Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #25

[borndem]

Homebirth is legal in Colorado... however, it's irrelevant here because SW would've been risked out of hiring a homebirth midwife due to her Lupus dx. This is MOO having experience with birthing two of my own children at home. Any sign of high risk and CPMs will drop you like you're a hot potato and refer you to an OB. I had to have BP under 120/80 at all times in order to keep seeing mine. No dx of diabetes, or high blood pressure (especially prior to pregnancy) or any other disease. I had to have a history of healthy, non complicated deliveries, too.

Thanks for that info on Colorado. What is a CPM?

 

[Kensie]

I agree 120 percent with post #733 by Madison.

 

[NuttMegg]

Not what I said. Killing a spouse requires no underlying mental disorder beyond an inability to control one's temper.

I've seen many posts saying CW is a narcissist, a sociopath, a psychopath etc. based on his media interviews and those posters have concluded he also killed the children. A theory that SW had a personality/disorder based on interpretation of her social media is doing the same thing for those of us who believe it is possible SW killed her children. JMO

Oh I don't think (very many) posters are basing their conclusions on his media interviews, I think most of us are basing our opinions on a lot more than that, like desecrating the bodies of his kids, destroying evidence, all of the lies, etc.

 

[CFlo]

With all respect, no one is getting bashed here. There is no poster bashing going on, which is what you make it sound like. Not agreeing with the content of a post or an underlying but vague theme is not "bashing" a poster.

“Bashed” was probably, no definitely too harsh of a word.
Let make a second attempt. I pointed a question to someone here using the @ symbol, attempting to see a big picture, all sides to which some on that “side” had previously said they were bashed for their opinion or thought as they saw it. Yes, they absolute,y did as did a few others on the “CW side.”
After taking a break a couple weeks ago, I truly wanted to see but had others chiming in which is fine, but still it didn’t answer my OP question and kept taking an around the bush approach trying to hit on all other points of an affidavit than what I had asked!
Also, unwanted PMs in disagreement and/or reporting simply when you’re trying to have a adult conversation isn’t cool and unnecessary, IMO, MOO.
It continued thrice, so whatever that word is, that’s it.
I had also previously stated that I had taken a typing break and had issues in quoting posts FWIW. I e also stated that I can only speak to facts in terms of legal documents OR my own personal opinion. Also stated, I’m trying to learn this new format, again trying to see all “sides”. I dislike the word sides, but that’s what I keep coming up with based on the behavior exhibited.
But this is what I was also trying to state.
Ugh, I just wanted to ask a couple questions to see different views. I give.

 

[Marli61]

So funny. It lasted long enough I was thinking, Oh (swear word) I'm going to have to go back to following politics!

I wish we had laughing like buttons! I was thinking I'd have to go back to just reading & I was all kinds of sad!!

 

[SausagePizza]

'Depression Is Setting in' for Chris Watts'

Article source: People Magazine - September 17, 2018 03:48 PM - Steve Helling

'Depression Is Setting in' for Chris Watts as He's Jailed in Deaths of Wife, Daughters, Source Says

 

[JEM1975]

That has certainly not been my experience nor has it been for most people I know. I have lived here off and on since the 1970's and have not had "the same" doctor since leaving a small town in the 1980's.

After 11 years of going to many specialists, I was diagnosed with Fibromyalgia. Even now that I have a diagnosis, I've had multiple doctors because not all doctors specialize in everything. It seems like when I've been lucky enough to find one, they've moved. I live in the same town as Shanann so I can absolutely see why she may have gone to multiple doctors. Unfortunately when the pain isn't visible, not all doctors take you seriously.

 

[MerryB]

I honestly can't remember but @MerryB might!

Yes. I’ll try to find a link. I’m still looking for the one of Bella at the chiropractor, so I’ll keep my eye open for both.

I did find this of CeCe getting one of many chiro treatments:
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My daughter is 22 mo old and loves getting adjusted. She taps the table when I'm done with my adjustement. Dr. Hettick is awesome! Best…”

 

[MyBelle]

So are we saying that SW was lying about them having asthma, but they may have had bronchitis or pneumonia or RSV instead? Would it matter?

I have asthma, and over the years one of the issues I have is getting bronchitis quite often. In my opinion, if a 3 yr old had bronchitis, they would likely have asthmatic conditions as well.

I really do not see any reason to doubt that the girls has asthmatic issues. There is plenty of evidence, for example, an inhalor being prescribed, to indicate they had those types of issues. JMO

I believe the children's medical conditions and her own were embellished for attention and to portray herself as "super" woman, wife, mother and it was all made possible by using Thrive. JMO

 

[Tranquileyes]

Also it was her first trip back to NC for people to see the girls . This was not a yearly thing . Odd to find out you are pregnant with a possibly high risk pregnancy in first trimester for such an extended trip . And a witness heard her speak of possibility . It coincides with lack of interaction at beach trip together as well imo

She had not gone to visit NC from the time they moved to Colorado until this past summer?

 

[CFlo]

Hello, I’m a little confused on the question so I’ll
Do my best. My opinion was he deleted it because of the lovey posts even when she knew there were
Problems.

Thanks @Trinket78. That’s what I thought you meant, even if I didn’t state verbatim/paraphrased.
I can only speak to my own experience on SM or being a “workerbee” in SM side since SM inception, but generally speaking you’re spot on OR that SW was sending a public message (FB privacy is source) to a known or unknown AP at that time.
I really hope in this tragedy that you are doing as well as can be expected. Hugs, and hearts to you and all other VIs.

 

[MsBetsy]

Homebirth is legal in Colorado... however, it's irrelevant here because SW would've been risked out of hiring a homebirth midwife due to her Lupus dx. This is MOO having experience with birthing two of my own children at home. Any sign of high risk and CPMs will drop you like you're a hot potato and refer you to an OB. I had to have BP under 120/80 at all times in order to keep seeing mine. No dx of diabetes, or high blood pressure (especially prior to pregnancy) or any other disease. I had to have a history of healthy, non complicated deliveries, too.

Right but my original point was if SW was considering looking into holistic approach exploring all her options, that would explain all the medical appointments, instead of assuming she was doctor shopping for suspicious reasons. Someone mentioned she looked into Midwives, which you can still have to deliver your child in a Birthing Center, even if you are high risk. At least in NY. Its just a more homelike environment, and allows easy access to the same care in a hospital should something go wrong. I'm not saying SW did this, or was even considering it. It was a response to a post that suggested she may have contacted one. I was focused more on the use of a chiropractor to treat allergies. It would make sense. Many people consider a variety of options. We don't know for sure, but it has been suggested, someone supplied a source for me, but I had to go out so I haven't even seen it yet. Jmo

 

[Ronso]

Thanks for that info on Colorado. What is a CPM?

CPMs are Certified Professional Midwives. They have a certificate, not from a college, but from a midwifery program geared towards natural birth.

Whereas CNMs typically have a degree from an accredited school (usually a masters degree from what I've seen). CNMs have to carry malpractice insurance like doctors do, and the vast, vast majority only deliver in hospitals/birthing centers. CPMs only do if it's required by law in the state they practice midwifery. And even so, most won't risk taking on high risk deliveries (though you can find a small percentage who will deliver twins or breech babies... but I find that more in states where midwifery is less-regulated), and they have no hospital privileges. I wanted to hire a homebirth midwife this time around but I had complications (a hemorrhage) in the first trimester that risked me out of a homebirth, so I'm delivering in a hospital instead. (Then came the diabetes dx... which would've risked me out had I not had the hemorrhage anyway)

 

[Jennifer17]

Yes. I’ll try to find a link. I’m still looking for the one of Bella at the chiropractor, so I’ll keep my eye open for both.

I did find this of CeCe getting one of many chiro treatments:
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My daughter is 22 mo old and loves getting adjusted. She taps the table when I'm done with my adjustement. Dr. Hettick is awesome! Best…”

So what does that prove?
Many people go to chiropractors. Some people teach Yoga for babies too.

 

[borndem]

Lol, I was like oh man did I violate TOS??

Same here -- I was, "What did I do? What did I do?"
We're cool now.

 

[Ronso]

Right but my original point was if SW was considering looking into holistic approach exploring all her options, that would explain all the medical appointments, instead of assuming she was doctor shopping for suspicious reasons. Someone mentioned she looked into Midwives, which you can still have to deliver your child in a Birthing Center, even if you are high risk. At least in NY. Its just a more homelike environment, and allows easy access to the same care in a hospital should something go wrong. I'm not saying SW did this, or was even considering it. It was a response to a post that suggested she may have contacted one. I was focused more on the use of a chiropractor to treat allergies. It would make sense. Many people consider a variety of options. We don't know for sure, but it has been suggested, someone supplied a source for me, but I had to go out so I haven't even seen it yet. Jmo

Yeah, I was trying to differentiate between CPMs and CNMs because it seems like people don't understand the difference. She could absolutely have used a CNM even high risk because they have hospital privileges and often work under the guidance of doctors with higher risk patients.

 

[CoreyRocks]

Just Moo.

Just my observation but I believe her children had health issues. I lean more towards Bella, just a feeling I get. She seems "fragile " to me. Hard to explain but appears like something is going on medically. I believe fragile is a good term to use based on my history of supporting friends whose children appeared the same way.

Both the children are so precious.

Shanann and Bella and Celeste and Nico did absolutely nothing to deserve to be murdered.

BIG MOO.

 

[MerryB]

Okay....then that should be the rules for the whole picture. If there were relationship dynamics that laid the foundation for the tragedy then it is certainly worth discussion. The problem is the same people who are doing the most speculation on one 'side' are the first to complain when someone looks at the other side of the coin.

If there is to be free discussion of all potential theories you can't have one side being free to add inflammatory speculation while trying to prevent opposing viewpoints from even being discussed.

Virtual high five to @ray9898 ! I think I like you, man.

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

'Depression Is Setting in' for Chris Watts'

Article source: People Magazine - September 17, 2018 03:48 PM - Steve Helling

'Depression Is Setting in' for Chris Watts as He's Jailed in Deaths of Wife, Daughters, Source Says

If that article is presenting an accurate picture, would that negate some ideas that he may have certain disorders? Did the Scott Peterson's, Chris Longo, Jodi Arias's, etc., ever break down initially when they realized what the rest of their lives may be like? Could this point to something else like a dissociative disorder? Just thinking out loud and since there have been apparently been studies done on family annihilators and their shared characteristics, has this ever come into play with them?

 

[katydid23]

I believe the children's medical conditions and her own were embellished for attention and to portray herself as "super" woman, wife, mother and it was all made possible by using Thrive. JMO

So they had no respiratory issues, but the doctor prescribed a nebulizer machine and steroids anyway, for a 3 and 4 yr old?


It took me 2 years of asking politely to get my DR to ok the prescription for my nebulizer. I was on inhalers, but had to come in if I wanted a Neb treatment.

He said he didn't like to prescribe the machine if it was unnecessary.