Darlie Routier asks for DNA testing

[cami]

There was a root and this newer testing can prove if it belongs to a family member. Proof of an intruder. Attack and Ambush style convictions aren't well respected in fed court. It is still behind closed doors so we will just have to wait.

I'm afraid it's not proof of any intruder..one pubic hair standing alone with nothing else. It could have come into that house from anywhere, could have been there for days. If it is a foreign hair found on one of the victims along with other evidence such as semen, it then becomes of evidentiary value but not one pubic hair in the light of nothing else. I don't think the courts will budge on this hair evidence. Blaming the investigators for following the leads that lead to Darlie is not proof of Darlie's innocence. The Fed courts care that the law was followed, not about the family's allegations of an unjust investigation.

 

[Goody]

Look for numerous breeds of dog hairs from my house. We ripped out all the carpet replaced with tile and I can not believe the amount of hair 1 chihuahua can shed in 1 week. Fur balls everywhere. Look for the perp who is covered in dog hairs, a Jack Russell, a plot hound, a pom/chihuahua, a chihuahua and a pit bull. If this combo of doggy hairs shows up anywhere you have your man/woman. I am not as fastidious as Darile or even my mother I only vacuum 1 a week on my day off. Maybe I just don't notice them but I don't find pubic hairs anywhere but my bathroom and dressing area. There is carpet in the bedrooms and the carpet seems to keep the stuff from getting blown or tracked around as much. I do notice head hairs as when I loose a hair its over a foot long. They get everywhere. Even wrapped around the legs of furniture. I have heard it is normal to loose 100 hairs a day. More than that and you may have a balding problem.

LOL! You house sounds like mine. It is so bad around here that we have to pour bleach down the drains once a once to keep them from clogging because of hair. We have 4 mutts, one pedigree with a deformed mouth, and a black cat who ignores us most of the time. All of them shed like they work in a wig factory. I told my doc to check my lungs when he takes them out to see if dog hair is holding them together. I wouldn't be surprised. We even find them in the freezer. You know, one lone hair in the most unlikely place like someone hid it there purposely for fun. TJ says one day the astronauts will open up a can from earth while in space and find one our pet hairs in it. Running joke around here.

What about the facial hair that was tested and didn't belong to Darlie ( never knew her to have facial hair anyway) or Darin. I know they keep a fingerprint profile on rescue workers like police and ambulance personnel why not a DNA too. It would sure clear out a room full of possible contributors in any case where police have to investigate a crime scene and rescue personnel where there first.

I have never heard about facial hair,but they did find one of Darin's hairs on the murder weapon. Maybe it was his facial hair. I believe he had long hair and a beard at the time of the murders.

 

[Goody]

I'm confused, where was this stupid hair found and does it have a root?

There were two or three hairs found. One was a negroid pubic hair, I believe. One was a deer hair and I think the other was Darin's hair found on the knife. I am not sure I can recall right now where the other hairs were found, but I think was found on the sock and the other in the house somewhere.

 

[deanws]

There were two or three hairs found. One was a negroid pubic hair, I believe.

Which shows how easily hairs are tracked in from various places. I think the only way a hair would do them any good was if it had been found on Damon or Devon's body, cluched in their hands, ect... Somewhere that direct contact with the victims could be shown.

 

[beesy]

I am not as fastidious as Darile or even my mother I only vacuum 1 a week on my day off. Maybe I just don't notice them but I don't find pubic hairs anywhere but my bathroom and dressing area. There is carpet in the bedrooms and the carpet seems to keep the stuff from getting blown or tracked around as much. I do notice head hairs as when I loose a hair its over a foot long. They get everywhere. Even wrapped around the legs of furniture. I have heard it is normal to loose 100 hairs a day. More than that and you may have a balding problem.

LE found these hairs with tweezers by crawling around on the floor. She did not do that,either do you cleaning is one thing, picking the floor another. They also used tape. That hair could have been there forever and a day

 

[dasgal]

I'm going to carry over a conversation I was having with GI from the 16 stories thread and put it over here as this has to do with the blood, hair, jewlery, and all that stuff.....this goes for Darlie's supporters to include as well Darlie's own defense team:

First you have to establish what Darlie version you are talking about. There have been quite a few new ones since her original 16. It's gone past the burglar intruder, the two intruders, the neighbor wanna be rapist, the stalker rapist and has now included the Darin Directed Hit, the gangster dope deal killers, and Darin himself. No fair switching from the burglar killer, to the Darin Directed Hit. You can't just switch paths between the stalker rapist killer and the Dope Deal Gone Bad. It can't be the neighbor rapist and then when it's more convenient to a theory, jump off to the Insurance Fraud defense. Pick one. Follow through.
I think the primary reason that Darlie, Darlie Supporters, and even the Darlie defense team keep switching back and forth is the simple fact that her story isn't consistant with any one scenario. Why? Because she keeps getting caught in situations where things just don't add up. She's tried just about everything to come up with a rational story, and has even gone so far as to COMBINE the stories, but still....they don't add up. Why? Because she is lying. When she is proved to be lying, she says that someone told her to think these things....it was OTHER people who had the suspicion.
The reason I'm saying all this, is because I'm pretty confident when you pick a Darlie story, ANY Darlie story AND TRY TO STICK WITH IT, you can then begin to see the faults. Then, if so inclined, jump to the next Darlie version and run that through....then go to the next one, and the next one. You will eventually find that none of them are consistant with evidence. If you keep combining the stories, and switching from one to another in a big mix and match, you'll just never catch on to the deception.
JonGalt/Dasgal over and out.

 

[beesy]

Warning-I'm highjacking my own thread-LOL
I could be totally wrong, but I thought that they were now able to identify DNA through hair slicing even without the root folicle. Again, could be wrong.
But I hear ya though.....even if these items were determined not to have belonged to anyone in the house, I can't imagine that it would have much baring as far as innocents. Even the cleanest housekeeper in the world is going to miss something.

What do you mean by highjacking?

 

[dasgal]

What do you mean by highjacking?

Hi Beesy,
Highjacking a thread means to change the topic or go off topic. On most forums it's a big no-no. Kinda like the hearing thread that turned into discussions about who is goodlooking, whether Jeff is lurking under a new hat, or what actually happened to the Space Shuttle.
In fact, asking what highjacking is, is highhjacking....:laugh: Just screwing with ya....

 

[beesy]

First you have to establish what Darlie version you are talking about. There have been quite a few new ones since her original 16. It's gone past the burglar intruder, the two intruders, the neighbor wanna be rapist, the stalker rapist and has now included the Darin Directed Hit, the gangster dope deal killers, and Darin himself. No fair switching from the burglar killer, to the Darin Directed Hit. You can't just switch paths between the stalker rapist killer and the Dope Deal Gone Bad. It can't be the neighbor rapist and then when it's more convenient to a theory, jump off to the Insurance Fraud defense. Pick one. Follow through.
I think the primary reason that Darlie, Darlie Supporters, and even the Darlie defense team keep switching back and forth is the simple fact that her story isn't consistant with any one scenario. Why? Because she keeps getting caught in situations where things just don't add up. She's tried just about everything to come up with a rational story, and has even gone so far as to COMBINE the stories, but still....they don't add up. Why? Because she is lying. When she is proved to be lying, she says that someone told her to think these things....it was OTHER people who had the suspicion.
The reason I'm saying all this, is because I'm pretty confident when you pick a Darlie story, ANY Darlie story AND TRY TO STICK WITH IT, you can then begin to see the faults. Then, if so inclined, jump to the next Darlie version and run that through....then go to the next one, and the next one. You will eventually find that none of them are consistant with evidence. If you keep combining the stories, and switching from one to another in a big mix and match, you'll just never catch on to the deception.
JonGalt/Dasgal over and out.

You're JonGalt? You're like the holy grail. Does she really exist? Her suporters also change Darlie's story for her. When faced with evidence they say, well she never said that didn't happen. She also didn't she's Santa Claus, as far as I know. The story cannot be changed to fit the evidence by her or her suporters.
And you don't need a good memory if you tell the truth!

 

[dasgal]

You're JonGalt? You're like the holy grail. Does she really exist?

LOL. The holy grail? I think most people think I'm the Holy Pain in the A$$, but yep I'm JG/Dasgal. I'll add that to my siggy here, because I'm sure it gets confusing to people.........but thanks for the props!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

LOL. The holy grail? I think most people think I'm the Holy Pain in the A$$, but yep I'm JG/Dasgal. I'll add that to my siggy here, because I'm sure it gets confusing to people.........but thanks for the props!

Pffftttttt. You're no where NEAR as old as the Holy Grail!!! :doh: :doh: :doh: :blowkiss: :blowkiss: :blowkiss:

 

[cami]

NEWS UPDATE 4/30/06 -

A motion to stay the Federal Habeas proceedings pending DNA completion
of the State DNA testing Proceedings was denied. Darlie's council filed
a Motion for Reconcideration (SIC) which addresses all of the Federal courts
concerns. This motion provides complete information about what is
expected to be discovered with the DNA tests and how it would prove her
innocence. The state has vigerously fought to prevent these tests. In this
motion, council explains in detail how each test result, independant of
the other, would undermine the conviction, and how most of the test
results would be conclusive of her innocence.

This motion can be viewed at
http://www.fordarlieroutier.org/Legal/Habeas/Reconsid.pdf

 

[sharpar]

Not too surprising ! Unlikely any motion will stop/ delay her execution.

Her goose is cooked already.

 

[justice2]

Does anyone know anything about this new Y-chromozone testing he keeps talking about. Is it for samples that don't have enough DNA to do regular DNA testing? I guess I don't understand.

Boy, I sure didn't see anything earth shattering in there.

I didn't know there were blood drops on the sock. I thought there were only two smears on the bottom. Anybody have a good picture.

DNA mapping of the nightshirt, now I'd like to see that, but I don't think it would prove her innocent, just might explain what happened better.

Kinda doubt all the different hairs would prove anything.

So back to the intruder theory instead of Darin did it. Hmmm.

 

[feenix]

Can someone tell me what exactly does this mean, in laymans terms.

Thanks

 

[cami]

Does anyone know anything about this new Y-chromozone testing he keeps talking about. Is it for samples that don't have enough DNA to do regular DNA testing? I guess I don't understand.

Boy, I sure didn't see anything earth shattering in there.

I didn't know there were blood drops on the sock. I thought there were only two smears on the bottom. Anybody have a good picture.

DNA mapping of the nightshirt, now I'd like to see that, but I don't think it would prove her innocent, just might explain what happened better.

Kinda doubt all the different hairs would prove anything.

So back to the intruder theory instead of Darin did it. Hmmm.

I believe the Y chromozone testing is to differientiate between male and female dna. At least that's what I get out of this....if they find a Y chomozone in the blood then they can allege "ah ha" it's an unknown male.

Yeah I kinda doubt the hairs would prove anything except we all drop hair daily and we all transfer hair....limb hair in particular is not microscopically comparable...it has to be dna tested. The pubic hair can be nucleur dna tested if it has a root. It appears that it has already been dna tested with no conclusive results so they are asking for more sophisticated dna testing that is available now...wasn't in 1996-97.

If it's from an unknown source, it would have to match other dna test results for it to mean anything in terms of an intruder.

In fact, as I understand this motion her counsel wants dna testing done on:

blood, saliva and limb hair found on the sock
an unidentified facial hair
the pubic hair found in the kitchen
all the blood on her nightshirt
all the blood on the murder weapon
the partial rape kit
the bloody fingerprint on the sofa table !!!! The utility room door is not mentioned!

What they want is to do Y chromozone dna testing on the blood on her shirt and the murder weapon citing the intruder may have cut himself during the commission of the crimes so his blood could be on the knife and the shirt. As well, they want Y chromozone testing on the partial rape kit.

They can do mitochrondial dna testing on the limb and facial hair...it's not as conclusive as nucleur dna testing however. But there are more sophisticated and precise dna tests they can perform.

All the tests would have to match an unknown source for her to get a new trial.

 

[Britlaw]

I had a quick scan read. I have to admit that I have some sympathy with the fact that her previous motion was denied quite abruptly. I note that Darin's jeans dont feature in this motion. I know there is nothing new here. However, I do think that given that shes requesting enhanced DNA testing of articles from the scene that could really put the nail in her coffin if she's faking it, that these items should be retested in the light of the more sophisticated testing available today. Further testing, if she is guilty, will not establish the DNA link she so desires between the tube sock, the unidentified fingerprint, the murder weapon etc. which will therefore make her conviction (and execution) safe and end all thr doubts. Finding different DNA to the family on a pubic hair found whereever (could be the tradesman fixing stove, boiler etc) is only going to be of any interest if its also found on blood evidence e.g the knife, her shirt, the sock.

For the sake of a few DNA tests why not? We have had innocent people proven guilty here after 10 or more years because of the enhanced DNA testing technology available today. If we had the death penalty here, I am sure people would vote in favour of enhanced testing in such a case, to make sure the right person died as opposed to giving a convicted person a way of getting off.

 

[cami]

Can someone tell me what exactly does this mean, in laymans terms.

Thanks

From what I can make of this motion is:

Her motion to have her federal habeas proceeding stayed pending state dna tests results was denied by the district court on March 2, 2006. This is a motion for reconsideration of the denial of motion to stay the proceeding until the State dna test results are completed.

The district court sees it as a delaying tactic citing the petitioner is more interested in staying the proceedings than expeditiously obtaining DNA testing on those items...which have been pending in the state court for 2 1/2 years. The Court denied on the grounds that Darlie did not sufficiently identify the precise dna evidence she believes will be produced.

I got a laugh out of this "the district court invited petitioner to re-file her motion, albeit scornfully"

If the State court denies her motion for further dna tests she can then pursue funding and the right to dna test in federal court. However, she is on a time limit from what I understand with this motion. If the State court action remains pending, and the federal proceeding is not stayed, she will lose her rights to federal funding and discovery.

Be careful what you wish for Darlie.

 

[cami]

I had a quick scan read. I have to admit that I have some sympathy with the fact that her previous motion was denied quite abruptly. I note that Darin's jeans dont feature in this motion. I know there is nothing new here. However, I do think that given that shes requesting enhanced DNA testing of articles from the scene that could really put the nail in her coffin if she's faking it, that these items should be retested in the light of the more sophisticated testing available today. Further testing, if she is guilty, will not establish the DNA link she so desires between the tube sock, the unidentified fingerprint, the murder weapon etc. which will therefore make her conviction (and execution) safe and end all thr doubts. Finding different DNA to the family on a pubic hair found whereever (could be the tradesman fixing stove, boiler etc) is only going to be of any interest if its also found on blood evidence e.g the knife, her shirt, the sock.

For the sake of a few DNA tests why not? We have had innocent people proven guilty here after 10 or more years because of the enhanced DNA testing technology available today. If we had the death penalty here, I am sure people would vote in favour of enhanced testing in such a case, to make sure the right person died as opposed to giving a convicted person a way of getting off.

Yeah it looks as if Darin is out of the equation. That bloody print on the utility room door is not mentioned either. But this motion also doesn't address the blood evidence against her, like the lack of cast-off where the knife was allegedly thrown down by the intruder and the blood cleaned up in the kitchen. I don't think this motion is going anywhere. I also agree about the testing...let them test....it will just reinforce Darlie's guilt in my opinion.

Got to tell you about a movie the other night on our CourtTV....10 Rillington Place, starring Richard Attenborough (Princess Diana's champion) and Judy Geeson. Do you know the case--Phillips I think his name was? Wasn't he the last person executed in Britain and didn't he receive a pardon posthumously? It was on very late so I didn't watch it but my boyfriend did and he said it was good albeit "dark." I remember reading something on this crime years ago....wasn't it one of the reasons England abolished the DP? Very interesting....

 

[Britlaw]

Yeah it looks as if Darin is out of the equation. That bloody print on the utility room door is not mentioned either. But this motion also doesn't address the blood evidence against her, like the lack of cast-off where the knife was allegedly thrown down by the intruder and the blood cleaned up in the kitchen. I don't think this motion is going anywhere. I also agree about the testing...let them test....it will just reinforce Darlie's guilt in my opinion.

Got to tell you about a movie the other night on our CourtTV....10 Rillington Place, starring Richard Attenborough (Princess Diana's champion) and Judy Geeson. Do you know the case--Phillips I think his name was? Wasn't he the last person executed in Britain and didn't he receive a pardon posthumously? It was on very late so I didn't watch it but my boyfriend did and he said it was good albeit "dark." I remember reading something on this crime years ago....wasn't it one of the reasons England abolished the DP? Very interesting....

Hi Cami,

Para 1 - If all the articles were tested and there was matching DNA between the sock, one of the hairs and the fingerprint and/or the knife then this would, I think, outweigh the damming blood evidence against her, as it would place an intruder in the house and cast doubt on the other evidence....but how likely is this? You have to admire her (hmm, perhaps wrong word) for trying, as this could REALLY backfire and fairly conclusively prove her guilt....an intruder is not realistically going to be present at a scene and leave no trace of DNA whatsoever on at least some of the things he's alleged to have come into contact with.

Para 2 - The case was Timothy Evans. He's not really a good example as he was convicted of murdering his daughter and hanged but his wife was also killed but he wasnt charged. It was later established that he definately didnt kill his daughter and he was postumously pardoned for this but the enquiry found that there was a high probability that he did kill his wife. Heres a link which explains this case in brief http://www.stephen-stratford.co.uk/evans_christie.htm
Derek Bentley is a better example of death penatly mistakes, hanged on 28 January 1953 with his conviction overturned in July 1998 http://web1.pipemedia.net/~sar/bentley/db_mainframe.html

We abolished the death penalty by statute in 1969. Its fair to say that if we had a referendum here, there would probaly be a majority vote (not unanimous but more than 50%) by the public to return it but there remains a majority against it in the House of Commons and even if there wasnt, the House of Lords would put up a fight. There hasnt been any protest by the public about this on a 'the will of the people' argument, on the basis that the people who would likely vote for it are those least likely to vote in political elections....sorta put up or shut up lol.