CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #24 *ARREST*

[The Saint]

Yes you are correct. But I've been in the horse world for many
years and there is a long standing problem of horse trainers
having access to illicit drugs in the show world and racing world.
No direct experience w/ farriers or horse dentists administering illegal drugs but it wouldn't
surprise me.

It makes me think of the murder of candy heiress Helen Brach and
the murder of racehorses for insurance money.
The article mentions that Helen's body was burned in a steel furnace. Could that be a possibility for KB? Maybe a campfire is more likely. There are so many remote places in CO.

Candy heiress Helen Brach was disposed of on orders from Chicagoland horse dealer | Daily Mail Online

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

BBM
Who would this be? Is there a verifiable source I missed? Thanks

Did you see the Speculate Speculate part? Just me saying, IN could pass for KB at a distance, IMHO, and maybe the clean up fell to her. pure speculation

 

[Esma]

I didn't follow the CW case consistently except for on the news. How will this go in Colorado once things start to move? Will you be able to watch the trial live? Will we see all the documents and evidence released during the trial or after?

 

[SoVeryMe]

Yes, he wanted her "gone." But, I believe the murder was motivated by wanting sole custody of baby K. Sadly, the very one who will comfort KB's family, was likely the reason for her murder. I hate saying it, but if KB had never become pregnant, maybe he could have just told her it was over and walked away. But not once the baby was born. I have a lot racing through my head about all of this, including IN (KK)'s role. What she knew, what she didn't know. I suspect she is a victim more than anything, but I could be wrong. If she was truly a major player in all this she would be behind bars, singing a tune for a lesser charge. Since she is still free, I get the feeling she knows a lot but didn't participate a lot. JMO

I agree completely, he wanted baby K. Maybe he even wanted to relocate to ID with child.

I’m inclined to agree about KK....reluctantly though. I would hope if she were involved in planning or clean up she would be in custody, because that’s where she would belong.

 

[enelram]

That's exactly the type of "sensitive evidence" that I thought of when they first announced that. And I can't help but think of the Tim Bosma case (which happened right near me) and the use of an incinerator . I'm pretty sure the idea of an incinerator was discussed a few threads back, but I can't remember if it was decided that PF was likely to have one or not. I'm sure someone can refresh my memory!

I was just thinking today...if PF did hot shoeing of horses,
he would have access to a portable forge. Either his own
or his 2 other farrier buddies from Florissant who I've uncovered.
A forge is a metal box, can be heated w/ gas or coal and can
get temperatures up to 2500-3000 deg. F., enough heat to
soften steel bars to make "hot" shoes to fit horses better.
The better farriers all have one around me. And they do get
hot, hot enough to make steel bars red hot so farriers can
hammer the steel for shoes.
This would certainly be an easy way to dispose of a body
and remember these forges are portable. some are carried
in the back of pickup, some are on wheels and pulled behind.
Just some food for thought.

 

[cluciano63]

Jmo there is no way the filing of a civil suit means the prosecutor instantly hands over evidence, before the criminal case is even assembled, much less gone to trial. The details on the civil suit are general, not from any knowledge of the crime scene, manner of death, etc...

After a criminal trial, yes, they probably can proceed woth civil case using details and evidence from the prosecution, etc...but not at this stage when the perp isn’t even sure what ecidence LE has.

Jmo...but pretty sure.

 

[Esma]

BBM. Just a legal lesson here, not relevant to this case I don't believe, but knowledge alone, without more, NEVER makes you an accomplice.

Thanks. I thought it did.

 

[riolove77]

Well, if hypothetically she knows something, is talking, and is turning on him then the Colorado DA doesn't need anything from PF. PF talking at that point doesn't get him any better of a situation and actually makes it worse.

That said, so many of the activities by law enforcement and leaks to the media seem aimed at trying to get PF to talk - and that gives me the nagging suspicion that the DA does not have a very strong case.

BBM. Don't worry, not true. I could have the strongest case on earth, and I still always love a defendant who talks.

 

[Jethro4WS]

if PF is ordered to pay a large sum, he may need help from his family's finances.

If a financial judgement is awarded against PF then the only recourse to collect is limited to what he has. In jail he can't make any money. So the judgement would just sit there unpaid and collecting interest never to be paid. Kelsey's parents can be in serious financial jeopardy should PF be acquitted (which is always a possibility) and he counter sues them as unlike PF they are millionaires several times over - this is why I question the timing of their lawsuit.

 

[jewelsmac]

IMHO, LE knows what happened to the body already. (I could be totally wrong.)

i agree

 

[The Saint]

BBM. Just a legal lesson here, not relevant to this case I don't believe, but knowledge alone, without more, NEVER makes you an accomplice.

Aren't there exceptions like ones that are listed in this article?
https://www.wklaw.com/knowing-about-a-crime-and-not-saying-anything/

 

[Vandalay Industries]

Was there or has there been any thought to the fact of crime scene contamination? It has been reported that the LE made an initial entry to confirm a "well being" check. Then I read that family members had then gone to her home to confirm she hadn't packed up and left. THEN LE goes back and finds evidence, twice..

 

[cluciano63]

I'm thinking KB's mum's comments mentioning how she looked different in the video than normal was only to help the public to identify her in a search. Meaning KB would more often look like the photo provided, with her hair down, etc. MOO

I agree...Kelsey probably was very put together when she saw her mom, as mom was expected. Not the same as running to the store for last minute needs.

 

[cluciano63]

It's not a civil suit for murder though; a wrongful death suit can be brought for any type of death inflicted by the responsible party. No malice necessary (though we know there was malice here obviously).

But it is still a death...which has not been legally confirmed.

 

[riolove77]

IIRC, exceeding the amount of $75,000. Let me look. BRB

ETA:
7. Jurisdiction is proper within the United States District Court for the District of
Colorado pursuant to 28 USCS § 1332 in that:
a. the matter in controversy exceeds the sum or value of $ 75,000, exclusive of
interest and costs, and
b. is between citizens of different States.

Okay good. Thanks!

 

[Irmese]

I think it would be easier to buy a gun than obtain succinylcholine. For a farrier without a criminal record, to buy a gun is legal, to start asking for succinylcholine would be very suspicious. Too sophisticated as a killing modality. MOO.

And mostly, how would we even know that succinylcholine was used? KB is missing.

A gun would have been messy and noisy. Drugging KB would be fast, clean and easy. She wouldn't be able to breathe. Right now, we have no proof of what happened. If he's willing to commit murder and solicit someone to commit murder , he might be willing to pay someone for a deadly drug. But it could be something else like fentanyl. Did he drug her and rob and kill her while she couldn't move? At this point, we don't know.
ETA MOO

 

[enelram]

Are the two men that went to the dump POI?

We don't know. See my comment about his 2 farrier buddies
which I've uncovered.

 

[moonlessnight]

did anyone find out if he is on title to his mother's home?

If a financial judgement is awarded against PF then the only recourse to collect is limited to what he has. In jail he can't make any money. So the judgement would just sit there unpaid and collecting interest never to be paid. Kelsey's parents can be in serious financial jeopardy should PF be acquitted (which is always a possibility) and he counter sues them as unlike PF they are millionaires several times over - this is why I question the timing of their lawsuit.

 

[pcrum12]

Ahhh.. KB as a pilot had regular required physicals and the date is part of her FAA license. Sullenberger, for comparison, has a qualifier on his FAA license that per his physical, corrective lenses are required. KB had no qualifiers.

I think it would be entirely possible and reasonable for a co-parent of baby to have a life insurance policy on a parent who has a somewhat risky profession. Maybe PF and KB got mutual policies at the same time. Don't they push those on new parents these days?

We haven't heard anything about a straight money motive, but it's certainly possible. Except for that no body problem... is it possible that the murderers did setup a car accident, like off a cliff on "her way to Idaho" but of course they cannot direct LE to the "scene of the accident" while they pretend that KB took off on a trip?

In my opinion, they would have left the phone in the car in that scenario.

 

[Esma]

Aren't there exceptions like ones that are listed in this article?
https://www.wklaw.com/knowing-about-a-crime-and-not-saying-anything/

I used the word accomplice- this talks about aiding and abetting. I'm guessing accomplice is different.