CO - Dylan Redwine missing from Vallecito ***SEARCH DISCUSSION ONLY***

[The Cheese]

Search dogs picked up a scent along the reservoir shoreline over the weekend. That prompted the two-day search below Middle Mountain Campgroud.

Crews built a dam and drained a section that was 20 feet long and reached 10 feet in the water, according to the Durango Herald. But they found nothing.

"We’re satisfied that we thoroughly checked that spot," Dan Bender, spokesman for the Sheriff’s Office, told the newspaper.

"We have had canine alerts at multiple locations around the lake throughout the winter," Bender told 7NEWS. "They have all been negative."

Bender said investigators are exhausting all their possibilities.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...e-vallecito-reservoir-search-turns-up-nothing

 

[The Cheese]

http://denver.cbslocal.com/video/8809763-mother-speaks-about-updates-in-search-for-dylan-redwine/



In the video, the map shows the incorrect location of MR's home. MR's home is north on CR 500, near the end of CR 500.

Reporter says,

"They wanted to focus on an area he may have been able to walk to."

"It was something 12 feet from the shore dogs sniffed out"

Woman on the phone says,

"So we just really wanted some confirmation, and to rule out the lake"

Reporter says,

"The search ended the same way every other one has - with nothing"

 

[The Cheese]

Video interview with Wendy Kessinger of K-9 Forensics, where she talks about the area where her dog alerted strongly.



http://fourcorners.kob.com/news/news/145021-k-9-rescue-team-returns-redwine-search

 

[The Cheese]

Very long article. More than can be posted here. Please see more at the link.

It was a follow-up to several days of sonar and cadaver dog searches organized by the Hope for Dylan Redwine organization.

snipped

The latest search used a technology called side scan sonar as well as cadaver search dogs.

Hess said a recognized expert in side scan sonar, Gene Ralston, contacted her on Facebook the same day that others recommended that she contact him.

snipped

With the lake now ice free, the sonar search started last Friday and continued to Tuesday afternoon, Hess said. Dog searches also resumed in conjunction with the sonar searches.

snipped

The canine team arrived Tuesday, April 16, and with the assistance of a boat donated by Doc’s Marina began searching Vallecito lake last Wednesday morning. The dog began indicating in areas along the mid eastern side of the lake in the water and the shoreline, Hess said.

The team also indicated in areas along the southeastern shoreline and light indication at the dam in the area that teams had indicated last November in the first searches for Dylan.

Last Thursday, the dog team spent the day on the water in an attempt to narrow down the indications in relation to the winds that were blowing, and rule out any other areas of the lake that might indicate a human remains odor, Hess said.

Last Friday, the Illinois canine team did one final check on the very south side of the dam in the waters that come out of the power plant, and the dog indicated that a human remains odor was present, Hess said.

snipped

Also last Friday, Ralston, his wife Sandy and a third member of their team arrived in the early hours and began the process of getting their boat cleared to place on the lake.

The sonar team was able to spend a few hours on the lake before high winds made things difficult.

Last Saturday the sonar team was able to spend most of the day on the lake scanning the lake bottom in the areas that the canine team indicated.

snipped

Sunday the team was able to get on the water fairly early and spent a large portion of the day scanning near the dam. Hess said the scan picked up something odd on top of the grate that covers the drain for the power plant.

Also on Sunday, law enforcement brought a helicopter from San Juan County, N.M. that flew low over the lake for about an hour. Right now the lake water is low and clear, Hess said. They didn’t spot anything.

Monday after reviewing the photos of the scans from Sunday, Hess said it was decided that the sonar team would put the ROV (remotely operated vehicle) in the water to see what was on the grate. The ROV equipped with a video camera was launched in the southwest corner of the dam and descended nearly 60 feet to the drain where it discovered large logs, sticks and rocks atop the grate.

The team spent the remainder of the day on the mid eastern portion of the lake that the dogs had highly indicated on, Hess said.

On Tuesday after checking the shoreline where the dogs had indicated “hard hits,” law enforcement representatives decided to excavate a portion of the shoreline to make sure something wasn’t buried.

They began building the coffer dam and the sonar team did additional scans on the water from east to west in that area of the lake before high winds once again drove them back to the marina.

snipped

Hess told the Times that even though the effort didn’t find anything, “We aren’t disappointed in the work that was done at all. We know there’s a body in the lake (not necessarily Dylan), somewhere in or around the lake in a water source feeding the lake.

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1162

 

[The Cheese]

Dogs used in the lake area searches
Total 5 dog teams, 5 handlers, 7 dogs. All but one dog is a cadaver dog. (Vreeland/Cayenne team searched 2 separate areas, south and mid-east.)

November
3 dog teams (3 dogs with 3 separate handlers)

Trained cadaver dogs from La Plata Search and Rescue alerted on unidentified scent sources in Vallecito Lake Saturday and again Sunday morning.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/-/s...in-bayfield-area-for-missing-dylan-redwine-13

The dogs are trained to distinguish between human remains and animal remains, according to handlers Rae Dreves and Katie Steelman, both of Durango. Their dogs are Selah and Darc, respectively.

The third dog on the search, Cayenne, is handled by Roy Vreeland of Bayfield.
http://durangoherald.com/article/20121125/NEWS01/121129707/-1/s

February
1 dog team (1 handler with 3 dogs)

Wendy Kessinger of Special Operations Canine Detection of New Mexico conducted the searches with two dogs, Jetta and Saber, that are trained to identify bones and human remains. Another bloodhound, Sadie, is trained to find live people and also was involved in the search.

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1138

April
2 dog teams (2 dogs with 2 separate handlers)

Hess said Hope for Dylan Redwine contacted the cadaver dog team best suited for their needs and flew in a handler and her dog that is specifically trained and certified on cadavers, but especially recognizes the scent of human remains on water.

Local resident Roy Vreeland’s dog searched the same stretch of shore, and again the dog indicated the odor of human remains, Hess said.

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1162

 

[sarx]

I really do not know what to say about all the hits all over the lake and nothing to show for it...

 

[*Lash*]

I really do not know what to say about all the hits all over the lake and nothing to show for it...

Thank you Sarx!

May I ask if this is anything you have ever experienced or have knowledge of happening in other searches? TIA

 

[azgrandma]

I really do not know what to say about all the hits all over the lake and nothing to show for it...

Sarx, what is your opinion on cadaver dogs being able to scent on ancient burial grounds that have been covered by a lake for 70 yrs? Wouldn't a specialized type dog be needed to detect burial grounds? Trained in a different way than cadaver dogs or water cadaver dogs? TIA.

 

[neverletgo]

I really do not know what to say about all the hits all over the lake and nothing to show for it...

Sarx, just wanted to say thanks again for your input regarding historical sites and all the other information you've provided us in Dylan's thread! Your search and rescue information and insights are always very helpful, IMO!

:gthanks: :yourock:

Dogs that work historical sites are trained specifically for that. It is a different scent composition than fresh remains, which is why there are dogs specific to historical remains detection.

While it is possible that someone else is down under that water, it's not likely that these particular dogs being used were trained for historical/archaeology detection. There is a very small group of dogs/handlers that do this kind of work, and I am pretty certain none of them were out there.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9141224&postcount=71"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #48[/ame]

 

[The Cheese]

One of the dogs who searched the lake area in February was Saber, one of Wendy Kessinger/K-9 Forensics' dogs.

In March, Wendy posted on the K-9 Forensics facebook about Saber finding 1300 year old human remains.

Here's one of the posts with a picture

Warning: graphic picture of human remains

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...409404.-2207520000.1366992960.&type=3&theater

 

[Salem]

I really do not know what to say about all the hits all over the lake and nothing to show for it...

Sarx - is it possible that a deceased body laid in the spot, for a few hours and then was moved? If that were the case, how long would the scent last? Any idea?

The scenario I'm envisioning is one were someone took a body to put in the lake, say. They set the body on the shore and then sat there - maybe in shock from the turn of events, or maybe they were doing something else - than the someone thought maybe there was a better place, so they picked the body up and went to another area of the lake?

Would such a scenario leave a scent strong enough for SAR dogs to hit on it, several months later?

Salem

 

[The Cheese]

I just found a really good map of the lake area and wanted to post it

http://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/sanjuan/recarea/?recid=43060

 

[The Cheese]

It's approximately 4 1/2 miles from where the dogs hit on the shore at the south end of the lake to where the dogs hit on the shore in the mid-east side of the lake by Middle Mountain Campground.

This is a link to Google Maps. I hope it will work. Could someone try it and let me know please? Thanks.

http://goo.gl/maps/OaxTT

 

[ColdHands]

It's approximately 4 1/2 miles from where the dogs hit on the shore at the south end of the lake to where the dogs hit on the shore in the mid-east side of the lake by Middle Mountain Campground.

This is a link to Google Maps. I hope it will work. Could someone try it and let me know please? Thanks.

http://goo.gl/maps/OaxTT

That worked fine, Cheese, thanks for posting!

 

[sarx]

Thank you Sarx!

May I ask if this is anything you have ever experienced or have knowledge of happening in other searches? TIA

Nothing I have ever seen, but it does seem to be getting more and more common sadly, and I have my own theories as to why.

 

[sarx]

Sarx, what is your opinion on cadaver dogs being able to scent on ancient burial grounds that have been covered by a lake for 70 yrs? Wouldn't a specialized type dog be needed to detect burial grounds? Trained in a different way than cadaver dogs or water cadaver dogs? TIA.

The dogs that do old remains, are trained for just that. Dogs that haven't been trained for stuff that old would likely not have a clue, especially given water aspects.

 

[sarx]

Sarx - is it possible that a deceased body laid in the spot, for a few hours and then was moved? If that were the case, how long would the scent last? Any idea?

The scenario I'm envisioning is one were someone took a body to put in the lake, say. They set the body on the shore and then sat there - maybe in shock from the turn of events, or maybe they were doing something else - than the someone thought maybe there was a better place, so they picked the body up and went to another area of the lake?

Would such a scenario leave a scent strong enough for SAR dogs to hit on it, several months later?

Salem

I get what you're saying, and under certain conditions yes, it might be possible, but in this, I really don't think so.

 

[sarx]

One of the dogs who searched the lake area in February was Saber, one of Wendy Kessinger/K-9 Forensics' dogs.

In March, Wendy posted on the K-9 Forensics facebook about Saber finding 1300 year old human remains.

Here's one of the posts with a picture

Warning: graphic picture of human remains

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...409404.-2207520000.1366992960.&type=3&theater

Wow, those dogs can do just about anything...

 

[The Cheese]

Noting a search area in November I just came across.

Officials will continue to scour the Vallecito area, including miles of USFS Middle Mountain Road.

http://kwgn.com/2012/11/25/divers-k-9-units-continue-search-for-13-year-old-dylan-redwine/

 

[Salem]

I get what you're saying, and under certain conditions yes, it might be possible, but in this, I really don't think so.

Why? If you don't mind expanding a bit. I guess I just have a solid faith in the dogs and I'm certain they are hitting those areas for a reason and yet, that reason is eluding LE. It's puzzling.....

Salem