FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #12

[JnRyan]

There could be some missed possibilities in the very first 50 or so tips received. A new LEO, or a PI should be given those tips to go over with a fine tooth comb. Probably something there that was either overlooked or dismissed. jmo

This is assuming LE has a record of those tips. I know I've read that the original detectives didn't document the case as they went along and just before leaving the case or OPD they had to recreate what they did from memory. (I believe Drew Kesse alluded to this in the 24 January 2018 press conference as well.) If this is true are those tips from the first few months lost as well? Maybe that is why in the press conference OPD is asking people who have called in early on to do so again.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Just trying to wrap my head around a lot of this new more enlightening information (at least new to me). Also another thought occurred to me.

I remember posting at length concerning the described scenario of friend's phone in a briefcase, how an intruder would be very unlikely to find that to disable along with Jennifer's phone. And I'm not sure how I got led down that path. How would anyone know where the friend's (Travis) phone was in her condo? Why would someone say it was in her briefcase in her condo the night before, and just as importantly to me, why did I accept that and try to work with that in scenarios? For some reason I thought there was a basis for it (and maybe there is, but how would anyone have any idea?)

I think we need an open mind and a sense of humor to accommodate all this seemingly ever changing information.

In fact, it is a certainty that Jennifer retrieved it and likely was laying out in plain view. If an intruder was disabling phones, they would disable that phone just as surely as her phone. An intruder wouldn't even try to determine which was "her" phone. The intruder would assume they were both same capability.

Now, having got past that scenario difficulty, the next is why would the phones be taken away with her? I am never sure what is missing given the ambiguous information about Jennifer's disappearance, but I think it is a given that driver's license and such is missing. And what we often have with a woman's disappearance is at least the appearance of a voluntary departure, as if they just decided to vanish. Lacking a violent crime scene, the difference between a clear abduction and a vanishing is the abductor bringing keys, wallet, and phone with the victim. In this case both phones.

Okay.

A key clue here is the timing of the 11 pings which we know stopped by 10:40 pm. We know the pings indicated movement, and we know Jennifer was on her landline at 9:57 pm. That doesn't leave much time for movement. It is possible she was dealing with someone at the door (maybe even ending the call because of it), or that she went out to her car to get something, or that she went out to her car to drive somewhere.

I find the timing really tight here, too. One of your scenarios is quite possibly the correct one--for the purpose of this discussion, I'll favor that she went out to her car to drive somewhere.

To return to the "tight timing" discussion--if we consider the last known phone call was a brief call of 10 or so minutes, that puts us at around 10:10 pm. Trying to consider Mr. Kesse's most recent information that the "final events" of the cell phones could have occurred between 10:20 pm and 10:40 pm, that would give Jennifer a total of 10 minutes. Five minutes to end the land line call, grab her keys, driver's license and for some reason both cell phones, lock her condo and head toward her vehicle.

If she encountered her abductor or abductors in the hallway, the last five minutes could have been used to get Jennifer into any vehicle prepared to begin moving immediately. If the cell phones were on her person, the ping movement would show regardless of what vehicle she was in.

I don't know. It could have happened that fast. The problem for me comes from trying to fit in that it was said she was ready and in bed. A t-shirt and personal things were lying on the bathroom floor as if she had had a shower. Her contacts are missing, but her glasses were in the bathroom beside the contact case. There's that dang damp towel hanging over the washer in the laundry room with the door closed; a little water behind some shampoo/soap bottles.

Nothing there indicates a hurried, unplanned departure.

Unless she was already prepared to do something unusual that evening and didn't want to share that knowledge with anyone. It's difficult for me to make myself accept that, though. In my heart of hearts, I don't believe it.

The timestamp of the pings would be helpful because movement (and therefore change in strength of tower signals) causes re-evaluation of controlling tower which involves pings. But I think the time to accept that Jennifer was abducted shortly after she ended her phone call with her bf is 12 years overdue.

I may agree, but I don't think we are all in agreement at the current time.

 

[liz b.]

If she was abducted, why did her abductors not leave the phones wherever they were, for example in the condo, or in her vehicle ?, Or throw them in a trash can ? Why go to the trouble of disabling two phones ? Could they have thrown them into a body of water ?

 

[liz b.]

BBM-I haven't either. I've been in a fairly large office where someone didn't show up and had us all worried. Honestly, no-one went down to personnel and asked them to dig out the emergency contact. And we were all worried to the point of trying to decide who would take a little drive over to their residence to see if everything appeared to be okay. I don't know, but I guess I feel there are certain respectable time limits that we all try to abide by when we can't find someone we care about. We could cause them embarrassment. On the other side of the coin, I guess, the delay could cause them harm.

(We eventually got our buddy located and all was well.)

But really, I can see where this is a matter of personal opinion. I'd be surprised if law enforcement didn't look into the timing, at least a little bit. Maybe they did, though, and thought everything checked out. Just a great place to work where everyone was so very, very concerned about everyone else.

Let's take a look at 2010 then. It doesn't seem like it was such a great place in 2006. The delay could have given someone four years.

Didn't Mr Kesse know JK's boss well, before she ever went to work there ?

 

[liz b.]

Just trying to wrap my head around a lot of this new more enlightening information (at least new to me). Also another thought occurred to me.

I remember posting at length concerning the described scenario of friend's phone in a briefcase, how an intruder would be very unlikely to find that to disable along with Jennifer's phone. And I'm not sure how I got led down that path. How would anyone know where the friend's (Travis) phone was in her condo? Why would someone say it was in her briefcase in her condo the night before, and just as importantly to me, why did I accept that and try to work with that in scenarios? For some reason I thought there was a basis for it (and maybe there is, but how would anyone have any idea?)

In fact, it is a certainty that Jennifer retrieved it and likely was laying out in plain view. If an intruder was disabling phones, they would disable that phone just as surely as her phone. An intruder wouldn't even try to determine which was "her" phone. The intruder would assume they were both same capability.

Now, having got past that scenario difficulty, the next is why would the phones be taken away with her? I am never sure what is missing given the ambiguous information about Jennifer's disappearance, but I think it is a given that driver's license and such is missing. And what we often have with a woman's disappearance is at least the appearance of a voluntary departure, as if they just decided to vanish. Lacking a violent crime scene, the difference between a clear abduction and a vanishing is the abductor bringing keys, wallet, and phone with the victim. In this case both phones.

A key clue here is the timing of the 11 pings which we know stopped by 10:40 pm. We know the pings indicated movement, and we know Jennifer was on her landline at 9:57 pm. That doesn't leave much time for movement. It is possible she was dealing with someone at the door (maybe even ending the call because of it), or that she went out to her car to get something, or that she went out to her car to drive somewhere.

The timestamp of the pings would be helpful because movement (and therefore change in strength of tower signals) causes re-evaluation of controlling tower which involves pings. But I think the time to accept that Jennifer was abducted shortly after she ended her phone call with her bf is 12 years overdue.

Is it possible that someone was in the condo with JK when she was on the phone with her BF ? Otherwise it doesn't make much sense, that timeline of the phones being disabled so quickly after the phone call with the BF ended ? Were there slider doors anyplace in the condo ? like near the back steps ?

 

[soonersleuther]

Something I always found curious is that soon after calls were made to the condo offices to check on her, her vehicle gets dumped. Could be coincidence, but if not, either someone in the office could have been involved or a tenant or worker could have panicked when they noticed people start to check on her.

I believe OPD handled this so badly that they are embarrassed to share their files with the Kesse's. I also believe they know if solved that it will make them look bad--a scenario that should have been easy to deduce.

I do know that after researching missing cases on here, there needs to be laws in place that make case files accessible after a certain period. The old 'LE' line of not releasing info to protect the case is total BS, especially after 12 years.

Short of that, OPD needs to get off their arses and start interviewing and asking for polygraphs from her neighbors, co-workers (lets not forget the office crush who was late to work that morning), office workers, and contractors---oh and security guards!!

 

[rd_jfc]

I find the timing really tight here, too. One of your scenarios is quite possibly the correct one--for the purpose of this discussion, I'll favor that she went out to her car to drive somewhere.

To return to the "tight timing" discussion--if we consider the last known phone call was a brief call of 10 or so minutes, that puts us at around 10:10 pm. Trying to consider Mr. Kesse's most recent information that the "final events" of the cell phones could have occurred between 10:20 pm and 10:40 pm, that would give Jennifer a total of 10 minutes. Five minutes to end the land line call, grab her keys, driver's license and for some reason both cell phones, lock her condo and head toward her vehicle.

If she encountered her abductor or abductors in the hallway, the last five minutes could have been used to get Jennifer into any vehicle prepared to begin moving immediately. If the cell phones were on her person, the ping movement would show regardless of what vehicle she was in.

I don't know. It could have happened that fast. The problem for me comes from trying to fit in that it was said she was ready and in bed. A t-shirt and personal things were lying on the bathroom floor as if she had had a shower. Her contacts are missing, but her glasses were in the bathroom beside the contact case. There's that dang damp towel hanging over the washer in the laundry room with the door closed; a little water behind some shampoo/soap bottles.

Nothing there indicates a hurried, unplanned departure.

Unless she was already prepared to do something unusual that evening and didn't want to share that knowledge with anyone. It's difficult for me to make myself accept that, though. In my heart of hearts, I don't believe it.

I may agree, but I don't think we are all in agreement at the current time.

I haven't seen a definitive beginning or ending of call at 9:57 pm. Is it your understanding that 9:57 pm was the placing of the call? If that is the beginning of the call then that is even less time for movement. The timestamps of those pings are an important part of the picture here.

Why would the party involved (the bf) not be specfic as to when the call began and ended? Even approximately. Maybe was and I haven't seen it? No one seems to know anything about it.

I am assuming that at least some of the pings are somewhat recent before the 10:40 pm event. Obviously if all the pings are before 9:57 pm then they are not telling us anything. If people want this case to move forward they need to look at those timestamps and the estimated ending of call with bf (short good night, 10 minutes or so, etc. Was knock at door during that phone call, etc.)

I don't think it was beyond realm of possibility that she took a shower that evening. We have zero positive indication of Jennifer up and about in morning or her car outside. Nothing about dinner, nothing about breakfast, even a positive indication coffee was made, anything? Nothing that I have seen. Just a damp shower. Everything else would be as is after a shower whenever it took place.

We need to also keep in mind that her luggage was not unpacked and now I see that her purse was in that luggage. So one needs to think about what was her usual practices, she didn't need the purse that day, maybe didn't need it for next day, did she carry a clutch, a wallet? She would have had that at work Monday. Her boss would have seen what she walked out with.

She was said to have carried shoes in a briefcase, changed them for driving. Changed them at her desk before walking out to car? Or changed them in car? Her shoes (new shoes that are missing) could be in briefcase I expect.

Some more info on this final event at 10:40 pm would make things clearer for an investigator. There is 0 possibility she powered off or took the battery out of her alarm clock cell phone and everything was normal the next morning.

 

[rd_jfc]

If she was abducted, why did her abductors not leave the phones wherever they were, for example in the condo, or in her vehicle ?, Or throw them in a trash can ? Why go to the trouble of disabling two phones ? Could they have thrown them into a body of water ?

This is an interesting question. I was gving it some thought and came back to post.

The interesting thing about disabling phones is that the person knows why they are disabling them, the phones leave a trail. This by the way also rules out most random people, crimes of passion, etc. It indicates pre-planning, a knowledgeable abductor, etc.

The next interesting question is where were the phones disabled? Disabling in the home and then bringing them with you wouldn't make any sense. Disabling and leaving them in the home wouldn't make any sense either. But to bring them leaves a trail.

So, just as with parking her car in an apartment complex a mile up the road, this can be used as a diversion. It would be interesting to see if ths "area where Jennifer would never go" is generally east of Jennifer's condo. Because that's where her car was found, unknown to the abductor that the parking of the car was caught on camera.

 

[Myserty64]

In the beginning this is what I thought (rightly or wrongly when I looked at the POI clip):

short in stature & dressed in coveralls; leading to Hispanic person; leading to illegal immigrant; leading to a maintenance/landscaping worker; leading to morning abduction.

Throw in empty condos (used at times by illegals) spare keys and the very fact many of these illegals fled after the abduction and there are red flags everywhere.
This is still my favoured scenario.

However in the event this theory goes pear shaped and it is a case of being taken by someone you know there are two candidates:

an ex or a work associate.

This case should be solvable.
The elephant in the room is no physical evidence and no witnesses,

 

[liz b.]

This is an interesting question. I was gving it some thought and came back to post.

The interesting thing about disabling phones is that the person knows why they are disabling them, the phones leave a trail. This by the way also rules out most random people, crimes of passion, etc. It indicates pre-planning, a knowledgeable abductor, etc.

The next interesting question is where were the phones disabled? Disabling in the home and then bringing them with you wouldn't make any sense. Disabling and leaving them in the home wouldn't make any sense either. But to bring them leaves a trail.

So, just as with parking her car in an apartment complex a mile up the road, this can be used as a diversion. It would be interesting to see if ths "area where Jennifer would never go" is generally east of Jennifer's condo. Because that's where her car was found, unknown to the abductor that the parking of the car was caught on camera.

Based on these things, the phones would have been disabled where ? In the vehicle ? But how would an abductor have known she had two phones on her, and why would she have had the phones on her person ? So strange.
I wonder if JK had been seen in that undesirable area before ? Had some residents of HOTG seen her there at some point ? And that was what OPD might have been getting at when JK's parents had become offended ?

 

[Truth Prevails]

Didn't Mr Kesse know JK's boss well, before she ever went to work there ?

I'm not sure. I believe I have heard that circulated, but it was a while back and I couldn't dig up anything on it when I was researching my mini novella.

It would give more weight to the understanding of the perhaps overly concerned workplace. For example, your friend's daughter suddenly doesn't show up for work one morning, and you are her boss.

Yeah, probably that would increase the panic level, some. Interesting, though.

 

[rd_jfc]

Based on these things, the phones would have been disabled where ? In the vehicle ? But how would an abductor have known she had two phones on her, and why would she have had the phones on her person ? So strange.
I wonder if JK had been seen in that undesirable area before ? Had some residents of HOTG seen her there at some point ? And that was what OPD might have been getting at when JK's parents had become offended ?

I can only speculate that if the police told Kesses what the pings indicated, and didn't point out that Jennifer may heve been abducted for those pings to take place, that Kesses were offended that anyone would suggest Jennifer was out and about driving in area "Jennifer would never go". The OPD in their earliest statements said that Jennifer might have been looking for a place to send the friend's cell phone. Actually pretty garbled because the reporting ended up being about mailboxes or something. Just a sorry experience for all involved.

The most likely scenario involving phones disabled at 10:40 pm is that Jennifer went to her car with the friend's phone, her phone, her wallet, and her keys. I don't know that there is anything else missing that definitively would have been brought inside after work and then needed to be brought back out to car to be missing.

There is not much time involved, and it seems that an abduction at her car is likely. Or not driving far, for example to that mall parking lot where the bar was. I have speculated on that extensively. The phones would be with her and they would need to be disabled by someone who didn't want the phones leaving a trail to where he took her.

The other possibilities are an intruder, perhaps the person that knocked on her door, or she went out to her car to get something. In those scenarios the abductor would have gone back into her condo to get her wallet and phones to make it look like she left on her own. The phones in my opinion would both be laying out and an intruder wouldn't know which was her primary phone, they would take and disable both of them if both were in sight.

That would make sense if it were to make it appear that Jennifer left on her own and was abducted elewhere, i.e. not someone from her condos or someone she knew that came to see her, etc. But that also shows criminal sophistication. the phones would be disabled elsewhere, or thrown in water, before driving off somewhere else.

 

[rd_jfc]

I'm not sure. I believe I have heard that circulated, but it was a while back and I couldn't dig up anything on it when I was researching my mini novella.

It would give more weight to the understanding of the perhaps overly concerned workplace. For example, your friend's daughter suddenly doesn't show up for work one morning, and you are her boss.

Yeah, probably that would increase the panic level, some. Interesting, though.

And wouldn't have to go to HR to get an emergency contact number.

 

[JnRyan]

I haven't seen a definitive beginning or ending of call at 9:57 pm. Is it your understanding that 9:57 pm was the placing of the call? If that is the beginning of the call then that is even less time for movement. The timestamps of those pings are an important part of the picture here.

Why would the party involved (the bf) not be specfic as to when the call began and ended? Even approximately. Maybe was and I haven't seen it? No one seems to know anything about it.

I am assuming that at least some of the pings are somewhat recent before the 10:40 pm event. Obviously if all the pings are before 9:57 pm then they are not telling us anything. If people want this case to move forward they need to look at those timestamps and the estimated ending of call with bf (short good night, 10 minutes or so, etc. Was knock at door during that phone call, etc.)

I don't think it was beyond realm of possibility that she took a shower that evening. We have zero positive indication of Jennifer up and about in morning or her car outside. Nothing about dinner, nothing about breakfast, even a positive indication coffee was made, anything? Nothing that I have seen. Just a damp shower. Everything else would be as is after a shower whenever it took place.

We need to also keep in mind that her luggage was not unpacked and now I see that her purse was in that luggage. So one needs to think about what was her usual practices, she didn't need the purse that day, maybe didn't need it for next day, did she carry a clutch, a wallet? She would have had that at work Monday. Her boss would have seen what she walked out with.

She was said to have carried shoes in a briefcase, changed them for driving. Changed them at her desk before walking out to car? Or changed them in car? Her shoes (new shoes that are missing) could be in briefcase I expect.

Some more info on this final event at 10:40 pm would make things clearer for an investigator. There is 0 possibility she powered off or took the battery out of her alarm clock cell phone and everything was normal the next morning.

The lack of LE's processing the condo is probably the biggest reason we have the question: Was she abducted that night or the next morning?

If Jennifer left for a brief vacation she may have emptied her trash before leaving. The only persons there in the interim were her brother and friends. Logan might have known what was thrown out as far as meals such as a pizza box. So if there was take out Chinese in the trash we can expect she ate dinner. If there was something on top like a package for breakfast or coffee grounds we can expect she ate breakfast. What was in the dishwasher, her coffee cup or a breakfast plate? We don't know any of these things. The Kesse's are not investigators so they likely would not have checked and it appears LE didn't either.

I bring up the Jodi Huisentruit case here several times. Jodi was abducted at her car early in the morning - much earlier than Jennifer likely was as Jodi was taken at 0400-0430. Neighbors heard screams. The area around her car had personal items scattered about and her key broken off in the lock. In Jennifer's case she leaves about 0715-0730 every morning so the abductor is taking a chance on taking her while someone else might be in the lot even as sparsely occupied as the complex was at the time. And we have nothing - no scream, no items around the car, no forensic evidence in her car to speak of save a partial print and maybe partial DNA. No one saw strange activity or vehicles in the area. So without LE processing the condo, we have a huge gap in the timeline when she got off the phone with Rob and 0730 that morning. I don't see how anyone can say with any certainty she was abducted that morning. Or the night before. I can see either scenario happening.

 

[Markybug]

You raise some interesting questions.

The care taken with respect to wiping the vehicle and parking it near Jennifer's apartment make it clear that she was killed by someone known to her.

To me it looks like the person was wearing the sort of disposable coveralls people sometimes use for painting or working with chemicals, which would mean that he was even attempting to avoid leaving clothing fibers.

If I were a betting man, I'd be all in on the coworker who was several hours late to work.

Yes , i find it hard to picture the worker/workers for example being so meticulous?

 

[Markybug]

You asked for a guess, so I'm going to give you mine. I'm most likely not right, but it really is something I ponder over. Many may not agree and that is a good thing.

It would be a boring old discussion if we all agreed.

So, I think someone pulled Jenn in that empty condo across the hall. It was kept unlocked and I first read it had the cabinets stripped out of it and lately I have read it had no carpet.

Jenn's brother and his friend apparently looked around in there on the 24th, but no time was given. Also, LE did eventually get around to perfunctory search but Mrs. Kesse wasn't certain exactly when.

I reserve the right to change my mind, but for right now; that's where I favor.

I agree with your comment, btw. I think they need a little bit of luck. They never seemed to have any; the dang POI had it all.

Was the carpet missing before the 24th? If not , that would be significant surely , disappearing at the same time as jen..

 

[Truth Prevails]

I haven't seen a definitive beginning or ending of call at 9:57 pm. Is it your understanding that 9:57 pm was the placing of the call? If that is the beginning of the call then that is even less time for movement. The timestamps of those pings are an important part of the picture here.

Yes, I'm quite sure 9:57 pm has been given as the confirmed start time of Jennifer's final call. Give me a little time to look for a link, but I know I should be able to come up with one fairly easily. (If I'm not back with one later tonight, I should be around early tomorrow evening).

Why would the party involved (the bf) not be specfic as to when the call began and ended? Even approximately. Maybe was and I haven't seen it? No one seems to know anything about it.

They have just recently come out and admitted the call was from Jennifer's landline. Before that they always said it was from her cell phone. Why? I don't know--maybe LE asked them to withhold those details? I believe the party involved was as specific as he was allowed to be--this is something else I will try to link but will be harder to find. I know I have heard him mention briefly in an interview how long the call lasted. I don't know that I can find it but I will look. I did try to find it before I mentioned the 10 minutes in my comment because I wanted to review it. However, I couldn't find it and I did finally just go with my memory. So, let's take that with a grain of salt.

I really do find it unusual and wonder why no-one has confirmed a time ending for that call. Maybe we will get that soon.

I am assuming that at least some of the pings are somewhat recent before the 10:40 pm event. Obviously if all the pings are before 9:57 pm then they are not telling us anything. If people want this case to move forward they need to look at those timestamps and the estimated ending of call with bf (short good night, 10 minutes or so, etc. Was knock at door during that phone call, etc.)

Well, I'm questioning even myself at this point, but I believe Mr. Kesse indicated all the pings occurred after the final phone call but before the 10:20 pm to 10:40 pm final event. I'm sure I have linked that recently here, but I'm going to review it again. Maybe I'm misunderstanding.

We have nothing about that knock on the door, other than that it occurred. We don't know that it happened at 8:00 pm or 9:00 pm or while Jenn was talking with Rob. We don't know and it's not fair to put that on Rob.

I don't think it was beyond realm of possibility that she took a shower that evening. We have zero positive indication of Jennifer up and about in morning or her car outside. Nothing about dinner, nothing about breakfast, even a positive indication coffee was made, anything? Nothing that I have seen. Just a damp shower. Everything else would be as is after a shower whenever it took place.

I agree. (Except Mr. Kesse has said Jennifer didn't drink coffee.) It's just that Mr. and Mrs. Kesse believe that it was Jennifer's routine to have a morning shower. They have a point. They are her parents.

Why do I feel like I'm usually the lone one lobbying in favor of the points you are making above, but tonight I seem to have myself on the opposite side? LOL

We need to also keep in mind that her luggage was not unpacked and now I see that her purse was in that luggage. So one needs to think about what was her usual practices, she didn't need the purse that day, maybe didn't need it for next day, did she carry a clutch, a wallet? She would have had that at work Monday. Her boss would have seen what she walked out with.

Good point about her boss maybe noticing her purse as she walked out. Maybe some of the other co-workers might remember, too.

The most recent information is that it was the brown purse--still being shown in the picture on Jennifer's website--that was eventually found with the remaining unpacked luggage. The Kesse's believe that she was carrying a purse, but they can't describe it.

Yes, I'm still looking for that link. But, I'm not kidding, that is what we are being asked to believe at the current time.

She was said to have carried shoes in a briefcase, changed them for driving. Changed them at her desk before walking out to car? Or changed them in car? Her shoes (new shoes that are missing) could be in briefcase I expect.

That's the assumption. But that is all that is. The Kesse's suspect LE has the briefcase because they think it was in Jennifer's trunk and the briefcase is not listed as missing on the FBI flyer.

My guess would be she would slip her shoes off in the car only while driving and slip them back on before exiting. The briefcase and what was in it is still in slightly unclear territory for me. But Mrs. Kesse is sure the shoes are missing.

Some more info on this final event at 10:40 pm would make things clearer for an investigator. There is 0 possibility she powered off or took the battery out of her alarm clock cell phone and everything was normal the next morning.

I agree with your last statement, 0 possibility.

Now I have some homework to do and there might be a new episode of the podcast dropped tonight.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Was the carpet missing before the 24th? If not , that would be significant surely , disappearing at the same time as jen..

This is a great question. From what I've read, no-one knows for sure.

 

[rd_jfc]

Truth Prevails wrote: "We have nothing about that knock on the door, other than that it occurred. We don't know that it happened at 8:00 pm or 9:00 pm or while Jenn was talking with Rob. We don't know and it's not fair to put that on Rob. "

I agree. What I was saying was a confirmation of how long phone call was (even approximately) and whether knock on door happened during that call (especially!) would be of great benefit in moving case forward in conjunction with timestamps of pings.

Rob is only one that can answer those two questions (not necessarily when knock too place if earlier, but whether it took place during his call). I also understand that infomation has been withheld all these years and that an investigator is really the one who needs these answers, but it's been 12 years and we're the only ones asking questions, so questions need to be taken in that context.

So don't know that we'll get answers, and not putting anything on Rob that he can't answer, but really answers to questions that can be answered are needed to move finding out what happened to Jennifer forward.

Thanks Truth!

 

[rd_jfc]

The lack of LE's processing the condo is probably the biggest reason we have the question: Was she abducted that night or the next morning?

If Jennifer left for a brief vacation she may have emptied her trash before leaving. The only persons there in the interim were her brother and friends. Logan might have known what was thrown out as far as meals such as a pizza box. So if there was take out Chinese in the trash we can expect she ate dinner. If there was something on top like a package for breakfast or coffee grounds we can expect she ate breakfast. What was in the dishwasher, her coffee cup or a breakfast plate? We don't know any of these things. The Kesse's are not investigators so they likely would not have checked and it appears LE didn't either.

I bring up the Jodi Huisentruit case here several times. Jodi was abducted at her car early in the morning - much earlier than Jennifer likely was as Jodi was taken at 0400-0430. Neighbors heard screams. The area around her car had personal items scattered about and her key broken off in the lock. In Jennifer's case she leaves about 0715-0730 every morning so the abductor is taking a chance on taking her while someone else might be in the lot even as sparsely occupied as the complex was at the time. And we have nothing - no scream, no items around the car, no forensic evidence in her car to speak of save a partial print and maybe partial DNA. No one saw strange activity or vehicles in the area. So without LE processing the condo, we have a huge gap in the timeline when she got off the phone with Rob and 0730 that morning. I don't see how anyone can say with any certainty she was abducted that morning. Or the night before. I can see either scenario happening.

On the other hand, and I know this is not fair to either the police or the family, but the family reorganized the crime scene if you will ('straightened it up"). Nothing in any picture is as it was when they found it. I don't know how you process a scene like that.

I won't try to restate Truth's info on the trash, just point you back a few pages where she recently covered that well. Her brother left the apartment clean, and IIRC nothing much was in the trash.