Discuss Max's death here - Thread #1.

[MyBelle]

Brain swelling was completely consistent with spinal cord damage, as was explained in the autopsy. I don't believe the doctor would be making claims that brain swelling was not consistent with visible injuries had he known about extensive spinal cord damage.

bbm. Brain swelling was mentioned on the search warrant and can not be diagnosed without testing. The child suffered blunt force trauma to the head. You are making an assumption that the brain swelling was caused by a spinal cord injury.

I doubt an insider would claim that DS believed the child was suffocated unless DS had a little more to go on than a doctor's "visual" inspection.

JMO

 

[CDS22]

I would like to believe that too and imo I still feel Rebecca's death was most likely a suicide. BUT now more than ever I hope that BOTH cases are reopened. BOTH. There has always been something that has made me extremely uncomfortable about Max's death fall and there just happened to be no eye witnesses. That has bothered me for sometime and I really don't know why exactly, but with Rebecca in one bathroom and her sister supposedly in another bathroom at the very same time gives me pause.

BUT if Rebecca did not commit suicide but was killed then if something untoward was done to Max and it wasnt an accident at all that could change everything. Also if one of the doctors at the hospital told the family they thought Max had been smothered before being thrown off of the banister then I would certainly find the homicide more plausable than I do at the present time.

IMO

Just curious: If it turns out that RZ did smother MS, why would you find it more likely that she died from homicide rather than suicide? Wouldn't the guilt of killing a child be a driving factor for suicide? Or the fear of being found out and going to prison?

 

[jjenny]

bbm. Brain swelling was mentioned on the search warrant and can not be diagnosed without testing. The child suffered blunt force trauma to the head. You are making an assumption that the brain swelling was caused by a spinal cord injury.

I doubt an insider would claim that DS believed the child was suffocated unless DS had a little more to go on than a doctor's "visual" inspection.

JMO

I am not making any assumption. His autopsy report says what was his cause of death.

 

[4Jacy]

I don't know of too many cases where parents have murdered the person they assumed was their child's killer prior to police making an arrest. I think the usual reaction of parents is for justice and the perp spending the rest of their life in jail or awaiting on death row. I have seen no evidence whatsoever that would lead me to believe either JS or DS would choose murder rather than allow justice to take its course.
JMO

BBM

Gee, I can. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

 

[MyBelle]

You claim that the poster is making an assumption that is an insult to the doctors integrity, however, by saying that the doctor continued to believe that Max was suffocated, yet he did nothing about it, did not go through cps or other channels or fight for Max. That is a much larger insult to a doctors integrity.

Please don't misrepresent my posts. I didn't say the doctor did nothing about his suspicion of suffocation. The search warrant makes it clear LE spoke to the doctor.

JMO

 

[SunnieRN]

Meaning it would explain why he didn't die of a brain bleed like most head injury victims?

If he were suffocated prior to being propelled from the second floor to the floor below, it would explain why he couldn't use his hands to stop his fall and face planted.

That poor little boy. I hate to think of what his final moments inside that house were like.

So, just so there is no misunderstanding, you are saying that Max WAS suffocated. Who did this to Max? How did he get over the balcony, which caused his face plant? How did the chandelier end up on the floor next to him?

My take. Max was NOT suffocated, as the injuries from the fall could cause his heart to stop. I am amazed that ems got his heart restarted. I do, however, believe that the anger that Dina and Jonah felt about the accident was pivotal in Rebecca's death.

 

[MyBelle]

I would like to believe that too and imo I still feel Rebecca's death was most likely a suicide. BUT now more than ever I hope that BOTH cases are reopened. BOTH. There has always been something that has made me extremely uncomfortable about Max's death fall and there just happened to be no eye witnesses. That has bothered me for sometime and I really don't know why exactly, but with Rebecca in one bathroom and her sister supposedly in another bathroom at the very same time gives me pause.

BUT if Rebecca did not commit suicide but was killed then if something untoward was done to Max and it wasnt an accident at all that could change everything. Also if one of the doctors at the hospital told the family they thought Max had been smothered before being thrown off of the banister then I would certainly find the homicide of Rebecca more plausable than I do at the present time.

IMO

I think the suffocation theory makes suicide more plausible because far more people commit suicide to avoid going to jail vs. parents killing the presumed killer of their child before the killer is even arrested.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Just curious: If it turns out that RZ did smother MS, why would you find it more likely that she died from homicide rather than suicide? Wouldn't the guilt of killing a child be a driving factor for suicide? Or the fear of being found out and going to prison?

ITA. Just posted something similar in fact.

 

[coastal]

So, just so there is no misunderstanding, you are saying that Max WAS suffocated. Who did this to Max? How did he get over the balcony, which caused his face plant? How did the chandelier end up on the floor next to him?

My take. Max was NOT suffocated, as the injuries from the fall could cause his heart to stop. I am amazed that ems got his heart restarted. I do, however, believe that the anger that Dina and Jonah felt about the accident was pivotal in Rebecca's death.

What she said.

 

[SunnieRN]

Please don't misrepresent my posts. I didn't say the doctor did nothing about his suspicion of suffocation. The search warrant makes it clear LE spoke to the doctor.

JMO

I did not misrepresent your post. I gave my opinion on the situation, as compared to what physician I work and have worked with, do, to protect the children in their care. If you will be kind enough tolook at my signature line, it does say that all posts are imo.

 

[jjenny]

I think the suffocation theory makes suicide more plausible because far more people commit suicide to avoid going to jail vs. parents killing the presumed killer of their child before the killer is even arrested.

JMO

Only she wasn't going to go to jail, considering the autopsy declared the death to be a tragic accident caused initially by damage to the spinal cord. Not suffocation!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

http://www.10news.com/news/29268087/detail.html

Wow so he was the head honcho of the ICU at Rady's.

Among the information presented is a potential factor in the death of Max Shacknai suggested by Dr. Brad Peterson, the head of the Intensive Care Unit at Rady Children's Hospital, that hadn't been made public previously.

 

[jjenny]

Wow so he was the head honcho of the ICU at Rady's.

Among the information presented is a potential factor in the death of Max Shacknai suggested by Dr. Brad Peterson, the head of the Intensive Care Unit at Rady Children's Hospital, that hadn't been made public previously.

Whatever he was head honcho or not, I do not believe he was aware of the spinal cord damage. Cardiac arrest and brain swelling are completely consistent with spinal cord damage, which is what autopsy concluded. There was not a single bone broken in Max's neck which is what one might expect if this was a case of strangulation.

 

[CDS22]

Wow so he was the head honcho of the ICU at Rady's.

Among the information presented is a potential factor in the death of Max Shacknai suggested by Dr. Brad Peterson, the head of the Intensive Care Unit at Rady Children's Hospital, that hadn't been made public previously.

Yes. Pretty significant guy with pretty significant information. I wonder if the police approached RZ for another interview after the doctor told them his suspicions. I wish there was more information about the timeline to all of this.

 

[CDS22]

Whatever he was head honcho or not, I do not believe he was aware of the spinal cord damage. Cardiac arrest and brain swelling are completely consistent with spinal cord damage, which is what autopsy concluded. There was not a single bone broken in Max's neck which is what one might expect if this was a case of strangulation.

The doctor suspected suffocation, not strangulation.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think the suffocation theory makes suicide more plausible because far more people commit suicide to avoid going to jail vs. parents killing the presumed killer of their child before the killer is even arrested.

JMO

Who knows........I am getting very creeped out now by the head Doctor's belief concerning Max.

If it was just a spur of the moment thing then she could have regretted it afterward I suppose and that resulted in the suicide.

I just read the AG is not going to investigate the cases but I sure wish they had.:banghead:

IMO

 

[jjenny]

The doctor suspected suffocation, not strangulation.

Not a cause of death according to the autopsy.

 

[MyBelle]

Wow so he was the head honcho of the ICU at Rady's.

Among the information presented is a potential factor in the death of Max Shacknai suggested by Dr. Brad Peterson, the head of the Intensive Care Unit at Rady Children's Hospital, that hadn't been made public previously.

Exactly. And he suspected suffocation and cops got a search warrant. That's huge.

JMO

 

[CDS22]

Not a cause of death according to the autopsy.

My point is that you used the word strangulation when the doctor used the word suffocation. They are two different things.

 

[jjenny]

Exactly. And he suspected suffocation and cops got a search warrant. That's huge.

JMO

They got a search warrant, removed items-and then after the autopsy declared this to be a tragic accident. His death was not caused by suffocation, it was due to spinal cord contusion sustained in the tragic accident.
Whatever the doctor believed initially was not proven in the autopsy.