George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #4

[katiewonders]

With all due respect that is racial profiling. I'm sorry if you don't see that. Any black male in that neighborhood would be suspicious. That is the essence of racial profiling.


He wasn't purple and could not be purple. However lets use your example, if a purple male was committing robberies in the area, and your are saying all purple males you may see in the neighborhood are suspicious that is racial profiling.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's just my opinion, but I see it a little differently. I think it would be racial profiling if, there were burglaries in the community -- and no suspects at all were identified -- and GZ thought this AA guy was suspicious. Hey, then he wouldn't have any reason to suspect an AA individual, so why on earth would he? Racial profiling.

But when a suspect in the robbing of a home is an AA guy, then yeah, RZ (or just about anyone who is honest to admit) would be suspicious of TM.

My word, if a middle-aged Caucasian woman, who has a fondness for chocolate and is overweight were a suspect in the burglaries, then go ahead, and let the NW person call me in, follow me even. MOO

 

[PaintingAnemone]

We have two elements to your chasing claim. The intent to follow, and the intent to catch or catch up with.

No, we don't. We only have one: the act of following. Your assumption about the intent to catch up is just that, an assumption.

The first is fact. He admitted to following him.

I know. That's what makes it chasing.

However, the second:

As for speculation, given that he was following a young man who was running (or so GZ says in the audio), and the wind noise described by the operator, it's a fairly safe guess, imo, that Zimmerman took off running to catch up. Later GZ told Hannity that Trayvon was "skipping" but not actually running, but I'm going to go with running since that's what on the tape. That's my speculation.​

Which makes the second element your opinion or speculation, which in turn makes your claim of chasing non-factual, or speculation, or your opinion. Both of the conditions are not factually met.

That's quite a strawman argument. My clearly marked speculation does not make the entire thing speculation. It makes my clearly marked speculation... Speculation.

 

[Chester_from_THM]

Watch George on his walk through.. It's impossible.

Linda, do you know where I can watch this?

 

[Tulessa]

It would be physically impossible, the emt's would have noticed, and he would have been doing it in front of witnesses. Claiming the injuries were self inflicted is a shameful attempt to square the circle and paint GZ as a bloodthirsty crazed racist. Occam's Razor anyone?

IF, I had done that, I would agree. I was asking out of curiosity.

 

[legalmania]

And again, I ask:

So, he fell on the back and front and all sides of his head? How is that physically possible?

The same way it's not physically possible that the injuries to his hands of Trayvon, do not support the claims of GZ.

 

[Linda7NJ]

And again, I ask:

So, he fell on the back and front and all sides of his head? How is that physically possible?

If you watch the "walk through" video... GM at one point starts to say he fell, right next to a tree ...with some mulch around the bottom of it.

Not hard for me to speculate he did slip and fall into that tree and land in the mulch.

 

[m00c0w]

Are you stating you believe TM was going to murder GM that night? Seriously?

Well, apparently people think it's okay to kill a person that's doing nothing but following them...

So, I'd say it's a valid point.

 

[callyn]

I don't have a gun, so I'm curious. How do you have a concealed "hidden" weapon when you're wearing it in a holster on your hip?

A jacket or shirt can cover it.

 

[daisy7]

We have two elements to your chasing claim. The intent to follow, and the intent to catch or catch up with.

The first is fact. He admitted to following him.

However, the second:

As for speculation, given that he was following a young man who was running (or so GZ says in the audio), and the wind noise described by the operator, it's a fairly safe guess, imo, that Zimmerman took off running to catch up. Later GZ told Hannity that Trayvon was "skipping" but not actually running, but I'm going to go with running since that's what on the tape. That's my speculation.​

Which makes the second element your opinion or speculation, which in turn makes your claim of chasing non-factual, or speculation, or your opinion. Both of the conditions are not factually met.

IMO, if someone is running after me, I would call that chasing. And you don't usually chase the person if the second person is not running away. That's pretty much the basis of playing tag JMO.

We may just have to agree to disagree on this point :blowkiss:

 

[iluvmua]

The point again, this murder could have been avoided. George should never have been given a gun.

He was not given a gun, He legally purchased it, He has a legal right to carry it. He had a legal CC permit.

This is a fact.

 

[legalmania]

Are you stating you believe TM was going to murder GM that night? Seriously?

I think GZ couldn't live with the fact he was beat up by a teen. He wanted to be the hero like the stucco guys.

 

[lisalei321]

He was walking while on the phone with 911 saying he did know where TM was. The dispatcher asked him if he was following. "Yes" GZ said. Dispatcher told him "we don't need you to do that" so GZ said okay and according to his statement was returning to his vehicle when approached from behind by TM.

What evidence has been presented that shows something different happened?

Where Trayvon actually died? No where near the truck...

 

[m00c0w]

No, we don't. We only have one: the act of following. Your assumption about the intent to catch up is just that, an assumption.

I know. That's what makes it chasing.

That's quite a strawman argument. My clearly marked speculation does not make the entire thing speculation. It makes my clearly marked speculation... Speculation.

Negative.

Let's go back to your post:

Verb: Pursue in order to catch or catch up with: "police chased the stolen car"; "the dog chased after the stick".

Noun: An act of pursuing someone or something.

Synonyms:
verb. pursue - hunt - follow - run - chevy
noun. hunt - pursuit - hunting - shooting - chasing

This has already been settled. GZ was following TM, and GZ was carrying a gun. That's chasing someone with a gun.

What is your definition?

Pursue in order to catch or catch up with​

"IN ORDER TO" makes the second part necessary. It is not a strawman argument when using the definition you provided to show that you have not met all of the elements of the definition to call it that factually.

 

[corundogs]

IMO That smacks of a rape victim asking for it.

UUMMM...that would mean in my example that GZ would be dead.

George put himself into the situation. Someone else is now dead. George needs to pay the price for that.

NOTHING LIKE BLAMING THE VICTIM!

Of course, we have seen victim blaming of Trayvon. It has been repeatedly stated here that if he wasn't up to anything bad, he would have been home already.

If he thought he was being followed, he should have gone home.

Except common sense and recommendations of Law Enforcement tell you...if someone is following you, going home where there is no adult and only a smaller child is NOT A GOOD IDEA!!!

 

[iluvmua]

Are you stating you believe TM was going to murder GM that night? Seriously?

So you don't think George would have been seriously injured or killed?

JMO

 

[Linda7NJ]

Remember when they were talking about the lumps on GZ's head? This is what is confusing to me, I've seen guys with totally shaved head before and their heads are lumpy and bumpy. I guess it's rare to have a completely smooth head.

And isn't it interesting his head is now covered with hair!

My husband shaves off his hair in the summer. His head is super bumpy

 

[m00c0w]

IMO, if someone is running after me, I would call that chasing. And you don't usually chase the person if the second person is not running away. That's pretty much the basis of playing tag JMO.

We may just have to agree to disagree on this point :blowkiss:

In tag, the point is to catch the person. Yes, that would be chasing as both of the elements of the definition are met.

 

[Linda7NJ]

So you don't think George would have been seriously injured or killed?

JMO

No. Not for one second.

 

[Tenaciousdae]

I think it's good he had one as it saved his life. Concrete and skulls are a bad combo imo.

Yes fortunate indeed, considering he purchased the gun to protect himself from a vicious neighborhood pit bull!

Cars and skulls are a bad combo as well... GZ was loaded up with all kinds of protection. Too bad common sense wasn't his first line of defense...

IMHO! :seeya:

 

[Sweet Fox]

Scary to think she's allowed to testify she heard "wet grass" over a cell phone and can't even describe it. In a murder trial. What a farce.

Yes indeed, it is a farce.