CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #13

[T4Tide]

I've gotta call bull on the author of this article. Quite a leap of 'logic' to get from "Police are trying to determine if there is any connection between the two cases," authorities said in a bulletin to media" which is what is in the Denver Post, to this:

They’ve changed direction in Jessica’s murder case, narrowing the net to a ............................, (edited to remove description) according to the Denver Post.

****

They have not NOT NOT narrowed the search unless I'm totally missing something??????? I removed the description, because I don't want people to think that's the perp who killed Jessica.) LE are investigating the possibility of a connection.

And its a connection they looked at from the very beginning, BEFORE any evidence was found at all in Jessica's case. See scanner thread #1, page 4 or 5.... Posted by nursebeeme.



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[Marilynilpa]

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No one wanted to listen to me yesterday and is quick to dismiss any thought explained away by the media.

I went bag and SEVERAL of the initial reports state a paper bag was found. I believe the perp toyed with them by giving them "evidence" in an "evidence" bag. I researched the bags, their sizes, and types last night and did few experiments. Using a regular paper grocery bag and my daughter's backpack, I tried to come up with some logic. First, just so you get an idea of size, a normal backpack fills a regular grocery bag to the very top. I could not fold down the top at all. This was with a notebook, folder, textbook, and bottle of water in the pack. You would need at least 6-8 more inches of paper bag to fold it down like the one seen. Second, I could not get it to stand up when I simply placed it in the bag. I could only get it to stand when I kinda smashed it in at an angle. LE would not smash evidence. Third, the paper bag on the sidewalk is in a vertical position with the top folded toward the sidewalk. Like with all bags, you can imagine its folded position before it was used. The bag being placed in the truck is larger, being held horizontally (why not just carry it by the obvious folded down top?) And the opening is closed in, what seems to me, the opposite direction of the bag we see on the walk. Spacially, when I picture the size of a normal sidewalk, and view the picture of the first bag, and then imagine the back of a SUV transposed over said walk, the bags are not the same size.

I know some posters do not agree and easily dismiss this. However, my opinion is that there is something amiss here between LE, first responder reports, and later reports by the media.

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BBM

I wouldn't be "quick to dismiss" what you are talking about if you would please be so kind as to link the "several initial reports" you are referring to. I assume you are referring to MSM articles?

It isn't uncommon for there to be a lot of misinformation when a story first breaks in a case like this. JMO

 

[carbuff]

The rope stretching across looks like where the tire tracks were. It looks to me like the perp either parked across from where he disposed the body and walked to the area.

Looks like an accident reconstruction team at work.

It'd make sense if the perp left vehicle marks behind.

 

[Mom2Kate]

Hello all, I'm new to commenting on the forum, but I've lurked for awhile, brought here by my interest in true crime. Jessica Ridgeway's abduction and murder, however, was the catalyst; I have a 5 year old daughter and can't imagine how Jessica's parents must feel.

Below is a link to a pair of insightful articles published recently in Boulder Weekly. I thought the one on the killer's awareness space being a potentially important lead was especially useful. Also, in the comments section to the first article, someone comments that both Jessica's lower body and head were not among the remains discovered last week and have yet to be found. Hadn't come across this detail anywhere else and find it a little creepy that this poster seems to know this. Has this been discussed? I guess it's a reasonable inference given how difficult it was for LE to make a positive ID.

http://www.boulderweekly.com/article-9977-jessica-ridgeway-sketches-of-a-killer.html

http://www.boulderweekly.com/articl...ss-lsawareness-spacers-may-lead-to-clues.html

 

[cindersoot]

Good catch, maybe he did park in the middle facing the crime scene, with his headlights on.

Also look at the ropes on the ground, looks like the perp made a turn around. Had to be a smaller vehicle to do such a tight 3 point turn.

 

[John Sands]

the lady who saw it at 0815 on her way out also said it was a backpack.

but couldn't that be misreporting too?

 

[Marah]

How do you think the killer is feeling if he infact is related to the jogger? How do you think he is feeling if he was not related to the jogger?

Any thoughts on this????

 

[DylansMom34]

I absolutely know that her legs from the thighs down were found. There has been talk of a torso.

How do you know that her legs were found?

 

[The Farm]

How do you know that her legs were found?

Huh??? I can't catch up here.

 

[Boodles]

I just got up and I'm catching up.

There were photos and video that showed two people standing among the tree branches about where that red flag or mark is. Here is one: http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Jessica Ridgeway -CO-/101012body10.jpg There are more photos and video of the site on pages 8 & 9 of Amandareckonwith's case archive

I found another video in the case archive that talks about the red paint and shows the garbage truck. It's wheels are not marked but there are red chocks under the wheels.
Jessica Ridgeway -CO- :: 10/11/12 Garbage truck workers found Jessicas remains. Spray paint and flags mark where investigators found evidence video by crankycrankerson - Photobucket

Something I had NOT seen or heard before in this video - a man on a bicycle said he had ridden past the site on Monday and saw and smelled nothing unusual. So Jessica was probably not left there over the weekend.

If you weren't looking, it would be very unlikely to notice anything if, in fact, something was visible in the field (vs down toward the culvert). He was zipping by on his bike. And there were 30 mph winds. So I don't think one can reliably conclude from his account that the remains were not there over the weekend. Maybe yes, maybe no...

 

[Daisy1975]

Dasiy, can I get you to clarify your quote of my post? I was trying to say that the article was wrong and I'm afraid readers will misunderstand and think we have a description of the perp in Jessica's case. TIA and sorry for the confusion.

I apolgize - I misunderstood too. So there is no official release of a suspect description? Age etc?

 

[BlueIris]

I just got up and I'm catching up.

There were photos and video that showed two people standing among the tree branches about where that red flag or mark is. Here is one: http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Jessica Ridgeway -CO-/101012body10.jpg There are more photos and video of the site on pages 8 & 9 of Amandareckonwith's case archive

I found another video in the case archive that talks about the red paint and shows the garbage truck. It's wheels are not marked but there are red chocks under the wheels.
Jessica Ridgeway -CO- :: 10/11/12 Garbage truck workers found Jessicas remains. Spray paint and flags mark where investigators found evidence video by crankycrankerson - Photobucket

Something I had NOT seen or heard before in this video - a man on a bicycle said he had ridden past the site on Monday and saw and smelled nothing unusual. So Jessica was probably not left there over the weekend.

In the video linked, the reporter also says that there were evidence markers mostly concentrated near the culvert, but also along the side of the hill towards the ruins of the building there. What the heck does that mean? Do we take that to mean the perp hid out in the ruins and did something there, then brought down the remains, left them and then drove off or something? Or did he bring the remains from his car, UP to the cabin ruins... and continue onto somewhere from there.

Why do we assume he was in a car? Could he have been on horseback? Is horseback riding common there? If it is, a guy on a horse, with a backpack or camera pack (?) might not be someone who would stand out in the area.... Just brainstorming.

 

[T4Tide]

BBM

I wouldn't be "quick to dismiss" what you are talking about if you would please be so kind as to link the "several initial reports" you are referring to. I assume you are referring to MSM articles?

It isn't uncommon for there to be a lot of misinformation when a story first breaks in a case like this. JMO

Sorry... I am not at home and on my phone where I can't link or even google easily.... Errrrrr. And when I am at home, and have time to look at the links, I don't have time to post! lol My kids and their activities are seriously messing up my sleuthing. I have time to read and catch up on the threads from my phone, and I'll come across something I know I read about yesterday but can't post any links. Sorry! I'll just retreat to my quiet little crazy spot and let the real sleuthers post. :thumbsup:

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[BlueIris]

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No one wanted to listen to me yesterday and is quick to dismiss any thought explained away by the media.

I went bag and SEVERAL of the initial reports state a paper bag was found. I believe the perp toyed with them by giving them "evidence" in an "evidence" bag. I researched the bags, their sizes, and types last night and did few experiments. Using a regular paper grocery bag and my daughter's backpack, I tried to come up with some logic. First, just so you get an idea of size, a normal backpack fills a regular grocery bag to the very top. I could not fold down the top at all. This was with a notebook, folder, textbook, and bottle of water in the pack. You would need at least 6-8 more inches of paper bag to fold it down like the one seen. Second, I could not get it to stand up when I simply placed it in the bag. I could only get it to stand when I kinda smashed it in at an angle. LE would not smash evidence. Third, the paper bag on the sidewalk is in a vertical position with the top folded toward the sidewalk. Like with all bags, you can imagine its folded position before it was used. The bag being placed in the truck is larger, being held horizontally (why not just carry it by the obvious folded down top?) And the opening is closed in, what seems to me, the opposite direction of the bag we see on the walk. Spacially, when I picture the size of a normal sidewalk, and view the picture of the first bag, and then imagine the back of a SUV transposed over said walk, the bags are not the same size.

I know some posters do not agree and easily dismiss this. However, my opinion is that there is something amiss here between LE, first responder reports, and later reports by the media.

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Wait, there is a video of the bag being placed in a car? Is there a link anywhere by chance? Haven't heard this, haven't seen it but sure would like to! ESpecially considering your observations about how the bag is carried - that seems like a good question!

This makes me wonder, if the BP was found and bagged, then perhaps a second item / evidence / possible evidence was also located, bagged and placed in a car?

 

[T4Tide]

Wait, there is a video of the bag being placed in a car? Is there a link anywhere by chance? Haven't heard this, haven't seen it but sure would like to! ESpecially considering your observations about how the bag is carried - that seems like a good question!

This makes me wonder, if the BP was found and bagged, then perhaps a second item / evidence / possible evidence was also located, bagged and placed in a car?

Ok.... Hold on and let me see if I can possibly manage this from my phone.

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[K.jill]

I appreciate your out of the box thinking and think you could be on to something. Your first post from yesterday explains it best and I think some people missed it. I am going to go back and bump it up.

I find it puzzling that le would place the Bp in a bag and take the bag to the sidewalk and take photos.

Actually, the initial reports conflict. Several DO say bag. A reporter at the presser asked what was in the paper bag, and LE declined to comment, but in a separate statement said we found the backpack and water bottle, but refuse to talk about the contents. The immediate live newscast said a bag was found containing the backpack and water bottle. If just a backpack was found, the water bottle would be a content of it. All the first live.....NOT LATER summaries.... Videos can be found on YouTube.

This is the last I will post about it, but I am not an inside the box thinker. I don't want to argue, but the night the picture was displayed of Jessica's little legs in that photograph, I knew exactly what I saw and would not let others opinions sway me. I know I was right, because that photo has now been photoshopped to remove her legs and leave only a small portion of her feet. (Denver CBS?). I saw other photos and ariel views of the bag originally, that now I cannot seem to find when searching. The original helicopter shots were the best, but they are gone.

Anyhow... Carry on...

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[LisaB]

(snip)
The bookbag drop was probably done where he thought he'd fit in walking with a bookbag, imho.

It was a pink, Nickelodeon backpack. There aren't a lot of neighborhoods where a guy would think he looked like he fit in carrying that.

This is my first thought from the beginning of all this, since the day of the discovery of the backpack, and probably one of my first posts here on WS...the traffic cams...there has GOT to be footage of him at some light somewhere. There are traffic cams all over Superior. (snip)

As mentioned previously, most of those cameras either provide a live feed and DO NOT record at all, OR they are set to snap a picture under specific circumstances ony (i.e. vehicle entering intersection after light turned red, or vehicle travelling too fast).

Interesting. Thank you spamelope.

Re"open space", I'm wondering about the terminology. I live in NJ. Afaik, there's nothing labeled open space in my state.(snip)

I'm in Maryland. In order for a developer to get approval for a subdivision, a certain percentage of the property must remain pristine. It can not be divided into lots and sold, and nothing is to be constructed there. It is primarily to protect the habitats of the animals who live there. On the plat the developer submits to the county, for approval it would be designated as open space. This information would probably NOT appear on a map any more than the property lines for the actual buildable lots would.

 

[K.jill]

Bumping post from yesterday. By T4Tide

[I am actually doubting this report, now. As far as I know, there was one news station reporting this info. When questioned, LE would not comment about the paper bag. If the backpack was placed in the bag, why not just confirm that? No harm there. I went back and read through threads 1 and 2 last night. I believe the perp wanted the backpack to be found in the spot it was in. I think it is likely that the homeowner who reported the found backpack picked it up to look at it, and possibly even took it inside their home/garage. I know that's what I would do. Who finds something, announces it to be claimed, but leaves it in its "lost" place? I think it made the perp mad that his clue didn't get publicized in the timely manner he wanted, so he left the paper bag in the same spot. (Before backpack was reported.) I think the bag contained her clothing, pieces of it, or her glasses. There is a picture of it (the bag) and it is on the sidewalk with police tape encircling it about 10 feet on all sides, including the street, with NO LE or anyone in the picture. Now, why would LE get the backpack from the homeowner, who admits to picking it up and looking at it...and possibly moving it, put it in a bag, then tape off an area that everyone has already walked on, step back, and THEN take a picture? Once the backpack was placed in the bag.... if it was for evidence sake.... then it wouldn't make sense to put it BACK on the sidewalk, everyone walk away from it, and then take pictures. Or at least I can't make any sense of it. I believe that somehow, the perp got back in that neighborhood undetected. That is one big clue they know he's local. They know he's watching. After the backpack and the bag were found, it is obvious in the presser that LE shifts gears. They mention not to look for Jessica in same clothing, or with her glasses on. (LE for 'we found clothes') They begin to search only open spaces. This was a clue left in maybe the backpack... maybe in a notebook, or a textbook in the bag. They had to look closely to find it, and LE mentions in presser going over the contents of the bag for what was Jessica's and what wasn't. They also started collecting DNA (LE speak for 'we are looking at a murder') As far as I know, DNA is not usually collected for less serious crimes. There was a clue that was sexual or fatal in nature that made them start that. In this same presser... LE asks media to PLEASE cooperate with them in not publishing certain information that might be crucial evidence. There were tweets of bagged evidence at another location by media, but NO photo. I know LE asks this in all cases, but there was a plea to his voice that was different. LE also makes a random, odd sentence in presser that has no bearing on the sentence prior to it, or after it. It wasn't a question asked by media. "We are not concerned with distance in this case." What does that mean? Was it a message to the perp? They also abruptly moved the command center from the rec center, then posted a pic of new command center. Did he taunt them about what he was seeing there? Was this interaction with the perp?

These are ways I think LE knows it's one of their own community. One possibly on foot at times.... maybe even a journalist or member of the community that others would EXPECT to find near the crime scenes. He might even be helping so much that his family and friends think he is such a swell guy for caring so much about this child's murder. He does not stand out. He isn't creepy, sweaty, balding, with warts all over and a hook for his left hand. He's one of them, and that is the scariest part of all.

Please excuse the absence of links. The phone makes that difficult. The pictures and presser links I am speaking of are found near the end of thread 1 and throughout thread 2.

All of this is just my observations, opinions, and guesses.]

I think this post has some very good points.

 

[Sigh Sister]

Wait, there is a video of the bag being placed in a car? Is there a link anywhere by chance? Haven't heard this, haven't seen it but sure would like to! ESpecially considering your observations about how the bag is carried - that seems like a good question!

This makes me wonder, if the BP was found and bagged, then perhaps a second item / evidence / possible evidence was also located, bagged and placed in a car?

Here you go:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8474695&postcount=258"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #13[/ame]

 

[Jax49]

I apolgize - I misunderstood too. So there is no official release of a suspect description? Age etc?

The only description released is of the perp in the previous (May 28) attempt to abduct a female jogger. A similar description was made in the July 2010 attempt.