Dellen Millard: Innocent Dupe? Alternative Theories

[Carli]

If I'm not mistaken, it was mentioned that DM and MS had a friend that was a make-up artist. Rather than finding look-alikes, perhaps another 'insider' had latex masks made up, like on 'Mission Impossible'.

Oh yes, I recall that, too. I think it was another friend of DM's who knew someone who was taking make-up classes in high school. As I recall this is the person who created DM's friend's realistic looking bloody gashed head and DM's bloody eye for Halloween photos. I'll try to find the link. Not sure about making DIY latex masks, though. It seems like it would be quite a complicated process, imo, http://www.fxwarehouse.info/make_mask.shtml especially if you were trying to create a believable looking face of particular living persons. Wouldn't you have to first make a plaster mold of their actual faces?

 

[Snoofo]

Juballee, in this scenario, might there not also be the possibility that this 3rd suspect - an insider - could have alerted an accomplice(s) that TB was on his way back home or, possibly, even stayed with TB in his vehicle after DM and MS had left? I suggest an insider because this person possibly had access to the hangar and also knew the location of both DM's mother's house and his farm. MOO. Possibly he only thought the plan was for his pal(s) to hi-jack the truck, though, not murder TB. MOO. IMO.

I agree there is a third suspect. This person has disappeared off the face of the earth, IMO, and I really hope this person is not dead. It could be someone whose lifestyle is such that loved ones wouldn't really be sure they were missing per se, to have it reported.

IMO the 3rd did not know a murder was going to take place. I am not sure about MS, whether he knew. I would like to think he was innocent in all this but more holes would be filled if he wasn't. But I think DM must have trusted him. I feel one of their so-called "friends" was involved, at any rate. What evidence is found, if any, in the Yukon, should help a lot.

The third suspect could be the link to OC, even if they didnt know it. Could just be "the grunt" as someone referred to him early on, but one who talks a lot to be cool and is gullible. Wholly MOO!

I will follow the advice of the "anti-alternative theorists" here and "follow the evidence". Although there are so many aspects in DM's life where people would have wanted him locked up, I think the fact that Hamilton Police is keeping the chop shop investigation is too meaningful to avoid. This means chop shop OC ring a strong contender to this mysterious murder (and disappearance of one suspect IMO).

 

[Blomquist]

I agree there is a third suspect. This person has disappeared off the face of the earth, IMO, and I really hope this person is not dead. It could be someone whose lifestyle is such that loved ones wouldn't really be sure they were missing per se, to have it reported.

IMO the 3rd did not know a murder was going to take place. I am not sure about MS, whether he knew. I would like to think he was innocent in all this but more holes would be filled if he wasn't. But I think DM must have trusted him. I feel one of their so-called "friends" was involved, at any rate. What evidence is found, if any, in the Yukon, should help a lot.

The third suspect could be the link to OC, even if they didnt know it. Could just be "the grunt" as someone referred to him early on, but one who talks a lot to be cool and is gullible. Wholly MOO!

I will follow the advice of the "anti-alternative theorists" here and "follow the evidence". Although there are so many aspects in DM's life where people would have wanted him locked up, I think the fact that Hamilton Police is keeping the chop shop investigation is too meaningful to avoid. This means chop shop OC ring a strong contender to this mysterious murder (and disappearance of one suspect IMO).

I think that at the very least the fact that Chop Shop /OC is still in the running as it were.....is enough IMO to make other OC groups/accomplices at least a potential subsidiary of the Chop Shop 'business'..... I think the hangar and even MillardAir as a viable business was /is in the firing line as acquisitions for future 'projects' by corporations unknown....or not.

Such businesses are known to be cut throat ...and IMO the words cut throat were not coined for such operations without the intent to mean 'murderous' ....... and with good reason IMO JMO MOO

I also agree that there is a 3rd suspect...and IMO possibly a few more than that....being as LE had no idea how many were in the 'following' vehicle...not to mention there is no idea whether TB truck was intercepted etc after the test drive or during, which would indicate potentially more 'suspects' IMO.

 

[Juballee]

I agree there is a third suspect. This person has disappeared off the face of the earth, IMO, and I really hope this person is not dead. It could be someone whose lifestyle is such that loved ones wouldn't really be sure they were missing per se, to have it reported.

IMO the 3rd did not know a murder was going to take place. I am not sure about MS, whether he knew. I would like to think he was innocent in all this but more holes would be filled if he wasn't. But I think DM must have trusted him. I feel one of their so-called "friends" was involved, at any rate. What evidence is found, if any, in the Yukon, should help a lot.

The third suspect could be the link to OC, even if they didnt know it. Could just be "the grunt" as someone referred to him early on, but one who talks a lot to be cool and is gullible. Wholly MOO!

I will follow the advice of the "anti-alternative theorists" here and "follow the evidence". Although there are so many aspects in DM's life where people would have wanted him locked up, I think the fact that Hamilton Police is keeping the chop shop investigation is too meaningful to avoid. This means chop shop OC ring a strong contender to this mysterious murder (and disappearance of one suspect IMO).

I also agree that I think that there is a third suspect, wasn't that the first thing that DP said to the media, that when the other suspects are caught, we will get a better picture? He definitely said suspects not suspect. But I disagree that the third didn't know the plan, I think the fact that this suspect has avoided detection thus far leads me to believe that this person out of the three (or more) was seemingly the only one to take precautions to avoid detection, likely because he was the only one who knew the real plan and the dire consequences of getting caught.

 

[Snoofo]

I have been trying hard to find the press conference where Kavanagh states the third suspect is not seen as a threat. When pressed on this he sort of laughs/scoffs and says something like "you'll just have to trust me on this one". This was just before Smich's arrest, I believe. I have never been able to get this out of my head when I think of what might have gone down.

I can't see him saying that unless he already knew who the third suspect is. And I can't see him saying that unless he was sure. I believed then that suspect 3 was harmless, and either already chirped and disappeared willingly, or chirped and disappeared unwillingly. And when K later came out to say they dont know for sure if there was a third, all I could think of was this comment he made before about trusting him on this. This is the one time Det. K. really puzzled me. Or maybe he said it because they believed to know who it was it cannot find this person anywhere. JMO.

 

[Carli]

I have been trying hard to find the press conference where Kavanagh states the third suspect is not seen as a threat. When pressed on this he sort of laughs/scoffs and says something like "you'll just have to trust me on this one". This was just before Smich's arrest, I believe. I have never been able to get this out of my head when I think of what might have gone down.

I can't see him saying that unless he already knew who the third suspect is. And I can't see him saying that unless he was sure. I believed then that suspect 3 was harmless, and either already chirped and disappeared willingly, or chirped and disappeared unwillingly. And when K later came out to say they dont know for sure if there was a third, all I could think of was this comment he made before about trusting him on this. This is the one time Det. K. really puzzled me. Or maybe he said it because they believed to know who it was it cannot find this person anywhere. JMO.

When it comes to searching for three or more suspects in this murder it seems to me we are treated to a bit of accidental or intentional obfuscation, IMO. There's the harmless third or fourth person in the following vehicle - both of whom seem to have subsequently evaporated and there's the new third man, who wanted to sell his Dodge Ram but slept through the appointment.

Initially we seem to have had either 1 or 2 people, plus TB himself, in TB's truck, plus 1 or 2 persons in a SUV following them.

Anyway, you do the math - a bit of a challenge since the values keep changing.

At http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2882383-clairmont-no-id-yet-of-two-other-suspects-in-bosma-murder/ we learn that

"Investigators have not identified the two suspects they are looking for in connection to Tim Bosma's murder, says the detective in charge of the case.

Yet Detective Sergeant Matt Kavanagh of the Hamilton police homicide unit told The Spectator he does not believe the public is in any danger.

"You'll just have to trust me on this," he said when asked to explain.

Police have previously said there were at least three people involved in the abduction and murder of Bosma: the two men who went with him to test drive his Dodge Ram pickup truck that was for sale and another person following behind them in another vehicle. Police had left open the possibility there could be more than one individual in that following vehicle, which has only been described as an "SUV-type vehicle."

Now, however, Kavanagh says he believes there was only one person inside the second vehicle. "

 

[swedie]

I've doubted it in one of the many scenarios. I'm not sure I've convinced myself this is the case but SB's description of the perps was pretty vague so I am going to assume it was dark and she didn't have a very good view. I have seen a picture on AM's FB pages of a friend who could very easily pass for DM in the wrong lighting. I'm not saying this particular person posed as DM (and I'm not saying he didn't) but it led me to think DM looks like a LOT of guys out there. Wouldn't be too difficult to find an imposter within a group of thugs who could pass for him in bad lighting.

I've doubted just about everything. By the same token, a percentage of the time I believe that the majority here are right and DM is responsible for the death of TB. It is possible. But it may not be right. I can't just think "it's so obvious" when there is way too much weirdness abound.

:moo:

Underlined: I totally agree with this part of your post Snoofo, atta way. :highfive::yesss:
Sometimes the obvious is too obvious IMHO. SB and the BO probably gave a very thorough description of the suspects. The description given to the public by LE was concise, and does not mean there wasn't more to the description given by SB and the BO (business owner).

There are no reports to indicate SB saw them in the dark. I believe the opposite; suspects showed up at TB and SB's home and they were invited into the foyer at least IMO. Long enough for TB to collect keys, wallet, truck info ect. and talk to SB about going out. Being that time of night (nineish), and taking into account the suspects didn't show up at the time they originally arranged, maybe TB was in his PJs and needed to go get dress into street clothes, leaving SB with the suspects. In that case, she may have made small talk with them. Not only a physical description may have been given, but SB and BO may have noticed DM's speech impediment. I believe DM still has it and both witnesses picked up on that. That would be a dead giveaway IMHO.

Your suggestion of poor lighting/being dark, if the perps stayed outside, I would believe a stoop light would have been on and possibly SB was the one who answered the door when they showed up. It's apparent TB and SB were trusting of the so called test drivers, otherwise why would TB have taken them out late at night and alone. For all we know, the Bosma home could have had security cameras on their property and near their doors. The cameras could provide a clear imagine of the perps. Not to mention a camera at the BO business or from surrounding businesses.

There was IMO talk of the truck inside the house and SB could have been present through the whole conversation before the three left for the test drive. Obviously SB was in the suspects presence long enough to give a description of both of them. AND her description matched that of BO's description. The descriptions were that good LE caught both perps and they are now in jail awaiting trial for the murder of TB. I feel very certain LE has so much more evidence (largely video evidence) we do not know about, to nail DM and MS against the wall, that's MHO and I am sticking to it. I have looked into and highly considered, had a very open mind to all other theories presented thus far and I do not see anything legitimate at this time to convince me otherwise. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and this is :moo: I am not trying to persuade anyone from their opinion, just showing the facts and how I see they relate to the evidence only as we know it at present. JMO, JMHO, IMO, MOO.

Former classmates describe him as an awkward kid who had difficulty speaking and pronouncing words. He is remembered more than most of his peers because he stood out, several said.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...riends-remember-him-as-attention-seeking-kid/

They also have a far better description of one of the two suspects who drove off with him in his black 2007 Dodge Ram pickup truck

He said descriptions of the two men provided by the owner match those in the Bosma case, but provided some new details, including on a distinctive tattoo on one of the suspect’s wrists. The suspect is described as white, in his mid-20s, between six feet one and six feet two inches tall, and weighing between 170 and 180 pounds. He was unshaven, had light to medium short brown hair and wore blue jeans, a long-sleeve orange shirt and running shoes. Kavanagh said the Toronto man described the orange shirt as being short-sleeved and noticed several tattoos on the suspect’s arms. The most distinctive was one on one of his wrists where a person wears a watch. It read “Ambition” and was framed by a box in the same direction as a watch. Kavanagh said the description of the second suspect is unchanged: white, in his early to mid-20s and between five feet nine and five feet 10 inches tall. He had a small to medium build and wore a dark red hoodie with the hood up over his head. He said police have also received information that Bosma’s pickup truck was seen at 10:10 p.m. on Monday in downtown Brantford.

http://www.flamboroughreview.com/news/bosma-suspects-ambition-tattoo-unique-police/

Late last week Hamilton Police learned of another man, in Toronto, who was selling a similar truck and had a suspicious encounter with two men who matched the description of the pair given by Bosma's wife. But that man was able to add something distinctive — a tattoo of the word "ambition" on one man's wrist. Millard has such a tattoo.


http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2013/05/13/20817771.html

Police have only released the description of one of the suspects still wanted in the case. This man was described by both Bosma’s wife and an Etobicoke man who was also reportedly approached by the suspects when he listed his Dodge Ram 3500 for sale. The suspect was described as being white with a medium build. He is around five-foot-nine with dark hair. He was wearing a red hooded sweatshirt that was pulled over his head.

Read more: http://www.cp24.com/news/at-least-t...-murder-investigation-1.1280534#ixzz2ZzdNlrgz

Police said Smich has been identified as the other person who accompanied Bosma on the test drive, alongside 27-year-old Dellen Millard, of Toronto.

Read more: http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/second...se-police-seek-1-more-1.1292053#ixzz2Zzewcjc2

A young Mr. Smich was often in trouble, said a former friend who did not want to be named. “I seen him one day as being in jail or dead,” he said, but he never contemplated such a grievous charge. Mr. Smich appears to be the family’s black sheep.

“The devil led the vilest form of evil down my driveway and he smiled at me before taking Tim away,” said Sharlene Bosma.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...in-tim-bosma-murder-case-to-plead-not-guilty/

A second vehicle was waiting on the road at the end of Mr. Bosma’s driveway on Monday, May 6, and it followed as the men drove off with their victim, police said video evidence shows.

Investigators believe the same suspects had taken a similar test drive with a Toronto man selling a similar truck before Mr. Bosma’s disappearance. In that incident, however, there was not a second vehicle waiting at the bottom of the driveway, police said.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...olice-anxious-as-hunt-for-suspects-continues/

 

[cansleuther]

Not only a physical description may have been given, but SB and BO may have noticed DM's speech impediment. I believe DM still has it and both witnesses picked up on that.

There are several videos on FB where DM can be heard speaking and he has no discernible speech impediment - in fact there isn't anything "off" about his manner of speaking at all IMO.

Where have you heard him speak with an impediment?

 

[swedie]

There are several videos on FB where DM can be heard speaking and he has no discernible speech impediment - in fact there isn't anything "off" about his manner of speaking at all IMO.

Where have you heard him speak with an impediment?

My words "I believe". I'll check that out. :seeya: Someone with a speech impediment doesn't always grow out of it or corrects it. Although it may not be obvious to everyone, some may observe it. It could be as simple as a slight lisp, mispronunciation of certain words or a certain pitch/tone in their voice. HTH and MOO

Former classmates describe him as an awkward kid who had difficulty speaking and pronouncing words. He is remembered more than most of his peers because he stood out, several said.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/05...n-seeking-kid/

 

[cansleuther]

Former classmates describe him as an awkward kid who had difficulty speaking and pronouncing words. He is remembered more than most of his peers because he stood out, several said.

JMO but since DM was an English speaking child with no French background enrolled in a French school, couldn't this just have meant that he had trouble learning a second language and perhaps did not pick it up at the same rate as his peers? It does not specifically mean that he has a speech impediment. Several people he spoke to directly have been interviewed by MSM yet no other article mentions he had any trouble with his speech, especially as an adult.

 

[swedie]

JMO but since DM was an English speaking child with no French background enrolled in a French school, couldn't this just have meant that he had trouble learning a second language and perhaps did not pick it up at the same rate as his peers? It does not specifically mean that he has a speech impediment. Several people he spoke to directly have been interviewed by MSM yet no other article mentions he had any trouble with his speech, especially as an adult.

Watched the video and you are correct CS, no obvious speech impediment there. That is just one theory I had as to witnesses ID the perps. Thank you for the information. I still believe SB and BO were able to positively ID them and there was more definite descriptions give and not what was just released to the MSM. And here's hoping some video evidence to back it up. MOO

In the video I noticed DM was speaking french, maybe he had a habit of doing this and did it while in the presence of the SB and BO. No one else in the video was speaking french so why was he? :waitasec:

 

[Alethea Dice]

When it comes to searching for three or more suspects in this murder it seems to me we are treated to a bit of accidental or intentional obfuscation, IMO. There's the harmless third or fourth person in the following vehicle - both of whom seem to have subsequently evaporated and there's the new third man, who wanted to sell his Dodge Ram but slept through the appointment.

Initially we seem to have had either 1 or 2 people, plus TB himself, in TB's truck, plus 1 or 2 persons in a SUV following them.

Anyway, you do the math - a bit of a challenge since the values keep changing.

At http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2882383-clairmont-no-id-yet-of-two-other-suspects-in-bosma-murder/ we learn that

"Investigators have not identified the two suspects they are looking for in connection to Tim Bosma's murder, says the detective in charge of the case.

Yet Detective Sergeant Matt Kavanagh of the Hamilton police homicide unit told The Spectator he does not believe the public is in any danger.

"You'll just have to trust me on this," he said when asked to explain.

Police have previously said there were at least three people involved in the abduction and murder of Bosma: the two men who went with him to test drive his Dodge Ram pickup truck that was for sale and another person following behind them in another vehicle. Police had left open the possibility there could be more than one individual in that following vehicle, which has only been described as an "SUV-type vehicle."

Now, however, Kavanagh says he believes there was only one person inside the second vehicle. "

That article was published the same day that MS was arrested, but apparently written before the arrest was announced. The two suspects referred to are MS and whoever was driving the Yukon. When Det. Kavanagh said "you'll just have to trust me on this", he probably knew they were about to arrest him.

Prior to MS's arrest, there was still considered to be a danger to the public.

“Look what he did the first time to Mr. Bosma. So, yes, there is a fear and we are doing everything we can to identify this person and get him under arrest,” said Staff-Sgt. Kavanagh.

“He will be arrested, I can guarantee that.”

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/05/14/tim-bosma-murder-leaves-police-anxious-as-hunt-for-suspects-continues/

After MS was arrested (same paper as Carli's link, same date, different author):

In the wake of Smich's arrest, Kinsella told the media, "We believe the danger to the public has been arrested, and we believe the danger to the public has subsided as it relates to this case."

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2882879-second-arrest-made-in-tim-bosma-murder/

JMO

 

[swedie]

Seems the perps who murdered TB have set a trend. Hopefully LE got the right guys they arrested in the Alberta abduction. OC in these two cases? Make me wonder now. Edmonton and Calgary... Would OC here in Ontario have connections in Alberta? Odd, never heard of robbing people through online sales until TB's case. Hope it isn't a trend or OC. MOO.

Police warn of online selling dangers after alleged knifepoint robbery

The Edmonton Police Service (EPS) is warning consumers to be cautious when buying or selling items online, after two people were allegedly robbed at knifepoint during a potential vehicle sale.

This incident comes less than a week after a similar case where a 23-year-old man was kidnapped at knifepoint in the Callingwood area and driven to Calgary. The alleged abduction happened on Sunday, after the victim met two men who were supposedly interested in buying the man’s vehicle. Two men have since been charged in connection with the alleged abduction.

Earlier this year, Tim Bosma of Hamilton, Ont., was killed after taking two men for a test drive in the pickup truck he was selling. His charred remains were later discovered on a property owned by Dellen Millard.

 

[Carli]

Seems the perps who murdered TB have set a trend. Hopefully LE got the right guys they arrested in the Alberta abduction. OC in these two cases? Make me wonder now. Edmonton and Calgary... Would OC here in Ontario have connections in Alberta? Odd, never heard of robbing people through online sales until TB's case. Hope it isn't a trend or OC. MOO.

Police warn of online selling dangers after alleged knifepoint robbery

The Edmonton Police Service (EPS) is warning consumers to be cautious when buying or selling items online, after two people were allegedly robbed at knifepoint during a potential vehicle sale.

This incident comes less than a week after a similar case where a 23-year-old man was kidnapped at knifepoint in the Callingwood area and driven to Calgary. The alleged abduction happened on Sunday, after the victim met two men who were supposedly interested in buying the man’s vehicle. Two men have since been charged in connection with the alleged abduction.

Earlier this year, Tim Bosma of Hamilton, Ont., was killed after taking two men for a test drive in the pickup truck he was selling. His charred remains were later discovered on a property owned by Dellen Millard.

Google "Kiiji robberies" and "Craigslist robberies" and "Craigslists murders" for many, many holdups, assaults and murders, going back years. That's just two of a number of for-sale-by-owner websites online. Even discounting the fear *advertiser censored* delivered up to us daily via the media, it's still can be a dangerous world out there when you've advertised your vulnerability together with the availability and location of something that somebody else wants to steal. IMO.

 

[Juballee]

I was going back over a few old posts and I noticed something that strikes me as odd. It was said in MSM that police told The family that TB's phone was turned off shortly after 10:00 and within a mile from his home. It was also verified in MSM that police say that his truck was spotted in Brantford at about 10:10. How fast did the killer drive, is it possible to make it that distance in that amount of time?

 

[Coldpizza]

I was going back over a few old posts and I noticed something that strikes me as odd. It was said in MSM that police told The family that TB's phone was turned off shortly after 10:00 and within a mile from his home. It was also verified in MSM that police say that his truck was spotted in Brantford at about 10:10. How fast did the killer drive, is it possible to make it that distance in that amount of time?

Could you please reference the MSM links for the posters that may want to respond.

:tyou:

 

[Juballee]

I will try, but I have honestly just been reading random snippets and their links lately without paying much attention to their location, and then closing them as I have too many windows open to cope with as it is.

Here is (I hope) the like to the article where it is mentioned that the phone was turned off within a mile of his home:

http://read.thestar.com/#!/article/...im-bosma-the-painful-search-for-a-missing-man

I had forgotten what a long article, and how interesting some of it is.

I will see if I can find one of the articles that mentions that the phone was turned off shortly after 10:00.

 

[Juballee]

And this is a MSM link tha says that the phone was turned off at around 10:00, and also that his truck was seen in Brantford at around 10:10.

http://www.cp24.com/news/bosma-s-cellphone-found-police-release-new-details-on-suspects-1.1275631

But now I am also curious, because I thought that there was reported to be other footage of Tb's truck on the actual test drive earlier, being followed by DM's Yukon, something about the cameras at a fairground, but this same quote in different articles was the only mention of the truck being spotted that I have come across just now when I searched.

 

[lanman]

And this is a MSM link tha says that the phone was turned off at around 10:00, and also that his truck was seen in Brantford at around 10:10.

http://www.cp24.com/news/bosma-s-cellphone-found-police-release-new-details-on-suspects-1.1275631

But now I am also curious, because I thought that there was reported to be other footage of Tb's truck on the actual test drive earlier, being followed by DM's Yukon, something about the cameras at a fairground, but this same quote in different articles was the only mention of the truck being spotted that I have come across just now when I searched.

You should probably be reading the cell phone thread, all of your points were already discussed there.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210485"]Cell Phone, Location and Mapping the Route - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Snoofo]

And this is a MSM link tha says that the phone was turned off at around 10:00, and also that his truck was seen in Brantford at around 10:10.

http://www.cp24.com/news/bosma-s-cellphone-found-police-release-new-details-on-suspects-1.1275631

But now I am also curious, because I thought that there was reported to be other footage of Tb's truck on the actual test drive earlier, being followed by DM's Yukon, something about the cameras at a fairground, but this same quote in different articles was the only mention of the truck being spotted that I have come across just now when I searched.

Is this what you're looking for, Jube? It doesnt mention fairgrounds (that may have been assumed in WS posts). They only started reporting the following from Bosmas later on, around the time of Smich capture, maybe later. See fourth paragraph here:

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/n...bosma-killing/article12370401/?service=mobile

Once again I dont find the language clear. Did the writer mean surveillance of the Yukon just from that evening or surveillance from when the two arrived at his house?