Identified! Greece - LIVING 4 year old, with Roma couple, Oct'13 - #2

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It was reported that she is a gypsy child that was physically and psychologically neglected in the Greek Roma home where she was living. Permanent foster care is a terrible idea, but how can she live with an adoptive family given her early childhood. It seems almost as though she should be returned to the only family that she has ever known, and her family should be supported so that the children; she and her younger siblings, can be monitored and educated, provided with food, clothing and roof over the head, if necessary. It looks like they have a roof over their heads, but it's not really big enough for the whole family. I say return her to her family, let her parents out of jail, and support the family that sold her ... donations should come ... especially the 800 or 8000 families from all over the world that showed interest in claiming a true blond.
 
LadyL said:
[bbm]

That's the issue I have. The 'culture' seems to revolve around lying, thieving, and defrauding. Yes, I am judgmental of that. Anyone here who does not participate in a criminal lifestyle is judgmental of it just by virture of choosing not to do it.

Are we supposed to be ok with this just because it's the 'culture'?

By many accounts, the criminality is not isolated but is a way of life.

Linking it to poverty is not an acceptable reason for it to continue. I understand the Roma people have evolved this way due to history but that doesn't make it ok.

This post is not a personal attack on anyone but an attempt to understand more through discussion (especially you Gitana because I think you're awesome!).
Click to expand...

I feel compelled to respond to the bolded part since I don't think you can speak for me. I don't participate in criminal activity because I don't need to. I am part of the mainstream culture in a well to do country. I'm educated and I have no dependants. It wasn't the way of my family or most friends and doesn't enter my mind. I don't want the consequences of committing crime either. It's more inconvenient than convenient for me. But I don't judge all people who live that lifestyle, mainly because I don't understand what drives people to do it. I don't judge people for living that way if it's through necessity or social norms. There but for the grace of god go I. I wish they didn't need to live under the radar and opportunistically, but I think that it's a systemic issue and as long as people and governments judge and ignore them it will happen. And I can't blame them for that.
 
This case has made me look up Roma to learn more. There are a few videos of them dancing together in their homes. Young and old, very happy. They are a beautiful loving bunch of people with some really wise customs, such as not washing tops with bottoms. That's something I find disgusting too, and I'm not even Roma.
 
sfbaynancydrew said:
The "foster" Roma family now has a lawyer and is going to try to legally adopt Maria.

Honestly, seems like the best option to me.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/1...an-woman-mother-mystery-girl-from-gypsy-camp/
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From your link

"Maria's case has drawn global attention, playing on the shocking possibility of children being stolen from their parents or sold by them. But its handling by media and authorities has raised concerns of racism toward the European Union's estimated 6 million Gypsies -- a minority long marginalized in most of the continent."


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I wouldn't like to see her returned to the people who have raised her so far until there is some explanation about the other children they're registered as being parents to. Weren't there 14 other children registered in 10 months that are nowhere to be seen? I'm sure I read news stories about that but I'm on my phone and I'm hving trouble with some links.
 
fruity said:
I wouldn't like to see her returned to the people who have raised her so far until there is some explanation about the other children they're registered as being parents to. Weren't there 14 other children registered in 10 months that are nowhere to be seen? I'm sure I read news stories about that but I'm on my phone and I'm hving trouble with some links.
Click to expand...

BBM: houdini? :floorlaugh:
 
I can't find any msm saying they've proved it. And as I said in my post earlier, until they've shown it 100% I don't think Maria should be returned to them. Moo.
 
"Bulgaria's Child Protection Services went to Nikolaevo on Friday to carry out what they said was an assessment of Saska Ruseva's "suitability as a parent" and the family's living conditions.
By nightfall, the same state officials were back with police to take Angel and Minka (teen children of bio-parents) into protective care.
A female relative had taken in the youngsters. She began to wail loudly at the prospect of the adolescents being taken away.
Just then, we saw another neighbor dodge past the police officers and help Angel and Minka slip away into the night." http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/26/world/bulgaria-nikolaevo-roma/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
 
pieper4 said:
"Bulgaria's Child Protection Services went to Nikolaevo on Friday to carry out what they said was an assessment of Saska Ruseva's "suitability as a parent" and the family's living conditions.
By nightfall, the same state officials were back with police to take Angel and Minka (teen children of bio-parents) into protective care.
A female relative had taken in the youngsters. She began to wail loudly at the prospect of the adolescents being taken away.
Just then, we saw another neighbor dodge past the police officers and help Angel and Minka slip away into the night." http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/26/world/bulgaria-nikolaevo-roma/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
Click to expand...

Lovely.
 
pieper4 said:
"Bulgaria's Child Protection Services went to Nikolaevo on Friday to carry out what they said was an assessment of Saska Ruseva's "suitability as a parent" and the family's living conditions.
By nightfall, the same state officials were back with police to take Angel and Minka (teen children of bio-parents) into protective care.
A female relative had taken in the youngsters. She began to wail loudly at the prospect of the adolescents being taken away.
Just then, we saw another neighbor dodge past the police officers and help Angel and Minka slip away into the night." http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/26/world/bulgaria-nikolaevo-roma/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
Click to expand...

Heartbreaking.




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hopefully they find a lawyer to help them out with their legal matters.
at this point I will take anything printed about them with a grain of salt.
 
looks like the children were left with a relative what's the problem??
 
jjenny said:
Yea, they took off and apparently didn't even tell their kid they were leaving.
Isn't that nice?
Click to expand...

I think it's fair to appreciate that not everything reported is factual in its entirety. Not to mention that the Roma's often misrepresent facts/details due to mistrust of outsiders.
 
My question to the people who want to send Maria back to either of the two families is this:

Who the hell is "Michaelis"?

And why is he keeping tabs on Maria? (this is the guy that the Greek family claimed left her there, periodically visited, even after the couple was taken into custody, according to their lawyer).

Reporters who visited the bio-parents village report neighbors as claiming that it was common for pregnant women of the village to go to Greece to have babies, and leave them there for a fee. Who is buying these babies? Presumably not the Greek Roma, who probably enough babies of their own. So who then? And what role does "Michaelis" play? Is he the trafficker that organizes all this? Is the Greek village the place where the women are kept until they give birth?

We hear reports of bio-mom being arrested twice in Greece on suspicion of baby selling, one of which coincides with the approximate time Maria was apparently left there.

There is something evil going on here. On the face of it, it appears that the Bulgarian village has a nice little economy going on supported by selling their children. And individuals in the Greek village are participating on the other end. That is why there are so many lies and no one wants to really talk about it.

How do we know that this "Michaelis" individual does not own Maria, and will not come back some day to recover his "investment" when she is old enough?

That is why she should not go back to either of these communities.
 
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