CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #17

[Ghostwheel]

I am 5'2" so I have my seat very far forward. I can easily reach the back passenger door in our jeep wrangler unlimited. I just checked. I know I can easily do it in a car. Most guys are taller than 5'2" and have much longer arms than me. I didn't even lean the seat back. Just reached back and opened it up.

An Unlimited is such a great vehicle. I am envious....

 

[krkrjx]

I just watched it again too at the other link http://www.9news.com/dontmiss/295663/630/Video-released-in-attempted-kidnapping and sure enough this is a four door vehicle and that back door did open. If you were waiting to see interior lights go on...it doesnt happen, not even when the passenger who tries to abduct the girl gets out. So it may be that the vehicle is very heavily blackened out windows or they shut off the interior lights just for the abduction purposes. But def at least 3 persons involved and definately a 4 door vehicle.

The "grabber" could not open the rear car door so it may have been locked? At least, it appears to me by the vid that he did try to open that door when he got out of the car. So, possibly the driver reached back and unlocked it, and maybe opened it. But that seems not as plausible to me as there being a passenger in the back seat, maybe one who was seated behind the driver and needed a few seconds to scoot over. Maybe those poor slobs didn't even know that rear door was locked initially!! So, while obviously not the sharpest tools in the shed, it seems they had planned to grab someone given they had a towel (likely with some chemical on it) handy. Not something most motorists just drive around with, ya know.

 

[Ari]

I could be wrong but the tail lights look like those on an 2001 Toyota Corolla.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Someone upthread, I believe it was Otto, asked why everyone keeps saying Hispanic. In this article it says the suspect in the lake ketner attempt was Hispanic. http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...kidnapping-outside-bar-investigated-in-aurora

CALL7 Investigator John Ferrugia reported Sunday night that the case bears some similarities to an attempted abduction case five months ago near Ketner Lake in Westminster.

In that case, a Hispanic male, 5 feet 6 to 5 feet 8 inches tall.* He also attempted to use a rag with chemicals on it to subdue a woman.

I believe that is journalistic license and he messed up on the description since no other media reported it as definitely being Hispanic. MOO

 

[Hatfield]

I think it is vital to teach our kids exactly what to say. "you're not my dad"?? Really? I wouldn't stop, I'd assume she was being a brat saying that to her step dad because she didn't want to go home. Big assumption on my part? Sure but she didn't seem to be in danger, IMO.

Yeah, I think that fake scenerio was just not done convincingly enough. In reality, if the girl would have screamed bloody murder at the top of her lungs, there may have been a better reaction from the public.

However, I do agree that not all people will help out no matter what the situation. We, as a society, need to try to teach other people to become more willing to stand up and help out in times of need. I realize that is very difficult to do because it goes to the very essence of who we are, and some people probably are just not cut out for it. But, I am convinced we could change some minds and maybe change some people. This is one of those things that we have to start working on and realize it will be a slow grueling journey.

 

[msthinksalot]

I have a mid-2000s Honda Civic hybrid sedan. I cannot open the rear passenger door (right side). I think some men could, possibly, but it would be awkward, and that's why I think there were 3 people in the car. It isn't how the door opens, it's how fast it slams shut. That would mean that the driver would have been leaning back in the awkward way to open it, and would have been holding onto it. How could he have been doing that, in that angle, and shut it as quickly as it was shut? A driver holding the door open wouldn't have had enough reaction time, IMO, to notice the guy go down and get the door shut before he even gets back to the car.

 

[DylansMom34]

Has LE said whether or not there is a tie between the attempted abduction in Aurora and Jessica's case?

 

[Tucarra]

I wish they had been able to find a better actor for the part of the child. Her cries did not raise my inner alarm because they sounded so stage-y and lacking in true terror.

She sounded like a child having a temper tantrum to me.

I'm sure it's really difficult to find realistic acting in a role that requires a very young child, though.

Tend to agree with that, and the step-dad thought would likely come to mind....

Sort of nauseating to see people do absolutely nothing though...as opposed to a 'hey, what's up?'.....or a photo, or an ask another person around...

Gotta say I guess I may be too interventionist....but....

To make a short story long, a kid screaming, as in shrieking help and truly struggling to get away, would change the reaction of people....IMO...

 

[LotusPawprint]

I think he's a local, since many aspects of this crime seem to show local knowledge.

I think he's probably still in the area for one simple reason: he can't afford to move.

But how's this for covering all the bases? If he moved, I think that may have been the trigger. He knew he was moving, so he let his fantasy off its leash.

I think he is in the area or was as of Saturday 6 October. I'm leaning towards planting the backpack as a panic move, feeling nervous because LE was getting too close in some way.

The reason I think the backpack was a panic move rather than a taunt is because he didn't try to display Jessica's remains. They were apparently found in a black plastic garbage bag and I believe he hoped the trash collectors would just pick it up and throw it on the truck without any further investigation.

I could easily be wrong about all of the above.

I agree with your post and hadn't thought much about the perp's financial situation. At all, actually. I try not to think too far ahead but I do often and when this is found and dragged to court, I'm already ticked off that he's likey going to have a public defender paid for by Colorado's residents and he will likely have the you-know-whats to come up with some dispicable defense that is only intended to hurt Jessica's family even more I will save my anger for that later date...

I digress. I really like your idea about the panic ditching of the BP,especially when put together with how Jessica was disposed of in the bag in the field. What he did was something he'd fantasized about (ughhh) for who knows how long, but to not anticipate LE reacting as quickly and efficiently as they did is a huge lapse in judgement and planning, IMO. If he really thought he'd have a few more days than he ended up having to do whatever he did, he wasn't THAT prepared. Seems like he could've easily gone out of town several miles to ditch the garbage bag to at least attempt to put distance and time between himself. But the panic sounds legit.

He's probably incapable of emotions other than rage, but I hope he's feeling ever increasing fear closing in on him right now.:furious:

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

Yeah, there is no way I could reach the far back door in my car (crappy 4dr sedan) even with seat back.

All things considered, though, my gut instinct is that the Aurora bar abduction had absolutely nothing to do with Jessica.

And police have had this footage since the 16th or 17th, so they've had time to look it over. If they thought there was a possible connection, I think we might know? Maybe not...

 

[Ghostwheel]

The "grabber" could not open the rear car door so it may have been locked? At least, it appears to me by the vid that he did try to open that door when he got out of the car. So, possibly the driver reached back and unlocked it, and maybe opened it. But that seems not as plausible to me as there being a passenger in the back seat, maybe one who was seated behind the driver and needed a few seconds to scoot over. Maybe those poor slobs didn't even know that rear door was locked initially!! So, while obviously not the sharpest tools in the shed, it seems they had planned to grab someone given they had a towel (likely with some chemical on it) handy. Not something most motorists just drive around with, ya know.

Good catch. Looks like he DID try to open that door.

 

[Elley Mae]

If the police are saying one has nothing to do with the other why does it matter what kind of car it is. just sayin

 

[iamnotagolem]

The car is a Pontiac Grand Am.

 

[Ghostwheel]

And police have had this footage since the 16th or 17th, so they've had time to look it over. If they thought there was a possible connection, I think we might know? Maybe not...

I'm going with maybe not, UNLESS "LE says that this is not connected with the Jessica Ridgway case." Until then, I will assume, as they must, that anything could be connected.

 

[tlcya]

forgive my question, I am having trouble staying abreast of developments (RL interferes).

Has WPD linked this recent attempt to pull a woman into a car (driver asked directions) to Jessica's case or are we speculating ourselves based on the report of the rag/towel/possible chemical involvement? Thanks in advance.

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

Just thinking about where the perp would have taken Jessica initially during those first 2 days...

-somewhere he would not be disturbed.
-somewhere there was no one else around
-somewhere he could come and go without being noticed.

Say he lives with a relative, and the relative wasn't going anywhere over the long weekend.

Then I remembered that sleezy area on Federal where there are lots of old run-down motels...between the 5400 block and about the 6500 block. I did a directions search from one of them to Witt Elementary school, and it's less than 10 miles.

I think a local would know about these. Maybe another spot for luminol?

I'm thinking he lives alone. Maybe has a storage locker? His own basement or garage? An abandoned home? The motels are a thought, but I would think there are too many eyes to see there and he wanted someplace that wasn't as busy.

 

[Kat]

Checking in for news about Jess this morning. Wow, a connection! Hopefully, this will lead to him quickly.

(was reading marazul and Grainne's convo) and wanted to add OT:

On Sunday evening right about an hour before dark my Husband and I pulled up to the house on the street (our home is a corner lot). There was a little boy about 4 to 5 years old standing on the curb. My Husband rolled down his window and asked him to move. He didn't. I got out of the car walked over and said Hi, come on sweetie lets move back from the road a little bit because he needs to park there. He moved with me, my husband asked me to go grab something out of the house, so I turned walked around to the front of the house, opened the door, walked in---grabbed what he asked for out of the diningroom sidetable and when I turned around---there was that little boy standing in my house. He had followed me. That's how easy it is for a child to be abducted. All I did was smile, speak in a pleasing voice and that child followed me without me even asking. I took him home. His Mom is clueless and blew it off. Whatever. Just sharing.

May Justice for Jess come quickly!

 

[TnVolsFan]

And even to their parents.

There was an incident a few years ago in a town near me where a little boy was screaming "you're not my dad!" at his own father. Onlookers encircled the pair, LE called, etc. It turned out that, no matter how much he wished it weren't so in the moment, your father remains your father.

Friend of mine has an adopted child of a different race than hers-- was hauling him out of a store while he was screaming (b/c he wasn't getting his way)-- she was followed and taken to the mall security office b/c they thought she was abducting him... she keeps his paperwork and photo id w/her at all times now to help eliminate such issues...

 

[Marilynilpa]

forgive my question, I am having trouble staying abreast of developments (RL interferes).

Has WPD linked this recent attempt to pull a woman into a car (driver asked directions) to Jessica's case or are we speculating ourselves based on the report of the rag/towel/possible chemical involvement? Thanks in advance.

To my knowledge this is sheer speculation at this time.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Moving over to subject that was touched on last night, does anyone know if Westminster Police has been reminded of Janine Johler from 2009 and the similarities between that case and Jessica's? Since that case was not in their jurisdiction, they might not have helped with it. (I'll tell you our police departments do not talk to each other.)

Just wondering if I should send in an anonymous tip that they might want to check on any DNA from that case and see if it matches Jessica's case.