Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #52

[Tippy Lynn]

I don't really care if Cindy Watts had a history with Shanann. I don't care if she didn't like her. That's her prerogative. However, the pregnant woman she doesn't like is now dead. Murdered by her son. No matter who you are or why, it's pretty disgusting to say anything negative about a murdered pregnant woman. And not only that, but to say it ad nauseam in interviews, on national tv, in online forums, on social media and on podcasts. That's not grief talking. It's anger.

IMO you cannot really believe Chris Watts is guilty of killing his family and also be ok with the way Cindy is behaving. There's no way an innocent pregnant murdered woman should be spoken about in that manner. So I conclude that those who are fine and dandy with the way Mrs. Watts is conducting herself doesn't truly believe Chris is guilty of killing his entire family. IMO. JMO. MOO.

I truly believe CW is guilty- 100% guilty. This is all on him, he killed them all.

I’m against every single bad or negative comment Mrs. Watts has said about Shan’ann, but his mother didn’t kill anybody and as much as I don’t like or agree with the things she’s said or how she’s conducted herself. I have some compassion for her, but not fine and dandy.
jmo

 

[Misy]

Not yet, anyway. But by her actions so far it wouldn't be too hard for people to imagine she might. She has said if she was guilty of a crime she never would confess to it. Jmo

Hi MsBetsy. I must have missed that one. Can you pls provide a link to that video? TIA

 

[Layla123]

* This has always been my theory too. If he had planned it he would have for one thing parked the truck in the garage for later “loading” purposes. I don’t believe he planned anything for that night, and don’t think he ever planned on killing the girls. He and SW had an argument that went out of control, the girls heard and witnessed something and he panicked. This theory is supported by NK saying CW wanted to find an apt for himself and the girls. Pls don’t misunderstand. I have always thought CW is 100% guilty.

* I think he offered the plea deal because he couldn’t face everything coming out in court. There were four/five people in that house and now there’s only one left alive. He was probably told he would *have* to testify to everything that happened (there was no one else left to do so) and how he saw SW strangling Cece, and then what he did, etc etc, and he probably couldnt bear that thought or face doing that, and he just gave up.

* I want to thank OldLadyBlues for her poignant post on the previous thread. She expressed my thoughts better than I ever could. My heart goes out to all the survivors of this tragedy, including CW’s mom. There are so many thoughtful, loving, caring posters here. But I have been surprised and troubled by the Cindy Watts bashing. While she has said negative things about SW, they have a history that she is drawing from, and if you listen carefully, she’s just believing in her son with every fiber of her being, trying to make sense of this unimaginable horror, and desperately clinging to a possibility that what he’s saying is true, and if so, reasons to support that.

I am looking forward to next week when hopefully there will be answers to so so many questions.

Everything Cindy Watts has said lacks wisdom, grace, dignity, and intelligence. She wants what she wants with no concern for who she hurts in the process. Just like her son. She has shown no interest in learning what the truth is, only in trying to convince everyone that the truth is what she wants the truth to be, in defiance of all the facts that are staring her in the face. Her son is a proven liar. Time and time again. She is not going to get the truth from him. She should know that by now. CW lied to his parents for days when he claimed Shanann, Bella, and CeCe were missing before he changed his story to Shanann killed the girls, and he killed her. He’s a liar. They know it. I feel sorry for Mrs. Watts that her son has committed this horrible crime and put them in this position, but what she is doing is wrong and not helpful to anyone, herself, included.

 

[NuttMegg]

Do you think the "source" on the podcast really had information from the autopsy?

Didn't someone post earlier that living victims of the crime (sometimes) get a preliminary summary of autopsy results before sentencing? IIRC.

If so, connect the dots.

 

[BabyButterfly]

Thank you so that means East Coast 8am. I do not have Facebook so I hope some good poster here will give us a live thread pleaseeeeeeee? Glad I asked because I thought I had read somewhere that it was going to be in the afternoon but could not remember where I read it to go back and check.

I think East coast is 12 noon?

 

[SweetPeas56]

Couple of thoughts this morning...would love input.
✓ CW's lies were going to fall flat eventually. My liar/cheater ex told some whoppers that would eventually come to light. But he still told them in the moment. Maybe CW told his "divorce" lies impulsively in the moment without forward thought. Maybe he thought he could keep having his cake and eating it too indefinitely. My ex was that way. Maybe he actually flipped because SW confronted/outed him/presented evidence/threatened to leave. And SW "barely let" him explain, make excuses.

Or, maybe he did plan to split up and SW wasn't going to make it easy, or maybe he planned to kill them all.

I know we have talked about these previously. But I'm revisiting it in light of recent info, impending court appearances, and even unproven rumors (that stupid podcast that I won't listen to, but which has been discussed here)

Everything MOO.

Thoughts?

 

[bonjoviblonde]

I truly believe CW is guilty- 100% guilty. This is all on him, he killed them all.

I’m against every single bad or negative comment Mrs. Watts has said about Shan’ann, but his mother didn’t kill anybody and as much as I don’t like or agree with the things she’s said or how she’s conducted herself. I have some compassion for her, but not fine and dandy.
jmo

I had compassion for her but she lost me. Even now, I do feel bad that she has a son who is a murderer and she will have to deal with that her whole life. No one deserves that life. He has put a terrible burden and legacy onto his family. I am not completely heartless to them. However, the way they have conducted themselves has disappointed me and shown me their character.

 

[Best of What's Around]

Couple of thoughts this morning...would love input.
✓ CW's lies were going to fall flat eventually. My liar/cheater ex told some whoppers that would eventually come to light. But he still told them in the moment. Maybe CW told his "divorce" lies impulsively in the moment without forward thought. Maybe he thought he could keep having his cake and eating it too indefinitely. My ex was that way. Maybe he actually flipped because SW confronted/outed him/presented evidence/threatened to leave. And SW "barely let" him explain, make excuses.

Or, maybe he did plan to split up and SW wasn't going to make it easy, or maybe he planned to kill them all.

I know we have talked about these previously. But I'm revisiting it in light of recent info, impending court appearances, and even unproven rumors (that stupid podcast that I won't listen to, but which has been discussed here)

Everything MOO.

Thoughts?

I could be wrong, but I am sticking with pre-planning all the murders based on the dumping the children in oil tanks, careful coverup like texting SW the next morning, and most importantly for me: his reactions the immediate day after and they next days. I personally do not find it possible for a man who did not plan to murder his own children to behave so casually and like nothing bad had happened (even to him, from his perspective) if what transpired was not indeed what he wanted all along. It is chilling. IMO

 

[The Farm]

There certainly does seem to be planning involved but he did make mistakes.
The neighbors camera's are what got me also because many of them you can visually see and some have lights on them at night like an LED circle in red etc. My friend has them and when you pull up to their house at night you can see those red circles.
Either way I can bet there were other neighbors with them also. Maybe he thought well they can not see anything because I will back my truck into the garage but he forgot about the timelines and who arrived and who left when. And it obviously never showed SW leaving with the girls. Like I said, he made mistakes so it will be interesting to see what others he made.
And let's not forget the GPS on his work truck.

 

[Layla123]

I could be wrong, but I am sticking with pre-planning all the murders based on the dumping the children in oil tanks, careful coverup like texting SW the next morning, and most importantly for me: his reactions the immediate day after and they next days. I personally do not find it possible for a man who did not plan to murder his own children to behave so casually and like nothing bad had happened (even to him, from his perspective) if what transpired was not indeed what he wanted all along. It is chilling. IMO

Until NK came forward I couldn’t imagine CW premeditating the murder of his family. But since I’ve learned that he spent 4-5 days a week with NK when Shanann, Bella, and CeCe were in North Carolina, I can see how he might have enjoyed that time with NK very much and wanted it to continue without interruption. Getting a divorce would take time and energy that he didn’t want to give to Shanann and the girls. He wanted out quickly, and murdering his family would be the most expedient way to get there.

 

[ZsaZsa]

This may have been touched on in another post,so forgive me if it was, but does anyone else find the timing of NK’s debut more then a little suspicious? Convenient? Somewhat self serving even? Yes I know witnesses had to stay silent until “now” but I feel like this was a very strategic (and clever) play by her lawyer...with the autopsies/MOST of the sordid details coming out in a few days, I feel her lawyer wanted to get her version of the truth (sorry I’m not buying what she’s selling about not knowing he was married) out there while she could still get some sympathy. As someone said in another post, the details are going to be gruesome enough that NOTHING could be forgiven after Monday...but coming out with the “poor ignorant mistress who did the right thing” story BEFORE we hear about the nasty crime she was (potentially)indirectly responsible for? Voila, instant sympathy and less tarnished image!
JMO of course

ETA Of course I commend her for coming forward to LE etc I’m just a jaded one who questions everyone’s motives now...

Absolutely. I thought I was the only one to be that wary of her. I don't believe she thought him separated, and I think she had been to their house while SW was away.

 

[MKZoo]

I cannot help but contrast Shanann’s family in all of this media madness. If anyone has a reason to give anger-filled interviews, it’s the Rzuceks. I have little doubt they are angry. They are grieving as well. They have lost their daughter and grandchildren. They have lost the son in law they thought they knew.

CW has admitted that he murdered his entire family. He’s admitted he lied about their daughter being a killer. But, if the Rzuceks have publicly said a nasty word against CW, I have missed it.

All they have done is ask the authorities not to seek CW’s death in their name and declare their intention to defend the memory of their daughter.

If anyone out there is looking for an example of how to balance what is certainly a private hell with public dignity, they are as good as I’ve ever seen.

Jmo.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

I think East coast is 12 noon?

10AM MST
12PM EST
11AM CST
9AM PST

 

[Best of What's Around]

There certainly does seem to be planning involved but he did make mistakes.
The neighbors camera's are what got me also because many of them you can visually see and some have lights on them at night like an LED circle in red etc. My friend has them and when you pull up to their house at night you can see those red circles.
Either way I can bet there were other neighbors with them also. Maybe he thought well they can not see anything because I will back my truck into the garage but he forgot about the timelines and who arrived and who left when. And it obviously never showed SW leaving with the girls. Like I said, he made mistakes so it will be interesting to see what others he made.
And let's not forget the GPS on his work truck.

He certainly made MANY mistakes and if planned, it was poor planning at best. But FAs before him all made mistakes as well. I do not believe it shows evidence of a lack of pre-planning, just poor planning. IMO. As for me, I have never noticed anyone having cameras on my street but it is not something I worry about, either. I do not believe he knew there was a camera trained on his house/garage to show the comings/goings so clearly.

 

[MintLeighf]

Absolutely. I thought I was the only one to be that wary of her. I don't believe she thought him separated, and I think she had been to their house while SW was away.

We have the gift of polished intuition, I’d say we’re right. I also feel she was there or was seen by CW during Shannan’s business trip...this helped seal his decision. And his loathing of the family life, he saw exactly what it would be like to have the girls in “his own apartment”. A lot of work, barely any play? “This has got to stop”.
JMO

 

[Thepoet]

Well. we're fast approaching a day of reckoning!

day of reckoning
phrase of day

1. the time when past mistakes or misdeeds must be punished or paid for; a testing time when the degree of one's success or failure will be revealed.

Primarily, and certainly, for CW. But also for his family, because they will have to face the truth of what he's done, who he is, and their responsibilities. And their responses.

It will also be a time, probably over a couple of days, when a lot of facts will be revealed and questions answered. When it's over, then what? The investigation and prosecution have been quick, amazing and all that could be expected! But, has anything been learned that could prevent this from happening again? Has anything been learned that would help women recognize a bad situation and leave, before it's too late? Has anything been learned that would help us protect our daughters and grandchildren? I do believe damage has been done by the CW fan clubs and supporters and by those who defend his parents, for whatever reason. It's an unnecessary distraction and lessens the onus on those who should be seen as monsters.

We're fast approaching a day of reckoning and it will be very interesting and very tragic.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I am not sure that Chris was capable of love. The skater boy saw a woman who owned a house and thought that that looked pretty good for him and then he found a woman who was earning much more than he ever could and checked out on SW and thought that he was going on to much bigger and better things. But, he had to make his family disappear before this could happen.

Agree.

CW was moving on from Sugar Momma Shan'ann, to Sugar Momma Nichol.

 

[MintLeighf]

I can understand suspicion of her not knowing he was married, but I doubt she would come forward with information that the LE could dispute - and they must have all the texts between her and CW. She said he revised his story of his relationship with his wife to her that Monday night via texts and calls. So there might very well be proof of her lack of knowledge when it comes to his marriage.

I do not find her timing suspicious, either, personally. Was she advised when to do so strategically? I believe, yes. But she is undoubtedly hounded by the press and other layperson sleuthers on a daily basis, which I imagine will ratchet up after sentencing. She needed to set the record straight. Perhaps she was about to be exposed by a tabloid and chose this time, or perhaps she is heading off the additional scrutiny to inevitably come on Monday. I think she is so far handling herself with dignity and grace and showed no signs of leaking information about her relationship with CW prior to this article that I can tell. So I do not have a problem with considering her a full fledged victim of CW unless and until there is evidence to the contrary. IMO.

Okay, I can accept this, this all sounds plausible. But for whatever reason (personal experience, too much tv, too many Twinkie’s) I can’t comfortably call her a 100% victim...your response gets a 100% though!

 

[Thepoet]

Didn't someone post earlier that living victims of the crime (sometimes) get a preliminary summary of autopsy results before sentencing? IIRC.

If so, connect the dots.

I had read that and it is what I thought. Mrs. CW!

 

[erik28]

...But by her actions so far it wouldn't be too hard for people to imagine she might. She has said if she was guilty of a crime she never would confess to it. Jmo

Hi MsBetsy. I must have missed that one. Can you pls provide a link to that video? TIA

The statement begins in response to a question at 15:00 of the extended interview about "what if" CW is truly guilty. It is a bit indirect and hypothetical: Extended Interview: Cindy Watts, Chris Watts' mother, questions son's plea deal

to paraphrase, Cindy Watts considers that CW may be guilty of all that he has plead to and it scares her to death to think that, then she adds at 15:31
"I don't see why he's pleading guilty. I wouldn't. I'd fight. I'd fight to the end."