GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 8

[Carolinapeach]

Didn't lakeoconee or tomkat post a prior comment about a road that leads to another rock formation directly across from where SD was located?

Rock Hawk. That would be closer.

http://rockhawk.org/maps/maps.html

 

[Foxfire]

Rock Hawk. That would be closer.

TY, Carolinapeach

 

[Bootsctr]

Thanks so much, Bootsctr. I couldn't get the book on York on my Kindle (hardcover only) so did read a few articles last night. I liked your info better than what I read. I can see how this can all be connected; I think my initial thoughts about it were that they were old news, not there anymore, disbanded (hopefully), etc. This train of thought that you are onto is about revenge and money (so many cases are the "follow the money" type). I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions.
ps..your name reminds me of all the line dancing I used to do!

You're so very welcome Happyshoes! Glad you found the information helpful. This Dwight York guy has some serious issues and I understand where many want to dismiss a "cult" involvement, especially when he says he's waiting for a spaceship..... :ufo: But, make no mistake he is very dangerous, still alive and still has followers and I believe nothing would make him happier to bring misery and death upon Sheriff Sills and Putnam county.

p.s.: Your name makes me smile. Makes me want to do a Happy Dance with Happyshoes! :great:

 

[Bootsctr]

Good morning Bootsctr. BBM for focus. You are probably referring to Rock Eagle - which is an ancient Indian rock formation of a bird. There is a 4-H Camp and the mound near Eatonton, GA....
See this for more info: http://www.rockeagle4h.org/about.html#mound

Thank you so much JustyThoughts. Yes this is exactly what I was referring too. A big Thank you to CarolinaPeach, tomcat and Foxfire and other posters who mentioned the Rock Eagle. Fascinating!

:yourock:

We have mounds built by Native Americans in our neck of the woods too. I find it all very fascinating. No rock formations such as the Rock Eagle, but mounds. If anyone is interested here is a link to more information.

http://www.texasescapes.com/DanaGoolsby/Caddo-Mounds-State-Historic-Site.htm

More than 1,200 years ago, a group of Caddo Indians known as the Hasinai built a village and ceremonial center just east of Weches. Today, three earthen mounds still rise from the Neches River valley which was the southwestern-most ceremonial center for the great Mound Builder culture. The Caddoan culture thrived in the eastern North America woodlands for more than 2,500 years.

http://www.visitcaddomounds.com/index.aspx?page=2

 

[mck16]

Thank you so much JustyThoughts. Yes this is exactly what I was referring too. A big Thank you to CarolinaPeach, tomcat and Foxfire and other posters who mentioned the Rock Eagle. Fascinating!

:yourock:

We have mounds built by Native Americans in our neck of the woods too. I find it all very fascinating. No rock formations such as the Rock Eagle, but mounds. If anyone is interested here is a link to more information.

http://www.texasescapes.com/DanaGoolsby/Caddo-Mounds-State-Historic-Site.htm

http://www.visitcaddomounds.com/index.aspx?page=2

thanks. I didn't know those even existed. Guess I need to visit. jmo

 

[mck16]

Good morning Happyshoes and everyone! Thought I might add a little information regarding the United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors aka Dwight York aka "Chief Black Eagle" aka “Ansaru Allah Community” (AAC).

"In 1993, York bought a 476-acre property in Putnam County, Ga., and moved there with members of his Brooklyn chapter. The relative isolation of the land probably appealed to him; the largest town in the region is Eatonton, population 6,764 in 2000. The move may also have been prompted by the fact that the group had been investigated by the FBI for criminal acts allegedly committed by its members in Brooklyn, including arson, welfare fraud, and illegal possession of weapons."

"York’s operation became very profitable. During a June 1998 “Savior’s Day” celebration at the Georgia compound, York took in about $500,000. He charged Nuwaubians $25 a year for their Nuwaubian “passports,” which allowed them to enter and exit the compound. A network of chapters and bookstores, called All Eyes on Egipt, also brought in funds, and members continued to raise money through begging and holding jobs."

"A Nuwabian member, along with several "associates" of the group, were indicted in Atlanta for counterfeiting payroll checks to the tune of $5 million. (A son of York's was indicted in Richmond, Va., on similar charges.) Two men with reputed ties to the Nuwaubian Nation were arrested for armed robbery in Rockdale County, halfway between Putnam and Atlanta.

"There's a myriad of criminal activity associated with the group," Sills says."

The part that I bolded and enlarged is what makes me wonder if somehow there is a connection between the Dermonds and the Nuwabians. I know Mr. Dermond was no longer active in the restaurant chain business, but I assume he still maintained a presence especially regarding the finances and profits and losses. I would be interested in what companies had their payroll checks counterfeited and who helped "catch the counterfeiters" and who testified against them, etc.

Anyway, the Nuwaubians have sued Sheriff Sills 12 times and even attempted to place a lien on Sheriff Sills property.

The women of the group were impregnated by Dwight York in order to draw welfare checks and the women who weren't pregnant were given urine by the pregnant women in order to file for welfare checks. Hmmmmm..... lots of fraud going on with these folks.

I read that a lot of the local folks joined the Nuwabian bandwagon when they came to Putnam County, Georgia. I don't really know if the original Nuwaubian cult members knew how to fish or hunt, but I feel positive that the locals from Putnam county knew how to fish and hunt and were quite familiar with the lay of the land including Lake Oconee. Now by the time Sheriff Sills arrested Dwight York the numbers of the cult had dwindled, but there are always a few die-hards. He still has an active web site and I am sure there are still a few faithful to him. I don't believe all members went back to where they came (New York). They hung around in Georgia, especially the locals who joined :moo:

http://www.splcenter.org/get-inform...s/2002/fall/savior-in-a-strange-land?page=0,2

http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/nuwaubian-nation-of-moors

For what it's worth, there is a cult in Houston County where I live. They have a supreme leader. All the men stay at the compound and the women are sent into the community to work - at the Family Dollar Store, cleaning houses, etc. They even allow their children to attend public school. They aren't really into guns or militia-type training. In fact, they are called a Hippy Commune more than a cult. I believe they would much rather smoke a joint and lay around doing nothing that start a war.

Anyhow, I meant no disrespect to Sheriff Sills and his comment about giving his workers off for the Memorial Day weekend. I am sure they all needed it and he probably need a break himself although it sounded like he worked going through paperwork. From what I have seen and heard of Sheriff Sills, I like him a lot. I hope he can solve this case. I wish him luck because he's going to need it. Hopefully, the perps will be caught and justice will be served because no one deserves it more than the people of Putnam County Georgia and the residents of Great Water/Reynolds Plantation. I hope this upcoming Fourth of July is one of the best ever for everyone, and it would be even better if we knew who killed the Dermonds and they were behind bars. :moo:

:happy4th::fireworks2::fireworks:

Is this the church in wells you are speaking of? If not what is the name of the cult/commune? ty

 

[Bootsctr]

OH mck16! I wish you would come visit. We could meet up at the mounds and do the little tour. It's been years and I know they have done more excavations since the last time I was there. It kind of puts me in place when pondering the Universe and how many people have existed many, many moons before I was even a spark in my parents' eyes. And, they did it all without cells phones, smart phones, microwaves, computers. . . I love history. Guarantee we would have a boot-scooting boogie of a time.

I've got "Georgia on My Mind" bad right now. It's on my list of places I must visit before I die.

 

[Bootsctr]

Is this the church in wells you are speaking of? If not what is the name of the cult/commune? ty

Not wells, but Congregation of the Firstborn. . .

Rxxxxxx Xxxxx, Xxxxxxxxx, TX: Teaches that Jesus is not God; also sabbatarianism, festival keeping.

Understanding Cults: http://www.666soon.com/understanding_cults.htm

The Nubian Nation of Moors: See Ancient Mystic Order of Malchizedek.

Nuwaubians: See Ancient Mystic Order of Malchizedek.

Wells is in Cherokee county. My mother was raised in Cherokee County. We would cross the Neches River every Saturday going to visit my grandparents. When my grandparents would come and pick me up every few weeks to stay with them, my grandmother would often mention as we crossed the Neches River bridges about a little girl that was found murdered in the woods there and by the time she was found, partially obscured by brush, she was identified by an earring in one of her little ears. I think that was my beginning of being interested in unsolved murders. I still think about that little girl to this day. I wish I knew her name. I do remember that her killer was caught. He confessed and told where LE could find her body. Just remember being very sad and confused that a little girl had been killed by a grownup. *sigh

Forgot to add, David Koresh visited the church I attended as a child trying to recruit members. Lucky for me, my mother, sister and I were not in attendance for that church service. His cult was an offshoot of the Seventh Day Adventist church. I believe Congregation of the Firstborn might be an offshoot of the Pentecostal church. The women do not cut their hair and they are only allowed to wear dresses or skirts.

ETA: I tried to access the links for Nubian nation and Nuwaubians and Dwight York at the Understanding Cults site and they have been deleted. Guess they missed the one that is in Georgia still actively posting.

 

[Litig8ter]

While we don't know the exact date of Mr. D's death, my theory is that it happened after dark on Friday, May 2. Has it been discussed that May 2 is the anniversary of bin Laden's death? And there are the conspiracy theorists out there that claim bin Laden was beheaded and his head shipped to Yale's Skull & Bones club.

 

[Bootsctr]

While we don't know the exact date of Mr. D's death, my theory is that it happened after dark on Friday, May 2. Has it been discussed that May 2 is the anniversary of bin Laden's death? And there are the conspiracy theorists out there that claim bin Laden was beheaded and his head shipped to Yale's Skull & Bones club.

My opinion too that Mr. D died Friday night. Ocean mentioned bin Laden a couple of times with reference to a reward being offered to information leading to his location and no one claiming the reward. I don't remember any discussion regarding the claim that bin Laden's head was shipped to Yale's Skull & Bones club. Would be very interested in hearing more of that theory.

This was in the news recently about a shipment of teddy bears being confiscated in Mexico because they contained skulls. Seems there is a shortage of human skulls due to an increase in members of the Cuban Santeria religion.

Human Skulls Found in Shipment of Teddy Bears in Mexico City

A man was in custody Monday on charges of attempting to ship human remains to the U.S. for use in Santeria religious rituals after two "recently exhumed" human skulls were discovered inside teddy bears, Mexican authorities said.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/human-skulls-found-shipment-teddy-bears-mexico-city-n138751

 

[southernmimi]

Sometimes, after reading these posts, I feel like I've been transported to some other planet. Who in the world does what some of these people are doing...or even contemplates doing it? We live in a very different world..

 

[Foxfire]

Cult leader duped politicians
Book on "Malachi" York and his crimes against children details what prosecutor calls his "most significant" case
http://www.nuwaubianfacts.com/2007Jul27.htm
Daily Report online July 27, 2007


<snipped - read more - BBM for Focus>

Former GA Governor Roy Barnes declined an interview with the Daily Report about Osinski's book; Ungodly, referring all questions to his former top aide, Bobby Kahn.

In an interview this week, Kahn said that Barnes had been in office less than three months when he first learned of trouble brewing between the Putnam County sheriff and the Nuwaubians.

Kahn confirmed that the Georgia governor was "taking his cues" about York and the Nuwaubians from (state rep & NC Defense Attn)Tyrone Brooks, and from the GBI, which "was concerned we would have another Waco."

Kahn also said that the Putnam County sheriff didn't apprise Barnes of the child molestation allegations and that the governor was made aware only that a potentially violent confrontation was brewing over local code enforcement.

"Our approach to this wasn't who's right and who's wrong, and whose fault it is," Kahn said. "Our concern was how do we avoid a blow-up?"

"Osinski has determined that Sheriff Sills was a hero," said Kahn. "Anything that gets in the way of that, he basically ignores. &#8230; If he [Sills] were a hero, he would have told us and would have told the GBI he suspected there was child molestation going on."

But Sills did try, unsuccessfully, to talk to Governor Barnes directly about the Nuwaubians, according to Osinski.

"He wanted to go to Barnes personally and directly. He didn't want to go through the GBI," the journalist said in an interview. But Sills feared that the GBI "might have been compromised" and might leak information about the investigation to York, Osinski explained, because the sheriff was aware that GBI agents had gone to Tama-Re to go fishing. "He simply did not want the GBI to know what the real investigation was."

 

[Litig8ter]

My opinion too that Mr. D died Friday night. Ocean mentioned bin Laden a couple of times with reference to a reward being offered to information leading to his location and no one claiming the reward. I don't remember any discussion regarding the claim that bin Laden's head was shipped to Yale's Skull & Bones club. Would be very interested in hearing more of that theory.

This was in the news recently about a shipment of teddy bears being confiscated in Mexico because they contained skulls. Seems there is a shortage of human skulls due to an increase in members of the Cuban Santeria religion.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/human-skulls-found-shipment-teddy-bears-mexico-city-n138751

BBM. I did not mean that it had been discussed here. I mean if you search the internet for bin laden and beheading, you will find some who claim that happened. I am not agreeing with their theories, just bringing them to my fellow sleuthers' attention.

 

[Happyshoes]

Let me see what I can put together in my mind: GBI agents went fishing at Tama-Re? I don't know how to re-post all that Foxfire said, but it made me think, too, of what Bootsctr put on here about some of the "friendly" guards who were fired, right? Yeesh. I was going with the druggie/meth head feeling, esp after seeing that darn movie the other night ("300:Rise of the Empire"). I just have had that creeped out feeling of a basement baby who won't grow up, playing videos, tweaking....feel like I've read a lot about that lately, too; it's been the grandkids, but still - just sayin'. We need an update or press conference. Isn't this what we pay taxes for? If I'm off base, moderator or others, let me know. I need a cocktail.

 

[Happyshoes]

Ok, one more thought...why wouldn't Barnes give SS time to go over this? I don't care if he'd been in office less than 3 months, you only listen to the GBI and the defense atty? I obviously don't understand how this works. I just know I would listen to everyone, get the facts, and decide for myself (or I'd like to think I would). This was huge, though - $5 million and welfare fraud should have been a red flag if nothing else. Ahhhh!

 

[Bootsctr]

Let me see what I can put together in my mind: GBI agents went fishing at Tama-Re? I don't know how to re-post all that Foxfire said, but it made me think, too, of what Bootsctr put on here about some of the "friendly" guards who were fired, right? Yeesh. I was going with the druggie/meth head feeling, esp after seeing that darn movie the other night ("300:Rise of the Empire"). I just have had that creeped out feeling of a basement baby who won't grow up, playing videos, tweaking....feel like I've read a lot about that lately, too; it's been the grandkids, but still - just sayin'. We need an update or press conference. Isn't this what we pay taxes for? If I'm off base, moderator or others, let me know. I need a cocktail.

Glass of wine perhaps? Helps settle my nerves. Yep! I think you're catching onto how big this "cult" ordeal was/is... Guards were handing out literature to prisoners that were pro-Dwight York's teachings. Infiltrated Georgia by coming in as cowboys then became Indians in order to try to get Tama-Re casinos and not have to pay taxes. . . .

We do need an update. I have hope that as Foxfire stated there is A LOT of investigating being done BEHIND closed doors. Bartender, another round for my friends.

 

[Foxfire]

Glass of wine perhaps? Helps settle my nerves. Yep! I think you're catching onto how big this "cult" ordeal was/is... Guards were handing out literature to prisoners that were pro-Dwight York's teachings. Infiltrated Georgia by coming in as cowboys then became Indians in order to try to get Tama-Re casinos and not have to pay taxes. . . .

We do need an update. I have hope that as Foxfire stated there is A LOT of investigating being done BEHIND closed doors. Bartender, another round for my friends.

Reading assignment for your drinking buddies;

Hidden Justice...& The Nawaubian Nation of Moors..
<ignore blank pages & keep scrolling> Pay close attention to page #82 Sheriff Sill's life is threatened by NC membershttp://books.google.com/books?id=5d...udge arrest warrant for sheriff sills&f=false

 

[Bootsctr]

Cult leader duped politicians
Book on "Malachi" York and his crimes against children details what prosecutor calls his "most significant" case
http://www.nuwaubianfacts.com/2007Jul27.htm
Daily Report online July 27, 2007


<snipped - read more - BBM for Focus>

Former GA Governor Roy Barnes declined an interview with the Daily Report about Osinski's book; Ungodly, referring all questions to his former top aide, Bobby Kahn.

In an interview this week, Kahn said that Barnes had been in office less than three months when he first learned of trouble brewing between the Putnam County sheriff and the Nuwaubians.

Kahn confirmed that the Georgia governor was "taking his cues" about York and the Nuwaubians from (state rep & NC Defense Attn)Tyrone Brooks, and from the GBI, which "was concerned we would have another Waco."

Kahn also said that the Putnam County sheriff didn't apprise Barnes of the child molestation allegations and that the governor was made aware only that a potentially violent confrontation was brewing over local code enforcement.

"Our approach to this wasn't who's right and who's wrong, and whose fault it is," Kahn said. "Our concern was how do we avoid a blow-up?"

"Osinski has determined that Sheriff Sills was a hero," said Kahn. "Anything that gets in the way of that, he basically ignores. … If he [Sills] were a hero, he would have told us and would have told the GBI he suspected there was child molestation going on."

But Sills did try, unsuccessfully, to talk to Governor Barnes directly about the Nuwaubians, according to Osinski.

"He wanted to go to Barnes personally and directly. He didn't want to go through the GBI," the journalist said in an interview. But Sills feared that the GBI "might have been compromised" and might leak information about the investigation to York, Osinski explained, because the sheriff was aware that GBI agents had gone to Tama-Re to go fishing. "He simply did not want the GBI to know what the real investigation was."

OH MY! I just about fainted when I read your latest link Foxfire! You could have warned me.... :seeya:

"Dwight "Malachi" York was a false prophet, a psychotic , a con man extraordinaire and a sexual predator who headquartered his religious cult in rural Georgia, then used his position as a religious leader to deflect scrutiny from his criminal activities, a newly published book asserts."

:notgood::thud: That does it! I'm buying the book! It seems Sheriff Sills said the murders were committed by "thugs."

 

[K.jill]

If these murders were committed by York's followers it is gonna be especially difficult to solve. If the perps were complete strangers to the Dermonds there will be no way to connect them. IMO, it is possible the Dermond's were targeted because of their isolated location and ages. If this is the case and the crime was planned in advance they could have left minimal evidence behind.

Please let there be something, some kind of evidence to bring justice!

 

[lakeoconee]

Reading assignment for your drinking buddies;

Hidden Justice...& The Nawaubian Nation of Moors..
<ignore blank pages & keep scrolling>

http://books.google.com/books?id=5d...udge arrest warrant for sheriff sills&f=false

For the Nuwaubians or anybody else trying to make a statement to Sills or the community: Why would they select such low-profile people? They are not rich by local standards. Don't get me wrong I would feel pretty comfortable owning a couple of successful fast food franchises. But there is a former CEO of one of the big three US auto makers living here, CEO of Revlon, CEO of Calaphon, managing partner of Lehman Brothers. Heirs to Coca Cola and on and on. I can't even remember all the pedigrees I know. This is basically a community of meritocracy not aristocracy. I am always stunned by the accomplishments and the people I run into at the clubhouse. Engineers, scientists, etc...I don't know how to describe the awe I feel. However lovely the Dermonds were, they weren't attention-getters and didn't want to be.

I keep proclaiming my last post, and maybe this will be it. Local thinking (among my acquaintances) is that the children had nothing to do with these murders, but the murders had to do with that family.