Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #39

[margarita25]

I think it was on Monday night.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...18CR2003/001/Warrantless Arrest Affidavit.pdf
Page 2:
"A neighborhood canvas was conducted for several hours later that evening by patrol and a check well-being BOLO was initiated through dispatch."

What time was this exactly? I’m sorry I can’t see squat on the small letters.

 

[NuttMegg]

I can just picture them looking around after finding Shananns body, not finding anything, then looking up at the tanks and having the possibility of the girls being in there slowly dawn on them. It must have been horrible. Didn't they say the drones detected them in the tanks somehow?

i haven't heard that about the drone detecting them in the tanks, i cant imagine that, maybe it was a logical leap of deduction, looking up at the tanks. But i would have been looking for more graves.

 

[MsBetsy]

maybe it depends on the type of crude ie alaska vs weld crude, how much it has already evaporated ie how thick and whether the body was stationary and protected like scrunched up , etc. Seems unlikely to find much research on it, though. Mostly we'd have the dna of the individual, and not be looking for someone else's dna on the surface. ????

Yeah, I don't really know. I would think any skin cells would mix with the surrounding oil. I don't see how it would stay on the body. Maybe trace DNA in the surrounding oil or that scraped from the bodies? I would think they would have to be very careful when removing them. Would a body sink or float in oil?

 

[margarita25]

YESSS, those words are going to come back to haunt him. I think someone, maybe a close family member, told him to make sure to say 'actively' during his confession, so he could bring the charges way down. If the child was s till alive, then he was protecting the child, and he could walk away from this.

But in actuality, it backfired, because if he tells the jury his 2nd child was still alive and could have been saved if she had medical aid, and he used those precious minutes to strangle his pregnant wife, killing her and his unorn baby, then he is a true murderer, and not a protector after all.

Exactttllllllllyyyyyyyyyy.

And there you have it folks.

Throw away the key already, jeez.

MOO!

——
WTA: Actually I’m quite curious how the defense will supposedly back up this claim. And due process and all that, as long as it is respectful to Shanann and the girls and RELEVENT.

Might they decide to change their plea? Make a deal, especially after the autopsy information.

Gosh I hope it reveals a lot. The autopsy results in Elisa Lam’s Case were so disappointing imo (she had been submerged in a water tank for days on a hotel rooftop...(still the. Craziest case I think I’ve ever seen to date..the elevator video..)

 

[Tippy Lynn]

https://mediaassets.thedenverchannel.com/document/2018/08/20/arrest affidavit chris watts_95256653_ver1.0.pdf

View attachment 149889

That clears that up - thanks

 

[PommyMommy]

well the way i am remembering it is they put it out that they suspected it before he told them.

They had found the sheet at 4:15 pm. They don't tell us the time they noticed the clandestine grave, but I sort of assume it was the same drone. He pointed out the locations on an aerial photograph, but only after he was backed into a corner.
MOO

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Several of them:

Phillip Austin - Mallet/Strangulation/Stabbing
Christian Longo - Strangulation/Drowning
Robert Fisher - Shooting/Throats cut
Edward Zakrzewski - Crowbar/Strangulation/Machete
Ronald Simmons - Bludgeoning/Shooting/Strangulation/Drowning

MOO

I won't be surprised if the autopsies reveal different methods in this case too.

 

[JudgeJudi]

On the subject of DNA, many people think it’s the be all and end all in criminal cases, but that just isn’t true. DNA evidence alone is frequently not enough to prove guilt beyond reasonable doubt and only serves as partial proof of a criminal act.

Once forensic samples are collected, often in less than ideal conditions, they are sent for analysis. The DNA must then be isolated from the samples (that may contain mixed or only partial DNA), and that DNA must be accurately analysed to determine whether there is a match with the suspect’s DNA. There are many possible risks of inaccuracy (e.g. the risks of contamination of forensic samples, risks of laboratory error etc), but also subjective judgments to be taken into account, in determining the weight to be given to the evidence of a match. It has been stated repeatedly in many articles that DNA evidence should not be considered in isolation from the other evidence, but rather, considered in the context of all of the evidence presented by the prosecution. A DNA match between an accused and a crime scene stain only demonstrates that the accused could be the offender.

In the van Breda case I’ve previously referred to, there were DNA experts for both the State and Defence and their testimony lasted approx. 5 days. In the end, it played no part whatsoever in deciding his guilt. He murdered 3 and almost 4 with axe. The axe was an exhibit and yet not a trace of DNA was found on it. There was a huge amount of blood spatter and some of the victims blood was found on his clothing. You would have thought it must prove his guilt but it didn’t. He was found guilty on other forms of circumstantial evidence that proved that no-one else but him could have committed the crimes. It's possible the same will happen in this case too.

 

[katydid23]

well the way i am remembering it is they put it out that they suspected it before he told them.

They had the GPS data from his truck and they had the sheet, which was by the shallow grave. So it was all over for him before he told them about the tanks.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Hmmmm....

I wonder if initially any of them tried to pull a defense that the spouse did it? And initially said it was all one COD until proven otherwise forensically? I remember we touched a little on some of these cases much earlier on.

Ftr: CW might or might not share many similarities with some of of these other FAs necessarily, as there does exist variances between perps, etc in other cases/genres (child abductions, etc).

CW isn't the first, from PommyMommy's list, Christian Longo accused his wife of killing the children.

 

[PommyMommy]

I was so surprised about the oil tanks, i thought it was a fake report. Doesn't anyone else remember le saying they knew before he confessed? Maybe I'm mistaken.

I remember reports that said law enforcement had recovered Shanann's body and they knew where the girls' bodies were located. When it was reported that they were in the oil tanks then we understood what was taking so long.
MOO

 

[Jennifer17]

They had the GPS data from his truck and they had the sheet, which was by the shallow grave. So it was all over for him before he told them about the tanks.

And I believe that that was when he first confessed to killing them all, but he had that talk.

 

[MsBetsy]

i haven't heard that about the drone detecting them in the tanks, i cant imagine that, maybe it was a logical leap of deduction, looking up at the tanks. But i would have been looking for more graves.

Yes, I didn't understand how the drones would find them either. It would be too early for the bodies to have warmed back up again, I would think, if they even used an infrared camera. I just don't know. I wish I could remember where I saw it. I thought it was this morning. Then again, this morning already feels like last night.

 

[PommyMommy]

I think many people have done research, including myself, and there just does not to be anything on the effects of crude oil on the body and especially of DNA. I don't think even a scientist could tell us anything for sure since there is limited research. We can keep searching, but since there haven't been many cases of retrieving DNA from bodies that were soaking in crude oil, I'm not sure we will find anything! I'm not confident that they will find anything significant in terms of DNA, and I'm not sure they will need it. I think the time and manner of death will be more revealing. Jmo

No specifics unfortunately, but one of the leading DNA experts in Colorado thinks they may still be able to retrieve trace DNA.
Chris Watts case: Expert says 'trace DNA' could be found on daughters' bodies
(Sorry if this is a repeat!)

 

[margarita25]

Not sure if this case has been referenced:

LRB · Jonathan Raban · Just Two Clicks: The Virtual Life of Neil Entwistle

 

[margarita25]

No specifics unfortunately, but one of the leading DNA experts in Colorado thinks they may still be able to retrieve touch DNA.
Chris Watts case: Expert says 'trace DNA' could be found on daughters' bodies
(Sorry if this is a repeat!)

That’s ok that it’s a repeat. It’s hard for me to always remember and absorb entirely all I read and post so thank you again. Since there is no new info I believe all we have is what we have to stew over.

“Danielson is a professor at the University of Denver. He runs his own DNA laboratory and has testified in dozens of criminal cases.

"DNA testing and other physical evidence is certainly a very, very important part of any criminal proceeding, but equally important is the process."

He said even though the bodies of Celeste and Bella were found submerged in oil tanks, investigators may still be able to detect trace DNA.

"The DNA methods that we have are able to detect the tiniest trace quantities," said Danielson. "Because strangulation involves force that can increase the amount of skin cells."“

 

[tmar]

My husband ranks our pets ahead of me. He just does not like 99.9999999 percent of the human population. I don't take it personally, he just loves the pets.

I must be his twin.

 

[Colorado303]

The thing is- if it was premeditated, then why did he fail to think about all of the things that gave him away?

- inadequate burial spot/plans/way to hide the bodies (shallow grave for one, tanks for the other two, tanks that would at some point be checked, especially since they were on his actual job, which LE would automatically check first)

- evidence left helterskelter- a sheet at the burial site, a bag at the burial site, her cell phone and other belongings and kids carseats, her car, EVERYTHING left inside their locked, videoed home.

- zero alibi

- no stage set/scene set up- if he had preplanned it, he would have had an actual plan, one that explained her absence, the girls' absences, one that left room open for them leaving voluntarily or being killed due to something else. Gas leak in the house, boat capsized and they drowned, fire, something. Not kill them, hide them, go to work and try to pretend it never happened.

- didn't call and re-arrange her medical appointment. Didn't use her phone to pretend to be her to throw her off (the whole discovery could have been avoided if CW had used SW's phone to text her friends/coworkers back, something simple like "I'm exhausted from all the travel, and need to rest this morning, will get back online in the morning, carry on without me! thanks dears!")

I personally don't think his daughter going to school was a factor at all. Why would it be? If you're hardcore evil enough to slaughter your whole family, why would it matter if it happened on a Sunday night before the first day of school or a Thursday night midway through the second semester?

I think whatever went down, whoever did what, it happened spontaneously, in the heat of the moment.

The trick with texting something from her phone would be he’d have had to bring her phone to work with him, and he probably knew when she was eventually reported missing LE would look at the phone to track her movements. His story wouldn’t hold up if it looked like she and her phone were at his workplace.

 

[MsBetsy]

It's here.

https://mediaassets.thedenverchannel.com/document/2018/08/20/arrest affidavit chris watts_95256653_ver1.0.pdf

Thank you. That says the drone revealed fresh dirt near the tanks. But not that they knew there were bodies in the tanks. Unless that's how they figured it out. Could be. I would think eventually it would come to their minds they might be in there along with a feeling of dread and disbelief. And horror.

 

[NuttMegg]

Yeah, I don't really know. I would think any skin cells would mix with the surrounding oil. I don't see how it would stay on the body. Maybe trace DNA in the surrounding oil or that scraped from the bodies? I would think they would have to be very careful when removing them. Would a body sink or float in oil?

we had a really long discussion about that, i think it would depend on their clothes, were they in bags with air pockets etc. It also would probably depend on the thickness of the oil, too. I wish i knew more. Maybe the girls were still floating on the surface when found, but they drained the whole tanks for recovering all evidence. Also maybe because the hole was so small on top that they didnt want to destroy anything. Just a pure guess on my part: after just a few days, maybe dna from the murderer could be found deep in protected creases of skin or tissue. ??