

Bolded by me.

I know LE monitors those websites and possibly someone will get a lead on him that way. God Bless anyone who has to go on those sites and connect with these people. I couldn't do it. It has to give them nighmares!

 

[nao]

Matou - yea i thought same thing- theres gotta be smoke - but - i live west coast cabin country. Out here some people rent their cabins for the winter season, some hire or get their buds to check their cabins - so the caretakers might stay there for a few nites.
Fishing gear, boats, gas,canned food,dryed food,fire wood, cars, trucks(i live ferry dependant place), they leave keys, they don't lock up - causes less damage, some places are boat access only, cops don't worry about it,its really to be expected, spring time the insurance claims come in, I feel like i'm advertising, bear, racoons,squaters, its to be expected.
You could do the winter without going to town. He cares about his car, he'll cover it keep it safe, you still have to start old car once in a while, or battery will die, car motor will sieze.
Out here its common curtisy to pick up hitchhikers, locals will actually offer you rides if your not hitchhicking, its sweet(30yr inner city jaded)
Kienan is freckled face, red head lill cutie, in a small town adults come an go, but the little fella he'll stand out.

 

[curiousc]

I wonder what the father meant by Kienan can't speak? I'm even more upset now knowing this guy tried to abduct another child. Did LE know this? Is that why when Kienan was abducted they immediately named Hopley as a suspect?

Where is Kienan?

I think what he meant is the child isn't able to vocalize well. My third child is 3 and cannot speak very well. Some kids develop their vocabulary after 3 and some before.

 

[flipflop]

I think what he meant is the child isn't able to vocalize well. My third child is 3 and cannot speak very well. Some kids develop their vocabulary after 3 and some before.

Having several brothers and sisters, he probably doesn't have to speak. Back when I was that age, my older sister (who had the gift to gab) did all the talking for me, my parents said I didn't really start talking until I was 4 (when my sister started school)

 

[Kamille]

I'm having problems with video, but have the police confirmed when they were made aware of the first abduction attempt? It wouldn't make a difference to the investigation, but I would hate for the police to be getting blamed for not issuing a warning (in the middle of the night?), or not acting fast enough to catch Hopley before he had a chance to abduct Kienan, or whatever, when they didn't know about it until after.The possibilites range from "On the scene and investigating potential abduction, running background checks and coming up with Hopley's name and not immediately acting" to "Kid sees Hopley's face on the news and says 'That's the man from my bedroom last night' and investigation provides evidence of attempted abduction after Amber Alert was already issued." And that second option is freaking me right out, so I'll be stopping that train of thought at the nearest station.

A horrible thought but I can actually see your second example as being quite possible. If the child was in their room and being lured out in the middle of the night but they didn't go and parent's weren't awakened, at what point would the child tell the parents about their "visitor"?

By the next morning, when police were called on Kieran, if the police were aware of the other abduction attempt, I would think they would have already checked out RH's home and location. They had to have known they had this predator in their midst for them to have gone to his home a half hour after they responded to Kieran's disappearance.

Or were they so quick because they were already in the middle of investigating the attempt and his name came up then? :waitasec:

 

[dotr]

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/09/10/parents-plea-for-tots-safe-return
We have been able to make significant advances in this priority investigation," Moskaluk said at the press conference Saturday.

Earlier in the week police visited a property where Hopley is renting a room.

"This residence has been surveilled since the onset," said Moskulak. "We have to look at the possibilit(y) of the individual coming forth himself, perhaps returning to the residence."

Orville Sheets, the 74-year-old owner of the property, said police took some papers from the residence, but he didn't know what they were. He told QMI Agency Hopley's car - a brown Toyota Camry with B.C. licence plate 098 RAL - was parked on the site the morning the tot was reported missing.

Mounties are hoping surveillance videos from individuals and businesses will help them get a break in the search for the boy and his alleged abductor