GUILTY FL - Dan Markel, 41, FSU law professor, Tallahassee, 18 July 2014 - #3 *Arrests*

[dotr]

Sorry dotr. The page won't come up. And here I thought it was going to be a recording of Barbara Streisand.

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The link, Barbra Streisand, and hopefully the accused, sing.

 

[Razz]

The link, Barbra Streisand, and hopefully the accused, sing.

Actually, I meant, "People, people who need people, are the luckiest people" blah, blah

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[Paulas88]

NG covering this case tonight.

 

[SeesSeas]

NG covering this case tonight.

On NG now... http://tunein.com/radio/Nancy-Grace-p59185/

 

[dotr]

On NG now... http://tunein.com/radio/Nancy-Grace-p59185/

The segment ended just when it started to get heated up, hope they do a followup soon.
imo.

 

[dotr]

Unrelated to DM, but sad news..

http://www.wsj.com/articles/darlene...entified-as-london-stabbing-victim-1470354105

London Stabbing Victim Identified as Darlene Horton of Tallahassee, Fla.
Husband was teaching at Florida State University’s study-abroad summer program

 

[wildebeest]

People, people who need PEOPLE..
http://www.people.com/article/ex-wifes-family-refutes-alleged-ties-florida-professors-murder

The A's are in a serious state of denial. :jail:

IMHO

 

[miamiheat]

Following up on this story:
http://www.wctv.tv/content/news/Gra...to-review-Markel-case-evidence-384831441.html
Does anyone know if the grand jury proceedings will go forward as scheduled in August? Has any news been released?

 

[86Violet]

I hope the grand jury is still meeting. I know the proceedings are closed to press and public but I feel like last time they at lest reported that they were meeting...

 

[nancydrew71]

I hope the grand jury is still meeting. I know the proceedings are closed to press and public but I feel like last time they at lest reported that they were meeting...

Why would they not be meeting? Not enough evidence? Sorry, I don't understand the legality of all of this.

 

[86Violet]

A source confirmed they are not meeting right now.

Nancydrew71, no it doesn't mean they don't have enough evidence, just that the proceedings were continued for any of a variety of reasons. I'm hoping Rivera and his attorney are doing some plea negotiations and they are going to try to have Rivera testify at the next grand jury proceeding. That would make sense of the attorney's comment, "there is a lot of stuff going on right now that I'm not at liberty to discuss" at the last hearing.

 

[nancydrew71]

A source confirmed they are not meeting right now.

Nancydrew71, no it doesn't mean they don't have enough evidence, just that the proceedings were continued for any of a variety of reasons. I'm hoping Rivera and his attorney are doing some plea negotiations and they are going to try to have Rivera testify at the next grand jury proceeding. That would make sense of the attorney's comment, "there is a lot of stuff going on right now that I'm not at liberty to discuss" at the last hearing.

Thanks! That last sentence is revealing.

 

[Razz]

A source confirmed they are not meeting right now.

Nancydrew71, no it doesn't mean they don't have enough evidence, just that the proceedings were continued for any of a variety of reasons. I'm hoping Rivera and his attorney are doing some plea negotiations and they are going to try to have Rivera testify at the next grand jury proceeding. That would make sense of the attorney's comment, "there is a lot of stuff going on right now that I'm not at liberty to discuss" at the last hearing.

So....Garcia should be very uncomfortable about now. If he doesn't sing soon, he may have no bargaining power later. And I doubt KM will sing unless Garcia says it's ok.

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[notwhatitseems]

So....Garcia should be very uncomfortable about now. If he doesn't sing soon, he may have no bargaining power later. And I doubt KM will sing unless Garcia says it's ok.

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Why would either of those in custody want to cooperate with prosecutors? If Garcia does, it will harm KM, who has not yet been charged with anything. I am not sure why Rivera would either. Even if they do, it is not clear that their testimony would be credible before a jury, unless there is any evidence that traces one of the Adelson's to a transaction to hire a hitman. I predict that none of the Adelsons will be charged, unless evidence that connects them to a transaction to hire one of the suspects in custody is identified. And without that evidence or a gun that ties them to the scene of the murder, Garcia and Rivera would both be better off rolling the dice and going to trial, as a prosecutor is going to have a hard time proving murder beyond a reasonable doubt against either one of theme.

I would also point out that there is an equally plausible story here that support the Adelson's story of no involvement. Suppose that Garcia knew that Charlie A. hated Dan, know of the nasty divorce proceedings, and also knew that the Adelson family was wealthy and willing to go to lengths to keep their children on a pedestal. Did Garcia murder Dan in hopes that he or KM could extort one or more of the Adelsons? Did this happen? I don't know because I haven't seen any evidence of it. But it seems equally probable that this would happen, as we haven't seen any evidence that the Adelson's hired Garcia and Rivera either. Without such evidence the prosecutors would have a very difficult time establishing guilt beyond a reasonable doubt against any of the Adelsons.

Without additional evidence this is not going to be an easy case for the prosecutors to win against Garcia or Rivera -- and it certainly would be a loser against any of the Adelsons.

 

[dotr]

Why would either of those in custody want to cooperate with prosecutors? If Garcia does, it will harm KM, who has not yet been charged with anything. I am not sure why Rivera would either. Even if they do, it is not clear that their testimony would be credible before a jury, unless there is any evidence that traces one of the Adelson's to a transaction to hire a hitman. I predict that none of the Adelsons will be charged, unless evidence that connects them to a transaction to hire one of the suspects in custody is identified. And without that evidence or a gun that ties them to the scene of the murder, Garcia and Rivera would both be better off rolling the dice and going to trial, as a prosecutor is going to have a hard time proving murder beyond a reasonable doubt against either one of theme.

I would also point out that there is an equally plausible story here that support the Adelson's story of no involvement. Suppose that Garcia knew that Charlie A. hated Dan, know of the nasty divorce proceedings, and also knew that the Adelson family was wealthy and willing to go to lengths to keep their children on a pedestal. Did Garcia murder Dan in hopes that he or KM could extort one or more of the Adelsons? Did this happen? I don't know because I haven't seen any evidence of it. But it seems equally probable that this would happen, as we haven't seen any evidence that the Adelson's hired Garcia and Rivera either. Without such evidence the prosecutors would have a very difficult time establishing guilt beyond a reasonable doubt against any of the Adelsons.

Without additional evidence this is not going to be an easy case for the prosecutors to win against Garcia or Rivera -- and it certainly would be a loser against any of the Adelsons.

Did Daniel Markel know too much about something?
Thinking of the arrest of L Rivera and other gang members on racketeering charges, also wondering why he and SG would ( allegedly ) commit a murder, together?
imo speculation.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-America-s-fearsome-gangs-indicted-Miami.html
May 14 2015

Downfall of the Latin Kings: Feds celebrate as 23 members of one of America's most fearsome gangs are indicted in Miami

A federal grand jury has indicted 29 people in Miami, including 23 members of one of the largest and most well-organized criminal gangs in the U.S.
Members of the Latin Kings have been charged with offences including racketeering, drug distribution, murder, fraud, robbery and kidnapping
Among those taken down were Christopher Isabel, also known as King Nano, 33, who was the second in command in Florida
All of them face lengthy prison sentences if convicted
Investigators have referred to the arrests as a resounding takedown of the Latin Kings gang leadership

 

[BSBC]

Why would either of those in custody want to cooperate with prosecutors? If Garcia does, it will harm KM, who has not yet been charged with anything. I am not sure why Rivera would either. Even if they do, it is not clear that their testimony would be credible before a jury, unless there is any evidence that traces one of the Adelson's to a transaction to hire a hitman. I predict that none of the Adelsons will be charged, unless evidence that connects them to a transaction to hire one of the suspects in custody is identified. And without that evidence or a gun that ties them to the scene of the murder, Garcia and Rivera would both be better off rolling the dice and going to trial, as a prosecutor is going to have a hard time proving murder beyond a reasonable doubt against either one of theme.

I would also point out that there is an equally plausible story here that support the Adelson's story of no involvement. Suppose that Garcia knew that Charlie A. hated Dan, know of the nasty divorce proceedings, and also knew that the Adelson family was wealthy and willing to go to lengths to keep their children on a pedestal. Did Garcia murder Dan in hopes that he or KM could extort one or more of the Adelsons? Did this happen? I don't know because I haven't seen any evidence of it. But it seems equally probable that this would happen, as we haven't seen any evidence that the Adelson's hired Garcia and Rivera either. Without such evidence the prosecutors would have a very difficult time establishing guilt beyond a reasonable doubt against any of the Adelsons.

Without additional evidence this is not going to be an easy case for the prosecutors to win against Garcia or Rivera -- and it certainly would be a loser against any of the Adelsons.

"Why would either of those in custody want to cooperate with prosecutors?" Simple: to avoid execution. Self-preservation is a pretty strong motivator. I agree that the publicly released evidence may not, by itself, be enough to guarantee Garcia's and Rivera's convictions, but I believe there is more that hasn't yet been revealed. And let's get real about the dynamics of a potential trial. Do two tough-looking Hispanic guys from Miami really want to face a jury in Tallahassee, which is really a small, conservative, Southern city that is a lot closer culturally to Alabama than to South Florida?

I find the extortion theory highly implausible. How exactly was this supposed to work? Garcia and Rivera, without the As' knowledge, drive 500 miles to Tallahassee and kill DM -- and when they get home, they go to the As and tell them that they must pay them $$? Or else what -- Garcia and Rivera would go to the cops and pin the murder on the As? How were they supposed to do that without themselves confessing to capital murder? And how would Garcia and Rivera convince the cops of this story without any corroborating evidence of the As' involvement (which wouldn't exist, because the story would be false)?

Occam's Razor, folks -- the simplest explanation is usually the most likely. Or, as medical students are taught, "When you hear hoofbeats, think of horses not zebras."

 

[Razz]

Why would either of those in custody want to cooperate with prosecutors? If Garcia does, it will harm KM, who has not yet been charged with anything. I am not sure why Rivera would either. Even if they do, it is not clear that their testimony would be credible before a jury, unless there is any evidence that traces one of the Adelson's to a transaction to hire a hitman. I predict that none of the Adelsons will be charged, unless evidence that connects them to a transaction to hire one of the suspects in custody is identified. And without that evidence or a gun that ties them to the scene of the murder, Garcia and Rivera would both be better off rolling the dice and going to trial, as a prosecutor is going to have a hard time proving murder beyond a reasonable doubt against either one of theme.

I would also point out that there is an equally plausible story here that support the Adelson's story of no involvement. Suppose that Garcia knew that Charlie A. hated Dan, know of the nasty divorce proceedings, and also knew that the Adelson family was wealthy and willing to go to lengths to keep their children on a pedestal. Did Garcia murder Dan in hopes that he or KM could extort one or more of the Adelsons? Did this happen? I don't know because I haven't seen any evidence of it. But it seems equally probable that this would happen, as we haven't seen any evidence that the Adelson's hired Garcia and Rivera either. Without such evidence the prosecutors would have a very difficult time establishing guilt beyond a reasonable doubt against any of the Adelsons.

Without additional evidence this is not going to be an easy case for the prosecutors to win against Garcia or Rivera -- and it certainly would be a loser against any of the Adelsons.

I find it hard to believe that prosecutors will have a difficult time prosecuting Garcia and Rivera for murder. The evidence is overwhelming against them both that they murdered DM. But, maybe they can claim that while visiting FSU and milling about town they had a road rage incident with DM, thus prompting their execution of him. (Sounds plausible, right? And it doesn't involve the As!) But, it doesn't really matter. Do you really think Garcia and Rivera will fall on their swords and take the death penalty like men? Maybe that would be a relief for KM. She'll be free to look for another, better man. Who knows, even hook up with Charlie again!



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[tallyeng]

I hope someone is singing to the grand jury, my bets are on the driver.

I think it's a deliberate strategy by LE and prosecutors to hold off arresting the prime perp(s) who ordered the hit, in order to wrangle testimony from one of the hitmen first, and get a rock solid case. It's like a chess game, they're willing to sacrifice a pawn or two, in order to capture the queen.

I've been theorizing this for some time. After I spoke with someone who is a state attorney in Florida (not Leon County) there is only one way they could do this, and I think that although the odds are slim, I think it's VERY likely.

I believe there is evidence, primarily cell phone and e-mail, that 100% incriminates the A family. There is a reason we haven't seen it yet. That is, LE/SAO could have released these docs by now (which they have, in my opinion, referenced frequently) BUT they don't have to IF they do not directly involve our two knuckleheads from Miami. A good example could be an email exchange between grandma dukes and CA:

SoFlaDentist420: "Hey Grams! The shipment of dentures and adult diapers finally made it in - you know, the ones you so badly needed. Have you processed the invoice?"

LuvzHer_Special_Snowflake_6969: "Hey booboo, OMG THANK YOU. Finally. I just processed the invoice. Plz tell Cookie Monster and Elmo to check the balance at an ATM"

In a situation like this, since our bonehead killers aren't technically identified here, this information could be withheld from discovery. I think there will be quite a big drop in the near future that will - dare I say - be quite shocking.

 

[dotr]

I've been theorizing this for some time. After I spoke with someone who is a state attorney in Florida (not Leon County) there is only one way they could do this, and I think that although the odds are slim, I think it's VERY likely.

I believe there is evidence, primarily cell phone and e-mail, that 100% incriminates the A family. There is a reason we haven't seen it yet. That is, LE/SAO could have released these docs by now (which they have, in my opinion, referenced frequently) BUT they don't have to IF they do not directly involve our two knuckleheads from Miami. A good example could be an email exchange between grandma dukes and CA:

SoFlaDentist420: "Hey Grams! The shipment of dentures and adult diapers finally made it in - you know, the ones you so badly needed. Have you processed the invoice?"

LuvzHer_Special_Snowflake_6969: "Hey booboo, OMG THANK YOU. Finally. I just processed the invoice. Plz tell Cookie Monster and Elmo to check the balance at an ATM"

In a situation like this, since our bonehead killers aren't technically identified here, this information could be withheld from discovery. I think there will be quite a big drop in the near future that will - dare I say - be quite shocking.

Nicely stated and very funny!!
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/551550285586445035/

 

[cvaldez1975]

Lol I want to like this but I'm on mobile

I've been theorizing this for some time. After I spoke with someone who is a state attorney in Florida (not Leon County) there is only one way they could do this, and I think that although the odds are slim, I think it's VERY likely.

I believe there is evidence, primarily cell phone and e-mail, that 100% incriminates the A family. There is a reason we haven't seen it yet. That is, LE/SAO could have released these docs by now (which they have, in my opinion, referenced frequently) BUT they don't have to IF they do not directly involve our two knuckleheads from Miami. A good example could be an email exchange between grandma dukes and CA:

SoFlaDentist420: "Hey Grams! The shipment of dentures and adult diapers finally made it in - you know, the ones you so badly needed. Have you processed the invoice?"

LuvzHer_Special_Snowflake_6969: "Hey booboo, OMG THANK YOU. Finally. I just processed the invoice. Plz tell Cookie Monster and Elmo to check the balance at an ATM"

In a situation like this, since our bonehead killers aren't technically identified here, this information could be withheld from discovery. I think there will be quite a big drop in the near future that will - dare I say - be quite shocking.