CANADA - Lucas Fowler & Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #6

[JuneBug67]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/manitoba-german-canoe-crash-1.4266176?__vfz=medium=sharebar

I read all the articles about the two German tourists who used a flimsy canoe on Hayes river, and then walked to Gillam area.

I am surprised that this amazing story didn't come up earlier, during all the expert discussions on outdoor survival.

These guys walked 115km through muskeg and rivers, exactly at this time of year in 2017.

Amazing. I’m sure somebody must have posted some kind of ‘walking on muskeg’ video somewhere along the way, but just in case anybody missed it:

 

[pissnglass]

What you've described is entirely plausible; it could be exactly what transpired. Like you, I don't think we're dealign with evil geniuses or criminal masterminds. I think they've been fortunate that there's been latency between the times their crimes were committed and the points at which law enforcement discovered the crimes and figured out what happened. The vast distances and wilderness are significant factors.

This scenario is so plausible, in fact, that I'm satisfied with this information instead of chomping at the bit for any piece of official info for now. I mean don't get me wrong they need to get those little *advertiser censored**h**es and soon but you whet my whistle info wise

 

[Normancita]

I have asked this before. What is the motive?

Why were Lucas and Chynna seating on chairs and looking calm after they broke down? Were they waiting for somebody? Who was the bearded man they were seen arguing with and why is he no longer being sought by the police?

Was the bearded man Prof. Leonard Dyck?

 

[otto]

Agree with your logic on this topic.

The press did jump on the story relatively quickly and some of the more intrepid journalists asked about the possiblity of a serial killer and this put the RCMP on alert and perhaps it also stopped them from releasing any information early in the process as this seems to be their default MO. It wasn't really until the press started talking about public safety of tourists and residents that more info started to be shared but it was in drips and drabs.

Going back and reading the initial articles on the 'missing' story, I truly wonder if RCMP knew earlier than we might even be giving them credit for about what they were dealing with in this case? It seems like RCMP came up the missing narrative in this case and not the families of the 2 suspects. The reason I wonder this is because we have no evidence that any of the family of either of the two suspects ever filed missing reports or even contacted RCMP or local police in BC. We just have the early statements of BS father talking about his son being missing and perhaps heading to the woods to hide, but those statements didn't sound like BS father had reported him missing either. Reading those early 'missing' articles now, it seems like the RCMP declared the two missing and then called their parents/family to confirm. MOO but going back and reading these articles again left me seeing now that from the beginning this wasn't a missing case.

I am curious though about why the RCMP made the choices they did in terms of the info flow to the public as if I recall there was another delay that lasted until the 2nd Press Briefing when the RCMP made the statement that 'gun violence' was involved.

So you have the initial ID delay and another COD delay that related IMO clearly to public safety issues.

This is what police had to work with until July 18. Basically they had 2 bodies and a van.

"Around 7:19 a.m. on July 15, Northern Rockies RCMP were called to a location on Highway 97, also known as the Alaska Highway, about 20 kilometres (12 miles) south of Liard Hot Springs, B.C. Officers who arrived at the scene found the bodies of two adults, and both deaths appeared suspicious. An older blue minivan with Alberta license plates was also located at the scene.

On July 18, Northern Rockies RCMP revealed that they had confirmed the identities of the victims. B.C. RCMP spokesperson Sgt. Janelle Shoihet stated in a news release that the two individuals are Chynna Noelle Deese of the United States and Lucas Robertson Fowler of Australia."​

Updated: tourist couple from North Carolina and Australia found murdered in Northern B.C.

DailyMail grabbed the headline and started the "serial murder" rumour, which RCMP had to address. Based on all the links posted here, it seems like there were daily updates from then on.

The suspects were on a road trip to look for work, and the parents probably expected to hear from there from time to time and not every day, so they were never reported missing. When RCMP found their burned truck, they considered them missing.

 

[steelybird]

Okay...so I just signed up yesterday and this is my first post and I haven't even made it through all the comments from this morning yet so apologies if I'm repeating anything someone else has voiced.
I've been watching this case since the start for numerous reasons:
1. I live in BC and to be completely honest I am terrified they will come back this way. I know it is unlikely as they would easily be recognized, but it IS their home and if at some point they need that level of comfort maybe they would. I also have a camping trip planned soon, and well....not sure how I feel about going now. Though this is all just my own paranoia taking over and I am aware of that.
2. This is what I really want to discuss....I keep seeing people talk about how they were part of gaming communities and how that apparently is the cause for what they are doing, and/or that they have had help from them.
What I want to say about that is this....First, one of the people they Were associated with that way have already come forward with information so what is making anyone think that they are helping them?! Also, what makes you think that the police are not already looking into this? They've been to their houses....I''m sure they have collected any electronics they could and would be checking through them for any useful information. If they had been talking with people online about 'a plan' or something, the police likely already know and have spoken with said person.
Second, just because someone plays video games does mean that they are more likely to go off on some spree(assuming that is what they are doing).

I'm sorry if I sound angry, but this type of thing bothers me quite a bit. I've been playing video games my whole life and Yes, ALL kinds of games. I am fully aware of reality vs. a game....I am fully aware of right vs. wrong.....I function just fine in society. I can also say that if anyone I know through gaming were suspects of murder and a massive country wide manhunt was underway, the first I would be doing is calling the police if I had any information I thought they may need.

Please stop making this assumption simply because someone picks up a game controller.

I think people make this assumption because we relate it to other cases in which there was a connection. The suspects here indeed seem to fit that profile from the little information we know of them. Having said that I’m sure there are millions of gamers who play violent games that will never murder anyone. My opinion is that how much a violent video game influences an individual depends on their personality, genetic make up, life history, and mental wellness/illness. It may have little or no influence on some people while on others it may be highly influential. For some people the line between reality and fantasy is extremely blurred.

 

[PingTheRouter]

• 
  
  
  RCMP Manitoba
  @rcmpmb

Investigators have now received over 200 tips in the last 5 days. None have established that the suspects are outside of the Gillam area. The RCMP continues to remind the public that it's possible the suspects inadvertently received assistance & no longer in the area. #rcmpmb

 

[Kubirai]

RCMP did not initially know whether the victims were connected to the van or why they were there. They had nothing to go on until they figured out something about the van or the victims, and that part of the process was delayed by 3 days.

Fort Nelson RCMP knew immediately that two murders by gunshots took place near a blue van on Alaska Highway.

Eventual public inquiry will blame them for not warning all Alaska Highway travellers on July 15.

 

[Seattle1]

Let's suppose that the vehicle that was bought in BC at the ranch was registered by the new owner at his known BC address : the ranch.

When police learned of the incident at 7:19AM July 15, they would have tracked the licence plate to the ranch. This could have been done before RCMP arrived at the scene. The ranch owners would have immediately provided RCMP with the names and descriptions of Lucas and Chynna. Police would then contact the families of Lucas and Chynna - ranch would have Lucas family contact information - and the investigation would have been moving forward.

RCMP did not initially know whether the victims were connected to the van or why they were there. They had nothing to go on until they figured out something about the van or the victims, and that part of the process was delayed by 3 days.

I'm not understanding the emphasis on delayed investigation. There are no perfect crimes.

So is it your position that the investigation was delayed 3 days because of identification of the victims, or because the murders were not reported to msm for 3 days?

Same can be said about the delayed identification of victim Len, but I don't think the investigation came to a halt awaiting proper identification.

Len may have been resting in an authorized or unauthorized highway turnout, in a properly licensed, registered, and insured vehicle, when he was murdered by the teens.

It took a sketch and almost a week for his identity to be made.

I believe investigators work with the information they have, and look for more.

MOO

 

[Estrojane]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/manitoba-german-canoe-crash-1.4266176?__vfz=medium=sharebar

I read all the articles about the two German tourists who used a flimsy canoe on Hayes river, and then walked to Gillam area.

I am surprised that this amazing story didn't come up earlier, during all the expert discussions on outdoor survival.

These guys walked 115km through muskeg and rivers, exactly at this time of year in 2017.

Young, strong and determined. Proves it can be done. Maybe the murderous duo read all the articles on these German tourists too.

According to Bryer's father, Kam and Bryer have been practicing survival techniques for over 2 years(don't know how spartan that training was) and are also young, fairly strong, very determined and definitely deranged, to boot.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Try this link. Krever Inquiry | The Canadian Encyclopedia

Yup, absolutely nothing about reusing medical supplies there.

 

[PixieStix]

Let's suppose that the vehicle that was bought in BC at the ranch was registered by the new owner at his known BC address : the ranch.

When police learned of the incident at 7:19AM July 15, they would have tracked the licence plate to the ranch. This could have been done before RCMP arrived at the scene. The ranch owners would have immediately provided RCMP with the names and descriptions of Lucas and Chynna. Police would then contact the families of Lucas and Chynna - ranch would have Lucas family contact information - and the investigation would have been moving forward.

RCMP did not initially know whether the victims were connected to the van or why they were there. They had nothing to go on until they figured out something about the van or the victims, and that part of the process was delayed by 3 days.

How do we know it took three days to identify CD and LF? Did RCMP specifically say it took them three days to identify the bodies? I can't remember reading that, but I have had an insane work week, and I have not kept up with information like I usually would.

It's possible they knew the identities a lot earlier but did not release to the public. Also, it's possible LE knew KM and BS were connected or involved earlier in the investigation but let the media keep saying they were missing to catch them off guard potentially?

 

[Seattle1]

My whole issue is that LD didn’t die from a gunshot wound. I highly doubt that there is any ballistic evidence from that crime scene at all. So I don’t believe that ballistics evidence was the common link.

Is there a cause of death for LD? Please link. Thanks.

 

[CanadianMade]

Young, strong and determined. Proves it can be done. Maybe the murderous duo read all the articles on these German tourists too.

According to Bryer's father, Kam and Bryer have been practicing survival techniques for over 2 years(don't know how spartan that training was) and are also young, fairly strong, very determined and definitely deranged, to boot.

I don't think he said they had practiced survival techniques for 2 years. Pretty sure he said they had been playing air soft for 2 years. I don't know one way or the other, but knowing how to play air soft wouldn't make you a survival expert.

 

[Kubirai]

Was the bearded man Prof. Leonard Dyck?

No!

That witness was probably describing Derek W., the fugitive from US who crossed into Manitoba. Derek wasn't at the van either.

Let us all forget the arguing man with short dark beard. RCMP did, for good reasons.

 

[minn77]

Amazing. I’m sure somebody must have posted some kind of ‘walking on muskeg’ video somewhere along the way, but just in case anybody missed it:

thanks! You can even see all the pesky bugs

 

[Justatheory]

I'm struggling with the main 'story line' that these guys were going out on a spree and were going to go out in a blaze of glory. There have been no more killings (that we know of) and they took a very remote route, very far, and have been silent since. If they wanted to do a spree, why aren't they still killing? If they want to go out in a blaze of glory, why don't they hold someone hostage or stay in somewhat more populated areas where their crimes would be noticed?

What's the motive here? What's the ultimate objective

ETA: typo

I don't think there is one. They are alleged to have committed the ultimate crime of murder, but there is no definitive documentary evidence to prove that they are on a killing spree or that they desire to go out in a "blaze of glory." The novelist father of one of the accused put forward the latter thesis, but current evidence suggests that the suspects are attempting to evade capture and avoid conflict. As we learn more, we'll know more, but I don't think it's ever been firmly established that they're spree killers.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

They would need to charge their phones and as far as I can tell, the weather in Gillam has not been conducive to solar charges this last week

I'm not sure about solar phone chargers, but we have a huge bank of solar panels on our home. Surprisingly, we still generate a good deal of power on cloudy days and when they're absolutely green from being covered in pollen during spring. Yes, they work optimally when clean and on a bright sunny day, but DH is obsessed and stores all of the data. For example, we generate 70 kWh on a good day and the worst cloudy day with dirty panels, we generated 22kWh. The 22kWh day was unusual though. Also we used a pretty rudimentary hand-built solar oven when my boys were teens (they were always doing science experiments) and were surprised when we could still cook on cloudy days.

 

[Kubirai]

Is there a cause of death for LD? Please link. Thanks.

Australian media reported that he was shot. There were rumours that he was run over.

Only certainty at this point is that his body was left on a very visible lookout, right next to a cliff.

 

[Herat]

Amazing. I’m sure somebody must have posted some kind of ‘walking on muskeg’ video somewhere along the way, but just in case anybody missed it:

Whoa.

That doesn't look like fun at all.

 

[SiciC]

Let us all forget the arguing man with short dark beard. RCMP did, for good reasons.

I don't think their was anyone else arguing with LF and CD that night, I think whoever witnessed that misinterpreted it as a confrontation, or was witnessing the person that murdered them. I don't think they would have encountered two different hostile situations that night... I mean what are the chances they had a hostile engagement with someone, that person left, and then came along someone else who murdered them. That would be quite bad luck. Which I suppose they had anyway tbh.
jmo!