DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #7

[SpanishInquisition]

That's one reason I do not think JW is involved. $20K would fund him for what, 3 months? He's going to risk life in prison for kidnapping for $20K?

Why do you assume whoever was involved specifically wanted $40K as opposed $40K merely being the amount they were able to get? To me it just doesn't seem believable that even if DW did this all by himself that he'd specifically go into this for $40K and not some other higher figure. The $40K to me seems to show whoever was involved didn't know how banks worked with the $40K being the most the bank allowed to be withdrawn in cash with the timeframe of notice they received. Even if you have a $1 million dollars in the bank, you can't just go into the bank with a few hours notice and pull out $1 million in cash instantly.

 

[thinksalot]

I wonder why he deleted all of his SM? He deleted them before he was named in the fox 5 report. That doesn't sit weird with some of you?

He probably came on WS and saw the speculation! :shame:

 

[TexMex]

Why do you assume whoever was involved specifically wanted $40K as opposed $40K merely being the amount they were able to get? To me it just doesn't seem believable that even if DW did this all by himself that he'd specifically go into this for $40K and not some other higher figure.

I don't think the killer demanded specifically $40K. I think the demand was: when the bank opens tomorrow I want you to get me some money

JW needed a sponsorship. He worked for his money. He had jobs. Seems like a hard worker.
DW seems to have been on a downward spiral since being fired from AIW. IMO the co conspirator, if there is one, is going to turn out to be a relative or long term friend of DW

 

[popsicle]

The end result of a crime does not give us information about what the EXPECTED result was hoped to be.

If two people plan to rob a jewelry store, and one holds the gun and another is supposed to scoop up Jewelry...IF, the gun-holder starts shooting and kills 4 people...and the other perp only has a few Timex's in the bag...that does not mean that they only planned to take a few Timex's.

I think this was preplanned. But I think the planners thought they each would come away with a far bigger pay-off than they did. It's possible that they had a buyer for one of the cars, for example and tried to complete the deal in the hours between the house fire and the car fire. But the torture and murder of four people might have spooked the buyer...so that payoff never happened.

I do wonder about watches, jewelry etc that might have been in the house. Maybe after you commit a crime that went from burglary to a high profile murder/torture case, you don't rush out to "fence" the jewelry. That payoff will wait.

Then why didn't they take the car/cars Weds night and sell them to this buyer? I mean if the cars were part of this plan why weren't any of them already gone before Thursday morning? Unless, it is because JW would have noticed and he was not a part of this?

 

[Elley Mae]

He probably came on WS and saw the speculation! :shame:

Whoda thunk it? I know at the beginning LE made reference to it being more then one person involved in this and I think they were/are wrong. If any one else is involved I don't think it's JW. jmo idk

 

[Elley Mae]

I don't think the killer demanded specifically $40K. I think the demand was: when the bank opens tomorrow I want you to get me some money

JW needed a sponsorship. He worked for his money. He had jobs. Seems like a hard worker.
DW seems to have been on a downward spiral since being fired from AIW. IMO the co conspirator, if there is one, is going to turn out to be a relative or long term friend of DW

I may be wrong but I thought at the start that the 40,000.00 was taken from 4 accounts, 10.000.00 from each account, I have looked and tried to search for that but I am coming up empty. Sometimes I think stuff and think I say it but don't, I confuse myself all the time. lol jmo idk

 

[privateaye]

I do agree I think some things went wrong in the execution of this crime. Why do I come to that conclusion? Because I don't think the criminals are very smart (read: pizza crust), so for some of the highly orchestrated scenarios postulated to have occurred, it would require smarter people (probably), and I doubt that was what we have here. However, I do believe it was planned, as LE said it was not random, therefore something different than what resulted was planned. This is a theory, of course. There are pieces in my head I'm trying to figure out, such as, what do I believe the original plan constituted, and what went wrong? Do I think the murders were planned? Was there a very personal motive involving rage, or was that just an escalation after things went wrong? Was money the object, or was it the aforementioned potential rage, and money was a nice add-on? Were there 2 differing motives, split between a team whose goals weren't the same?

I know LE knows a lot more than we think because they've said the killers made a lot of mistakes. I believe they have evidence implicating someone else, but are waiting to gather more evidence against them to strengthen the case, and/or are observing them in the free world as they reach out to associated people, providing LE with more leads and links. They may even be doing this knowingly, to lessen their own damage and posture themselves for plea dealing.

 

[jjenny]

I may be wrong but I thought at the start that the 40,000.00 was taken from 4 accounts, 10.000.00 from each account, I have looked and tried to search for that but I am coming up empty. Sometimes I think stuff and think I say it but don't, I confuse myself all the time. lol jmo idk

As far as I can tell, it was never reported anywhere, only speculated about. So its total speculation.

 

[jjenny]

I do agree I think some things went wrong in the execution of this crime. Why do I come to that conclusion? Because I don't think the criminals are very smart (read: pizza crust), so for some of the highly orchestrated scenarios postulated to have occurred, it would require smarter people (probably), and I doubt that was what we have here. However, I do believe it was planned, as LE said it was not random, therefore something different than what resulted was planned. This is a theory, of course. There are pieces in my head I'm trying to figure out, such as, what do I believe the original plan constituted, and what went wrong? Do I think the murders were planned? Was there a very personal motive involving rage, or was that just an escalation after things went wrong? Was money the object, or was it the aforementioned potential rage, and money was a nice add-on? Were there 2 differing motives, split between a team whose goals weren't the same?

I know LE knows a lot more than we think because they've said the killers made a lot of mistakes. I believe they have evidence implicating someone else, but are waiting to gather more evidence against them to strengthen the case, and/or are observing them in the free world as they reach out to associated people, providing LE woth more leads and links. They may even be doing this knowingly, to lessen their own damage and posture themselves for plea dealing.

Mistake was made when DNA was left on a pizza crust. Now, if that mistake wasn't made, what would LE have?
Doesn't sound like they found physical evidence of other perps being on the scene (at least yet), since they would have presumably made an arrest if there were fingerprints or DNA from somebody else left, that they could identify. It's possible they have DNA or fingerprints that they can't match to someone because that person isn't in the system.
But no additional arrests is curious, since LE seemed so sure more than one person were involved.

 

[thinksalot]

I don't think the killer demanded specifically $40K. I think the demand was: when the bank opens tomorrow I want you to get me some money

JW needed a sponsorship. He worked for his money. He had jobs. Seems like a hard worker.
DW seems to have been on a downward spiral since being fired from AIW. IMO the co conspirator, if there is one, is going to turn out to be a relative or long term friend of DW

Someone posted here a few threads back a link to a CNN story that supposedly told of someone (no name) law enforcement were looking at in connection with helping Wint. However, the link didn't work. Anyway, either CNN took the story down because it wasn't supposed to go with that info or someone was speculating or heard something ITSELF :cheerful: about the investigation. The person was NOT W1.

 

[stmarysmead]

Then why didn't they take the car/cars Weds night and sell them to this buyer? I mean if the cars were part of this plan why weren't any of them already gone before Thursday morning? Unless, it is because JW would have noticed and he was not a part of this?

Removing one of the cars might have been "risky" before they got the money. Especially if they had to move cars around to get to the one they wanted. Too much strange happenings that could have been observed.

The decision to stay overnight had to do with waiting for the withdrawal of the cash. It was actually smart thinking IMO, to get everyone locked down in the quiet of the evening...instead of a busy workday/schoolday morning.

You lock everyone down. Wait for the money. Then...they get the money and wait again. Hours more. I think the car part of the deal was falling apart. Something was going wrong that caused that delay. DW may have been furious then and took the messed up deal out on the family.

He might have been thinking...this was NOT worth my share of $40,000. But they did take the Porsche.

Did it sit in a garage somewhere while they tried to make at least a deal on that...in the hours between the house fire and car fire? I dont think after murdering four people that you'd been swanning around town in their highly recognizable car.

But, in the end, even that deal didn't work. So they torched the car and ran.

 

[TexMex]

Removing one of the cars might have been "risky" before they got the money. Especially if they had to move cars around to get to the one they wanted. Too much strange happenings that could have been observed.

The decision to stay overnight had to do with waiting for the withdrawal of the cash. It was actually smart thinking IMO, to get everyone locked down in the quiet of the evening...instead of a busy workday/schoolday morning.

You lock everyone down. Wait for the money. Then...they get the money and wait again. Hours more. I think the car part of the deal was falling apart. Something was going wrong that caused that delay. DW may have been furious then and took the messed up deal out on the family.

He might have been thinking...this was NOT worth my share of $40,000. But they did take the Porsche.

Did it sit in a garage somewhere while they tried to make at least a deal on that...in the hours between the house fire and car fire? I dont think after murdering four people that you'd been swanning around town in their highly recognizable car.

But, in the end, even that deal didn't work. So they torched the car and ran.

The CNN story said that LE was looking at a cousin of DW


http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2015/05/28/mansion-murders-wint-dnt-brown-ac.cnn#

 

[privateaye]

Mistake was made when DNA was left on a pizza crust. Now, if that mistake wasn't made, what would LE have?
Doesn't sound like they found physical evidence of other perps being on the scene (at least yet), since they would have presumably made an arrest if there were fingerprints or DNA from somebody else left, that they could identify. It's possible they have DNA or fingerprints that they can't match to someone because that person isn't in the system.
But no additional arrests is curious, since LE seemed so sure more than one person were involved.

Makes me wonder if they came to the multiple perp conclusion based on circumstantial evidence that they're now trying to bolster by attempting to gather harder evidence....

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I don't think the killer demanded specifically $40K. I think the demand was: when the bank opens tomorrow I want you to get me some money

JW needed a sponsorship. He worked for his money. He had jobs. Seems like a hard worker.
DW seems to have been on a downward spiral since being fired from AIW. IMO the co conspirator, if there is one, is going to turn out to be a relative or long term friend of DW

JW seemed to me to be on a downward spiral as well. With the picture that had been floated on here at the track as part of the job if you read the comments on it was about how he hadn't been racing with someone making a remark about why isn't he on the other side of the fence. Last year JW even created his own internet TV series about the launching of his pro career where he talked about everything he was donig and what was going on and you compare that to what was going on for him in 2015 and to me he seems worse off. That you have a job of some kind doesn't mean you haven't taken a downward spiral. We also for instance don't know how things were working out between JW and SS where JW might have received a hint that he was probably going to lose his job with SS before too long as I would think him only having been there a few weeks was still on a trial run instead of SS's job being firm at that point.

 

[thinksalot]

Except for the rolling van, everything points to money, not cars, being the motive. I think the Porsche was primarily the getaway car. Perhaps he hoped to sell it but didn't have that thought out

If he hadn't torched the house, I wonder how long it would have been until the murders were discovered? Probably it would have been another 12-24 hours before discovery. In that scenario, he might have had time to sell the car.

Does anyone have a link to JW's father being retired LE?

 

[jjenny]

Makes me wonder if they came to the multiple perp conclusion based on circumstantial evidence that they're now trying to bolster by attempting to gather harder evidence....

It's hard to pull off the crime of this magnitude, with controlling multiple people, making them to make phone calls, by one person.
So I can understand where LE is coming from. I am curious if they have any evidence to support that idea, though. Seems if there were any physical evidence against someone else, addional arrests would have been made.

 

[TexMex]

Makes me wonder if they came to the multiple perp conclusion based on circumstantial evidence that they're now trying to bolster by attempting to gather harder evidence....

The CNN report says police are still interested in the two women who were with Wint at arrest (cousin also with him)
I think if a woman knocked on the door AS might be more likely to open it than if a man were
Also Wint had a cousin who had worked for AIW. Reported says it's not clear if it's this cousin with him at the arrest

http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2015/05/28/mansion-murders-wint-dnt-brown-ac.cnn#

 

[Skigirl]

I thought it was agreed NG was NOT supposed to clean on Thursday. Hence, the messages from AS were probably sent as a "help." None of the curious messages sent from the S's though were deciphered by their recipients.

I don't think that's right.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/05/1...eeper-not-to-visit-before-being-killed-in-dc/
"'I don't understand why. God saved my life,' the housekeeper who received the text told ABC News."


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/houseke...-new-clues-in-upscale-dc-neighborhood-murder/
"Nelitza Gutierrez, the family's second housekeeper of 20 years was warned not to come to the house the night before the family's home was set on fire.

She was supposed to report to their home on Thursday, but got an unusual message Wednesday night from the owner, and one of the victims, Savvas Savopolous, telling her she wasn't needed because their other housekeeper Vera Figeroa was staying the night.


'Like maybe they changed plans at the last minute? They say not to come,' Gutierrez said."

 

[jjenny]

It's also been reported that NG wasn't supposed to come on Thursday anyway, because she was helping with the new Dojo that week on other days.
Here:
"Gutierrez said in the interview that Savvas Savopoulos had asked her to help at the studio on Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday, instead of at the couple’s home on Thursday."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...140154-fbf7-11e4-9030-b4732caefe81_story.html

 

[privateaye]

I don't think that's right.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/05/1...eeper-not-to-visit-before-being-killed-in-dc/
"'I don't understand why. God saved my life,' the housekeeper who received the text told ABC News."


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/houseke...-new-clues-in-upscale-dc-neighborhood-murder/
"Nelitza Gutierrez, the family's second housekeeper of 20 years was warned not to come to the house the night before the family's home was set on fire.

She was supposed to report to their home on Thursday, but got an unusual message Wednesday night from the owner, and one of the victims, Savvas Savopolous, telling her she wasn't needed because their other housekeeper Vera Figeroa was staying the night.


'Like maybe they changed plans at the last minute? They say not to come,' Gutierrez said."

NG also said, very early on, that SS told her earlier in the week to help out at the dojo three days that week INSTEAD of cleaning their house on Thursday. If someone has the link that would be great.