Crime Scene Animation by Websleuths Member grayhuze

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It's incredible that that one piece of information that was so critical was a typo. Like you said, a bullet can pass through the skull without breaking the dura mater...at least one that is claimed to have hit the brain. I wish he had done the rod trajectory test or whatever you call it.
 
BBM: I saw that same episode, crazy! IMO Travis was shot first - I can't think of any other scenario that puts him over the sink with the amount/pattern of the blood. However, I think that's where Jodi started stabbing/slashing him in the shoulders. I think she had the knife at hand. Your re-enactments are thought provoking. :thinking:

yeah..I think the stabbing began at the sink as well, but not the back stabs. They are all confined to a small area which means travis wasn't moving. If he was standing, surely he would have pivoted out. You can tell that 8 with the left hand were made one after another because the angle stays the same, just different positioning. I had once thought the one I have circled in red was when her finger slipped and then she changed hands and stabbed once with the right hand, marked in purple.
 
5:27:28 is the picture that I was talking about that is missing from your timeline with the white jaggy lines coming down across his shoulder. This is when I believe Jodi stun gunned him.

the jaggy white lines if that is what you are talking about are light artifacts produced in the court room and overhead projector.
 
http://www.military-sf.com/Weaponry.htm
"Let's consider the weapons today. Most are projectile weapons, they propel a projectile at the enemy. When this projectile hits a target it inflicts damage. The damage varies on the type of bullet and its velocity. For example a 22 caliber bullet can hit a person in the head, skim the skull and 'pop' out the back of the head without penetrating the skull. A 22 can also fail to penetrate muscles. A .50 caliber round can tear a person in two."

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...shot-in-head-drives-man-shot-east-74th-street
 
Two things convinced me that Travis was shot last:

1. It was determined that the gunshot wound did not bleed much. Head wounds--even minor ones--bleed profusely. If TA's head wound did not bleed it was likely due to it being inflicted after death. That's the "scientific" take on the issue that I find very telling.

2. Jodi's personality leads me to believe she would pick up a gun and shoot the person she had just viciously murdered with a knife. It was, IMO, her final "FU" to Mr. Travis Alexander and she probably even screamed the words seconds before or after she pulled the trigger. That's not scientific reasoning, but I do not believe science always has all the answers. Sometimes you can gain much information in the process of observing.
 
View attachment 69562
so, this image means the gunshot was last? Very shaky evidence.

I don't think that's what I said. lol I stated I don't find the location of the shell casing to be compelling one way or the other as to gunshot first or last, there are many ways it could have ended up where it did.
 
the jaggy white lines if that is what you are talking about are light artifacts produced in the court room and overhead projector.
Then why aren't they on all the photos??
 
It's incredible that that one piece of information that was so critical was a typo. Like you said, a bullet can pass through the skull without breaking the dura mater...at least one that is claimed to have hit the brain. I wish he had done the rod trajectory test or whatever you call it.

Who said that??? I said just the opposite, it's impossible to hit the brain and not damage the Dura Mater. I fully believe it was a typo- a word left out and Horn didn't immediately catch it.
 
It helps my conclusion. I think she shot him after all the work was done. The stabbing and slashing. She then shoots him last to make sure he is dead and the casing landed there and stuck in the blood.
Well I obviously disgree.
 
Two things convinced me that Travis was shot last:

1. It was determined that the gunshot wound did not bleed much. Head wounds--even minor ones--bleed profusely. If TA's head wound did not bleed it was likely due to it being inflicted after death. That's the "scientific" take on the issue that I find very telling.

2. Jodi's personality leads me to believe she would pick up a gun and shoot the person she had just viciously murdered with a knife. It was, IMO, her final "FU" to Mr. Travis Alexander and she probably even screamed the words seconds before or after she pulled the trigger. That's not scientific reasoning, but I do not believe science always has all the answers. Sometimes you can gain much information in the process of observing.

That would be the first shooting of a decapitated head in history.
 
I don't think that's what I said. lol I stated I don't find the location of the shell casing to be compelling one way or the other as to gunshot first or last, there are many ways it could have ended up where it did.

oh weird I think I replied to the wrong person above.
 
Great visual grey. I've always Believed the more likely scenario was she shot him first which only incapacitated him but was not fatal and ran to get a knife to finish the job. It was nice seeing it in animation.
 
Then why aren't they on all the photos??

well if you watch the trial portion where they move the photos around, then you will notice that the positioning of the light changes. You are just seeing where someone did a screen crab at a particular moment. surely a stun gun was not used. If it was, Jodi would have claimed using it much earlier as that would help dramatically her self defense claim and soften what she did. IMO
 
May I ask you the reason why you are so determined to (try) to proof the prosecutor and the Dr. are so wrong?

I'm not. It's just that everyone keeps asking me about it and trying to prove their point so I am debating. Why are you so determined to prove they didn't lie. I go where the evidence takes me and don't support everything the prosecution says nor most anything the defense says based on evidence, weather circumstantial or hard evidence.
 
http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Horn+Final

Horn: Yes, the entire brain was decomposed.
Martinez: Is that one of the reasons that ..that.. did that hinder you in attempting to find out what a trajectory was?
Horn: Yes, in addition to lack of hemorrhage in the wound to begin with. If the hemorrhage had still been there, I might have been able to identify that, even in a decomposed brain, but there was really no hemorrhage and the brain was uniformly green-grey and soft.
Martinez: And if there is no hemorrhaging there, that’s what you previously indicated.. could indicate that he was already dead?
Horn: Yes.
Martinez: And if the bullet goes in this direction, and the frontal lobe is there, is it your opinion, even though the brain was in that tapioca pudding kind of state, that you can at least give us an indication as to what the trajectory was, and I know you previously indicated something about simple geometry..
Horn: Yes, if you draw a line straight from the right front part of the head towards the left cheek, which is in this area here ...
Martinez: Go ahead ..go ahead and draw the line if you can, I don’t know exactly how to work it ...
Horn: The trajectory is this way and the cheek is in this location, so the bullet ends up here. So you can see that it enters the skull here, and why we have a larger fractured exit point is because the bullet has begun to tumble and deform, and you get a larger exit as the bullet is deformed by the bone.
Martinez: So it isn’t a situation where the bullet then goes down in this direction, but it actually keeps going this direction, is that ..?
Horn: Yes, it goes down below the skull into the face.
Martinez: And if it goes down in that direction, do you have an opinion as to what would have happened once that shot struck Mr. Alexander in the front portion of his face?
Horn: If it had been the last wound nothing, because he was already dead. If it’s the first wound and it’s passing through his frontal lobe, that bullet is tumbling and deforming and it’s causing a large temporary cavity which is involving areas of brain, even away from the frontal lobe, that this person would have collapsed.
Martinez: Is there something to a bullet involving, for example, concussive affect, in other words , it’s not just the item that is going through, but is there any sort of, for lack of a better term, radiation of energy that goes from there?
Horn: A bullet as it passes through something soft like brain, will create what is called a temporary cavity, and you see that in ballistic gelatin when you test fire a bullet through gelatin. You see it in the ballistic labs. It’s the same concept in the brain. You get a very large open area that squashes the brain around it into the skull around it, and then that will collapse back down ... and you may be able to see a wound track, but in this case, we don’t. But it damages areas of the brain away from the frontal lobe, even only passing through that one part of the brain, other areas of the brain are involved and damaged.
Horn: He would have been incapacitated.
Martinez: And would this have been an immediate sort of reaction, seconds?
Horn: Yes.
Martinez: By seconds, how many seconds would you indicate?
Horn: A second or two. He would collapse to the ground and be unresponsive.
 
well if you watch the trial portion where they move the photos around, then you will notice that the positioning of the light changes. You are just seeing where someone did a screen crab at a particular moment. surely a stun gun was not used. If it was, Jodi would have claimed using it much earlier as that would help dramatically her self defense claim and soften what she did. IMO

It's come out in this phase of the trial that she offered Travis her stun gun to help catch the slasher of his tires. So she must have one.
 
I'm not. It's just that everyone keeps asking me about it and trying to prove their point so I am debating. Why are you so determined to prove they didn't lie. I go where the evidence takes me and don't support everything the prosecution says nor most anything the defense says based on evidence, weather circumstantial or hard evidence.

If you're not, why make the animation to show people the prosecution and the doc are wrong, suggesting they lied to the jury?
Why?
This is the point of this whole thread.

I have no reason to believe the prosecution lied to the jury....I think otherwise about the defense.....

I can guarantee you that Juan Martinez, the prosecutor in this case, went to where the evidence took him.
No doubt in my mind.
 
It's come out in this phase of the trial that she offered Travis her stun gun to help catch the slasher of his tires. So she must have one.
Because she's so honest? Like how it came out that she sprang onto his shelves to retrieve his holstered gun in his closet. Must've had one

ETA I'm assuming you made that in jest.
 
http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Horn+Final

Horn: Yes, the entire brain was decomposed.
Martinez: Is that one of the reasons that ..that.. did that hinder you in attempting to find out what a trajectory was?
Horn: Yes, in addition to lack of hemorrhage in the wound to begin with. If the hemorrhage had still been there, I might have been able to identify that, even in a decomposed brain, but there was really no hemorrhage and the brain was uniformly green-grey and soft.
Martinez: And if there is no hemorrhaging there, that’s what you previously indicated.. could indicate that he was already dead?
Horn: Yes.
Martinez: And if the bullet goes in this direction, and the frontal lobe is there, is it your opinion, even though the brain was in that tapioca pudding kind of state, that you can at least give us an indication as to what the trajectory was, and I know you previously indicated something about simple geometry..
Horn: Yes, if you draw a line straight from the right front part of the head towards the left cheek, which is in this area here ...
Martinez: Go ahead ..go ahead and draw the line if you can, I don’t know exactly how to work it ...
Horn: The trajectory is this way and the cheek is in this location, so the bullet ends up here. So you can see that it enters the skull here, and why we have a larger fractured exit point is because the bullet has begun to tumble and deform, and you get a larger exit as the bullet is deformed by the bone.
Martinez: So it isn’t a situation where the bullet then goes down in this direction, but it actually keeps going this direction, is that ..?
Horn: Yes, it goes down below the skull into the face.
Martinez: And if it goes down in that direction, do you have an opinion as to what would have happened once that shot struck Mr. Alexander in the front portion of his face?
Horn: If it had been the last wound nothing, because he was already dead. If it’s the first wound and it’s passing through his frontal lobe, that bullet is tumbling and deforming and it’s causing a large temporary cavity which is involving areas of brain, even away from the frontal lobe, that this person would have collapsed.
Martinez: Is there something to a bullet involving, for example, concussive affect, in other words , it’s not just the item that is going through, but is there any sort of, for lack of a better term, radiation of energy that goes from there?
Horn: A bullet as it passes through something soft like brain, will create what is called a temporary cavity, and you see that in ballistic gelatin when you test fire a bullet through gelatin. You see it in the ballistic labs. It’s the same concept in the brain. You get a very large open area that squashes the brain around it into the skull around it, and then that will collapse back down ... and you may be able to see a wound track, but in this case, we don’t. But it damages areas of the brain away from the frontal lobe, even only passing through that one part of the brain, other areas of the brain are involved and damaged.
Horn: He would have been incapacitated.
Martinez: And would this have been an immediate sort of reaction, seconds?
Horn: Yes.
Martinez: By seconds, how many seconds would you indicate?
Horn: A second or two. He would collapse to the ground and be unresponsive.


BBM.

Thank you for posting this.
I trust this Doctor Horn.

He knows what he's talking about, and it makes complete sense to me.

Thank you again!
 

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