GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #62

[Tortoise]

Page 541

Thank you!

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I posted this earlier in the media thread - mostly just a recap of what we discuss.

Christopher Watts lied, cheated prior to murdering family

One of the cards CW gave NK - thought it was the interesting that the focus was all on having "firsts." The first time I saw you, the first time, etc. And that they can still have new FIRSTS together. My speculation was that NK had been voicing how she wouldn't have those "firsts" with him - the first wedding, the first house, the first couch, the first pregnancy, the first births, etc. etc. All those things a single girl hasn't had that her married (or divorced) boyfriend has already done. I bet it was a conversation where she had expressed her issues about that. And so that's what prompted this card. He didn't want her to walk away.

I'm not sure what the significance is of this, but I did notice on the reports that the toilet in the Jack and Jill bathroom between the children's rooms was locked. And also there was no water in the toilet. I guess they did not use that bathroom in between the girls room and used another one for the girls that had the toys in it. But it also leads me to believe that if he was doing something to one girl, that the bathroom was locked in between and there was much space so that the other girl and if she was there would not hear him going in there and doing anything.

 

[Mamamiamaria]

I would think she was looking for a way to sue news sources that are implicating her in the murder or saying things that are not true. That was the one thing she was so concerned about. Imo

Well she could have come out of this relatively unscathed with a high degree of public sympathy. She chose to delete what could have been vital information and sounded like a witness to a traffic accident on the audio I have heard of her interviews. Posters here who did not know th family were more upset than she appeared to be, Imo.

 

[mrjitty]

Agree, I think Chris morphed according to who he was with. He was in to Thrive and getting in shape as well as Shanann but he sure loved eating her baked goods and Italian lasagna. I doubt he ever thought about macro nutrients til he met NK then the narrative became whatever he thought she wanted to hear. The guy had zero identity and zero personality, even the cards he wrote to her seemed to be canned lines that he googled. Original thoughts for him were fair and few between.

This is all not surprising for this personality type.

SW got all his love bombing, until he found something better. Then he dropped her like trash and moved on.

The apparent stormy nature of his relationship with SW (behind closed doors) is also not surprising but the key is the apparent cliff edge SW experience where he suddenly went cold.

 

[MsBetsy]

The sheet that accompanied her clothing in the chain of evidence was white with dirt all over and red stains; it was placed under her body in the cadaver bag after she was recovered to preserve possible evidence (Discovery pages 109, 250, 1076). Not that you shouldn't be skeptical of Radar Online anyway

Yes, I've read so much misinformation from some of those sites that I question everything they say. I'm confused about the sheet because LE said the one in the field matched the one they saw in the bedroom. They said the dirt marks were consistent to the sheet being dragged but I don't recall any mention of it being blood stained. I did not realize there was another sheet. I thought he used the blue and white sheet to transport her and then just dumped her body in the hole he dug. Do we know where the second sheet came from?

 

[curiouschat]

My favorite part of the polygraph video is when awesome Tammy says, "Wow, the good news is, you are a horrible liar! Has anyone ever told you that? That was awesome. If you lie it will be really easy to tell!"

There is another ironic part where he says something about not being as good at sales because I think Shanann said he would give too much info on the product?

 

[zea mays]

I think she is just as effed up as he is and that they began an interest in each other back in late 2017 and it turned physical somewhere in early 2018, hence the increased sex drive in CW. This is common for people who are also having sex outside of the relationship. The baby came either as a last ditch effort for CW to "fix" things, as he put it or as a way to keep SW in the dark.

RSBM. BM. This triggered me to remember something that I heard in the pre-polygraph interview with Tammy. They were talking about all three pregnancies and if the pregnancy with Nico was planned. SW had to take fertility meds to get pregnant with Cece and Bella and it sounds like they used timed intercourse to get pregnant. I don't think CW wanted to have another baby but decided that he would act as though he did since the likelihood of a natural pregnancy was so small. He specifically said she wasn't taking fertility meds with Nico. I think he thought he was safe and buying some time by appearing cooperative and excited. I think the affair with NK and the unexpected-by-CW (though stupidly, lol) pregnancy were the main triggers. It explains the reaction in the "reveal" video perfectly.

 

[Tortoise]

Did he slip up in the questioning as to knowing what color of underwear Shanann was wearing? He said blue but I can't remember if that was after he'd admitted to burying her or if it was at an earlier point in the questioning, when he wouldn't have seen her underwear because she was in bed under the covers.

 

[The Farm]

The apparent stormy nature of his relationship with SW (behind closed doors) is also not surprising but the key is the apparent cliff edge SW experience where he suddenly went cold.

Yes and I think it was then that he was putting the plan together, he had been thinking about it while SW was in NC but when the SW started noticing that he was moving forward then....JMO

 

[mrjitty]

I don’t think she would google Chris first, she knew what he looked like, where he worked. She most likely knew nothing about Shanann and wanted to see what the wife looked like.

Yeah - I still think this was just typical office stalking.

The fact that there doesn't appear to be any other digital forensic link between them for months until the final weeks is significant.

We have to follow the evidence here.

 

[zea mays]

I can't remember what video it was in, but before they confronted CW, Agent Tammy asks CW if they find SW and the girls murdered, what does he think should happen to the person who did it.

And he gives a cold, clinical, non-emotional answer that then they should get the death penalty or if Colorado doesn't really do that, then life in prison. But no emotion or anger like how he would want them dead or suffer or what he would want to do to the person who did this to his family.

Which of course he didn't have that emotion because he is the guilty one! But even more was telling that if he was going to blame this on SW, he should have been all, "I would want to do to them the exact thing they did to my daughters, those were my kids."

My favorite part of the polygraph video is when awesome Tammy says, "Wow, the good news is, you are a horrible liar! Has anyone ever told you that? That was awesome. If you lie it will be really easy to tell!"

That was my favorite part, too! I actually paused and replayed for my DH because I was so delighted by that moment, LOL!

 

[SassynOz]

If Alexa could read Websleuths to me whilst I did laundry or did sit-ups, my life could be SO PRODUCTIVE!

Can we make this happen in the near future? We are Alexa junkies here.

 

[Tortoise]

I didn't like the pre-2018 polygraph "lie" questions. I thought that was a bit clunky. Especially the one about wanting to harm someone - it would not necessarily be a truth that he would have to lie about. Does everyone fantasize about harming another person? I certainly don't.

 

[ilovewings]

I have had this thought for a long time- I recall the video where Shannan said when she met CW, how he saved her life: how she was so sick and he accepted her and how grateful she was. Fast forward two children later, another one on the way, and Shannan during those years she was with Chris becoming a healthier and stronger woman, bringing in a good income and developing a strong personality--I think he may have liked the sick weaker grateful Shannan better than the person she became over the years of their marriage. Perhaps she stopped being grateful and spoke her mind---and CW just did not like the woman she had become over the years and decided he wanted a new model----It is obvious that what you see on the videos with his wife and children was a
total lie-- he had no attachment to any of them and disposed of them like yesterday's garbage (sorry for that reference but that is what he did).

 

[MsBetsy]

Well she could have come out of this relatively unscathed with a high degree of public sympathy. She chose to delete what could have been vital information and sounded like a witness to a traffic accident on the audio I have heard of her interviews. Posters here who did not know th family were more upset than she appeared to be, Imo.

Yes, I know, but that is the first thing I thought of when someone mentioned her hiring a "libel" attorney. They mentioned something about slander and since she was so concerned about all her pictures and texts being all over the news it makes sense that she would be fuming since that's exactly what happened. LE assured her that they weren't interested in that, they only cared about her conversations with Watts in regard to Shanann, the girls and how it relates to the murders. So it's not hard to assume that she may hire a lawyer because of it. It's not hard to believe that some of the gossip and entertainment sites stretched the truth or made assumptions.
She just seems like the type to want some type of compensation for that. I'm sure she thinks all this attention is ruining her life. Imo

 

[Layla123]

I saw that her new lawyer was specifically a type of lawyer for libel.

That made me think she was perhaps looking after a book deal ( or do an exclusive tell all) to see what she could say legally without being slanderous or libelous, because why else would she get that type of a specific lawyer.

I thought, maybe, she is investigating the possibility of holding everyone who she believes misrepresented, exaggerated, and falsified information about her involvement with CW accountable for the damage they’ve done to her life and reputation. That sure would be interesting. Not that I claim to know the truth about everything, but do wonder if she was falsely maligned, does she have any recourse?

 

[mrjitty]

Having seen the interviews to go with the transcripts I am firm in my conclusion that this is ultimately a simple case that we've seen a 1000 times before.

Man finds another women. Man murders wife because she is in the way. He wants it all. The new women, the house, the money.

The only unusual aspect is the kids. But I think they were also just in the way, and because he is a sociopath, he could dispose of them like trash.

Because he is a "perfect dad" and lives in a nice neighbourhood that creates moral peril that the media just love.

But actually he is just one more dumb killer who decided to murder his wife.

 

[Tortoise]

I thought, maybe, she is investigating the possibility of holding everyone who she believes misrepresented, exaggerated, and falsified information about her involvement with CW accountable for the damage they’ve done to her life and reputation. That sure would be interesting. Not that I claim to know the truth about everything, but do wonder if she was been falsely maligned, does she have any recourse?

She has the same rights as any other citizen, if that's what you're asking. Not against LE, because they haven't released any false information, but against news organisations etc.

 

[Layla123]

Yes, I know, but that is the first thing I thought of when someone mentioned her hiring a "libel" attorney. They mentioned something about slander and since she was so concerned about all her pictures and texts being all over the news it makes sense that she would be fuming since that's exactly what happened. LE assured her that they weren't interested in that, they only cared about her conversations with Watts in regard to Shanann, the girls and how it relates to the murders. So it's not hard to assume that she may hire a lawyer because of it. It's not hard to believe that some of the gossip and entertainment sites stretched the truth or made assumptions.
She just seems like the type to want some type of compensation for that. I'm sure she thinks all this attention is ruining her life. Imo

Maybe, it’s not money she’d be after, but to set the record straight. Sure would be interesting. I’d love to hear why she googled SW in September 2017. Could it have had something to do with seeking out information about purchasing Thrive?

 

[x_files]

I keep going back to the same thought. Chris is a guy who has to be led around by a woman, cannot think on his own. Dumb, dumb criminal. Sociopath. And yet we are to believe he planned the murders all on his own? I believe he was “led” and was just crazy stupid in detail and cover up. It’s hard to believe but she comes across with the same personality disorders, so why not?

It wouldn't be the first time two psychos meet and fall in "love". So far there's no digital trail or texts proving she asked him to kill them or she knew he was planning to do so but she came on strong started telling him to move out, to managing his diet. I find this bizarre behavior for only knowing/dating him six weeks. The google searches for wedding dresses makes me think he proposed or she hoped he would soon. The photo of the wildflowers right after he dumped and buried his wife seems like a confirmation photo. "I fixed" "it's finalized." In her own words. She asked him to "fix it" "to finalize it." Those words cannot be ignored.
Folie à deux.