Casey's Psych Evals unsealed

[FrayedKnot]

You might want to investigate whether your daughter has Asperger syndrome rather than ADHD. I was told repeatedly that my youngest son had ADHD when he was a young boy but I knew what that was and had seen lots of kids with that and in my mind, it didn't really fit what my son's problem was. One Dr who tested him back then said as soon as he met our son that she could tell right away that he did not have ADHD and she was the only one who had said that. He is now 25 and we are now convinced beyond doubt that he has Asperger's which is a high functioning form of autism. Our son has a very high IQ is extremely gifted but cannot relate to other people like a normal person and his views of the world and how it works is what I would call, warped. The thing about Asperger's is that it manifests differently as they get older and to deal with it, you have to start when the kid is young in teaching them how to manage it.

Because of her high IQ, Asperger's was one of MY initial concerns but after several evals, it was pretty evident she didn't have some of the other markers usually seen in Asperger's. She has no SI difficulties and is socially on target and has no problems relating to peers or adults. *shew*.

I guess I thought that all kids with ADHD were hyper, out of control, and performed poorly in school. So when my child was making honor roll but having conduct issues because of talking ALL of the time and blurting out answers, etc. I assumed it couldn't be ADHD. I wasn't even aware ADHD had a 'spectrum'.

Which is why I started to wonder about KC and her impulsive, reckless behavior. If she does, in fact, have ADHD and her parents were in denial or simply not educated or informed and never learned the parenting skills necessary to help her (or got her on meds-not wanting to start a debate on that-just mentioning ANY help for ADHD) is it possible that the ADHD could have morphed into full blown evil like the KC who killed her baby?

I am not making excuses, I am just wondering based on the similarity of behaviors in untreated ADHD and KC.

We always remind our daughter that her ADHD might make it harder to make good choices, but it isn't an excuse. There are all kinds of coping skills parents can teach their children and sometimes letting them fall on their faces is a very valuable teaching tool! You know if the homework is still sitting on the table and you get marked off for it, you might remember to put it in your backpack next time.

I wonder how things might have differed if CA had let KC suffer a consequence or two when she was younger and the consequences weren't as dire. It seems she just covered for and cleaned up after KC from day one.



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[LambChop]

Whatever CA said to KC on the night of the 15th, during the so-called fight they had according to LA, is the motive for KC putting her plans into action. I would think that in KC's fantasies there was no Caylee and if CA told KC she would have to be more responsible and stay home with Caylee, no more sleepovers with strange men, that may have put KC over the edge. Only KC and CA know what was said. The fact that CA has never revealed that incident tells KC, CA is protecting her. I think the "We forgive you" comment from CA in the jailhouse video was in regards to the fight. CA knows she was the trigger that set KC off. CA knows she never should have lost it with KC.

GA has mentioned to others that his daughter has some real problems and I think they know she is sick and they were never able to control her. Instead of trying to hide the fact that KC was not stable CA should have revealed it and asked the court to allow CA to be the primary caretaker of Caylee or at least gotten KC into counseling as soon as the problems began. jmo

 

[2goldfish]

This semester I am taking Abnormal Psychology in college. This is a straight-out-of-the-textbook definition of Antisocial Personality Disorder:

Now, tell me this isn't classic FCA. I just have a hard time believing that neither one of those doctors thought FCA was sociopathic.

my snip

I think, after reading the depo's of the doctors in their entirety, the problem would be.....neither had a true history of OCA. all they had is what OCA told them which even she told them she is a liar. I believe they knew almost nothing about her thievery (which goes WAY back but they seemed under the impression it was primarily during the 31 days) and I havent much in the way of proof, but I would put money on OCA being cruel to animals at a younger age too. I remain convinced the amount of pets that died in that household with OCA living there was alarmingly high....and even if they hadnt all died, one can be QUITE cruel without actual murder.

and that's not counting things we know nothing about that OCA, CA, etc will never ever tell.

I believe the tests they did give her that showed under-reporting were NOT due to denial, but instead due to ....introducing occam's razor!!!....sociopathy. I was interested that JA never asked what scores are typical for sociopathy on those tests.

 

[2goldfish]

Danziger went prosecution, and Weitz revealed himself to be easily confuddled and torn apart by the prosecution. Why oh why did the DT ever consider either of these men as a good idea for them? They are either morons or thought it was something else they'd be able to slide in and get away with. It couldn't be money because at that point there was none to give out!

my snip IMO it is because they had to look far and wide for a doc like weitz who would just write down "long dark hair" and feel like looooooooooooove.


hence the fast removal of the psychs after HHJP would allowed SA psychs to test her. they were NOT going to say she was simply in denial, and weitz was likely to turn SA like all the other experts except baby bug boy did.

 

[kaki]

Kc seemed to have convinced Dr. W she was so sensitive and attentive with Caylee, and she spent sooo much time with her, etc., yet a little research would have shown she was on her phone (or computers) talking, texting, myspacing and whatever almost every single second she was alone with Caylee!!!!! Poor Caylee! Seriously, that little girl was so neglected by her mother! It makes me want to scream when people say she was a good mother!!!! Remember her im's with rusciano..? Caseys brb?...and she slopped another piece of pizza in front of Caylee, took her a whoppin 10 seconds or so??? Yep. Great mom! I paid attention to the times surrounding this, wondering what that poor baby was doing during that 2 hour span of time ... we know per her messages it was just her and Caylee at home. What was Caylee doing? Wandering around the house, entertaining herself? I can see her sitting in her high chair, alone, babbling, ignored, trying to get her mom's attention. And this was kc's normal pattern, always on the phone/computer... Caylee never had her undivided attention! Not what a good, attentive mother does who is sensitive to her daughters needs!
Also, another pattern with kc that stands out to me is her referencing drugs that render people unconsious, date rape drugs (roofies), chloroform...this topic shows up in many conversations kc has had, like with both of the doctors evaluations, with Tracy M., computer searches, with ricardo, etc...We know there is a little bit of truth in everything she says, and this is just more confirmation to me that Caylee was rendered unconscious prior to the duct tape being applied. )-: jmo, tear, tear

I always wondered why the prosecution didn't do more to challenge all these friends who said she was "a good mother" .. and Mallory "amazing mother". Show the jury in black and white that she was NOT a good mother. Use her IM'ing and texting to prove that while she was alone with Caylee she was NOT a good mother but was so self absorbed and involved in her own interests.

Also they could have used her texts/IM history to prove what she was doing every minute of the day on the 16th to disprove all her drowning nonsense... I guess there had to be a good reason why they didn't .. or maybe they did and I missed that day ..lol.

Of course.. with this jury it may have just shot right over their heads. It just really bothers me that all these witnesses were allowed to say she was a good or amazing mother.. without being challenged more. :waitasec:

 

[jane the dood]

I always wondered why the prosecution didn't do more to challenge all these friends who said she was "a good mother" .. and Mallory "amazing mother". Show the jury in black and white that she was NOT a good mother. Use her IM'ing and texting to prove that while she was alone with Caylee she was NOT a good mother but was so self absorbed and involved in her own interests.

Also they could have used her texts/IM history to prove what she was doing every minute of the day on the 16th to disprove all her drowning nonsense... I guess there had to be a good reason why they didn't .. or maybe they did and I missed that day ..lol.

Of course.. with this jury it may have just shot right over their heads. It just really bothers me that all these witnesses were allowed to say she was a good or amazing mother.. without being challenged more. :waitasec:

That bothered me too, kaki. All of her "friends" were 20-something party-hearty types and the friendships were based on partying and shopping (in KC's case, with other people's money). How would they know what constituted a "good mother?" That really bugged me...a lot.

But with the Pinellas 12, I don't think it mattered. They were just clueless.

 

[lowens1975]

I always wondered why the prosecution didn't do more to challenge all these friends who said she was "a good mother" .. and Mallory "amazing mother". Show the jury in black and white that she was NOT a good mother. Use her IM'ing and texting to prove that while she was alone with Caylee she was NOT a good mother but was so self absorbed and involved in her own interests.

Also they could have used her texts/IM history to prove what she was doing every minute of the day on the 16th to disprove all her drowning nonsense... I guess there had to be a good reason why they didn't .. or maybe they did and I missed that day ..lol.

Of course.. with this jury it may have just shot right over their heads. It just really bothers me that all these witnesses were allowed to say she was a good or amazing mother.. without being challenged more. :waitasec:

I agree, they were all young, none of them had any children and everyone of them had only known her for about six weeks prior to Caylee's death (except for Mallory...)


And, the jury didn't 'debate' much of anything, it only took them 11 hours to pour over all that scientific material, look at all 300 pieces of evidence and I just can't believe that they all understood every aspect of every little thing that was presented at trial that not one single one of them had a question about the evidence or the law either. :rocker:

 

[Pensfan]

My daughter has ADHD and I recently read an article which included a study that showed a frighteningly high percentage of children who either go undiagnosed or are not treated for ADHD (either behaviorally or medicinally) go on to display MANY of the same behaviors outlined in that definition of sociopathy once they reach adolescence/young adulthood.

Not to say that KC's major malfunction is as 'simple' as ADHD, but as a parent who is always educating herself to best help her child, I am often struck by the anti-social behaviors exhibited in some types of ADHD and the way the behaviors change as the child enters adulthood.

My child has primarily the inattentive type, which is more common in girls but she is very outgoing and gregarious which is less common in girls with ADHD. However, even at her young age I have seen the progression from fidgeting and a messy room to acting impulsively and making poor choices based on what she wants NOW, consequences be darned.

I worry quite a bit about what kinds of choices she will be making when she is no longer under my watchful eye 24/7. Stealing? Promiscuity? Self medicating? Lying?

I know many psych conditions have blurred lines with other psych conditions or learning disabilities making armchair diagnoses or even clinical diagnoses rather hard, esp. in young people.

But is it possible that KC always exhibited some of these behaviors and her parents ignored them or covered for them, until she became an adolescent and the fruits of her impulsivity became impossible to ignore? I am surely not qualified to make a diagnosis (but it appears being qualified is rather arbitrary...gahh) and KC is obviously pure evil, but I couldn't ignore the similarities and thought I'd share.


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May I read the reference for that? Sociopaths lack the capacity for empathy. This is not true for ADHD individuals. The only trait ASPDs share in common with ADHD individuals is impulse control issues.

 

[beach]

I posted the message below in 2 threads last night after spending over an hour deep cleaning this forum and still haven't gotten it all. It is an impossible task. The only option is pulling the threads because I'm not going to spend hours & hours cleaning them up. I just removed a post linking a non MSM twitter account so here is the ONE warning for this thread.


Sorry guys but this is completely out of control. Think about what is being promoted here.... you guys are SMART! These anonymous folks can go to any other forum they want to promote their blogs and increase their twitter followers but they are NOT going to use Websleuths as a vehicle for it. Some of it may end up being factual but I promise you, if it is, MSM will figure it out and report it. I refuse to allow anymore of these rumors (and that is exactly what they are until we have factual proof) to infect this forum.

So here it is. Bump it for your friends who might have overlooked it because I am completely out. of. patience. with this issue.

NO MORE TWEETS FROM ANYONE OTHER THAN A MSM REPORTER.

If anyone posts any anonymous tweets, including promoting discussion by paraphrasing anonymous tweets - the poster will get a TIME OUT. If that happens, don't quote and perpetuate the discussion unless you want a WS vacation too.

 

[SindyBill]

Whatever CA said to KC on the night of the 15th, during the so-called fight they had according to LA, is the motive for KC putting her plans into action. I would think that in KC's fantasies there was no Caylee and if CA told KC she would have to be more responsible and stay home with Caylee, no more sleepovers with strange men, that may have put KC over the edge. Only KC and CA know what was said. The fact that CA has never revealed that incident tells KC, CA is protecting her. I think the "We forgive you" comment from CA in the jailhouse video was in regards to the fight. CA knows she was the trigger that set KC off. CA knows she never should have lost it with KC.

GA has mentioned to others that his daughter has some real problems and I think they know she is sick and they were never able to control her. Instead of trying to hide the fact that KC was not stable CA should have revealed it and asked the court to allow CA to be the primary caretaker of Caylee or at least gotten KC into counseling as soon as the problems began. jmo

BBM. Hence the all too willingness to cover up, pretend things were better than they were, and make her daughter seem better than she was/is..to admit the truth would in her mind be to say she got the ball rolling on Caylee's demise. JMO.

 

[LAMARQ]

It's difficult for me to imagine a mother responding to a daughter like that - that alone would have traumatized me I think (more than a bro trying to fondle my *advertiser censored*). I'm unable to understand a response like that from a mother.

A very good friend of mine growing up told her mother in high school she was sexually molested for years by her father and uncle. Her mother didn't believe her at all. Don't know if she called her names, but my friend ended up moving out of the house as a result. Her father was found guilty and the parents divorced.

I've lost track of this friend so I'm not sure if mother/daughter ever reunited. My friend was deeply affected I think more by her mother than her abusers.

 

[atthelake]

OT. I started a new job tonight..and the lady training me asked me what I thought of the Casey Anthony case..talk about a can of worms. I decided not to say much because I didn't want to make the wrong impression nor did I want to go down that road..but she told me her opinion..and she actually sided with Casey and the jury! I was shocked. I decided not to go over the evidence, thinking..clearly she must not know every single detail..and probably doesn't..

but then she explained that she'd been molested by a family member at such a young age and that she said that sort of thing changes your brain for some people..that she whole heartedly believes casey was molested and that's why she's a narcissist and can't tell the truth or recognize the truth. I just said "you know, I never thought of it that way." I still believe Casey's a liar..but it was just intere

sting to hear an opposing opinion from someone who
genuinely felt that way and wasn't just being a troll.

Ooh my oh my. For someone to tell a coworker this on their first meeting screams red flags to me......and I Am not referring to the FCA part, but the aspect of sharing her history......

 

[yolorado]

After reading what I think was the entire depo, what bothers me is the questions not asked by Weiss. Maybe I missed something, but it appears he had no interest in probing Casey's strange response, particularly if she were, as he seemed to suggest, such a precise, careful, 'good mother' to the alleged sexual assault and murder of her child by her father. Shock? That was ok with him? That was all the explanation he needed? Why didn't he ask her why she didn't report the incident to the police, or anyone? More pointedly, why did he seem to have no interest in her explanation for not calling paramedics or a hospital, for failing to call 9-1-1, or to ask someone she trusted, Jesse, or someone for help, if she 'hoped Caylee was alive." Why did he seek no explanation for her lack of desire to find out the hows and whys of Caylee's whereabouts, or disposal, or to seek justice for her sexually abused and murdered child? Why the wild good chase? Why blaming non-existant baby sitters and even the 'trusted' Jesse Grund? Did she intend to hide the sexual abuse and murder of her child and to protect the perpetrator of those crimes? Why would anyone do that? Isn't guilt a much, much stronger explanation of the awful woman's actions than some sort of very selective disassociation? WTHeck? Our justice system is so hosed and so far from just. Thinking of this verdict and culpable defense actors still makes me sick!

 

[SindyBill]

Ooh my oh my. For someone to tell a coworker this on their first meeting screams red flags to me......and I Am not referring to the FCA part, but the aspect of sharing her history......

she hasn't stopped, either. idk what to say...just trying to be as nice as possible. i know it screams red flags, just don't know what they mean!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

A very good friend of mine growing up told her mother in high school she was sexually molested for years by her father and uncle. Her mother didn't believe her at all. Don't know if she called her names, but my friend ended up moving out of the house as a result. Her father was found guilty and the parents divorced.

I've lost track of this friend so I'm not sure if mother/daughter ever reunited. My friend was deeply affected I think more by her mother than her abusers.

Sometimes I think being molested as a child clouds some people's vision. It is like "I was sexually abused so if she says she was, I believe it.' Some are unable to look beyond their own pain and suffering and really look to see if the 'molestation claim' by someone else really makes any sense.

I am not talking about your good friend but Casey Anthony. I am a childhood abuse survivor and I dont believe a word that comes out of Casey's mouth. One thing about true sexual abuse the truth stays the same and remains consistent. It doesnt constantly change. One thing is not told to someone and another thing told to someone else. She claimed her father molested her then Lee and now she is saying she was raped and that is how she got pregnant with Caylee. All a bunch of concocted bull by a fullblown narcissist drama queen, imo.

It wouldnt surprise me at all if in the future we hear CA say that Baez also forced himself on her sexually. She has to be painted as the victim and she lies easier than water runs off a duck's back.

IMO

 

[2goldfish]

A very good friend of mine growing up told her mother in high school she was sexually molested for years by her father and uncle. Her mother didn't believe her at all. Don't know if she called her names, but my friend ended up moving out of the house as a result. Her father was found guilty and the parents divorced.

I've lost track of this friend so I'm not sure if mother/daughter ever reunited. My friend was deeply affected I think more by her mother than her abusers.

again I can only speak for myself but this is almost certainly true, and it also goes with what woebegone was saying upthread. to have one's mother have bad feelings to one is damaging beyond belief.

IF OCA had boobies fiddled, as I said upthread I think *that* is probably as likely as not, the damage that resulted would have come far more from CA's cruel reaction than from any fiddling LA did IMO.

also....this does explain one reason WHY OCA didnt seem to have the issues with her mother that she did with her father...why she seemed even in the universal interview to want her mother's approval...it might not make sense to someone with a normal relationship with their mother but the less a mother approves of you, the more desperate you become for that approval.

now I am not saying this excuses OCA in any way from anything, because as I said I have been through plenty and my kids are not bagged up and tossed in the woods.

I'm just saying that the LA thing may well be true, as OCA's story actually never changes about that, and it also helps explain her apparent desire to please her mother and not full out torture her like she is willing to do to GA.

 

[KarmaGet'em]

Gonzalez's attorneys seek doctors in Anthony mental evaluations
John Morgan files motion to use doctors as witnesses

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/Gonzalez-s-attorneys-seek-doctors-in-Anthony-mental-evaluations/-/1637132/7979242/-/n4rt7hz/-/index.html

Attorneys for Zenaida Gonzalez have filed a motion to talk to the psychologist and psychiatrist who gave mental evaluations of Casey Anthony prior to her murder trial.

According to court records, attorney John Morgan filed the motion on Thursday to use Dr. Jeffery Danziger and Dr. William Weitz as witnesses for Gonzalez’s civil suit. Gonzalez is suing Anthony for defamation, claiming her life was ruined after Anthony linked her to Caylee Anthony's disappearance in 2008.

Maybe we will be able to get "the rest of the story" :rocker: :websleuther:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

she hasn't stopped, either. idk what to say...just trying to be as nice as possible. i know it screams red flags, just don't know what they mean!

I find that very strange since she does not know you well. I never said a word about my abuse to anyone until I was 38 years old and that was with my dearest friend that I knew I could trust. She had been my friend for many years but I had to get to that point where I could even tell her.

IMO

 

[katydid23]

Sometimes I think being molested as a child clouds some people's vision. It is like "I was sexually abused so if she says she was, I believe it.' Some are unable to look beyond their own pain and suffering and really look to see if the 'molestation claim' by someone else really makes any sense.

I am not talking about your good friend but Casey Anthony. I am a childhood abuse survivor and I dont believe a word that comes out of Casey's mouth. One thing about true sexual abuse the truth stays the same and remains consistent. It doesnt constantly change. One thing is not told to someone and another thing told to someone else. She claimed her father molested her then Lee and now she is saying she was raped and that is how she got pregnant with Caylee. All a bunch of concocted bull by a fullblown narcissist drama queen, imo.

It wouldnt surprise me at all if in the future we hear CA say that Baez also forced himself on her sexually. She has to be painted as the victim and she lies easier than water runs off a duck's back.

IMO

BBM

I totally agree. I am a survivor, and have known many from a support group I have been in. Many have PTSD and suffered from bad reactions. Some of us acted out in bad ways. Promiscuity, or drug/alcohol abuse is sometimes rampant while a survivor works through their issues. And yet none of the survivors I have known have ever driven around with their dead child in their car trunk. None of them would ever go out and party after watching their abuser rape and murder their child.

 

[Aedrys]

Gonzalez's attorneys seek doctors in Anthony mental evaluations
John Morgan files motion to use doctors as witnesses

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/Gonzalez-s-attorneys-seek-doctors-in-Anthony-mental-evaluations/-/1637132/7979242/-/n4rt7hz/-/index.html




Maybe we will be able to get "the rest of the story" :rocker: :websleuther:

Well dayum!!!! You GO, Morgan! I'm sure Danziger will have no problem talking to you! Weitz, however, is probably trying to hide under a rock somewhere. This is getting interesting, folks!