CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, deceased/not found, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #63

[afitzy]

@afitzy - you are right - the Court has broad discretion regarding a mistrial.

But think about WHAT (if any) is the prejudice to Defendant here? If Defendant caused the protected document to be disseminated, in violation of the Court’s order, the Defendant only could be prejudiced if a Juror violates the Court’s order, and finds and reads the report on line, and concludes that the report is unfavorable to D. These facts are upside down - D wants the report in as exculpatory, so there is no prejudice to D.

The Judge was abundantly cautious to keep this issue from the juror’s ears - so just based on the record - the whole laptop screen incident should be “contained” with respect to the jury.

I get this I think but my concern is broader than just the laptop screen issue.

My first concern (nothing to do with this trial) is that because Defendant has the report that she leaks it online and effectively shames a Victim and harms the children. If this happens I do hope there is Civil action by the Farber family against Defendant as this is imo profoundly wrong. My second concern (has to do with trial) is that it seems like this report even though it can't be evidence and can't be shared with the jury effectively has taken on a life of its own in this trial and could I fear have the jury thinking that there is something key they aren't privy to that could somehow show the Defendant in a favourable light and that what the State is saying about Fd and MT not 'winning' in Family Court simply isn't true even though evidence to support the States case has been clearly presented.

The issue of this report has been kicking around on social media with the Defendant and her family now for 4 years and her two attorneys have now brought the report into the trial to the point where even if it can't be admitted as evidence it effectively has that same power even though nobody knows what is in the report or even if all the Defence attorney statements made about the report and MT commentary about the report in the LE interviews is even correct. The report isn't important but its been made to seem important and worse yet something important is now hidden from the jury as evidence. How can this fact pattern NOT taint a proceeding?

I think the only way out of the mess is to call it a day and start again with different rules on the report from day 1 which imo was huge error made here by Judge R. When you look back at Judge R allowing "Testimony/Cross" from Defence now for weeks (Judge R said today he has allowed it because everyone has different styles....I do hope Judge R rethinks this as he imo lost a game of 3 card Monte and had his clock cleaned by Defence Counsel imo) that the Defence has been dropping breadcrumbs since Day 1 about the report and nobody or nothing has stopped them really. We are now sitting in week 4 I think and the crazy irrelevant discredited report is the elephant in the room imo. Nobody seems to care whether the report could be damaging to the privacy of children or that a victim can be shamed with no defence either.

When you look at Defence "testimony/cross" where they don't really ask questions as they should be doing but are instead simply testifying to the Jury in contravention of what I understand (admittedly limited!) to be Court rules on procedure and evidence etc.

Atty Felson today with her 'testimony/cross' of GAL Atty Meehan effectively spent idk 90% of her time talking in a veiled and not so veiled way about the discredited report as she allegedly crossed Atty Meehan. What do you think the jury made of this? Judge R gave her his strongest admonishment yet (you've crossed the double yellow line) but she disregarded him imo and kept on hammering away until State had to get up 4 times in a row and simply object to all her questions which violated the pre agreed upon order/stipulation? regarding the matter. Atty Felson knew the ruling and agreed to it yet she still crossed the line repeatedly simply to convey the D message to the jury. This is just one example of this happening as Jon Shoenhorn has also been doing this for weeks. Shoenhorn even tried to horse trade the stipulation he signed on the evidence he kept in a box in his office for over a year! We also had more games on the phone location data which played out today. So much of the evidence imo should have been agreed to and resolved pretrial yet the games simply continue for some reason I don't understand.

IDK, just seems like banana republic justice tricks and games imo with no consequences and its all quite disappointing and unacceptable and IDK how jury can do its job and achieve justice with all that has gone on?

Not sure what to think but I'm pretty disgusted with the way this has been allowed to play out by the Judge as its all be totally avoidable imo. IDK what to think, like I said procedural court issues and mistrial are above my pay grade and maybe the jury can see through it all but why take that risk as imo its a huge risk to justice being served. Just call the trial and start again.

MOO

Edited to add Ch12 Marisa Alter article (full article posted by another person above) which summarises imo what this non admissible report has done to taint this trial with the Judge's absolute approval so far as i see.

"Meehan also told the jury Fotis Dulos was encouraged by a custody report that came out in April 2019—a report that is sealed and its contents not admissible at trial. Meehan said the findings led Fotis Dulos to file a new motion, which Meehan was barred from speaking on, with both sides appearing in court in May. That was just weeks before police believe Fotis Dulos killed Jennifer Dulos in her home in New Canaan."

So, today we get GAL saying what Defence has been saying about being encouraged by report. Sure anyone can say anything but that doesn't mean its correct. Zero effort was exerted by the State that I saw to put the FD comment by GAL in context.

I'm not posting Marisa Alter article for any other reason other than to show what a monster this non admissible report has become. Marisa btw has been following this case diligently and brilliantly imo since DAY 1 of JF being missing. I in no way put her into the same boat as the NBC CT Crew with Shannon Miller who seem to have a paid relationship with Defence and Defendant and family imo.

MOO

 

[waldojabba]

Michelle Troconis accused of violating court order at trial; jury hears testimony about Dulos custody battle

Supervisory Assistant State’s Attorney Michelle Manning told the judge that Troconis displayed on her monitor part of a sealed report regarding the custody battle between Jennifer Dulos and Fotis Dulos, who was Troconis’ boyfriend at the time.

connecticut.news12.com

Here is the Marissa Alter article regarding today - apologies if already posted
Imo

 

[carolmaria]

Absolutely agree. I thought we would see more bombshells.

I think p did a great job laying out all of the proof that Jennifer was murdered by Fotis but I honestly think that p has to do a better job of explaining MT’s involvement, CLEARLY!

Meaning they have shown the evidence but I’d like to see a step-by-step layman’s guide if you will showing every piece of evidence as shared beautifully in court by the exhibits/testimonies but not tied together like it should be to prove each and every charge against MT with the vivid examples as it’s been much too choppy and hard-to-follow.

For example, put up her written in perfect English alibi script on a giant screen in big bold font and with a lighted pointer go line-by-line, starting with highlighting her perfectly written English, then with the evidence to prove each line and lie with evidence to prove it with photos, quotes, testimony, phone data etc. moving down the paper, line by line showing her video clips saying she answered Andreas’s call and what that means, saying it clearly means that she stayed at 4jc and went up to his office and answered a pre-planned call from Fotis’s friend Andreas from Greece to form an alibi for Fotis and state clearly that this shows that MT conspired and explain what that means! Show the phone records of her going up the stairs….

Show a video clip of her saying what Fotis was wearing that morning and then a clip of him riding a bike wearing a hoodie during that time etc.! So what I am saying is show that she lied with the proof….

Show charts and clips of her going to and from 80 ms and 4jc multiple times with the phone data and surveillance clips. Show the clip of what Pg said and Lauren. Explain the coffee spill as she explained the bloody seats of the Tacoma and how she said it didn’t smell like coffee and say it seems like she should know what coffee smells like as she loves Starbucks and show that clip!!!!

Show close-ups of her body language from arrest to court appearances to interviews and in Starbucks and how body language matters citing other cases…

On the big screen show the mop pic and bloodied paper towel bits and green and yellow sponge that they found in the trash and roll the tape of her saying she brought these items to
80 ms to clean. Show her in the car coffee her phone records of her in the car etc…..state clearly that she accompanied Fotis dumping the garbage and show the photos of what they collected and state that tbis was clearly tampering with evidence.

Then show receipts of their cleaning lady from years of cleaning to explain how MT never typically cleans (show the clip of her saying just that) so why that day?!!!

Show clips of all the descriptive English words and phrases she used in all of the interviews. You cannot watch all of these videos in full and claim she doesn’t understand English. Get people to testify how she understands just fine as js is going to say she doesn’t.


Show her phone data and pics of her car driving to the car wash and explain that they took the red Tacoma that Fotis used in the murder to the car wash and they had a plan for her to follow him there to get a full detail and that proves Michelle is tampering with evidence. She followed him and emphasize how that was planned. She knew by this time re Jennifer but didn’t find this concerning? Explain why to anyone this would be gravely concerning. They never washed PH’s car before after using it many times and play that clip from pg.

I could go on and on as I am frustrated that it’s all there but not presented clearly, in my opinion.

It looks like all FD which I know they have to prove the murder but the evidence is there against MT but in my opinion they have not clearly shown the jury how she was involved in everything and in lockstep with him from the beginning to end.

Perhaps they plan on doing that in closing but it best be tight as it’s all there but must be better conveyed as I’ve seen in other trials.

Moo

Yes, a thousand times yes. Anything to defrag the evidence! Especially with no opening. I know PowerPoint is commonly in use—but what about presentation platforms like Prezi—much more vivid and intuitive and less mind-numbing?

Presentations and videos with engaging visuals for hybrid teams | Prezi Present

Welcome to Prezi, the presentation software that uses motion, zoom, and spatial relationships to bring your ideas to life and make you a great presenter.

prezi.com

Are courts limited to PPT? I have no idea.

 

[afitzy]

I questioned earlier why local media coverage isn’t all over this case. I suggested they were afraid of something. I smell a rat here!

What do you mean? Do you mean that no investigative journalists are out there covering the players in this case MT and KM?

MSM is streaming the trial live (think we have 5 live feeds with 1000s watching the trial on each stream live too).
What do you mean exactly? We don't have quality journalists but the feed is free and live and available on replay and anyone can watch. MOO

 

[waldojabba]

That’s what I remember too.

I wonder if Norm is somehow in cahoots with JS behind the scenes or even directly with the MT family. Wouldn’t that be something ! I think Norm was ordered not to speak about/ be at all involved with the case for a period of 40 years. Just musing.
Right now you can bet there is a lot of behind the scenes chatter and maneuvering going on by the D and the defendants family.
I think the judge should have taken MT computer but the hard drive will tell the story. If she dares to break it or wipe the computer etc that will also show guilt.
Such a strange depraved twist of events from a woman who we have seen lacks the ability to make good choices.
I suspect it’s probably CL who saw the screen from the gallery. She sits in the first row behind the P and the court room is so small it would not be hard to see the screens of the D - esp with that Font.
JMO

“A probate judge approved a settlement with the estate of Fotis Dulos Tuesday that would require his former criminal defense attorneys Norm Pattis and Kevin Smith to not discuss the case surrounding the disappearance of Jennifer Dulos for 40 years.”

https://www.ctinsider.com/news/article/Judge-approves-deal-to-silence-Norm-Pattis-on-16312316.php

 

[afitzy]

Yes, a thousand times yes. Anything to defrag the evidence! Especially with no opening. I know PowerPoint is commonly in use—but what about presentation platforms like Prezi—much more vivid and intuitive and less mind-numbing?

Presentations and videos with engaging visuals for hybrid teams | Prezi Present

Welcome to Prezi, the presentation software that uses motion, zoom, and spatial relationships to bring your ideas to life and make you a great presenter.

prezi.com

Are courts limited to PPT? I have no idea.

Hate to say it but I don't think the State is going to do what so many here have been asking for in terms of a coherent and visual narrative of the case.

I've given up looking for it and experienced attorneys have told me that I'm asking for something that this Prosecution team simply won't deliver as they don't see that as being their task. I've also been told that the path chosen by the State could prevail so we will simply have to wait and see what the jury thinks about it all.

I think what you are asking for simply doesn't seem to be who these prosecutors are and that is not how their case has been designed. From Day 1 the case presentation has consisted of dropping evidence piece by piece. The jury has seen zero synthesis or narrative and its been 4 weeks of building presentation of data points. Perhaps the State has been building a bridge to somewhere with the Jury but perhaps its the bridge to nowhere. I'm not used to this style so I'm uncomfortable with it but will hang on and see if we get a bridge to somewhere (or not).

Perhaps in closing a narrative by the State might be presented? IDK, but I haven't seen it so far.
MOO

 

[MX27875]

Absolutely agree. I thought we would see more bombshells.

I think p did a great job laying out all of the proof that Jennifer was murdered by Fotis but I honestly think that p has to do a better job of explaining MT’s involvement, CLEARLY!

Meaning they have shown the evidence but I’d like to see a step-by-step layman’s guide if you will showing every piece of evidence as shared beautifully in court by the exhibits/testimonies but not tied together like it should be to prove each and every charge against MT with the vivid examples as it’s been much too choppy and hard-to-follow.

For example, put up her written in perfect English alibi script on a giant screen in big bold font and with a lighted pointer go line-by-line, starting with highlighting her perfectly written English, then with the evidence to prove each line and lie with evidence to prove it with photos, quotes, testimony, phone data etc. moving down the paper, line by line showing her video clips saying she answered Andreas’s call and what that means, saying it clearly means that she stayed at 4jc and went up to his office and answered a pre-planned call from Fotis’s friend Andreas from Greece to form an alibi for Fotis and state clearly that this shows that MT conspired and explain what that means! Show the phone records of her going up the stairs….

Show a video clip of her saying what Fotis was wearing that morning and then a clip of him riding a bike wearing a hoodie during that time etc.! So what I am saying is show that she lied with the proof….

Show charts and clips of her going to and from 80 ms and 4jc multiple times with the phone data and surveillance clips. Show the clip of what Pg said and Lauren. Explain the coffee spill as she explained the bloody seats of the Tacoma and how she said it didn’t smell like coffee and say it seems like she should know what coffee smells like as she loves Starbucks and show that clip!!!!

Show close-ups of her body language from arrest to court appearances to interviews and in Starbucks and how body language matters citing other cases…

On the big screen show the mop pic and bloodied paper towel bits and green and yellow sponge that they found in the trash and roll the tape of her saying she brought these items to
80 ms to clean. Show her in the car coffee her phone records of her in the car etc…..state clearly that she accompanied Fotis dumping the garbage and show the photos of what they collected and state that tbis was clearly tampering with evidence.

Then show receipts of their cleaning lady from years of cleaning to explain how MT never typically cleans (show the clip of her saying just that) so why that day?!!!

Show clips of all the descriptive English words and phrases she used in all of the interviews. You cannot watch all of these videos in full and claim she doesn’t understand English. Get people to testify how she understands just fine as js is going to say she doesn’t.


Show her phone data and pics of her car driving to the car wash and explain that they took the red Tacoma that Fotis used in the murder to the car wash and they had a plan for her to follow him there to get a full detail and that proves Michelle is tampering with evidence. She followed him and emphasize how that was planned. She knew by this time re Jennifer but didn’t find this concerning? Explain why to anyone this would be gravely concerning. They never washed PH’s car before after using it many times and play that clip from pg.

I could go on and on as I am frustrated that it’s all there but not presented clearly, in my opinion.

It looks like all FD which I know they have to prove the murder but the evidence is there against MT but in my opinion they have not clearly shown the jury how she was involved in everything and in lockstep with him from the beginning to end.

Perhaps they plan on doing that in closing but it best be tight as it’s all there but must be better conveyed as I’ve seen in other trials.

Moo

We really have not learned anything that we didn’t already know. Is there really going to be no bombshell?

 

[Silverstorm]

Well in that case, I find it astounding she would be that blatant and post something like that! The judge needs to know this imo.

My apologies. I am the one who took the screenshot of what happens during a mistrial. That info was posted by me not Mt. Again my apologies for the confusion.

 

[lucegirl]

@afitzy

Depending on the findings regarding the dissemination/publication of the custody report - Jennifer’s family may certainly have a strong civil case on a number of grounds. I’m quite sure it pains them to go that route - but what happened today was shocking (if the facts bear out).

There is tremendous tension in the legal system - due process and right to a fair trial for D; justice for victims and families; jury integrity and impartiality; privacy boundaries for the jury - especially in the social media era; burdens of proof; rules of evidence; ethical conflicts in representation; venue; possible bias; grounds for recusal or disqualification, deterrence, public confidence and interest, and on and on and on. I don’t think there is anything happening here that rises to the level of a “case of first-impression”- things never heard of or encountered in criminal trials. Judges have to balance and weigh all of this, all of the time, and chart a path forward - mistrial and other outcome determinative actions being a last resort.

This Judge is excellent IMO. I have no doubt he will right the ship tomorrow.

 

[MX27875]

Yes, a thousand times yes. Anything to defrag the evidence! Especially with no opening. I know PowerPoint is commonly in use—but what about presentation platforms like Prezi—much more vivid and intuitive and less mind-numbing?

Presentations and videos with engaging visuals for hybrid teams | Prezi Present

Welcome to Prezi, the presentation software that uses motion, zoom, and spatial relationships to bring your ideas to life and make you a great presenter.

prezi.com

Are courts limited to PPT? I have no idea.

. We all expect much more given how much attention this case has garnered.

 

[waldojabba]

Yes, a thousand times yes. Anything to defrag the evidence! Especially with no opening. I know PowerPoint is commonly in use—but what about presentation platforms like Prezi—much more vivid and intuitive and less mind-numbing?

Presentations and videos with engaging visuals for hybrid teams | Prezi Present

Welcome to Prezi, the presentation software that uses motion, zoom, and spatial relationships to bring your ideas to life and make you a great presenter.

prezi.com

Are courts limited to PPT? I have no idea.

You are all so right about presentation. I don’t know much about trials, but I have done a lot of presentations so I wonder if the P lacks the skills, platforms, budgets assistance etc to put something together.
Every time P and D have to use what in the olden days would be called an overhead projector, there is an issue with operation and having it function properly.
Heck, even if it’s just poster board and black magic marker, the jury really needs some visual aids from the P to walk them thru what they have heard linking the defendant to the crimes she is charged with
JMO

 

[afitzy]

@afitzy

Depending on the findings regarding the dissemination/publication of the custody report - Jennifer’s family may certainly have a strong civil case on a number of grounds. I’m quite sure it pains them to go that route - but what happened today was shocking (if the facts bear out).

There is tremendous tension in the legal system - due process and right to a fair trial for D; justice for victims and families; jury integrity and impartiality; privacy boundaries for the jury - especially in the social media era; burdens of proof; rules of evidence; ethical conflicts in representation; venue; possible bias; grounds for recusal or disqualification, deterrence, public confidence and interest, and on and on and on. I don’t think there is anything happening here that rises to the level of a “case of first-impression”- things never heard of or encountered in criminal trials. Judges have to balance and weigh all of this, all of the time, and chart a path forward - mistrial and other outcome determinative actions being a last resort.

This Judge is excellent IMO. I have no doubt he will right the ship tomorrow.

@lucegirl, thanks for the refocus, much appreciated. Will hang on to see if justice can be delivered. Sadly no longer believe its possible. FWIW I heard back from law librarian on the question you asked yesterday and they had no answer other than that they believed Defence interpretation was incorrect as it relates to Conspiracy. I continue to read through the Craft's case for guidance and as a means of comparison to what we have been witnessing here.

I sadly share none of your confidence in Judge R as he imo allowed this entire situation with the irrelevant report to become something it never should have. I don't think the Jury or the trial can recover from this issue as its been going on for 4 weeks and is now an elephant in the room that nothing can be done about and imo its overshadowing important testimony and evidence which I find disturbing. Perhaps a strong jury instruction could solve the issue on the discredited report but frankly that just might be too little too late? IDK.

I pray you are right that Judge R can right the ship but based on all that we have seen in court that has been allowed (small infractions such Defendant texting and chatting on phone to gum chewing or watching videos on her phone or coputeretc.) to the "Testimony/Cross" from Defence on the discredited report now for weeks.

Wonder also about the States Atty General perhaps watching this trial and wondering what all is going on? Does he even care? Who even supervises the 2 States Atty's in this trial? I have no clue as their manager has been nowhere in evidence that I've seen.

I will hang on but frankly have little confidence based on where we are and what all we have seen in the proceedings turning around. Pray I'm wrong!
MOO

 

[afitzy]

IF anyone rewatches the last 2 min of trial today and can confirm what I think I saw which was Defendant walking away with her computer and SMILING, please post back.

I just rewatched the feed and I see zero concern from either Defence atty (after Atty Felson just effectively lied to the Judge and issued word salad) but I definitely saw Defendant smiling. I also see BOTH Defence Attorneys (Felson and Schoenhorn) looking at Defendant computer as it was hard to miss the size 48 font.

If this all is investigates that the report was in fact on Defendant computer and she was actually smiling then I hope the Judge acts accordingly. I also hope the Judge orders LE to investigate precisely how the Defendant got the discredited report if that is in fact what was on her laptop.
MOO

 

[Megnut]

IF anyone rewatches the last 2 min of trial today and can confirm what I think I saw which was Defendant walking away with her computer and SMILING, please post back.

I just rewatched the feed and I see zero concern from either Defence atty (after Atty Felson just effectively lied to the Judge and issued word salad) but I definitely saw Defendant smiling. I also see BOTH Defence Attorneys (Felson and Schoenhorn) looking at Defendant computer as it was hard to miss the size 48 font.

If this all is investigates that the report was in fact on Defendant computer and she was actually smiling then I hope the Judge acts accordingly. I also hope the Judge orders LE to investigate precisely how the Defendant got the discredited report if that is in fact what was on her laptop.
MOO

Two words. Duper's delight.

 

[kaen]

I am in a slightly different camp about the sealed report and the loosening of the visitation. While the whole defense posture is one of shaming, I don't think the jury will go with the innuendo that JD had some sort of mental health condition and was going to lose/have diminished custody. Many people in Fairfield County have experienced personally or familially or peers going through bitter divorces. The most interesting part of the Meehan testimony that I do think would give insight to Fd/JD dynamic/issues was the idea that he had an affair with a woman with a daughter and his solution to all of this was ..... everyone would live together in the 4JX house. Hello, that is unusual. Even more unusual in that scenario is that the defendant might have been good with it all.

It is horrific to have a dead woman's laundry hung out for all to see and a crappy move by the defense but they were the losers because what they were trying to sell made no sense. If JD was mentally ill, she would have lost the kids way earlier. If FD was not a liar, cheat, and manipulator, he would have equal access to the kids. Further, it is clear that JD is dead so it is not like she ran off because of some mental condition. I don't think the jury will side with defense on this one.

But, I am not sure that the prosecution has met the burden of conspiracy. The defense team is unlikable AND I am not sure the linkages have been made to hold MT to the letter of the law, YET.

 

[afitzy]

I've been posting since the beginning of this tragic case about the impact of the social media postings and activities of the Defendant and Defence Counsel (Atty Felson and Schoenhorn).

Sadly there has been no gag order imposed on this trial and so the social media activity over the past 4 years has been significant and imo largely disinformation. Also sadly there are those in the world that choose to profit from the misery of others and I believe that this has very much been the case with the relationship that has developed between the Defendant and a local artist in Avon, CT to document what I believe they term, "her innocence".

This particular choice that the Defendant and the Troconis Crew made which at first baffled me and then outraged me and so I was happy to see a change.org petition posted to raise awareness as to a local artist (Avon, CT) that the Defendant and her family aka Troconis Crew have financially supported and patronised to produce what imo effectively is a campaign as to her innocence. The alleged artist maintains a social media presence for those who wish more information. I will not name the local artist as it is my view that he is attempting to simply profit from the misery of DV victims in general, and JF and the Dulos children in particular. For those that wish to see more information simply follow the change.org link below.

Here is a link to change.org:

Sign the Petition

End the Production and Display of Artwork Exploiting Murder Victims like Jennifer

www.change.org

 

[stevemcmanus87]

I am re-watching the trial footage today. The state was handed a note from their investigator. Each attorney was handed a separate paper. They both quietly confirmed and acknowledged whatever was on the note. You then could see them both looking towards the defense table with their screens displayed. I believe MT still had her 'showing' on the screen at that moment, although I am not sure. In any case, the state rises to respectfully ask for the sidebar....and at the same time the female defense attorney and MT were ( notified by someone from the gallery?? )...suddenly shutting down their screens. This was BEFORE they knew what the sidebar request was for. ODD. And suspicious as hell.

Did someone in the gallery, maybe knowingly.., watch and hope for the Farber family and friends in the gallery to SEE what was displayed, and anticipate the quick move ( and note) to the state? Were they all conspiring for a mistrial?

So I just rewatched it too…they have the sidebar…but then it’s not till the end they bring up the note to the judge and he looks like he’s hearing this for this first time.

What was covered on the side bar when Sean M interrupts JS mid-sentence requesting the sidebar???

 

[DeDee]

IF anyone rewatches the last 2 min of trial today and can confirm what I think I saw which was Defendant walking away with her computer and SMILING, please post back.

I just rewatched the feed and I see zero concern from either Defence atty (after Atty Felson just effectively lied to the Judge and issued word salad) but I definitely saw Defendant smiling. I also see BOTH Defence Attorneys (Felson and Schoenhorn) looking at Defendant computer as it was hard to miss the size 48 font.

If this all is investigates that the report was in fact on Defendant computer and she was actually smiling then I hope the Judge acts accordingly. I also hope the Judge orders LE to investigate precisely how the Defendant got the discredited report if that is in fact what was on her laptop.
MOO

I think the sidebar was called bc Michi was displaying something on her laptop that shouldn't have been allowed.

The Judge fears the sealed documents are being disseminated. It was a meme seen on MT's computer screen! RE: Dulos custody report. In quotes, it begins "Dr, Frazner told me"

If so, it's violation of a court's order. There could be a contempt hearing. Issue will be addressed first thing in the morning without the Jury's presence.

Not only was Michi not allowed to possess the sealed documents, much less, allow them to be filmed on a livestream camera (dissemination), for everybody to see or whatever, it is being raised in order to put the incidents on the record, since there was another issue about an article displayed on her laptop MT allowed to be seen and she or her family was waving at the audience(?).

This is rich. Who gave the State the note? Sounded like a friend saw the meme. Defense attorney says they are innocent of any wrongdoing.

@6:44:00

 

[MX27875]

I am in a slightly different camp about the sealed report and the loosening of the visitation. While the whole defense posture is one of shaming, I don't think the jury will go with the innuendo that JD had some sort of mental health condition and was going to lose/have diminished custody. Many people in Fairfield County have experienced personally or familially or peers going through bitter divorces. The most interesting part of the Meehan testimony that I do think would give insight to Fd/JD dynamic/issues was the idea that he had an affair with a woman with a daughter and his solution to all of this was ..... everyone would live together in the 4JX house. Hello, that is unusual. Even more unusual in that scenario is that the defendant might have been good with it all.

It is horrific to have a dead woman's laundry hung out for all to see and a crappy move by the defense but they were the losers because what they were trying to sell made no sense. If JD was mentally ill, she would have lost the kids way earlier. If FD was not a liar, cheat, and manipulator, he would have equal access to the kids. Further, it is clear that JD is dead so it is not like she ran off because of some mental condition. I don't think the jury will side with defense on this one.

But, I am not sure that the prosecution has met the burden of conspiracy. The defense team is unlikable AND I am not sure the linkages have been made to hold MT to the letter of the law, YET.

They are not doing a good job of proving planning in advance besides spoken words. We need actions like proof of location, receipts, purchasing supplies, ponchos, or lime, etc that happened in ADVANCE of the murder.

 

[DeDee]

I'm listening to the MT LE Interviews again on Harvard Atty Lee as she has fixed some of the audio issues to make it easier to understand what MT is saying about the issue of custody being possible for FD.

I will do my best to summarise what MT said even though I find her commentary on this entire issue purely delusional and her role during this period 2 weeks before the murder seemed to me to simply wind up and pressure FD to resolve things and he simply exploded with rage.

But, the MT testimony to LE on this issue also could be simply more of her lies and frankly after having listened to this portion of the LE testimony 3x now I do very much wonder if the drama around JF and GF mental health isn't just an elaborate distraction lie created by MT (possibly with the assistance of Mama Troconis) to distract LE and make her appear as a victim in the entire scenario as I do believe MT cares VERY MUCH how she appears to people. I also wonder if the "Family Plan" phone calls might sort out some of the truth from the lies from MT! I hope so as this is just a tangled mess of a story and as I have said before seems like this MT LE Interview reads like the typical SA telenovela but written by someone on CRACK! There is no doubt some truth in this entire long segment of the LE Interview but I'm not sure we know yet where it might be as every time I listen to this story from MT it seems less and less believable....

Anyway, here goes a brief summary along with some of my questions from listening to MT comments to LE:

I never fully understood WHEN FD and MT went to FD Psychologist Humphrey to discuss JF - seems like MT is saying she and FD went to Psychologist Humphrey 2 weeks before the murder of JF. MT talks in the LE Interview about how she wanted to see a "Professional" as she wanted to make sure that 'she was safe, given JF issues allegedly raised in the Herman Report as I would be around the children and JF for the rest of my life". [clip of this discussion happens at 17:59 in Harvard lawyer Lee clips). Question: Was the reason MT stated as reason for going to Humphrey true or a lie? IDK.

What is fascinating is that it seems like MT wrote according to the LE Interview "Paraphrase: MT did alot of research she said and she wrote various lists on 67 things about all the psychological issues discussed about JF in the discredited Dr Herman report and MT reports that FD read all that she wrote and that they discussed all her lists on the issues with Psychologist Humphrey". Can you imagine what FD thought about MT and her list of 67 issues or is this even true? How long did it even take her to do her 'research' and write down her lists of 67 issues and questions. Question: Is this true or is this yet another MT lie? IDK.

I do wonder if FD was possibly doing a 'con job' on MT to try and pacify her to back off on her attacks against him on the issue of resolving divorce/custody but that she was then taking what he was feeding her on the report she claims to never had read and proceeds to bang the drum loudly on the fact that he needs to resolve divorce and custody etc. And so there was this escalation in the pressure in the MT/FD relationship during this period as it seems to be really ratcheting up in a potentially dangerous manner in the two weeks before the murder of JF by FD and fwiw I see MT most clearly as a catalyst of the emotional situation in the relationship escalating dramatically. MT during this period is amping up the pressure on FD while he is trying to pacify her and say everything will be ok because JF 'gets it".

What is also fascinating is that in addition to doing all this research on BPD etc. MT my SPECULATION is that MT enlisted Mama Troconis (herself a discredited former mental health counsellor) and that MT then proceeded to wind up FD on the entire issue as MT kept repeating over and over in the LE interview that she was very upset, very upset and I was concerned and wondered if I was safe....MT also claims that in the discredited Dr Herman report (which she never read as the report was in Atty Mike Rose office - interesting that MT even knew where the report was located) that the big concern was that the Dulos children weren't safe with JF (and ditto for GF).

What is fascinating is that MT does her level best in the LE interview to not only fully discredit the mental health of JF BUT she does the exact same thing about GF in a way that I believe is most clearly slanderous at a minimum. Question: Is MT lying to LE to in her mind somehow justify her involvement in the murder of JF? - IDK but she sure talks a along time and works hard to be quite convincing to LE imo.

What is so fascinating imo about this is that MT seems to fully believe (or is selling LE quite hard) that BOTH JF and GF (2 people who she no doubt believes wish her ill etc) are BOTH mentally incapacitated while she MT is emotionally 'healthy'. But, MT isn't done and now MT in the LE Interview also goes off on issues of JF sister as well (more slander here imo and I do hope GF and JF sister go after MT in civil trial for her remarks about them!). Fascinating that she has seemingly created adverse mental health information scenarios about each of the 3 people who she might believe either wish her ill or could possibly take on custody of 5 dulos children?

Apparently this interview with FD, MT and Psychologic Humphrey happened 2 weeks before the murder.

What is fascinating also to see is in the LE Interview imo MT is very clearly saying to FD that she believes JF is manipulating him and is dangerous (all the while her concern seems to be only for herself which imo is quite telling as she never really seems to even care about FD safety or even the safety of her daughter etc.) while FD is allegedly saying to her that JF 'gets it' and is willing to work with him on the custody issue. Seems like there is ALOT of MT prodding of FD on the issue of resolving custody and divorce.

Interesting imo how clear it is that MT is front and centre in the entire custody situation and seems very well aware of all that FD has told her about the discredited Dr. Herman report. But, what is also interesting imo is that FD seems to be saying to MT that JF 'gets it' and that there will be some resolution to the situation down the road - FD seems to be trying to pacify MT issues while MT seems to be trying to wind up FD getting him to act to resolve the divorce/custody situation. Still its fascinating to me that knowing what she knows (or claims to know) during this period that MT doesn't leave. Nope, she stays put.

At the point in time which was 2 weeks before the murder I very much wonder if FD was trying to pacify MT that the situation would be resolved because he knew that JF would no longer be alive in 2 weeks? This knowledge by FD made it 'safe' to try and pacify MT that all would be well in their world. Question: Was any of this true or is that just more MT lies to LE? Interesting that she works hard to make it clear that FD was the one saying that "JF gets it" while its MT who is saying that JF is dangerous and manipulative. Very curious imo and I wonder why MT is clearly putting FD in a passive role and someone who is willing to possibly work with JF when everything we know about FD is that he never just passively sits back and chooses to simply work with someone who he feels is an adversary. Its honestly hard to believe the MT narrative about FD state of mind here and I very much wonder if this is just another lie on top of many lies with this entire story?

But, it doesn't seem that MT bought this FD narrative that JF "gets it" she is 'selling hard' to LE and she seemed in her imo passive aggressive approach to be demanding that FD do something to resolve the situation soon or this is what she is trying to 'sell hard' to LE.

But, we've seen with MT in her prior LE Interview that she creates drama or certainly bizarre scenarios and lots of words and distractions around portions of the situation or story where she feels uncomfortable or vulnerable to questions or criticism. Perhaps the answer to all of this is that the part of the murder of JF that MT was most concerned about was the two week run up to the murder and that is why she concocted this elaborate story for LE? IDK

My speculation here is very much that MT well knew about the pending murder of JF at least two weeks before the murder and so created all this 'drama' and 'relationship tension' in her narrative with LE to simply distract from the issues that she knew LE was really interested in which was where was JF and I think MT created this entire line of narrative about mental health of JF and GF etc. as a smokescreen of lies for LE while in reality the couple FD/MT were very much in sync on the issue of murdering JF.

What is also fascinating is that in the LE Interview clips that MT clearly says that she believes FD killed Jennifer. MT spends so much time in her remarks being less than clear but as it relates to FD killing JF, I believe MT was quite clear here. Why? Did she say it because she thought LE wanted her to say it or did she say it because she knew it to be true?

My speculation is that MT well knew that JF was going to be murdered and no doubt knew it long before she and FD took the trip to see Dr Humphrey. FWIW, I'm not sure anything MT says about the reasons for the visit to Dr Humphrey can be believed and I very much wonder why else the couple might have gone to meet with Dr Humphrey? Were they trying to have his assistance or get some help figuring out how to secure full custody of the dulos children and their money? I am not believing the MT story at all about her being concerned for her safety. But, there was a reason for the couple meeting with Humphrey but I am not sure we yet know what it was.

I just think that what MT was feeding LE in her interview as simply a tangled mess of lies and some truths and I just hope LE sorted through it all and we eventually learn the motivation behind this interview which imo is MT at her delusional worst. But, regardless of what is true here and false here, its quite clear that MT KNEW EVERY DETAIL OF THE DISCREDITED HERMAN REPORT and was enmeshed with FD on whatever his plans were for the murder of JF imo.

MOO

All of this is so good. MT detested Jen for years. moo Truly want to know where Jen was taken by Fotis when her own Suburban became a Hearst, as Megnut stated earlier. That H report is a red herring planted to inspire a GG theory. Did MT have 67 items listed or was it more likely 6 or 7 items listed? Did she (who dresses like a beige librarian in court) actively seek a TRO against the victim or is she all talk?

We suspect the murder was planned at least two weeks in advance. Let us also consider the grave found on May 18, shall we? Jen disappeared on May 24th. KM is trying to dig a grave in March and April that's found in May.

"He [KM] left the club after a few years, but just a week before Jennifer disappeared, current members < > were hunting there and found a 6-foot long hole covered by two barbecue grill grates."

Furthermore, KM's phone pings in area of the grave go back to March 29:
"Police later found Mawhinney had asked a member about getting back on the property back in March or April. On March 29, records show Mawhinney’s phone pinged near the club. And, on May 31 again"

Was the grave found on May 18 meant for KM's wife? Or, nope, for Jennifer? Jen could not go in there because the grave had been discovered 6 days prior. Where did Fotis hide her?

"In the days leading up to his own wife’s disappearance, Fotis Dulos tried to help his friend and attorney, Kent Mawhinney, save his marriage, but instead got him arrested."
https://www.ctpost.com/local/article/Court-filing-Fotis-Dulos-offered-house-as-sex-14282750.php

MOO