GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #11

[1&2&3]

Okay, after reading all these posts on the house being for sale before they were murdered, I remembered something.

The house next door to them was for sale. Also, the owner's name was similar to Mr, Dermonds. Sounds unlikely, however, back in the beginning there was discussion about this and how odd the two names were so similar, but not related.

One of you super sleuthers may be able to trace this down.

 

[1&2&3]

Okay, after reading all these posts on the house being for sale before they were murdered, I remembered something.

The house next door to them was for sale. Also, the owner's name was similar to Mr, Dermonds. Sounds unlikely, however, back in the beginning there was discussion about this and how odd the two names were so similar, but not related.

One of you super sleuthers may be able to trace this down.

 

[1&2&3]

Is this Layout Sketch of the Dermond's Home what you've seen before?

Putnam County Tax Assessors Office - Layout Sketch of Dermond Home

qpublic7.qpublic.net/cgi-bin/gap_sketch.cgi?county=putnam&p=3605&b=8560&s=400&c=putnam&t=R

 

[1&2&3]

I found the information referred to in my post #282 above regarding a neighbor with a similar name. In the beginning, the neighbor next door to the Dermonds was contacted and bothered by reporters due to a similar name.

The neighbors name was Dermond Russell Maples. We know how well media journalists fact check what they do these days! To add insult to injury, this poor man had been deceased for a number of years. His widow still lived in the home at 143 Carolyn Drive, the Dermonds next door neighbors. The house was for sale, and still is. It seems to go on and off the market. Priced at a reduced price now at $1,795,000.

Think this might be one reason it is not selling? Then add to it that the Dermonds house next door sold for $650,100., a huge price difference between houses next door to each other, plus a double murder was committed next door.

Just some information for y'all.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I remember something now, I remember there was talk of another Russell Dermond who was an olympic swimmer or kayaker or soemthing

Also do remember reading something about the neighbors house, wrong name on house???Anyone else rememrber that?? Was it the tax records or some online thing that had the D's listed on wrong property.........

Okay, after reading all these posts on the house being for sale before they were murdered, I remembered something.

The house next door to them was for sale. Also, the owner's name was similar to Mr, Dermonds. Sounds unlikely, however, back in the beginning there was discussion about this and how odd the two names were so similar, but not related.

One of you super sleuthers may be able to trace this down.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Ill look, didnt notice dates on realtor.com, theyusually have outdated info from what I've seen in my business..... haven't had time yet but will check....I always found it odd it was listed so quickly too, if there was no debt on, that cash went straight to pay of a lien and/or whatever else they had, bought some more franchises..........if there was other evidence in the home, it aint there now! I was kind of surprised SS turned it back over to the family so quickly as well

Wouldn't trulia or Zillow list the dates for sale? I think it went up for sale after it was released to them and it sold in less than a year from the murders which I find odd. Prime real estate but for the kids to sell it so fast and for less than it cost them to build sends up a red flag.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

WOW, I remember something abuot that, did they discern it was a typo?? I can't recall No way that man's name was russell dermond maples......AND next door??..that's wild!! here's teh house plan layout, Im thinking kitchen is in that back left corner, according to inside images of home and grill on open deck connected to screened porch

https://qpublic.schneidercorp.com/A...D=4&PageID=5583&Q=2051547879&KeyValue=120A008

I found the information referred to in my post #282 above regarding a neighbor with a similar name. In the beginning, the neighbor next door to the Dermonds was contacted and bothered by reporters due to a similar name.

The neighbors name was Dermond Russell Maples. We know how well media journalists fact check what they do these days! To add insult to injury, this poor man had been deceased for a number of years. His widow still lived in the home at 143 Carolyn Drive, the Dermonds next door neighbors. The house was for sale, and still is. It seems to go on and off the market. Priced at a reduced price now at $1,795,000.

Think this might be one reason it is not selling? Then add to it that the Dermonds house next door sold for $650,100., a huge price difference between houses next door to each other, plus a double murder was committed next door.

Just some information for y'all.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

1,2,3........MAPLES RONALD S ESTATE MAPLES LINDA B AS TRUSTEE &
I think it was discussed that maybe the killer had the wrong folks but if they looked at tax records that would prove it wasn't russell dermond
https://qpublic.schneidercorp.com/A...D=4&PageID=5583&Q=1134412155&KeyValue=104B134

WOW, I remember something abuot that, did they discern it was a typo?? I can't recall No way that man's name was russell dermond maples......AND next door??..that's wild!! here's teh house plan layout, Im thinking kitchen is in that back left corner, according to inside images of home and grill on open deck connected to screened porch

https://qpublic.schneidercorp.com/A...D=4&PageID=5583&Q=2051547879&KeyValue=120A008

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

here is some family tree stuff showing possible relatives to neighbors https://www.familytreenow.com/records/people/maples/linda/tdhahzzzh3w5ftoskmuexq

i have found many times these "possible relatives " are not always correct

HOW did they confuse the 2? of Course they were neighbors but mistaken Ronald Maples and Russell Dermond? Was Russell Dermond on the note? Not necessarily on the deed at one time??

RD never owned that lot

143 house
https://qpublic.schneidercorp.com/A...1&LayerID=11797&PageTypeID=1&KeyValue=104B134

They purchased lot in 89, may have not built until 2000....seawall was built in 98 tho

RD purchased in 94, BUILT IN 99, i posted up thread they bought in 99 but that's when they built, I knew they built a few years later

so looks like RD purchased 5 years AFTER the Maples...and built close to the same time and they each purchased from a different seller, no confusion there.........weird

square footage very close to the same in 143 and 147 homes

zestimatges give 143 and the others close to a 1.2 mil price

My god, you can go to utah and purchase out there this kind of square footage for less than this house is listed at 1.8...and those homes on the west coast are twice as much as the prices in GA

They haven't sold that one because it's WAY over priced IMO........BUT...the D's home sold for proably HALF of what it should have been listed at


WHY???? The murders or the rush to get rid of it? Who did they owe?? Just very weird, of couse after this kind of murder the house will likely sell for less but if they'd waited it out they should have atleast grossed 900 or 1 mil...think? why the rush?


hey.are these Maples kin to Marla Maples Trump? Lol

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

SO confused about the huge price difference, appraisals use comparables, 120 sq ft more isn't 1 million more in sales price and the neighbros lot is smaller than the Dermonds lot, yeah Russell Dermond R Maples home is waaaay overpriced IMO, irrelevant here.... sorry..LOL

the children may have netted 590k or such..after RE fees and any taxes due etc.....the listing could have been a market analysis of the agent instead of appraisal price but they derive at the listing price basically the same way as an appraisal, with sold comps in the area.... it's just certified or whatever, when you get an appraisal and that comes before closing to be sure

Property History for 147 Carolyn Dr
This property was sold once in the last 2 years.

Sold for $650,100
May 6, 2015
Relisted for $769,000
Apr 30, 2015
Listed for $769,000
Apr 20, 2015

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Ok at 22:59 http://www.upandvanished.com/episodes under case evidence Q & A dated 08.03.17

PH stated:

The results of polygraph examinations are not admissable in GA court, They are sometimes used as an investigative too but I can tell you from my own personal experience, THEY ARE NOT VERY RELIABLE, THEY"RE NOT ACCURATE, and it's for those reasons they aren't admissible in court,THE ONLY WAY the result of a polygraph exam could ever be presented to a jury is if the parties used whats called a "stipulated polygraph" and under that scenario the prosecution and the defense would enter into an agreement, it would be signed and it would be prior to any polygraph examination that the results would be used no matter what the result of the polygraph, good or bad for the defendant would be admissible in trial and that is a huuuge gamble because if someone takes it and passes it, then the prosecutions case is sunk and likewise the defense bares the same risk basically, if he fails it. This doesnt' happen very often and it's very very risky and the only way the defense would attempt something like this is if he had a "PRIVATE POLYGRAPH" done on the defendant before the scheduled polygraph by the court, then he might approach the prosecutor about a stipulate polygraph if he passed BUT then you have to hope the defendant passes the polygraph a SECOND time,,,PH said he's seen about the same amount of people pass and fail taking the same poly twice on same issue and there fore the reasons the test or machines aren't reliable...it depends on many conditions and inaccurate in differentiating a lie from the truth...courts depend on something scientifically sound and Lie detectors haven't reached the level yet...

I know SS said he watched them take it and believed them.............from what he saw in their demeanor

 

[Bootsctr]

got me thinking, "WHAT AM I TALKING ABOUT?" hahaha

had to rethink it in my head....the kitchen is on the left side of house as is garage and screened porch

when you enter thru front door youll be in a hallway, you see the DR to the left and straight ahead is den with upper deck, left from there is the kitchen

bedrooms must be to the right of the LR/Den as you enter

and when you exit thru front door, you'd hang right on the sidewalk to the garage and screened porch, where you drive up

you could live on the main level without even going into the basement or needing it, i t looks like

Got to thinking about what hockyguy said about the D's not having house help............i can't keep up my 2200 sq ft by myself alone, but i have 2 dogs and have to help with a handicap individual also so thats like doing twice as much, if you have 2 adults picking up after themselves, would it be that difficult? Maybe if no hobbies? IDK,

Regarding the D's not having help to clean house, I always felt the daughter and granddaughter helped give the house a deep cleaning while they were at Easter. Maybe the daughter would come every month or every couple of months and help do a very thorough cleaning. I don't think the D's would make much of a mess that they needed hired help if the daughter was helping. From what I recall Mrs. D was still playing triplicate bridge twice a week and Mr. D walked a lot, even picking up the Rx's that Friday before the murders. So they were both still pretty active.

Maybe they were looking to downsize, just hadn't listed the home yet, and since the neighbors home was for sale, they did want to keep their home very clean in case someone did make an offer ??? Mr. D being frugal may have thought he could benefit from the neighbor's home being listed while he, himself, could save money by not going through a realtor???

For some reason, I do think the home and property could have been motive too.

 

[Bootsctr]

Let's do this:

1- angry grandchild........would have left a mess, like a druggee and woul dhave taken things from the home and probalby not beheaded nor hauled SD off and dumped in lake

2-mafia hit.....would have come in and shot them both and left them were they fell

3-serial killer.......would have likely seen murders of the same nature before the D's and especially AFTER the D's in the area or atleast in the same state

4-drugee/neighbor kid.........would have left a mess in house and stolen items that were not stolen during this crime, probably taken all the liquor or as much as they could carry

5-extortion....would have come during the week so they could take the D's to the bank, saturday banks are half day or closed in GA....and atm machines only give you $300 per transaction

6- Robbers........would have shot them AND taken their wares and cash and tv's and stereo and computer (and liquor ) and other hockable items

7 -hired hit man--would confuse the investigation and leave no trace and would take head to conceal evidence.

8 - Illegitimate son of Mr. D--would've held on to extreme hatred for a rough life without financial help from a wealthy father. Would've had the attitude that he didn't need or want anything from them at this point in his life but wanted them to pay for their mistakes.

9 - Mistaken identity. Killer was supposed to kill the neighbors, but incorrect information was listed and they murdered the wrong people.

10 - He could have loaned someone money without a paper trail for all we know and they killed him to get out of repayment but I dont think this kind of rage would be there.

What can we add or alter? Repost please

Added #9 and #10.

Would an illegitimate child leave the home in such pristine condition, especially if their mother had endured hardship w/o Mr. D's help? Just leaning toward the child would have wanted to destroy the home too. Maybe money was never a problem. They just hated Mr. D for being an absentee father. Great list BTW!!!

 

[watcher9]

Regarding the D's not having help to clean house, I always felt the daughter and granddaughter helped give the house a deep cleaning while they were at Easter. Maybe the daughter would come every month or every couple of months and help do a very thorough cleaning. I don't think the D's would make much of a mess that they needed hired help if the daughter was helping. From what I recall Mrs. D was still playing triplicate bridge twice a week and Mr. D walked a lot, even picking up the Rx's that Friday before the murders. So they were both still pretty active.

Maybe they were looking to downsize, just hadn't listed the home yet, and since the neighbors home was for sale, they did want to keep their home very clean in case someone did make an offer ??? Mr. D being frugal may have thought he could benefit from the neighbor's home being listed while he, himself, could save money by not going through a realtor???

For some reason, I do think the home and property could have been motive too.

I don't remember the Rx's being picked up on that Friday or did you mean the week before? Did he pick them up at a drive thru window or did he go inside? Did they check the video to see if he was alone when he left or if he was followed? Were the Rx's still in the house when the crime was discovered?

 

[Vedder]

Regarding the D's not having help to clean house, I always felt the daughter and granddaughter helped give the house a deep cleaning while they were at Easter. Maybe the daughter would come every month or every couple of months and help do a very thorough cleaning. I don't think the D's would make much of a mess that they needed hired help if the daughter was helping. From what I recall Mrs. D was still playing triplicate bridge twice a week and Mr. D walked a lot, even picking up the Rx's that Friday before the murders. So they were both still pretty active.

Maybe they were looking to downsize, just hadn't listed the home yet, and since the neighbors home was for sale, they did want to keep their home very clean in case someone did make an offer ??? Mr. D being frugal may have thought he could benefit from the neighbor's home being listed while he, himself, could save money by not going through a realtor???

For some reason, I do think the home and property could have been motive too.

It's really not difficult for a healthy, albeit elderly, couple to keep the house clean. My mother in law is 82 with a very large house and she keeps it pristine with no help. Of course there are rooms she never uses, and some we're "not allowed" in because we'll put footprints in the carpet.

 

[jonnyrock]

Just further musings.......The killers came to the Dermonds the day of the murder to carry out the executions. Period. So what prior event or events triggered such horrific rage that cost the lives of two people in the mid eighties? It's hard to believe it has anything to do with employment of some twenty years ago. Extortion just doesn't make any sense to me unless there were several prior attempts but surely wouldn't the Dermonds have reported such activity? I previously wondered aloud if the deceased Dermond son may have fathered a child who was born after his death and those who raised him tried to obtain maintenance money from the Dermonds. Quite puzzling all around.

 

[colette]

Maybe it was some group against older white Americans? Maybe it wasn't personal.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Well i have to agree with the two of them if living in only a few rooms might not be messy, esp with no pets or children.............not sure I think any family came from 7 hours or more away to help clean, on a monthly or bi monthly basis, they can't even call for 5 days after the derby party.... Im sure when they were there if needed they might help. My aunt lives alone, family comes a few times a year durig the summer but they are all too busy running around seeing the sites and at holidays they are busy with holiday affairs.........I just think they decluttered when they moved there or when all the kids left after college..if the house isn't listed, no one will ask or know it's for sale....Im sure it was listed for sale, that was their retirement home

Regarding the D's not having help to clean house, I always felt the daughter and granddaughter helped give the house a deep cleaning while they were at Easter. Maybe the daughter would come every month or every couple of months and help do a very thorough cleaning. I don't think the D's would make much of a mess that they needed hired help if the daughter was helping. From what I recall Mrs. D was still playing triplicate bridge twice a week and Mr. D walked a lot, even picking up the Rx's that Friday before the murders. So they were both still pretty active.

Maybe they were looking to downsize, just hadn't listed the home yet, and since the neighbors home was for sale, they did want to keep their home very clean in case someone did make an offer ??? Mr. D being frugal may have thought he could benefit from the neighbor's home being listed while he, himself, could save money by not going through a realtor???

For some reason, I do think the home and property could have been motive too.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

hahaha, love it, footprints in the carpet.....yeah the D's might be like your m-i-L....and if you dont have a lot of home hobbies or crafts then you wont make a mess either.....

It's really not difficult for a healthy, albeit elderly, couple to keep the house clean. My mother in law is 82 with a very large house and she keeps it pristine with no help. Of course there are rooms she never uses, and some we're "not allowed" in because we'll put footprints in the carpet.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

wouldnt they have killed others in the area then?

Maybe it was some group against older white Americans? Maybe it wasn't personal.