CAR SEAT discussion

[ahintexas]

Here's the thing - even if you could believe that he really forgot Cooper in the car and it didn't occur to him all day that his son was still in the car, even when he opened the door and tossed lightbulbs in - for sure he would have noticed him when he got in his car to leave work and presumably put his computer bag back in the passenger seat.

Even more so, when he walked to his car. His windows were not that tinted. You know he could see in the passenger window when he walked by to get into the car!

 

[ahintexas]

I just posted a response to this video in the Car Seat Thread - I will not side track from this thread :blushing:
except to say :blushing:
that they used a 2013 suv and not 2011. It's at the 26 or 27 second mark in video.

I would link my post here - but unsure how to do that from another thread.

my opinion etc. :moo:

The 2013 is same size as the 2011. Randy Travis stated that at beginning.

 

[Confusion]

I know this is going to sound like I'm making excuses for him, but I'm still just trying to make sure every aspect is examined. I do think he may have seen the car seat at least once during the times he was in or near the car, but he may not have paid enough attention to it to realize that CH was still in it. I do that all the time with things in my car or in my home; I walk past them, sit by them or just see them all the time so they don't stand out unless I have a reason to pay attention to them. If (Heaven forbid) I was ever in his place, I'm not sure how long it would take me to notice him either. When I backed up my car while my sons were still needing car seats, I didn't pay any attention to them when they were supposed to be empty. If I thought I had dropped my son off at the babysitter (at some point with each of them I was dropping them off at 4:30-5 a.m., and I'm not a morning person), I could have easily done the same thing when I got to work.

Luckily, my babysitters always had my work number, and I always called to let them know if I wouldn't be there. If it had ever happened to me, I'd probably have a message waiting for me when I got to work saying she called to find out if I had called in sick since I hadn't dropped him off. Neither of them went to a day care facility until they were too old for rear facing car seats, so I'm not sure how things would have turned out then.

 

[BrownRice]

gotta say...that's WAY less damning than I thought it was going to be. I'm not even being devil's advocate. Totally serious. jmo

eta: and thanks a ton for posting it PIM!

Ya! Me too. The car seat looks further back. How tall is the reporter?

It would be more convincing if the car seat was never in the car and that day was out of the ordinary. But since it's always there, he is often in the car w/out Cooper, so the car seat wouldn't automatically signal to him CH was in there. Just playing devil's advocate.

 

[MissJ]

With the position of RH's seat in his car Stoddard said the carseat protruded between the seats. He saw the actual car and carseat in it.
Thats the difference. I take him at his word.

 

[BrownRice]

With the position of RH's seat in his car Stoddard said the carseat protruded between the seats. He saw the actual car and carseat in it.
Thats the difference. I take him at his word.

That's why I was asking how tall the reporter was - it definitely was not protruding between the seats in that video.

 

[MissJ]

That's why I was asking how tall the reporter was - it definitely was not protruding between the seats in that video.

Yes I know. RH was/is a big guy and would have the seat as far back as it would go. I have this car and the carseat won't fit behind me. If you look at crime scene photos you can see his seat is way back.

 

[ReadyorNot]

With the position of RH's seat in his car Stoddard said the carseat protruded between the seats. He saw the actual car and carseat in it.
Thats the difference. I take him at his word.

That is NOT what he said. I believe what he did say has been pointed out multiple times.

 

[Elley Mae]

I thought it was established (after much discussion) that he nosed in. I don't want to rehash it but I will try to find links from previous threads. There was some confusion and it took a while to clear up.

For now here is the transcript:
UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: When he parked how did he park? Did he pull straight into his space or something else?

STODDARD: When he pulls from the parking lot he pulls past the space. After he pulls past the space he goes into reverse and he backs up and when he backs up he backs up in between two cars that were parked in the row behind him and then he pulls forward into the parking space.
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1407/03/wolf.02.html

This move is shown in this video:
http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/story/26000089/i-team-hot-car-seat#.U8CxeI1UP1U.twitter

Funny about the space that he parked in. It's the only space on that lot that can be accessed from either direction.
bbmThat is the part that jumps out knowing that he could have parked in the space in between the two that he backed up in, then pulls forward to park in the space ahead.

 

[ReadyorNot]

I'll go back and look. It was on the previous thread and in transcripts.

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: And what type of car seat did the child -- was the child restrained in.

STODDARD: Cooper was in that morning and most of the morning Cooper was in a rear-facing child seat.

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: And that rear-facing child seat, was that behind the passengers' side, behind the driver's side or in the middle of the backseat?

STODDARD: It was in the middle of the backseat.

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: How far or how close -- what was the distance between the driver's seat approximately and the head area end of the car seat?

STODDARD: Six inches at the most.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1407/03/wolf.02.html

 

[MissJ]

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: And what type of car seat did the child -- was the child restrained in.

STODDARD: Cooper was in that morning and most of the morning Cooper was in a rear-facing child seat.

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: And that rear-facing child seat, was that behind the passengers' side, behind the driver's side or in the middle of the backseat?

STODDARD: It was in the middle of the backseat.

UNIDENTIFIED PROSECUTOR: How far or how close -- what was the distance between the driver's seat approximately and the head area end of the car seat?

STODDARD: Six inches at the most.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1407/03/wolf.02.html

That is not the part I was referring to but thanks.

 

[daisy7]

It looks like Cooper's carseat may have had the shade canopy over the top. Do we know if it did and if was used that day?

 

[NancyA]

I dunno, I'm having trouble with this. All that RH's sexting activity indicates to me is that he's a sleazy, philandering cheat and it's largely irrelevant to the case except in that he may be proved to have allowed himself to be distracted (and therefore in dereliction of his duty) while acting as the primary caregiver to his child. Yes, it is reprehensible that his sexting partners included technically (allowing for the GA/federal age of consent conundrum) underage girls but, unless I'm missing something, he made contact with these girls on hook up sites of some kind which they freely joined and participated in, ie they weren't lured there and tricked or forced into participating by sex predators. I haven't been (and won't go) to the sites in question but can someone tell me if it's clear on his profile who and what he is - ie a 33 yr old married man? If so, I fail to see the 'victim' status of the girls in question, it seems to me the communications and exchanges of images were consensual and not coerced in any way.

To me the whole sexting thing goes to the ENTIRETY of the case against RH - the google searches, the 30 second forgetting time, the proximity of the carseat to the driver seat, the visit to the car at lunchtime among many other details - it goes in my common sense balance scale in which I weigh whether it is reasonable that all of these things can be coincidences or irrelevancies. We can take every one of those little things and individually explain away, justify and rationalise them but when does it just become an exercise in nitpickery to the nth degree? I have to look at the overall picture when deciding and the overall picture is telling me something is very very wrong.

 

[NancyA]

Where else could it be? That is when Stoddard testified. He never said anything "protruded between the seats".

It doesn't matter to me if the carseat protruded between the seats, I can look at the photos of the various reconstructions and it's clear to me that that type of carseat (allowing for the minor differences in models) in that type of car (allowing for the minor differences in models) is very prominent, clearly visible to the driver on entering, exiting and operating the vehicle and it defies common sense that it would not be seen. I am confident the prosecution will take care to use the EXACT models of seat and car in the EXACT relative seat positions and a similarly built driver in their reconstruction at trial and maybe that will be enough to set the cavils about exact dimensions and positioning to rest.

 

[ReadyorNot]

It doesn't matter to me if the carseat protruded between the seats, I can look at the photos of the various reconstructions and it's clear to me that that type of carseat (allowing for the minor differences in models) in that type of car (allowing for the minor differences in models) is very prominent, clearly visible to the driver on entering, exiting and operating the vehicle and it defies common sense that it would not be seen. I am confident the prosecution will take care to use the EXACT models of seat and car in the EXACT relative seat positions and a similarly built driver in their reconstruction at trial and maybe that will be enough to set the cavils about exact dimensions and positioning to rest.

I do agree its prominent, but if its always there why would it be a red flag? He wasnt an infant that would be carried in that seat. If it protruded it would be a red flag because he couldnt have not seen Cooper, if Cooper's head was 2 inches over the seat and the seat protruded how could he possibly have missed that?! But that's not the facts because it did not protrude. So was not easily visible when opening the door and getting in.

I very much want to believe it was undeniable, but the car seat to me isn't.

I know that considering the whole picture its damning but that is not good enough for me.

 

[NancyA]

I do agree its prominent, but if its always there why would it be a red flag? He wasnt an infant that would be carried in that seat. If it protruded it would be a red flag because he couldnt have not seen Cooper, if Cooper's head was 2 inches over the seat and the seat protruded how could he possibly have missed that?! But that's not the facts because it did not protrude. So was not easily visible when opening the door and getting in.

I very much want to believe it was undeniable, but the car seat to me isn't.

I know that considering the whole picture its damning but that is not good enough for me.

I guess we'll all just have to wait until the trial unless the cops release their own reconstruction prior to that.

 

[leah]

Lyn Balfour inadvertently left her son in a car after creating a "false memory" of bringing him to daycare. She got off, from 'false memory" leaving her baby to die in the car thinking she brought him to the babysitter. I don't think it is humanly possible to forget that you just ate with your son, put him in car seat, at a place that is a stone's throw from your work, park your car and leave him there to die. No way in my eyes, it is common sense. Though if this goes to trial, I'm sure there will be one juror that will buy that Harris forgot. Trial after trial I've watched, and literally scream at the TV, I'm so sick of excuses and different syndromes that people have for killing.

 

[Elley Mae]

STODDARD: When the defendant pulled over at the Akers Mill, he pulled directly into the shopping center, Akers Mill Shopping Center and parked his car in the middle of the roadway. He exited his vehicle and popped up the rear door to his vehicle. He entered into the rear door, removed Cooper from the car seat, removed Cooper from the car seat and placed him on the pavement next to the vehicle. He got down next Cooper.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1407/03/wolf.02.html

bbm, That is the strangest thing to me.

 

[ReadyorNot]

Lyn Balfour inadvertently left her son in a car after creating a "false memory" of bringing him to daycare. She got off, from 'false memory" leaving her baby to die in the car thinking she brought him to the babysitter. I don't think it is humanly possible to forget that you just ate with your son, put him in car seat, at a place that is a stone's throw from your work, park your car and leave him there to die. No way in my eyes, it is common sense. Though if this goes to trial, I'm sure there will be one juror that will buy that Harris forgot. Trial after trial I've watched, and literally scream at the TV, I'm so sick of excuses and different syndromes that people have for killing.

Please do not misunderstand me. I do not buy that he forgot, because I dont believe Cooper would have been silent the entire time. Which obviously cant be proved. So what does that leave? It leaves the big picture, but you and I both know the defense will have an excuse for everything.

They will probably call the entire day a series of unfortunate events. The most obvious to me will be that he was late to work, and I can surmise although he did think it appropriate to stop and eat that he did it only for Cooper because he had already missed breakfast at daycare. Then they will probably claim when he got back to the car and realized the time he became panicked over getting there as soon as possible. Almost everyone can relate to that!

See what I am saying? The big picture isnt so powerful when each negative thing has an opposing innocent explanation that creates a lot of reasonable doubt.

 

[cluciano63]

It doesn't matter to me if the carseat protruded between the seats, I can look at the photos of the various reconstructions and it's clear to me that that type of carseat (allowing for the minor differences in models) in that type of car (allowing for the minor differences in models) is very prominent, clearly visible to the driver on entering, exiting and operating the vehicle and it defies common sense that it would not be seen. I am confident the prosecution will take care to use the EXACT models of seat and car in the EXACT relative seat positions and a similarly built driver in their reconstruction at trial and maybe that will be enough to set the cavils about exact dimensions and positioning to rest.

Why not use the actual car seat Cooper was in, for trial? I am sure LE has it.