CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #59

[MemPat]

BBM..

HELLO! THIS right here...total bonehead move.

There's a whole square-dance of bonehead moves with this guy! Do-si-do, Patrick!

 

[MassGuy]

Sam's 8pm fb live recap conflicts with what we heard earlier about SF2 never meeting KB before. It sounds like he had met KB at least once, but had not met baby K.

I'll go back to fb video and add the timestamp to that part of video.

I had this in one of my recaps:

SF2 met Kelsey and the daughter once, and only found out about the pregnancy a month before she was born.

Edited to correct that it was PF’s brother who had only met Kelsey once. Not his mom.

 

[MassGuy]

Questions:

Anyone know if MS and those shady Idaho lawyers will be called to testify?

Ma called Kelsey "a hooker", I read, Who said that?

No word on the DNA of the teeth or blood spot on bleach bottle yet?

We don’t know when, or if, those two will be called to testify.

CB testified that Kelsey told her that SF called her a “hooker.”

We haven’t heard about any of the physical evidence yet. All the bombshells have been related to video and witness accounts.

 

[MemPat]

That's what I was thinking too.

But the cadaver dogs never hit on anything in the condo. If a battered body was in there for several hours, I'd think the dogs would have picked up on it, no matter how many scented candles there were.

It worried me that the last question the jurors asked was about why the dogs didn't hit inside the house.

Does anyone know how much cadaver dogs are affected by bleach and the chemicals KK would have brought for clean-up?

The cancer clinic where I worked had clean-up kits for blood that were of the "like it never even happened" variety.

 

[Seattle1]

Does anyone else think it is odd that he was paying 700 bucks a month child support? I only say that because I thought they were splitting time with the baby. And he and his mother and had her while KB was working. And she had a long commute. So they must have had the baby much of the week.

How did he end up paying that monthly support?

They did not share a residence, KB paid health insurance, and KB would was providing shelter for baby K. It sounds like PF was "daycare" while KB worked.

50/50 custody is a misnomer that there is no child support. MOO

 

[PommyMommy]

I think KB's time in treatment for depression or whatever may also have been around that same time frame of PF visiting the attorney about custody. We may not get details about that until the defense puts on its case. I was surprised at the testimony that Doss was going to cease the baby's insurance benefit because KB didn't work enough hours. I was under the impression KB worked full-time.

If PF was voluntarily paying child support then KB was also okay when he couldn't pay it because I'm not aware that she complained to friends or family about not receiving it. Has there been testimony that she complained? If not, there wasn't much she could do if the child support wasn't court ordered.

JMO

KB went to Nedley Clinic in August 2018 and was diagnosed with severe, non-suicidal depression.

I'm not sure how much stock we can put into the information about Baby K's insurance since that came from PF, IIRC. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong but it just strikes me as rather odd that Doss would call PF about a change in KB's insurance.

We have no idea if KB was okay with not receiving any child support or if she complained to anyone about it. Just because we haven't heard of any complaints yet doesn't mean there weren't any.

Since the child support payments stopped in July 2018, that could very well have contributed to her depression. MOO

MOO

 

[Seattle1]

Easy there...... Buffalo girl here.

Wow, listening to Sam's recap. Patrick only told his brother that Kelsey was pregnant a month or two before she was due. The whole scenario is so bizarre. I know the brothers weren't particularly close, but Patrick sure never acted to other people like he was in a relationship. But Kelsey clearly thought they were in one.

When Sam stated that PF told brother KB was pregnant but SF still did not know about pregnancy, I believe this may have been KB's first pregnancy that she lost. I can't believe that SF would not be aware of KB pregnant at 7 months. MOO

 

[Hexe7]

Because it has nothing to do with the murder of KB? JMO

Okay- could be - but also could give a lot of insight into PF’s character/ relationships... I find it significant that CF’s kids had never met the baby and that coupled with the sister’s lawyer wanting dirt on PF... But i agree it could only add to much confusion... especially for the jury.

 

[MyBelle]

Yah, don't think it will work for most of the jurors. Just trying to guess at the 'shape' of their defense narrative.

They are going to grab onto the state's assertion that not ALL comings and goings are on surveillance footage. So they can possibly get the jury to agree that NOT seeing Kelsey leave is not solid proof that she was deceased when PF was seen leaving with the baby.

It just goes to the dangerous terrain of reasonable doubt.

And it does change the timeline. If they can convince the jury that she was drunk and depressed, she might have sat alone in her condo for 48 hours, without communicating.

And even if he said she was the one who broke up, they can still say it was mutual, but she was having mental issues, etc. I don't think many people would believe that. But it just takes one.

True. Even more dangerous terrain is that which is beyond a reasonable doubt. Not only because of no proof of Kelsey leaving but also no proof of KK arriving or leaving and the times of the video they do have seem not to be reliable.

I think the jury is going to be very concerned if there is doubt about the time the video of PF was caught on camera entering and leaving the condo. It's odd that the neighbor saved PF entering and leaving but not KK and her cleaning supplies and multiple bags KK said she threw away.

The bigger detail will be LE used chemicals throughout the residence to detect blood after KK cleaned it up and CB found it. All we've been told is what was detected in the bath. What about in the LR and all the places KK claimed she cleaned.

JMO

 

[Aydrianna523]

Something still seems off about pf murdering kb just because of finances though. It's a component probably but not all.
If I understand right, kb's parents were offering to help them get a ranch. I imagine that means a down payment and co-signing. But the offer was refused.
Soooo....did he want kk back and thus wanted kb out of the picture.
Staying tuned for more details.
So sad kb got mixed up with crazee frazee. As someone above said, it reminds you a bit of the Watts guy who got rid of his family, to be free for his mistress.
After the details today, I'm starting to wonder...

 

[skyedaze]

He spent 8 minutes in front of the ATM?!! (And I don't think this was waiting in line)....

Footage from the camera attached to the ATM at the ENT Credit Union shows Frazee pulling up at 12:42 p.m., according to Courtney. He spent eight minutes at the ATM. At 12:46 p.m., it snapped a photo of him looking at the machine with his baby daughter visible in the front seat.

Nov. 22, 2018: What Patrick Frazee, Kelsey Berreth were doing on the last day she was seen alive

Why is lil K in the front seat??? Little babies do not go in the front seat.

 

[MemPat]

You can buy a Tyvek haz-mat suit with a hood on Amazon for $7.44 with free shipping.

Even Patrick could have afforded that.

 

[MassGuy]

True. Even more dangerous terrain is that which is beyond a reasonable doubt. Not only because of no proof of Kelsey leaving but also no proof of KK arriving or leaving and the times of the video they do have seem not to be reliable.

I think the jury is going to be very concerned if there is doubt about the time the video of PF was caught on camera entering and leaving the condo. It's odd that the neighbor saved PF entering and leaving but not KK and her cleaning supplies and multiple bags KK said she threw away.

The bigger detail will be LE used chemicals throughout the residence to detect blood after KK cleaned it up and CB found it. All we've been told is what was detected in the bath. What about in the LR and all the places KK claimed she cleaned.

JMO

The neighbor didn’t “save” anything. Those images were recovered from one of her devices after they had been deleted by the system.

If the times of those images are off, they are only off by an hour (of each other). It’s clear that PF was there when he shouldn’t have been, in direct conflict with both his “alibi notes” and what he told law enforcement.

His vehicle is also captured by surveillance from a furniture store, as he made his way to the Franch.

This fits perfectly with the timing of the last photo taken of him at Kelsey’s. The fact that it was his vehicle, and he was driving, is not in dispute.

 

[Seattle1]

I'm not sure how much stock we can put into the information about Baby K's insurance since that came from PF, IIRC. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

^^sbm
Per Sam fb live report, PF indicated that Doss Aviation notified him that baby K medical insurance being canceled because KB was no longer considered an employee since she was missing.

If this is true, then I think it was KB providing baby K's medical insurance and not PF. MOO

ETA: Actually, this makes sense because Doss probably provided paid insurance for KB as employee coverage but not paid dependents. If KB no longer earning a salary, there would be payroll deduction for baby K's insurance premium.

ETA.2: I just don't know who testified about this issue today, or how it made it into Sam's recap?!!

 

[osu]

Questions:

Anyone know if MS and those shady Idaho lawyers will be called to testify?

Ma called Kelsey "a hooker", I read, Who said that?

No word on the DNA of the teeth or blood spot on bleach bottle yet?

KB’s mom, CB, said that on Friday.

JMO

 

[MemPat]

Something still seems off about pf murdering kb just because of finances though. It's a component probably but not all.
If I understand right, kb's parents were offering to help them get a ranch. I imagine that means a down payment and co-signing. But the offer was refused.
Soooo....did he want kk back and thus wanted kb out of the picture.
Staying tuned for more details.
So sad kb got mixed up with crazee frazee. As someone above said, it reminds you a bit of the Watts guy who got rid of his family, to be free for his mistress.
After the details today, I'm starting to wonder...

The rage of bashing someone in the head with a baseball bat shows there was more involved than just the financial element though it's clear that was important.

I'm not one who believes (unlike the Watts case) that unrequited love for KK played a part. She was used.....stupid.....mean.....but not passionately loved by Patrick. MOO

 

[PommyMommy]

^^sbm
Per Sam fb live report, PF indicated that Doss Aviation notified him that baby K medical insurance being canceled because KB was no longer considered an employee since she was missing.

If this is true, then I think it was KB providing baby K's medical insurance and not PF. MOO

Yes, and part of the agreed upon child support would be his share of that medical insurance, I'd bet.

Do you remember if the Doss employee was asked about this, though? AFAIK, it came from PF so I'm just wondering how accurate it is. MOO

 

[katydid23]

Does anyone know how much cadaver dogs are affected by bleach and the chemicals KK would have brought for clean-up?

The cancer clinic where I worked had clean-up kits for blood that were of the "like it never even happened" variety.

If anyone would know how to completely clean up blood and tissue it would be a critical care nurse.

 

[katydid23]

The rage of bashing someone in the head with a baseball bat shows there was more involved than just the financial element though it's clear that was important.

I'm not one who believes (unlike the Watts case) that unrequited love for KK played a part. She was used.....stupid.....mean.....but not passionately loved by Patrick. MOO

I totally agree. I think she was going to be his next victim, if he was somehow cleared with this one. She knew way too much.

 

[Seattle1]

I had this in one of my recaps:

SF met Kelsey and the daughter once, and only found out about the pregnancy a month before she was born.

Hmmm... I'm questioning if the time PF phoned Sean to share pregnancy news was for first pregnancy because Sam seems to think that ma SF still did not know about KB being pregnant when this news shared with Sean.

Just seems far fetched to me SF would not know at 7 months (KB definitely showing then) unless KB had no contact with SF during her pregnancy. I could be wrong and this was when pregnant with baby K.

MOO