CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #17 *ARREST*

[MassGuy]

I smell a plea deal. MOO.

Ha! Lets hope they can build a strong enough case that he sees the writing on the wall. I wouldn't bet on that though.

Then again, I never thought that Chris Watts would plea, so you never know.

 

[NanZDrew]

In that case there would be no need for immunity. Immunity is granted to people who have committed crimes.

If this person's crime is minor, or they can help nail the bigger fish, I certainly wouldn't have a problem with it.

You're right on the immunity, if the person did nothing wrong. If they sent the text for example, immunity might be a good thing that would get them singing.

 

[MassGuy]

You're right on the immunity, if the person did nothing wrong. If they sent the text for example, immunity might be a good thing that would get them singing.

That's the exact scenario that I hope occurred. This person, if they did that, could help to bring him down.

Totally worth it.

 

[NanZDrew]

Who knows. In my opinion, the parents buying it and selling to her (if that is correct which I don't know) would be an investment strategy with tax benefits to her parents and work to boost her credit score.

I don't think they sold it to her. I think they were renting it to her if a previous post is correct.

 

[Charlot123]

Thank you! This answers many questions, and should probably be something like post #2 in the next thread.

Is it possible that he did manipulate her into believing that he was a rancher with vast lands, and she gave up her job to live with the online man from Colorado? When she arrived, she realized that mom lived at his house, and so she found another place to live? Then she found out that he lived at mom's house, but by then she was pregnant?

Something seems off about this entire story. Did he want a baby and she was lured?

It is impossible to tell, and I don’t know if we shall ever get the full story. MOO - we shall not.

My guess is, they might have made some human, common mistakes from the beginning, and neither was lured, and they tried to make the best out of the situation, for the sake of their child, but what and how made him arrive at this horrible idea, we should at least be able to find out. In a very cursory way.

Truth is, we never know what prompts these killers. I am not sure SP killed Laci for AF. Maybe AF would have been his next victim, after he insured her life, too?

I think that obsession with NK played a huge role in CW’s action, but perhaps, he also saw NK as the way to advance his career? Who knows?

They say that statistically, 17% of these killers are moved by jealousy, but what drives the rest? Another woman? Or finances? Or a mix?

All I can say, neither of the reasons would probably be understood by us.

 

[PrairieWind]

Yes, but he is charged with solicitation, not the solicited person.

That is correct and something that needs to be remembered. No one else has to be charged for there to be a solicitation charge against PF. What I meant was its possible that later the charges might be to add an additional defendant with an assessory or conspiracy charge. Maybe the solicitation alludes to something that occurred well before the actual murder. I don't know. That charge just seems odd and leads me to speculate.

 

[PrairieWind]

I don't think they sold it to her. I think they were renting it to her if a previous post is correct.

you may be right. I havent looked at those real estate records but may try to tomorrow.

 

[FlossiePotts]

I don't think they sold it to her. I think they were renting it to her if a previous post is correct.

My daughter live for four years in a property that I owned with no rent. She was my daughter.

 

[KBB87]

I've dated loads of men who live with and/or take care of their moms or family members. My last SO took care of his grandma and his mom rented the second part of his townhome. To me it's a really good quality in many ways, to take care of someone or do obligations or help the family etc. It's endearing in many ways and shows a lot of respectful qualities IMO.

Mother issues on the other hand? I think we all have those! Anyway, As a lady, a guy living with his mom wouldn't initially turn me off at all, and I would probably need to see the dynamic before entering a relationship, but sometimes if you like the guy even that doesn't matter! IDK, MOO.

It’s been suggested before on these threads that he may have been selling her a bill of goods like “my mom is currently living with me on my ranch” or “I’m taking care of my mom right now, but I’m working to get her into an assisted living community” or something along those lines.

Most (sane) people wouldn’t question assertions like that because most (sane) people wouldn’t lie about things like that.

And most young women don’t have a community of sleuthers to suss out those lies so quickly.

 

[NanZDrew]

My daughter live for four years in a property that I owned with no rent. She was my daughter.

They may have been doing the same, or if she was making payments to them, they may have been treating it as a "rent to own." I'm not sure anyone knows about that. I think the deed just shows the parents LLC as the owners. But I do think they may have done it that way to protect her from having PF getting an interest in the property. MOO.

 

[KBB87]

I am sure that the 'police' have attorneys on standby. And isn't it the DA who states that someone can be charged?

Yes.

 

[PrairieWind]

We don't know what is going on with the other person, but the person that was soliticted would be charged with something other than solicitation. Possibly they are giving immunity to that person to testify against him, especially if he did not do or have part in the murder but was only solicited by PF. There is no crime in being the person solicited as long as you do not agree and do not do anything criminal.

True, but if the solicited person has actual knowledge of location of body or phone they likely have more involvement and that leads to the defense posturing that they are the guilty party just trying to frame PF.

 

[otto]

Her family. Uncle maybe? Has his family even said anything publicly? Not that I know of.

I think you're stuck on the phrase 'dream job' as suggesting she moved here for it. But she's not in her first CO job anymore so that doesn't fit. Did someone quote her as calling her job a dream job? I think some poster here said it as a way to indicate that she had a stable and presumably desirable job, but I don't know that KB ever called it that herself As far as we know she moved to be with him after meeting him online. Jobs came after moving. Homeowner came much later. We don't know if she got pregnant before or after she moved. MOO

Yes.

"Ed Stanfill, Berreth’s uncle, spoke with News 5’s Sam Kraemer Monday, saying she wanted to get closer to then-boyfriend Patrick Frazee. After she moved, Stanfill said she accepted a job at Doss Aviation."​

more at link ...

Family: Kelsey Berreth moved to Colorado to be closer to Frazee

I am not stuck. I understand that Kelsey met PF online in 2016 and fell in love, moved closer to him, lived separately from him, got pregnant, had a baby in 2017, bought a house, got her dream job and then vanished.

My recollection of "dream job" was from one of her relatives, but I'd have to double check. I don't think it was a friend because we haven't heard from her friends, and it wasn't his family because according to them she's an irresponsible mother who leaves her daughter with in laws for extended and unpredictable time while she vanishes .

 

[FlossiePotts]

I honestly cannot image how she was attracted to him. Living with his mother?

 

[otto]

I still am mulling the solicitation charge. Why in the heck he would want someone to kill KB is beyond me but since he was charged with it I'm going on the thought it involved child custody and he didn't want to dirty his hands.
But I honestly think that while at the condo, opportunity presented itself, he went into a rage and killed her himself. And because LE was all over the condo the night before the arrest, I think they were acting on the info that they were getting from the person he solicited.

Blood spatter is a funny thing. No matter how much you try to clean it, people forget that it travels. The loft seems like the place that would have provided the most "bang for your buck" on spatter evidence. There is no WAY he was in there painting and dry walling. The ladder LE had was because there were unnoticed spatter perhaps on the ceiling. The loft edge might have contained matter.

As for dumping her body, I think he had KB in the truck and since he had the baby as well, perhaps he met with his solicited person and had that person do the body dump?
This is the only scenario that makes any sense to me at this stage of the game and with so little info.
Moo IMHO

Solicitation is usually about alibi - Some Other Dude did it.

I'm guessing that he was unsuccessful with the solicitation and was left to his own devices, with the same result.

As for the body, he had a red truck at Kelsey's house at noon on the last day that she was seen. Occam's razor means that she was put into the back of the truck after the murder at noon.

I doubt he could travel far with a body in the back of his truck, so where did he go next? Did he high tail it home and hide the body on mom's acreage until he could buy himself more time, or did he leave the body in a nearby familiar spot?

The phone could have been passed off the a or two after the murder. PF was most likely having Thanksgiving Dinner with his family on November 22. Who else was at the family dinner? Was anyone there from the Idaho area?

 

[TJtennispro]

Her parents buying it would have nothing to do with PF. It’s an out state of “office” or business condo which becomes a tax write off. Some theories about why people due things on this board are just not logical.

They may have been doing the same, or if she was making payments to them, they may have been treating it as a "rent to own." I'm not sure anyone knows about that. I think the deed just shows the parents LLC as the owners. But I do think they may have done it that way to protect her from having PF getting an interest in the property. MOO.

 

[mustloveco]

Colleague: Patrick Frazee is professional, a good father

 

[otto]

Yep She got pregnant in January of 2017, so she was there a few months at least before getting pregnant.

The picture becomes more clear.

Kelsey and PF met online in 2016 and started a long distance relationship. She moved closer to him (Mr Rancher) in 2016, but they did not live together; he lived with his mother. A few months later in January 2017, she was pregnant. The baby was born in October 2017. In May 2018, she bought a house for her daughter and herself. PF did not contribute financially to ensure that Kelsey and her child had a roof over their heads. He did not join his family.

In November 2018, she is missing and he is arrested for her murder without a body.
The baby was born in October 2017.

 

[KBB87]

Colleague: Patrick Frazee is professional, a good father

I wonder if the cops have seen this? Maybe they’ll drop the charges now that this random dude has spoken

 

[esayer]

The picture becomes more clear.

Kelsey and PF met online in 2016 and started a long distance relationship. She moved closer to him (Mr Rancher) in 2016, but they did not live together; he lived with his mother. A few months later in January 2017, she was pregnant. The baby was born in October 2017. In May 2018, she bought a house for her daughter and herself. PF did not contribute financially to ensure that Kelsey and her child had a roof over their heads. He did not join his family.

In November 2018, she is missing and he is arrested for her murder without a body.
The baby was born in October 2017.

Yes and I am quite certain that there is a bunch of stuff that happened in between 'In November 2018, she is missing' and 'he is arrested for her murder without a body' that all of us are keen to understand. It's like a slow motion, never ending book you can't put down.