General Discussion and Theories #2

[Snoofo]

YES, I do! I am in total trust of AS. I do not believe he had some hidden agenda and tried to sabotage an potential contracts, nor Millardair. AS is a business development consultant. He would have been hired by many businesses throughout Ontario and possibly Canada to help them develop their businesses. It's possible he specializes in a certain field or two of business development and air traffic may have been one. Why would someone such as AS come forward to discuss the failure of someone's business if he had anything to do with it? He has a reputation to uphold and a life to live. That makes no sense at all unless one is going to say it would take the heat off himself and he's hoping he won't be investigated for any involvement in TB's death. I am sure LE have thoroughly questioned him already and that is why he came forward.

:seeya:
You answered the question best yourself, Swedie. He would come forward to discuss the failure to ensure nobody thinks he didnt do his job, therefore he speaks up because he has a reputation to uphold, IMO.

No contracts signed would appear to be the fault of the professional whose job it is to get the contracts negotiated and signed. Now it seems this new MRO in Windsor blindsided everyone, by coming right out of left field with contracts in hand and incredible contacts within the industry, leaving any competition in the dust. This conclusion drawn from the combination of MSM links re PA and its parents, affiliates, etc., that were provided in this thread in the past 48hrs.

IMO, PA's appearance on the scene is the reason why AS ultimately failed to secure contracts, even if he was working in ernest for Millard Air to get them; however, it will hurt his reputation to blame PA, a huge new MRO operation that happens to be a part of a huge international aviation operation from AS' home state (he is likely known in the same circles). Why would AS go on record as to say anything about this company and burn any bridges when he might come across them in the future? Maybe I am wrong but blaming DM is the only course of action that won't hurt AS' reputation. Blaming DM does take the heat off himself in terms of any question of his ability and reputation. JMO. I am not suggesting AS made this stuff up so he won't be blamed for a murder. I am not suggesting he had anything to do with that.

So far as the rest, your opinion is completely respected as are most opinions in the forum. You could be right about DM...but you might be wrong. In the name of TB and justice, we continue to explore. :smiliescale:

 

[Juballee]

Let me get this straight.

Another new Ontario MRO gets some initial business.

This MRO also bought some of its operations from an Israeli company.

Back in the 1950s, an American guy named Al worked for an Israeli company.

Therefore DM didn't murder Tim Bosma.

What did I miss here?

I think it's about following the money here, and the fact that there are very large and some would say shady corporations and (possibly even governments) with big stakes in this doesn't really seem like something to make a mockery of. There seems to be evidence here that a very large company was squeezed out of business by the same people who then came in and bought up all their supplies for severely discounted prices, and then went back to doing what that business did before they were forced out, but with different people profiting from it now. Then it turns out that they have almost what appears to be a monopoly on that service in those part of the world, so why is it so funny to wonder if they didn't like the idea of a little competition and decided to wait until it was set up and ready to run on someone else's dime before they drive them out of business while grabbing up their supplies for pennies on the dollar.

If there are points to be made for or against this theory, criticism that is thought provoking and logical is appreciated, but I think that trying to minimalize the evidence presented here as a joke because someone pointed out that two men have the same first name undermines the sleuthing process and could very well exclude important issues from possibly coming to light.

 

[Juballee]

IMO there's a reasonable explanation why your last line may be necessary. According to MSM, it was the Eliminator SN250. Capable of 250Lbs. http://www.supernovamfg.com/250.html

Source: http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2013/05/16/20829241.html

If a farmer was purchasing a unit, they would be looking at 2 things- 1) total mass of animals carcasses and the height and width of the animal in full rig. ie) this unit could hold 250 1 lb chickens-numbers produced by large poultry farmers. Vets/animal shelters may be interested-30 cats, 10 small dogs etc. The point to remember here is the size of the individual animals being disposed of. 2) Second thing would be the size of the opening the farmer or vet would need. On the SN250, the loading door is only 12" x 20"...big enough for chickens and small animals-however, a farmer or vet could put up to 250lbs of small animals in it. Wouldn't be suitable for a farmer disposing of mature goats or calves
The SN1500 is the first of the units that can take the larger animals with an opening of 40" x 96", but it can hold 1500lbs. http://www.supernovamfg.com/1500.html It weighs 4 x's as much as the 250. IMO, the SN250 was purchased with only thought given to how many pounds a human body weighs. IMO there was a focus on that and no thought was given to the size of the opening to a human body in it. Thus the need for chopping up a body to get it in the 12" x 20" opening. MOO

It is said that the person who placed the order asked relevant questions, what is there to assume that the size of the opening would not have been a relevant question, since everyone here thought of it pretty quickly? If it was intended for disposal of human remains as you suggest, would the buyer want to give the impression that they would have livestock of a similar size to an adult human, like cows or pigs, to dispose of, and not numerous small animals, such as many chickens, as an example?

Do they actually come any smaller from that distributor, I wonder?

Money seemed no object to DM when it came to purchasing toys and work machinery, so why would he cheap out and not buy the big one? Was the salesman on the phone such a bad salesman that he didn't find the time to point out that there were other, larger, more expensive models available that might better suit the buyer's needs? That is pretty much Sales 101.

 

[MsSherlock]

It is said that the person who placed the order asked relevant questions, what is there to assume that the size of the opening would not have been a relevant question, since everyone here thought of it pretty quickly? If it was intended for disposal of human remains as you suggest, would the buyer want to give the impression that they would have livestock of a similar size to an adult human, like cows or pigs, to dispose of, and not numerous small animals, such as many chickens, as an example?

Do they actually come any smaller from that distributor, I wonder?

Money seemed no object to DM when it came to purchasing toys and work machinery, so why would he cheap out and not buy the big one? Was the salesman on the phone such a bad salesman that he didn't find the time to point out that there were other, larger, more expensive models available that might better suit the buyer's needs? That is pretty much Sales 101.

Good questions Juballee. IMO, the person ordering the product could have been very nervous and just heard the 250lbs. Perhaps they weren't aware of how big of an opening they would need? IMO they wouldn't be able to ask the salesman for his recommendation. Without farm expertise, I could see this error being easily made and JMHO, it was made. MOO

 

[redheart]

I think it's about following the money here, and the fact that there are very large and some would say shady corporations and (possibly even governments) with big stakes in this doesn't really seem like something to make a mockery of. There seems to be evidence here that a very large company was squeezed out of business by the same people who then came in and bought up all their supplies for severely discounted prices, and then went back to doing what that business did before they were forced out, but with different people profiting from it now. Then it turns out that they have almost what appears to be a monopoly on that service in those part of the world, so why is it so funny to wonder if they didn't like the idea of a little competition and decided to wait until it was set up and ready to run on someone else's dime before they drive them out of business while grabbing up their supplies for pennies on the dollar.

If there are points to be made for or against this theory, criticism that is thought provoking and logical is appreciated, but I think that trying to minimalize the evidence presented here as a joke because someone pointed out that two men have the same first name undermines the sleuthing process and could very well exclude important issues from possibly coming to light.

Sometimes taking a theory and putting it at its most basic elements clarifies the theory. I believe that poster did so, and if the end result shows the theory to have no evidence to back it up, so be it.

 

[dizzy1]

I think it's about following the money here, and the fact that there are very large and some would say shady corporations and (possibly even governments) with big stakes in this doesn't really seem like something to make a mockery of. There seems to be evidence here that a very large company was squeezed out of business by the same people who then came in and bought up all their supplies for severely discounted prices, and then went back to doing what that business did before they were forced out, but with different people profiting from it now. Then it turns out that they have almost what appears to be a monopoly on that service in those part of the world, so why is it so funny to wonder if they didn't like the idea of a little competition and decided to wait until it was set up and ready to run on someone else's dime before they drive them out of business while grabbing up their supplies for pennies on the dollar.

If there are points to be made for or against this theory, criticism that is thought provoking and logical is appreciated, but I think that trying to minimalize the evidence presented here as a joke because someone pointed out that two men have the same first name undermines the sleuthing process and could very well exclude important issues from possibly coming to light.

BBM. There is nothing illegal about what you describe here IMO. My Dad ran a fairly successful business in the trucking industry for 20 years. He made many attempts before he finally succeeded, and claimed bankruptcy 3 times prior. Competition would swoop in like vultures to buy whatever they could sink their claws into when the opportunity arose. Competition in the trucking industry was very tough, and he often had to learn the hard way, he got ripped off, walked on and taken advantage of by competition lots of times. Competition was a big part of the reason his prior 3 businesses went bankrupt. Competition was also tough for WM and DM, as in any business, IMO. Only the strong survive. Maybe DM shouldn't have given up so easily, even if this large corporation had cornered a big part of the market, it doesn't mean there's no business left for DM. It's like accusing a larger company like Bell or Rogers of cornering the cell phone market, and running all the smaller companies out of business. To be successful, you have to compete with the big guns. Nothing illegal about being competitive. MOO MOO MOO

 

[Blomquist]

Good questions Juballee. IMO, the person ordering the product could have been very nervous and just heard the 250lbs. Perhaps they weren't aware of how big of an opening they would need? IMO they wouldn't be able to ask the salesman for his recommendation. Without farm expertise, I could see this error being easily made and JMHO, it was made. MOO

I wonder why whoever ordered the machinery didn't ask for delivery to be made closer to the time that many assume it was needed for ?

Surely if it was used for a murder in May 2013 it was a little premature to have it delivered in July 2012 .... JMO

Where has it been sitting all this time... in a field throughout the winter ???

 

[dizzy1]

I wonder why whoever ordered the machinery didn't ask for delivery to be made closer to the time that many assume it was needed for ?

Surely if it was used for a murder in May 2013 it was a little premature to have it delivered in July 2012 .... JMO

Where has it been sitting all this time... in a field throughout the winter ???

Although delivery does seem to tie in pretty closely with the disappearance of LB IIRC(early July, 2012). I'm not totally convinced DM had anything to do with LB's disappearance, but I also wouldn't be surprised. MOO

I'm pretty sure there would be lots of room in the barn on Roseville Rd. to store the incinerator. If he bought it for "farming" purposes, why wouldn't he store it at his farm? JMO MOO

 

[swedie]

Although delivery does seem to tie in pretty closely with the disappearance of LB IIRC(early July, 2012). I'm not totally convinced DM had anything to do with LB's disappearance, but I also wouldn't be surprised. MOO

I'm pretty sure there would be lots of room in the barn on Roseville Rd. to store the incinerator. If he bought it for "farming" purposes, why wouldn't he store it at his farm? JMO MOO

Well if it was purchase to dispose of bird carcasses at the hangar, it would be at that location more than likely in the hangar. Yes or if he was telling the truth and bought it for farming purposes. I guess there could be a farm DM owns with animals on it we have not found out about yet. Did DM intend to purchase a farm last year which had farm animals on? Maybe he bought it for someone else and the deal fell through....

:waiting: Come on trial...

 

[Juballee]

Well if it was purchase to dispose of bird carcasses at the hangar, it would be at that location more than likely in the hangar. Yes or if he was telling the truth and bought it for farming purposes. I guess there could be a farm DM owns with animals on it we have not found out about yet. Did DM intend to purchase a farm last year which had farm animals on? Maybe he bought it for someone else and the deal fell through....

:waiting: Come on trial...

That makes me wonder, Swedie, can anyone tell from the pictures of the barn what type of floor it had? I am wondering because if it had a concrete or a packed earth floor, I would think that the incinerator could have been used inside the barn instead of out in the open where anyone could see it. Does it make too much exhaust for it to be used indoors, even in a large barn (or enormous hanger), does anyone know?

 

[Snoofo]

BBM. There is nothing illegal about what you describe here IMO. My Dad ran a fairly successful business in the trucking industry for 20 years. He made many attempts before he finally succeeded, and claimed bankruptcy 3 times prior. Competition would swoop in like vultures to buy whatever they could sink their claws into when the opportunity arose. Competition in the trucking industry was very tough, and he often had to learn the hard way, he got ripped off, walked on and taken advantage of by competition lots of times. Competition was a big part of the reason his prior 3 businesses went bankrupt. Competition was also tough for WM and DM, as in any business, IMO. Only the strong survive. Maybe DM shouldn't have given up so easily, even if this large corporation had cornered a big part of the market, it doesn't mean there's no business left for DM. It's like accusing a larger company like Bell or Rogers of cornering the cell phone market, and running all the smaller companies out of business. To be successful, you have to compete with the big guns. Nothing illegal about being competitive. MOO MOO MOO

You are correct dizzy, that part of competition is legal. What is illegal is what someone might have done to try to get in on that lease or break that existing lease. I can tell you a good lease is a powerful thing and I have seen in my professional life little mom/pop shop tenants with great leases completely thwart the big lucrative plans of big corporations with their powerful little lease.

Sadly in my personal life I have seen one such small but powerful tenant be put in a position to have their great little lease terminated early due to a setup of illegal substances being delivered to their business anonymously from S. America. Landlord very sophisticated professional but shady and the leased lands holding up what would be a sweet redevelopment. Why wouldnt landlord pay several thousands to create a "prohibited activity" that could end that lease and pave the way to multi-millions? (*epilogue: the landlord was not successful and we dont know 100% it was the landlord but it is the only possibility and they tried many times to trick these people out of their lease for years*)

Killing DM would not terminate the lease. Creating a dealbreaker would.

Moo.moo.

 

[Snoofo]

So maybe Region cant get them out but they can challenge the competition "if you can get them out its all yours".
Jmo, above and below.
I dont know if DM really planned to re-lease. He probably wanted to keep the hangar for other commercial uses. It was his father's baby after all. Maybe his colleagues were trying to sublease to competition (RK ad) and DM refused to give them his favourable lease seeing as how their tactics cost him a father. ???

So far as DM giving up too soon, maybe prospects were totally bleak by March. AS didnt say he ever did land a contract did he? Maybe he just knew he didnt know how to run an MRO. Moo.

 

[dizzy1]

That makes me wonder, Swedie, can anyone tell from the pictures of the barn what type of floor it had? I am wondering because if it had a concrete or a packed earth floor, I would think that the incinerator could have been used inside the barn instead of out in the open where anyone could see it. Does it make too much exhaust for it to be used indoors, even in a large barn (or enormous hanger), does anyone know?

We have a barn on our property similar to the barn on DM's property, ours is over 100 years old. I would guess DM's is pretty old as well. The bottom floor on our barn is cement, and the upper level is wood. Because the barn wood is very old and dry, they are VERY flammable. It wouldn't take much for an old barn like that to go up like a matchstick. Moo

 

[Juballee]

We have a barn on our property similar to the barn on DM's property, ours is over 100 years old. I would guess DM's is pretty old as well. The bottom floor on our barn is cement, and the upper level is wood. Because the barn wood is very old and dry, they are VERY flammable. It wouldn't take much for an old barn like that to go up like a matchstick. Moo

I realize that old barns are flammable, but I would think that being far away from all the walls and such would have given them enough distance to ensure that the heat didn't turn the barn into tinder. But I think that the brush and grasses where the incinerator was found were also flammable, and that they were closer to it than the walls of the barn would have been, was what I was getting at. If secrecy was of the utmost importance, for that matter, they could have loaded the incinerator (if it was being stored at the farm) into one of the many trailers and brought it to the hanger, which would have been far less flammable altogether. To me it just looks like it was meant to be found.

 

[Alethea Dice]

BBM. There is nothing illegal about what you describe here IMO. My Dad ran a fairly successful business in the trucking industry for 20 years. He made many attempts before he finally succeeded, and claimed bankruptcy 3 times prior. Competition would swoop in like vultures to buy whatever they could sink their claws into when the opportunity arose. Competition in the trucking industry was very tough, and he often had to learn the hard way, he got ripped off, walked on and taken advantage of by competition lots of times. Competition was a big part of the reason his prior 3 businesses went bankrupt. Competition was also tough for WM and DM, as in any business, IMO. Only the strong survive. Maybe DM shouldn't have given up so easily, even if this large corporation had cornered a big part of the market, it doesn't mean there's no business left for DM. It's like accusing a larger company like Bell or Rogers of cornering the cell phone market, and running all the smaller companies out of business. To be successful, you have to compete with the big guns. Nothing illegal about being competitive. MOO MOO MOO

The CFO of Laurentian Aerospace seems to disagree with you about the size of the market leaving room for both. Premier stated that they were concentrating on narrow bodies, but could accomodate wide bodies as well.

The MRO industry has migrated to Asia, Latin America and other low-cost regions, he said, and players outside those areas must have a well-defined and major competitive advantage…

As for MRO for narrow bodies, I would not want to be in that market under any circumstances," Edwards said.

"The margins are very, very low, so I assume (Premier) feels they have some niche or some edge." (François Shalom, Montreal Gazette January 8, 2011)

http://www.windsorsquare.ca/2011/02/another-fly-in-the-sky-edgar-boondoggle/

It may not be illegal, but it doesn't leave a nice taste in one's mouth. People don't like the monopoly of Bell and Rogers either, and there are a lot more potential customers for the smaller cell phone carriers than there would be in the MRO market.

JMO

 

[Carli]

Let me get this straight.

Another new Ontario MRO gets some initial business.

This MRO also bought some of its operations from an Israeli company.

Back in the 1950s, an American guy named Al worked for an Israeli company.

Therefore DM didn't murder Tim Bosma.

What did I miss here?

Huh?? Perhaps I don't understand your logic. Has someone said that Israelis murdered TB? Sorry, but I'm absolutely completely lost on this one. MOO.

 

[dizzy1]

I realize that old barns are flammable, but I would think that being far away from all the walls and such would have given them enough distance to ensure that the heat didn't turn the barn into tinder. But I think that the brush and grasses where the incinerator was found were also flammable, and that they were closer to it than the walls of the barn would have been, was what I was getting at. If secrecy was of the utmost importance, for that matter, they could have loaded the incinerator (if it was being stored at the farm) into one of the many trailers and brought it to the hanger, which would have been far less flammable altogether. To me it just looks like it was meant to be found.

MOO, but I just would never consider bringing any kind of device that has any type of flame into the barn. We won't even have a bonfire if the wind is blowing in the direction of the barn. I would think the field would be fine, as it would be pretty unlikely for a fire to burn out of control just from the heat of the incinerator, but I would still stay a safe distance from the barn just in case. The hangar would probably be a safe enough place to be able to use it as well. JMO MOO

 

[Curiositykitten]

Huh?? Perhaps I don't understand your logic. Has someone said that Israelis murdered TB? Sorry, but I'm absolutely completely lost on this one. MOO.

Nor has anyone said the Israelis murdered TB, just kind of, sort of implied it.

A lot of us are lost on this one.

 

[Snoofo]

I have a question about an entry in Swedie's (very useful) timeline.
May 10 states after DM was picked up a lengthy interview commenced. Did LE or MSM confirm this?
I thought he was silent.

 

[dizzy1]

I have a question about an entry in Swedie's (very useful) timeline.
May 10 states after DM was picked up a lengthy interview commenced. Did LE or MSM confirm this?
I thought he was silent.

I think this is what Swedie was referring to:

Dellen Millard, the scion of a noted aviation dynasty who was arrested after a Hamilton father disappeared a week ago after joining two men offering to buy his truck on a test drive, was interrogated by police for almost 24 hours by officers desperately searching to find Tim Bosma.

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/po...d-in-case-of-missing-ontario-father-tim-bosma

HTH