Still Missing CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #61

[Cloudydiamond]

Maybe it wasn’t used.

But they said it had a brown stain. Although that could be anything. But why was a liner in the bag anyway?

 

[citygirl]

MOO

JS really wants to distance MT from her DNA on the tape and bag.

First she could have touched him in the Raptor. Secondary transfer.

Then she could have inadvertently touched the next bag while removing a bag while inside cleanity cleaning.

Then because he understands mitochondrial DNA like a 5th grader, maybe the daughter or mother touched the bag when they were cleaning so it's not MT at all....

And that's why there's such a teeny tiny bit of nanopicomichi.

Yes, but what's more probable?

MOO

You've got a way with words.

 

[citygirl]

Homeland Security secured phone from Greek friend at Newark Airport.

 

[citygirl]

Video of the defendant leaving her second interrogation with her mother. Also, report from landfill.

 

[SkylarSid]

But they said it had a brown stain. Although that could be anything. But why was a liner in the bag anyway?

It is so weird. A stray liner? No underwear. Maybe it was dunked in bleach.

 

[afitzy]

Homeland Security secured phone from Greek friend at Newark Airport.

Seems like just another leak from “esteemed defence counsel”…..So far as I know these zoom calls were not made public….

Maybe time for Judge R to impose gag order on all parties, including the family of MT!

MOO

 

[Alkali13]

It is so weird. A stray liner? No underwear. Maybe it was dunked in bleach.

That was my thought, but wouldn't there be some sign or smell of bleach? Pads are pretty absorbent, but I've also admittedly never soaked one in bleach.

 

[Ruminations]

That was my thought, but wouldn't there be some sign or smell of bleach? Pads are pretty absorbent, but I've also admittedly never soaked one in bleach.

We are so alike! I've never soaked a panty liner in bleach either!

sarcasm aside, some liners have very little absorption capacity. For those days when one might have a tiny volume of discharge but the discharge is iron-rich and stains garments very effectively.

The stains are more effectively removed with vinegar and cold water than with bleach. But I've only attempted to remove the visible stain; I've never concerned myself with microscopic DNA. point being, I'm not sure drenching in bleach would remove an iron stain.

still, there is the sticky side. I would think at the very least, there would be degraded evidence there. It's so bizarre.

one thing I suspect...that liner definitely is related to this case being that it is preternaturally free of DNA.

MOO

 

[Aquarian]

We are so alike! I've never soaked a panty liner in bleach either!

sarcasm aside, some liners have very little absorption capacity. For those days when one might have a tiny volume of discharge but the discharge is iron-rich and stains garments very effectively.

The stains are more effectively removed with vinegar and cold water than with bleach. But I've only attempted to remove the visible stain; I've never concerned myself with microscopic DNA. point being, I'm not sure drenching in bleach would remove an iron stain.

still, there is the sticky side. I would think at the very least, there would be degraded evidence there. It's so bizarre.

one thing I suspect...that liner definitely is related to this case being that it is preternaturally free of DNA.

MOO

Any thought that a tampon was in use? Let’s say it was Jennifer’s , what if both were installed
Prior to leaving, where she was attacked. Little time for full transfer as would : hrs or more of use.
I know this is gross, but just trying to fathom the lack of DNA

 

[Gardenista]

View attachment 481171
Browsing through the SWs, here are the tower dump times... Assuming KM was actually at 4JC that morning, they might have his location for the entire day if the Avon and Bristol dumps are related to him, although those two locations are almost half an hour apart, and Avon was the Pond/storage units (not KM's purview I assume).

193 Birch Street, Bristol, doesn't seem to exist. It jumps from 191 to 197. It's a residential neighborhood as well. Anyone know if we ever got info on why Bristol?

Seems like KM would be charged with tampering if he would have dumped evidence.

 

[MX27875]

Is there anything in the search warrants that points to FD having help from another party in or near New Canaan besides LE stating that they think he possibly had help or the time “gaps”?

Are we at that point where we can start putting the moving pieces together of who was where and when?

What do you think the moving piece is that is going to prove conspiracy? If I were a completely objective juror right now, it would be yes on tampering and hindering, but no on conspiracy.

 

[Gardenista]

Is there anything in the search warrants that points to FD having help from another party in or near New Canaan besides LE stating that they think he possibly had help or the time “gaps”?

Are we at that point where we can start putting the moving pieces together of who was where and when?

What do you think the moving piece is that is going to prove conspiracy? If I were a completely objective juror right now, it would be yes on tampering and hindering, but no on conspiracy.

I think the conspiracy pieces are the prearranged phone call as well as MT and FD soliciting KM.

 

[afitzy]

Is there anything in the search warrants that points to FD having help from another party in or near New Canaan besides LE stating that they think he possibly had help or the time “gaps”?

Are we at that point where we can start putting the moving pieces together of who was where and when?

What do you think the moving piece is that is going to prove conspiracy? If I were a completely objective juror right now, it would be yes on tampering and hindering, but no on conspiracy.

Way too early to tell.

Need to have patience of Buddha on this one.

 

[sleuth66]

We are so alike! I've never soaked a panty liner in bleach either!

sarcasm aside, some liners have very little absorption capacity. For those days when one might have a tiny volume of discharge but the discharge is iron-rich and stains garments very effectively.

The stains are more effectively removed with vinegar and cold water than with bleach. But I've only attempted to remove the visible stain; I've never concerned myself with microscopic DNA. point being, I'm not sure drenching in bleach would remove an iron stain.

still, there is the sticky side. I would think at the very least, there would be degraded evidence there. It's so bizarre.

one thing I suspect...that liner definitely is related to this case being that it is preternaturally free of DNA.

MOO

While it might seem like common sense that a sanitary pad/panty liner would be an awesome source of blood/cells/DNA, modern feminine hygiene technology and materials engineering is quite sophisticated to trap cells and fluids in a polyacrylate gel structure that can actually inhibit access to forensic testing; and to have a repellent surface layer to keep wetness and fluids away from contact with the skin that will repel any cells or DNA.

Most of the use of such products in forensics is linked to sexual assault crimes where they are looking for semen, however the factors that inhibit semen detection would also pose challenges for blood and for DNA detection in general.

Here is some science behind why it might be challenging to get good DNA test results from the materials in panty liners (also keep in mind that these conditions could also degrade DNA and the trash had been left for a week before it was even picked up and perhaps longer before the pad was tested in the forensic lab).

"Current protocols employed for these samples include analysis of their upper layers which are free of superabsorbent polymers (SAPs) [1,2]. Because of their design and composition for retaining fluids [3,4], cells and biological fluids are repelled by the hydrophobic upper layers, and become enmeshed within the SAPs in the superabsorbent lower core, forming a hydrogel [[5], [6], [7]]. SAPs are cross-linked polymeric materials designed to absorb fluid up to 100% of their volume [3] and to swell thermodynamically without dissolving, reaching equilibrium as a hydrogel [4,5,8]...This process makes it hard to extract semen from the embedding hydrogels and risks losing biological information, which could lead to an incomplete genetic profile of the suspect."

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1872497318303946

If you look at the evidence item (multiple pics posted on this or previous thread) I am putting my bet that it was JFDs. Look at the area of the "pinkish stain" and it appears seepage from top, rather than more centrally, consistent with blood being absorbed from a bleeding event at the torso (based on the shirt and bra).

MOO. (Expert witness on science and engineering of panty liners.)

 

[afitzy]

While it might seem like common sense that a sanitary pad/panty liner would be an awesome source of blood/cells/DNA, modern feminine hygiene technology and materials engineering is quite sophisticated to trap cells and fluids in a polyacrylate gel structure that can actually inhibit access to forensic testing; and to have a repellent surface layer to keep wetness and fluids away from contact with the skin that will repel any cells or DNA.

Most of the use of such products in forensics is linked to sexual assault crimes where they are looking for semen, however the factors that inhibit semen detection would also pose challenges for blood and for DNA detection in general.

Here is some science behind why it might be challenging to get good DNA test results from the materials in panty liners (also keep in mind that these conditions could also degrade DNA and the trash had been left for a week before it was even picked up and perhaps longer before the pad was tested in the forensic lab).

"Current protocols employed for these samples include analysis of their upper layers which are free of superabsorbent polymers (SAPs) [1,2]. Because of their design and composition for retaining fluids [3,4], cells and biological fluids are repelled by the hydrophobic upper layers, and become enmeshed within the SAPs in the superabsorbent lower core, forming a hydrogel [[5], [6], [7]]. SAPs are cross-linked polymeric materials designed to absorb fluid up to 100% of their volume [3] and to swell thermodynamically without dissolving, reaching equilibrium as a hydrogel [4,5,8]...This process makes it hard to extract semen from the embedding hydrogels and risks losing biological information, which could lead to an incomplete genetic profile of the suspect."

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1872497318303946

If you look at the evidence item (multiple pics posted on this or previous thread) I am putting my bet that it was JFDs. Look at the area of the "pinkish stain" and it appears seepage from top, rather than more centrally, consistent with blood being absorbed from a bleeding event at the torso (based on the shirt and bra).

MOO. (Expert witness on science and engineering of panty liners.)

Thank you @sleuth66 for the info on this topic and interesting details on hydrogels!

The conversation here today was alot about how its possible that with so much of the evidence seen so far there were few DNA results.

What else could have destroyed DNA? We've heard mention of water, bleach, UV and other DNA disruptors but does it seem odd to you that items sitting in black bags (so presumably protected from being in pubic trash cans) are only showing a handful of DNA results for FD and MT?

Curious what you think we could be seeing?

Could the perps have intentionally done things to the evidence as they were 'cleaning' 80MS to render the bag contents less than useful for DNA ID purposes? Will we learn more at trial about this or is the answer as simple as perps wearing PPE and multiple layers of gloves>

 

[afitzy]

Interview with HC reporter Taylor Hartz (while she is allegedly viewing the trial, in this interview she got most of her evidence from Defence. SO, I very much wonder if she is simply a 'reposter'? Just putting this out there fwiw as "Esteemed Defence Counsel" continues to taint imo the 'sleeping' and 'non working' and highly concentrated CT Media imo) by Nancy Grace on the Hartford Albany trip:

Taylor Hartz (used to work at The Day produced a podcast on Todt murders: theday.com: New London and southeastern Connecticut News, Sports, Business, Entertainment and Video).

MOO

 

[Niner]

I missed this:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1754521000228552721

"A scheduling note--there is no court Friday, 2/9, or Monday, 2/12."

Wondering if they are closed for Super Bowl weekend... ??

 

[Niner]

Tuesday, February 6th:
*Trial continues (Day 18) (@ 10am ET) – CT – Jennifer Rebecca Farber Dulos (50) (May 24, 2019, New Canaan; still missing) – *Michelle C. Troconis (44/now 49) (Dulos’ GF) arrested & charged (6/1/19) & arraigned (6/3/19) with tampering with or fabricating physical evidence & hindering prosecution. Plead not guilty. $500K bond. Posted bond (on 6/3/19). These charges were dismissed (8/28/20) & recharged below.
*Charged (9/5/19) & arraigned (10/4/19) with tampering with evidence involving the borrowed car from work colleague. Plead not guilty. $100K bond. Posted bond (on 9/5/19). Off GPS 4/6/23.
*Charged (1/7/20) with conspiracy to commit murder. Plead not guilty. $2M bond. Bond reduced (1/8/20) to $1.5M & bonded out (on 1/9/20). Off GPS 4/6/23.
*Charged (8/28/20) with 2nd degree hindering prosecution, tampering with physical evidence & conspiracy to commit tampering with physical evidence. No plea entered yet. $500K bond. Posted bond. Off GPS 4/6/23.
The declaration of death for Jennifer was officially issued by Judge William P. Osterndorf on October 24, 2023.
Jury Selection began on 10/4/23 & ended 10/26/23. Started off with 6 jurors & 4 alternates. (6 men & 4 women). As of 1/4/24 2 more jurors were excused. 1/4/24: 6 jurors & 2 alternates. (4 men & 4 women). 1/10/24: 6 jurors & 5 alternates.
Jury Selection (2nd one) began on 1/9/24 & ended on 1/10/24. 1 alternate juror (male) dismissed (1/17/24). 6 jurors & 4 alternates. 1/18/24: 1 juror was dismissed. Now 6 jurors & 3 alternates. 1/29/24: 1 juror (#62-woman) replaced by alternate. Now 6 jurors & 2 alternates. (4 women & 4 men).
Trial began on 1/11/24. (will last about a month to 3/1/24)
Superior Court Judge Kevin Randolph presiding for trial. Assistant State’s attorney Sean McGuinness & Supervisory assistant State’s attorney Michelle Manning & defense attorneys Jon Schoenhorn & Audrey Felson.
Bond info & Court info from 6/3/19 thru 12/6/23 & Jury Selection Day 1-11 (10/4-10/26/23) & thru 1/4/24 & 2nd Jury Selection Day 1-2 (1/9 & 1/10/24) & Trial Day 1-16 (1/11-2/2/24) reference post #640 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...-canaan-24-may-2019-arrests-61.702968/page-32
2/5/24 Monday, Trial Day 17: State witnesses: State forensic analyst Kristen Madel testified to further analysis conducted after biological & fingerprinting analysis.
For more info see post #748 (article) here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...-canaan-24-may-2019-arrests-61.702968/page-38
Trial continues on Tuesday, 2/6/24. No court on Friday, 2/9/24 or Monday, 2/12/24.

 

[MX27875]

I think the conspiracy pieces are the prearranged phone call as well as MT and FD soliciting KM.

They are going to need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt the pre-arrangement, that’s the thing.

 

[ajksmom]

Wondering if they are closed for Super Bowl weekend... ??

I have no idea about Friday but Monday is Abraham Lincoln’s birthday. The following Monday (2/19) is Presidents Day - both are state holidays here. So for those of you looking to schedule appointments….