Does Skyline school bear any responsibility?

[Donjeta]

If TH had had to sign Kyron out of school, he would not be missing. There aren't many people who plan to make a child disappear who are dumb enough to do that -- so I think that, if TH is involved, she is not that dumb.

I'm not sure I agree. IMO he could be missing anyway, it would just have been planned differently, if it was a crime planned by TH. He'd have gone missing from their driveway at home or something. And if it wasn't planned and he got beaten in a rage outburst or something it could and has happened children who were signed out of school according to all procedures.

 

[Morag]

The buses used to park there until there was an accident with a parked car, so they changed things so that the buses park in the back. I'll look for the link.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who remembers this! But I thought that the net result of the accident was to forbid cars parking in the rear of the school- that's where the accident happened. I think the buses still turn around there, but there are no cars allowed, and the buses still park alongside the east side (where the portico entrance is).

 

[Billylee]

Kyron couldn't be signed "out" because he was never signed "in". It's been reported that attendance was not taken until 10:00 a.m.
So basically, ANY CHILD in that school that morning who was left by there by their parent or just got there by bus, was unaccounted for until 10:00 a.m. No matter if their parent dropped them off at 8:00 or 9:00 or whenever. For the school's liability sake, I hope a letter went out to all the parents saying something to that regard. Anyway, this is one reason, that I've said since the beginning, even if it was not TH who is responsible for Kyron's disappearance, I think it was definitely someone who was familiar with the happenings (e.g., attendance not being taken normally) of that school.

 

[Charlie09]

Kyron couldn't be signed "out" because he was never signed "in". It's been reported that attendance was not taken until 10:00 a.m.
So basically, ANY CHILD in that school that morning who was left by there by their parent or just got there by bus, was unaccounted for until 10:00 a.m. No matter if their parent dropped them off at 8:00 or 9:00 or whenever. For the school's liability sake, I hope a letter went out to all the parents saying something to that regard. Anyway, this is one reason, that I've said since the beginning, even if it was not TH who is responsible for Kyron's disappearance, I think it was definitely someone who was familiar with the happenings (e.g., attendance not being taken normally) of that school.

Do you have proof that he wasn't signed out? This is a huge sticking point for me.
If someone did sign him out, they would not have known when attendance was going to occur that day - and might have thought it was at the normal time - so that sign out sheet if it exists would be pretty telling ....

 

[Charlie09]

If TH had had to sign Kyron out of school, he would not be missing. There aren't many people who plan to make a child disappear who are dumb enough to do that -- so I think that, if TH is involved, she is not that dumb.

why do you think she's not that dumb?

 

[Billylee]

Do you have proof that he wasn't signed out? This is a huge sticking point for me.
If someone did sign him out, they would not have known when attendance was going to occur that day - and might have thought it was at the normal time - so that sign out sheet if it exists would be pretty telling ....

Not sure I follow, attendance was not taken until 10:00 a.m. that day, so if someone were to have signed him "out" it would have to have been AFTER 10:00 a.m. No one saw Kyron after 9:00 a.m.

 

[Aedrys]

why do you think she's not that dumb?

She was smart enough to hire Houze, and Kyron is still missing. You have to have some smarts to get a Master's Degree - it is NOT easy. She managed to have a separate daytime life with friends Kaine had never met or only met once or twice. She was better than the current teacher according to her, a great wife and mother. She also watched forensics shows and her best buddy has a father who is a former cop. She was able to ask a landscaper to kill Kaine, wait, just kidding, and he never knew about it until LE told him SIX or months after the fact. What about all of this makes her too dumb to do it? I don't see one thing that says she was too dumb to do this. Everything I've seen says she is more than smart enough to pull this off. The dumb card does not compute with me.

And getting back on topic, she is more than smart enough to try to pin this on the school and some perp at large. Unfortunately, the only way she isn't smart enough to do is get away with it! We wouldn't be talking about the school's responsibility at all if she wasn't smart enough to try and pin it on them.

 

[Charlie09]

Not sure I follow, attendance was not taken until 10:00 a.m. that day, so if someone were to have signed him "out" it would have to have been AFTER 10:00 a.m. No one saw Kyron after 9:00 a.m.

I see where we are not talking about the exact same thing.
I believe you can sign a child out from school, but not from class. (Office sign out at the office)

Let's just say in theory - she signed him out before even going to the exhibits - she had no way of knowing that the class wouldn't have actually taken their attendance at 10, and she wouldn't have had to sign him out.

 

[Charlie09]

She was smart enough to hire Houze, and Kyron is still missing. You have to have some smarts to get a Master's Degree - it is NOT easy. She managed to have a separate daytime life with friends Kaine had never met or only met once or twice. She was better than the current teacher according to her, a great wife and mother. She also watched forensics shows and her best buddy has a father who is a former cop. She was able to ask a landscaper to kill Kaine, wait, just kidding, and he never knew about it until LE told him SIX or months after the fact. What about all of this makes her too dumb to do it? I don't see one thing that says she was too dumb to do this. Everything I've seen says she is more than smart enough to pull this off. The dumb card does not compute with me.

And getting back on topic, she is more than smart enough to try to pin this on the school and some perp at large. Unfortunately, the only way she isn't smart enough to do is get away with it! We wouldn't be talking about the school's responsibility at all if she wasn't smart enough to try and pin it on them.

We can agree to disagree - I've interviewed way too many people with master's. and hiring an attorney with a great reputation is as easy as googling and coming up with money.

Even when defending her, I just didn't see how she was smart enough to pull it off alone.

 

[Morag]

Here's a story about an automated calling system in Ohio.

http://tinyurl.com/35h6pmx

Those automated phone notifications can be a great way for schools to convey information to parents -- until they aren't.
Parents at a Reynoldsburgh, Ohio middle school found that out the hard way. A staff member learning how the system worked mistakenly sent a message to the parents of all the school's fifth and sixth graders, alerting them that their children were not in school, the Columbus Dispatch reports.

 

[mmmagique]

FR:

why do you think she's not that dumb?

I LOVE this question.
This happens SO often in criminal cases.
Quite often the accused say "If I were to do something like (insert criminal act here) do you really think I'd be dumb enough to (insert dumb act here)?"

My answer, nine times out of ten (or more) is "yep...I do."

 

[Kat010]

We can agree to disagree - I've interviewed way too many people with master's. and hiring an attorney with a great reputation is as easy as googling and coming up with money.

Even when defending her, I just didn't see how she was smart enough to pull it off alone.

Just had to tell you that I grinned when I read the BBM part. I've interviewed some master's folks, and sailed their resumes into the round file ASAP. Having a master's doesn't equate to smarts, let alone real world smarts. And it also depends on what type of master's. The easiest to get, that requires the least intellectual stuff? Education. That was widely known in my college days. Around here, there are multi-millionaires running around in beat-up boots, old farm trucks, and without degrees, and ya can't tell 'em when 'ya see 'em.

So the fact TH got an education master's doesn't signal "super smart" to me. But I don't think that "degree smart" would give anyone any advantage in planning a complicated crime. Or any crime, actually.

Me, I like common sense. In the long run, that's what creates achievement along with stick-to-it-ness and honesty. JMO

Interestingly enough, a lot of very very fine cops with great success rates don't have college degrees, not even a B.A. So when it comes to crime, I'm not resume-hunting. I just want someone who can find Kyron, and I don't care what bits of paper they have hanging on their walls.

 

[Charlie09]

Just had to tell you that I grinned when I read the BBM part. I've interviewed some master's folks, and sailed their resumes into the round file ASAP. Having a master's doesn't equate to smarts, let alone real world smarts. And it also depends on what type of master's. The easiest to get, that requires the least intellectual stuff? Education. That was widely known in my college days. Around here, there are multi-millionaires running around in beat-up boots, old farm trucks, and without degrees, and ya can't tell 'em when 'ya see 'em.

So the fact TH got an education master's doesn't signal "super smart" to me. But I don't think that "degree smart" would give anyone any advantage in planning a complicated crime. Or any crime, actually.

Me, I like common sense. In the long run, that's what creates achievement along with stick-to-it-ness and honesty. JMO

Interestingly enough, a lot of very very fine cops with great success rates don't have college degrees, not even a B.A. So when it comes to crime, I'm not resume-hunting. I just want someone who can find Kyron, and I don't care what bits of paper they have hanging on their walls.

I'm not totally sure my dad had a high school degree, know for certain there was not a college degree. No one had more common sense, or could figure out what was really going on quicker than he could. Wish he was still around for input on this one....

Agree, the whole point should be finding him or knowing what did happen.

 

[Donjeta]

It seems that the intelligence argument is used in both directions anyway. Sometimes she's too intelligent to carry out such a dumb plan and sometimes she's too impaired to carry out such a brilliant plan, take your pick.

 

[Aedrys]

She had the smarts to determine that a landscaper might do something like murder for her. I wouldn't know how to find such a person nor determine if they were the type to do something like murder for me. It seems like she has street smarts as well as book smarts here. The fact that she got a group of friends to get batphones and possibly pulled in more than one person to help her means she can read people well and knows how to manipulate them.

And as someone who has a Master's Degree, I beg to differ that anyone can get one or that people that have them aren't that intelligent. I worked dang hard for my degree and I am proud of that. Now Terri does have way more street smarts than I do, so I think that makes her more than smart enough to think she could pull this off and completely get away with it, leaving the school responsible and sued, and her the sympathetic stepmother reaping monetary rewards. It doesn't sound that far fetched to me.

It's just that most people, even if they dream about it, don't actually follow through on committing crimes. Terri did, IMO. And now she's reaping consequences instead of money.

As for the school, I feel badly for them as until we know what exactly happened to Kyron, a lot of responsibility does lay on them for not reporting him absent to his parents a lot sooner. I hate the thought that Terri twisted this to make the school look like the guilty party. That's just sick to target an entire school.

 

[mimimama5]

I think the issue in this case is apparently TH told the teacher she would be taking Kyron *before* the start of school. As far as the teacher knew, he was in the care of his parent and left with her prior to the beginning of the school day. Since he was not ever given over into the care and responsibility of the school that day, there would be no need for signing him out of school. And there would be no need to call home to report his absence, since he was known to be with his parent. (This is all based on the assumption that TH did, indeed, tell the teacher they would be going to the doctor's appt., which of course is not known for certain at this point, though it has been reported.)

Otherwise, I totally agree with you that trying to call a parent much earlier in the day would have made it easier to find out what happened to Kyron.

All JMO.

It is my understanding that Skyline had a policy in place that required a written note to take a child out to a doctors appointment...is that correct?:waitasec: If that is the policy, then a verbal, across the room situation should not have been enough to release Kyron to TH. JMO

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Just had to tell you that I grinned when I read the BBM part. I've interviewed some master's folks, and sailed their resumes into the round file ASAP. Having a master's doesn't equate to smarts, let alone real world smarts. And it also depends on what type of master's. The easiest to get, that requires the least intellectual stuff? Education. That was widely known in my college days. Around here, there are multi-millionaires running around in beat-up boots, old farm trucks, and without degrees, and ya can't tell 'em when 'ya see 'em.

Respectfully edited. Re: BBM. I won't necessarily agree with the "easy" part, but I will say that graduate education degrees may seem that way because many "students" are teaching during the day and going to school at night or during the summer. I can't speak to requirements in other states, but in Michigan, educators in public schools who want permanent certification, opportunities for advancement, higher pay scale, etc. need to have a certain number of graduate hours to qualify. Most will end up getting a Master's or Specialist's degree while they're full-time teachers. jmo

 

[Charlie09]

She had the smarts to determine that a landscaper might do something like murder for her. I wouldn't know how to find such a person nor determine if they were the type to do something like murder for me. It seems like she has street smarts as well as book smarts here. The fact that she got a group of friends to get batphones and possibly pulled in more than one person to help her means she can read people well and knows how to manipulate them.

And as someone who has a Master's Degree, I beg to differ that anyone can get one or that people that have them aren't that intelligent. I worked dang hard for my degree and I am proud of that. Now Terri does have way more street smarts than I do, so I think that makes her more than smart enough to think she could pull this off and completely get away with it, leaving the school responsible and sued, and her the sympathetic stepmother reaping monetary rewards. It doesn't sound that far fetched to me.

It's just that most people, even if they dream about it, don't actually follow through on committing crimes. Terri did, IMO. And now she's reaping consequences instead of money.

As for the school, I feel badly for them as until we know what exactly happened to Kyron, a lot of responsibility does lay on them for not reporting him absent to his parents a lot sooner. I hate the thought that Terri twisted this to make the school look like the guilty party. That's just sick to target an entire school.

Nothing personal was meant by my comments, and I'm sure Kat's response to anyone on this forum (unless Terri is lurking...then you can take it personally that I don't think you're all that smart!) in all probability the people that we've interviewed were not in their chosen careers for a reason.

I really think where she may have tripped up is with the school. I don't think that at the end of the day, she'll be able to manipulate what happened there, like she did with what I consider to be the cover up with friends.

And until we know for sure what happened, and what may or may not have occurred as far as sign out sheets etc - I'm not sure the school does bear any responsibility.

 

[RubyRed]

As students return to school from summer vacation, a desk will be waiting for Kyron, says Matt Shelby, spokesman for the Portland School District.

"He's enrolled as a student. There's a spot there waiting for him," says Shelby, who adds that school policy states that a child is withdrawn from school after missing 10 consecutive days. "The school is ready for Kyron and we all hope he shows up."

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20419502,00.html

 

[BeanE]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who remembers this! But I thought that the net result of the accident was to forbid cars parking in the rear of the school- that's where the accident happened. I think the buses still turn around there, but there are no cars allowed, and the buses still park alongside the east side (where the portico entrance is).

A local confirmed in a post that the buses on June 4 parked along the east side of the school, with the students entering/exiting through the portico door.

God knows where the post is. Maybe this can be re-asked for confirmation in the locals thread.

ETA: I posted the question in the locals thread.