Elisa Lam - What Happened?

[findinganatta]

It just occurred to me that the announcement made on Monday said the tox results would be made public "this week," which would seem to imply they'll be released by tomorrow.

http://english.sina.com/world/p/2013/0514/590677.html

 

[Newton]

If I remember correctly from her blog, she posted a picture of her meds and listed them, and there was more than just Adderall, SSRI, and sleeping meds. I'm pretty sure she also had an anti-psychotic in there, although it may have been the low-dose kind that are now being marketed as an SSRI supplement for depressed people.

Medication and link:
http://nouvelle-nouveau.tumblr.com/post/22304102762/more-its-still-odd-to-me-that-people-are-so
225mg Effexor
300mg Wellbutrin XL
100mg Lamotrigine
10 mg Dexedrine Spansule

 

[Newton]

She blogged about going out to some nightclubs/"speakeasy" in California. That was where the whole 'Italian and Mexican' thing came from, because she was getting hit on by guys. Whether or not she went when she was in L.A. I don't remember exactly, because again, I have not gone back and looked at her blog in a couple of months because it takes so long to load and find things (maybe I'm just clueless with Tumblr).

But she definitely would have been in some environments where she likely would have had the opportunity to get drugs, or might have been offered them. Hell, even on the street in downtown L.A. she could have been offered something like ecstasy, but I would think it would more likely have happened in some type of club, if she did ever procure any drugs.

Jan 27
"The Speakeasy WAS AWESOME except I lost a cellphone SIGH"

 

[findinganatta]

Medication and link:
http://nouvelle-nouveau.tumblr.com/post/22304102762/more-its-still-odd-to-me-that-people-are-so
225mg Effexor
300mg Wellbutrin XL
100mg Lamotrigine
10 mg Dexedrine Spansule

Thanks.

The lamotrigine was the one I was trying to think of... it's a mood stabilizer for bipolar disorder. Not something given to a typical depressed person, as far as I can tell. I believe psychiatrists will combine that with antidepressants in order to manage the manic aspect of things, because antidepressants alone can cause a bipolar person to become manic.

One possibility (that some people have kind of mentioned) is that she ran out of or quit taking one or more of these meds, and was suffering the effects of that--like the side effects of the other meds that were being mitigated by whichever one she may have stopped taking. Just an idea... psych meds (especially multiple ones) get pretty wonky and can create weird side effects.

 

[LittleWing]

So what's up with the glasses thing guys? I can't find anything about her not having had them with her so not sure why some people are claiming this? Elisa's sister Sarah's twitter mentions "no glasses." In reference to a photo of Elisa not wearing them, probably to give an example of what she looks like without. If you have evidence she did not have them then kindly link to you source.


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[Newton]

Thanks.

The lamotrigine was the one I was trying to think of... it's a mood stabilizer for bipolar disorder. Not something given to a typical depressed person, as far as I can tell. I believe psychiatrists will combine that with antidepressants in order to manage the manic aspect of things, because antidepressants alone can cause a bipolar person to become manic.

One possibility (that some people have kind of mentioned) is that she ran out of or quit taking one or more of these meds, and was suffering the effects of that--like the side effects of the other meds that were being mitigated by whichever one she may have stopped taking. Just an idea... psych meds (especially multiple ones) get pretty wonky and can create weird side effects.

You're welcome.

Looks like the dosage of Wellbutrin is on par for what is prescribed to treat Major Depressive Disorder. Add to that a moderate dose of another antidepressant and an rx for Bipolar Disorder and I think it is a safe assumption that LAPD was either unaware of the extent of her mental health issues or (more likely) they were down-playing it to the media.

If she did decided to have a cocktail at the bar, I wonder how that would mix with all of those medicines. Adderall doesn't stay in the system very long but I think the others do, correct?

 

[Conductor71]

It just occurred to me that the announcement made on Monday said the tox results would be made public "this week," which would seem to imply they'll be released by tomorrow.

http://english.sina.com/world/p/2013/0514/590677.html

That would be great, but I am not holding my breath. I have been lightly following Chinese news sources and since early May they have all either reviewed the case or reiterated in some way that in speaking with the coroner, results are imminent, but they had no further comment otherwise. One added how the initial autopsy was complete pending toxicological report, but that is essentially protocol, in other words, stating the obvious as "news". Prior to this new snip dated 5/15 there were a few clips circulating saying results would be released week of May 7th, and here we are....sooo frustrating. I feel like a whiny kid on a road trip "are we there yet?"

 

[findinganatta]

You're welcome.

Looks like the dosage of Wellbutrin is on par for what is prescribed to treat Major Depressive Disorder. Add to that a moderate dose of another antidepressant and an rx for Bipolar Disorder and I think it is a safe assumption that LAPD was either unaware of the extent of her mental health issues or (more likely) they were down-playing it to the media.

If she did decided to have a cocktail at the bar, I wonder how that would mix with all of those medicines. Adderall doesn't stay in the system very long but I think the others do, correct?

I can only answer for the two antidepressants... you are not supposed to drink with them because it can reduce their effectiveness, but it is uncommon for any immediate averse side effects to result from most antidepressants and alcohol.

The other drug is a mood stabilizer, and I have never understood how they combine with alcohol, however I suspect they wouldn't create any major immediate issues.

I agree about the police. I doubt their announcement about her psych issues are comprehensive. My guess is that they only announced the depression thing as a roundabout way of indicating that they suspected possible suicide. Seems like that is usually what they mean when they associate "depression" with missing people, but they don't want to come out and say it yet out of respect for a family that doesn't want to hear that. I'm not saying that I think it was intentional suicide, though.

 

[findinganatta]

That would be great, but I am not holding my breath. I have been lightly following Chinese news sources and since early May they have all either reviewed the case or reiterated in some way that in speaking with the coroner, results are imminent, but they had no further comment otherwise. One added how the initial autopsy was complete pending toxicological report, but that is essentially protocol, in other words, stating the obvious as "news". Prior to this new snip dated 5/15 there were a few clips circulating saying results would be released week of May 7th, and here we are....sooo frustrating. I feel like a whiny kid on a road trip "are we there yet?"

Yeah, I check every day. It's ridiculous. This announcement did seem quite official, but I'm not crossing my fingers either.

 

[Conductor71]

I have left the video behind in this as it feels rather picked over at this point in regard to her recorded movements and gestures. I find other things beyond that kind of interesting that may still be relevant.

Why does she not have a key card to her room? Maybe her shorts had a pocket, but I find it odd that she did not have it in her hand. Safety 101 for women traveling alone is never have to fumble for your keys. I have traveled extensively on my own usually to big cities in the states and Europe; I never left my room to get ice or use washroom; when I arrived back at my hotel or my apt without my key ready before I entered a building.

Why would she go to Santa Cruz in the first place? At first, I thought it silly that this garnered so much attention in the press, but in looking at bus/rail travel it seems much more likely there was planned intent and thought at work. There is no direct route between San Diego or LA and Santa Cruz. The trip involves both bus and train lasting at least 8 hours given time tables. Why wouldn't she just go to San Francisco which is only 1 more hour of travel. This is unusual for a first time to visit to CA, IMO.

I also find it strange that her time in San Diego is not included in this investigation. It is as if she has been invisible this entire trip save for shopping in a book store. People are putting so much emphasis on her bookstore behavior; why then was she not noticed any where else? Just seems odd to me that her San Diego trip is not essential given that LE seems to have little else to go on?

Why would the LAPD reveal to the press that they had evidence that EL was in danger or may have been harmed at the time she was officially missing on February 6th (via CBC correspondent-video no longer accessible)? If they meant self harm due to mental state or prescription drugs, wouldn't it be professionally negligent to under play her mental health. No diagnosis needed to be revealed. Simply, adding on that she is vulnerable due to a medical or mental health condition would have sufficed.

Just further conjecture that leads nowhere given circumstances...sigh. Just thought some of you may have some insights on this stuff or maybe I have just over-emphasized given what little info we have.

 

[LittleWing]

I feel like a whiny kid on a road trip "are we there yet?"

Snip

Worse than that I'm afraid with each day that passes I think that we all fear more and more that we will never truly know what happened to this girl and that her case will be slipped onto the cold case pile.

Why does she not have a key card to her room?

I suppose it's possible it was in her pocket or she had a room she shared with others, or maybe she lost it.

Why would she go to Santa Cruz in the first place?

just because no one is really reporting about the other places Elisa visited on her California trip does not mean that the LE aren't on top of it. It seems to me the people she met a long the way are keeping shut for now at least either out of respect or have been asked to by LE.

Why would the LAPD reveal to the press that they had evidence that EL was in danger or may have been harmed at the time she was officially missing on February 6th (via CBC correspondent-video no longer accessible)? If they meant self harm due to mental state or prescription drugs, wouldn't it be professionally negligent to under play her mental health. No diagnosis needed to be revealed. Simply, adding on that she is vulnerable due to a medical or mental health condition would have sufficed.

Maybe they assumed something happened to her considering the location and other particulars (young petite female traveling alone)? Funny how it was most recently reported by Winter that no suspicious clues
Were found...which as someone already mentioned he might've been referring to suspicious clues in the autopsy report. Hard to say with the patchiness of translations.

Just further conjecture that leads nowhere given circumstances...sigh. Just thought some of you may have some insights on this stuff or maybe I have just over-emphasized given what little info we have.

Yeah. We have to be careful not to split hairs too much, as tempting as it is. I do hope we find out more soon. If they don't receive tox results soon I'm going to be so stressed and alarmed. This is just ridiculous at this point. I hope that the Canadian authorities also are conducting their own investigation (they are aren't they?).




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[LittleWing]

Well, it's Friday in LA.....and still no news. I guess they might've meant within a week as in within 7 days of the news report....which was on the 15th. So by the 22nd maybe...?


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[Deleted member 96356]

Why would she go to Santa Cruz in the first place? At first, I thought it silly that this garnered so much attention in the press, but in looking at bus/rail travel it seems much more likely there was planned intent and thought at work. There is no direct route between San Diego or LA and Santa Cruz. The trip involves both bus and train lasting at least 8 hours given time tables. Why wouldn't she just go to San Francisco which is only 1 more hour of travel. This is unusual for a first time to visit to CA, IMO.

Respectfully snipped and bolded by me...

As I recall, she indicated that she was going to Santa Cruz to do some farm work. One of those work/stay deals. Did anyone from any farm program come forward to confirm they were expecting her?

I thought it was weird that she didn't just rent a car to get around CA, but then she seemed kind of sheltered and not travel savvy. (and maybe didn't know how to drive...)

 

[Nickfalzone]

Respectfully snipped and bolded by me...

As I recall, she indicated that she was going to Santa Cruz to do some farm work. One of those work/stay deals. Did anyone from any farm program come forward to confirm they were expecting her?

I thought it was weird that she didn't just rent a car to get around CA, but then she seemed kind of sheltered and not travel savvy. (and maybe didn't know how to drive...)

I think that she was keeping something from her parents re: her travel plans.

 

[findinganatta]

[Trimmed for space ]

Why does she not have a key card to her room?

Those shorts definitely look like they could have pockets. I have some that are vaguely similar, and they do have pockets. And I could easily see her not having the card in her actual hand... I think a lot of travelers, female or male, just wouldn't have automatically thought to do that. Also, people do break their own safety rules a lot.

Why would she go to Santa Cruz in the first place?

I've never really been clear on exactly what details are known about the farm place. If anyone could find them and post a link (or better yet, maybe cut and paste whatever she wrote about it), that would be much appreciated!

I also find it strange that her time in San Diego is not included in this investigation. It is as if she has been invisible this entire trip save for shopping in a book store. People are putting so much emphasis on her bookstore behavior; why then was she not noticed any where else? Just seems odd to me that her San Diego trip is not essential given that LE seems to have little else to go on?

My assumption has always been that the LE have investigated her whole trip, at least whatever extent they could. It just that, as usual, we don't know anything about what they know or are investigating. And who knows if that is good or bad for the investigation.

Why would the LAPD reveal to the press that they had evidence that EL was in danger or may have been harmed at the time she was officially missing on February 6th (via CBC correspondent-video no longer accessible)? If they meant self harm due to mental state or prescription drugs, wouldn't it be professionally negligent to under play her mental health. No diagnosis needed to be revealed. Simply, adding on that she is vulnerable due to a medical or mental health condition would have sufficed.

I never got the impression they were exclusively talking about her harming herself (or that suicide was even their focus, given that they were clearly concerned about foul play). Earlier I posted about them discussing her depression on the news as a way of indicating that she was potentially suicidal, which just seems like a logical way to cover their bases. I think they were just baffled in general, and they wouldn't be held negligent for anything they didn't know about, like any possible psych episodes, med issues, or illegal drug taking. They certainly weren't held negligible for never disclosing what indications they had about foul play. I wonder if it wasn't just the elevator video (which hadn't been released publicly yet).

 

[findinganatta]

Snip

Worse than that I'm afraid with each day that passes I think that we all fear more and more that we will never truly know what happened to this girl and that her case will be slipped onto the cold case pile.

Me too. If they continue to release nothing, I wonder if this forum could affect an email/mail/phone campaign to let the authorities know that people aren't forgetting. Or to the L.A. or Canadian media. Not sure if that would work.

 

[Conductor71]

Me too. If they continue to release nothing, I wonder if this forum could affect an email/mail/phone campaign to let the authorities know that people aren't forgetting. Or to the L.A. or Canadian media. Not sure if that would work.

I assume the LA Times would be on top of this. I emailed one of the reporters on the case and got a response within a few hours I believe legally they must reach a conclusion on the manner of death and undetermined is legit, and I think they must conform to a standard time frame.

The only way it could not be released is when LE is holdings it open for investigation, I think. Regardless, the autopsy, once all reports are completed, becomess public domain, and a copy can be purchased. Further, reporters can file a Freedom of Info Act request.

A good way of checking into whether it is likely that things are complete but not being released is if the crime report section in LA Times starts up again with recording results of death investigations. They left off with deaths from December 2012, so if they start up again with listing toxicology dependent reports post EL's death it will be fairly obvious.

 

[findinganatta]

Snipped

A good way of checking into whether it is likely that things are complete but not being released is if the crime report section in LA Times starts up again with recording results of death investigations. They left off with deaths from December 2012, so if they start up again with listing toxicology dependent reports post EL's death it will be fairly obvious.

Is that kind of like a crime blotter section of the paper, but more of a 'result of investigation' blotter? I live in a big city with a lot of crime, but I'm not familiar with a formalized section like that in our newspaper. Maybe it is just the paper's way of streamlining the follow-up info for the especially large amount of crime in a huge city like LA?

 

[sugarpooper]

Is that something they listed sort of as a formality, like a crime blotter, except it's the 'result of investigation' blotter? I live in a big city with a lot of crime, but I'm not familiar with a formalized section like that in our newspaper. Maybe it is just the paper's way of streamlining the follow-up info for the especially large amount of crime in a huge city like LA?

I'm curious, Finding do you live in Los Angeles? Ever been here? Ever been to DTLA?

 

[Conductor71]

I think that she was keeping something from her parents re: her travel plans.

Actually, her parents footed the bill according to her Tumblr, so they knew what was up.