Hannah Graham: The Search - #3

[FindHG]

Added to the map in my post above, to include this ticket below from the timeline (post #10)
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...h-Graham-MAPS-amp-TIMELINES-**NO-DISCUSSION**


4/22/05 – Hearing: waived/paid – Buckingham General District Court (Charlottesville address) 3/04/05 – Traffic Charge: Speeding

Buckingham County considered "The Geographical Center of Virginia"

http://www.buckinghamcountyva.org/

There's a big quarry, relatively isolated right between routes 15 and 60. If you "earth" format, it's hard to miss.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Man...a79c95ae01!2m2!1d-78.5545165!2d37.5518299!3e0

Could there be the slightest chance that the equal to the Texas killing fields for this predator may have been geographical heart of Virginia?

 

[FindHG]

I've been thinking about his escape route all day. What I keep coming back to is the thought that he probably didn't go too far for several reasons. Because he seems to be impulsive, I don't think he has the control to wait very long to get started. Also, unless he rendered Hannah completely unconscious soon after leaving Tempo, there's the chance she could have regained her wits. If she had been drugged, the effects of GHB last a very short time so he wouldn't have long to get where he was going. If she was drunk and fell asleep, he might have a bit longer but I don't think he would have taken the chance she would regain consciousness while he was driving, IMO.

Afterwards, he could then have taken her to a different location possibly, but I still don't think it would have been far away. And I think it was all done that night because he could not afford to be missing too long afterward or take a chance someone would see him.

With regard to being a regular downtown, I think he trolled that area because he saw it as the best chance to get lucky without people becoming suspicious. He obviously didn't think he was being videotaped because of the controversy in town about cameras and the lack thereof, thank goodness.

ETA: I hope that LE revisits some of the areas they have searched closer to town because it's difficult to cover every inch the first time.

I suspect he may have been off his mark that night, when his eyes locked on Hannah Graham. According to Coy Barefoot's Timeline, he was reported shot down by a number of women, ditch by the group he'd run into, chastised by a man for being inappropriate, so one could be justified in thinking he may have been somewhat humiliated and angry. But once he was intent on taking Hannah Graham, he may have been in a hyper predator mode. He may have fallen to instincts, especially with hiding her.

You know sometimes when your driving someplace very familiar, you'll catch yourself and wonder how you got that far, because you drove by instinct, the same routine. Maybe his routine may have been that well ingrained in him.

 

[FindHG]

He received the tickets below after Morgan Harrington was found.

3/17/10 Trespassing after Forbidden – Keswick, VA 22947

3/24/10 Traffic Charges – Speeding – Keswick, VA 22947

he was in court the day she was found

~~1/26/10 Morgan Harrington body found at Anchorage Farm in Southern Albemarle County
1/26/10 Hearing: RE: 10/2/09 Traffic charges - dismissed

from the timeline post #10
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...h-Graham-MAPS-amp-TIMELINES-**NO-DISCUSSION**

 

[zapped]

Does anyone know if they have searched Palmyra? Its 30 minutes away by car from Charlottesville and certain areas are VERY secluded.JLM could have traveled by back road, straight down Rt 53.

I wonder if he has any friends or family that live in Fluvanna county. Much of that area is farmland and extremely rural.

 

[FindHG]

Just a goof, but can you see the man and his shadow there, no dreads, I think. There's a fairly big person right at the edge of the forest, by the access road, where the brown pool of water has a curving line, in the south-east corner of the quarry. He's pointed toward a pile of rocks or something. With JM's luck with camera's what are the chances that could be him? Not good, I know.

There's a clearing with a tree or something at the center to the man's right, if you zoom out a bit. It has great isolated access right off the RT60. you see that grassy line cut through trees right to the quarry.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Man...a79c95ae01!2m2!1d-78.5545165!2d37.5518299!3e0

 

[FindHG]

"What colleges shared about U-Va. suspect, then accused of sexual assault, is murky"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...d6c-11e4-aa5e-7153e466a02d_story.html?hpid=z5

 

[margarita25]

Good morning everyone :coffee:

BBM for reference:

Although deer season (firearms) is weeks away, many hunters will go into the woods ahead of time to scope out and prepare areas to set up camps or stands. This provides so many more eyes out there that can help in the search; what has LE done to reach out to this group, beyond simply making statements to the media? It would be great if every license application or renewal came with a flyer describing her clothing and items, etc.

When as bow season started and they asked hunters to be on the look out, I found a thread from a northern state far from Va where bow men were discussing the search for Hannah Graham. So the word went out some, I guess as a result.

Dylan Redwine was one of our little sweethearts here on WS who went missing from the Durango, CO area (Lake Vallecito, La Plata County) nearly 2 years ago. His partial remains were recovered last summer atop a mountain near his home. Here is a great example of reaching out to hunters:



Dylan Redwine's family asks hunters to look out for missing teen's belongings
Family hopes to promote public awareness

"DURANGO, Colo. - Dylan Redwine's brother hopes a new flier asking hunters and hikers to be on the lookout for the 13-year-old's belongings will raise public awareness that there are still no arrests.

Cory Redwine, 21, showed 7NEWS the flier, which has pictures of Dylan's backpack, his Blue Devils cap and the type of Verizon flip phone he was carrying.

"I just want to keep Dylan's story and Dylan's heart in the front of everybody's mind," said Cory."



http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/local-news/dylan-redwines-family-asks-hunters-to-look-out-for-missing-teens-belongings09242014

 

[zapped]

Wasn't aware there was voluminous evidence? All we know is that LE has a forensic link between MH and HG. If I recall correctly, they had to search JM's car a second time just to find evidence to support the Abduction charge. They just.p needed enough to show probable cause which is not difficult to establish from what I read. A forensic link could be a fiber from HG found in JM's car or apartment. Even a hair exchange...in the absence of a body it is very weak as this exchange can be explained by their contact on the mall.

Coy Barefoots 10/8 podcast is at the link below. Coy didnt name his source and doesnt have to as a journalist since its protected under the 1st Amendment.

IMO it was probably a member of LE.

Start at the 33:30 mark and listen from there. Coy's statement about the voluminous amount of evidence from an unnamed source is at 36:52.

http://insidecville.com/city/hannah-update-10-8-14/

Barefoot also goes in great detail about the search and efforts to help the searchers out by providing money, food and shelter.

 

[Foxfire]

"What colleges shared about U-Va. suspect, then accused of sexual assault, is murky"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...d6c-11e4-aa5e-7153e466a02d_story.html?hpid=z5

Seems Liberty University and CNU is in CYA mode... "Silence is the predators most lethal weapon".. Heads should roll, imo..
If Liberty administrators had involuntarily withdrawn a student during 2002, the student’s record would show “official withdrawal” — a term that covers expulsions and suspensions for discipline but also would be used for a student who chose to withdraw for a medical reason or bereavement.
__________________

<sniped from article link above->

&#8220;Other than death or a student in a coma, though, Administrative Withdrawal is generally used for disciplinary separations,&#8221; Liberty officials wrote. They said that they cannot say under what terms Matthew left the school.

When CNU dismisses students for academic or disciplinary reasons, &#8220;that is always placed prominently on the student&#8217;s transcript,&#8221; CNU President Paul S. Trible Jr. said. &#8220;Tragically, we have recently learned that is not done by many schools.&#8221;

But there was a second avenue for delving into Matthew&#8217;s history on campus.

As a transferring football player, Matthew faced a review of his eligibility to play under NCAA rules. The two universities appear at odds over what was presented about Matthew in &#8220;tracer forms&#8221; for athletes.

Trible said that before CNU accepts a transferring athlete, it requires signed statements from the athlete and from the athletics department he is leaving that say the player is in good standing with regard to academics and disciplinary matters.

&#8220;They would not be in uniform here otherwise,&#8221; said Trible, who has led CNU for 18 years. &#8220;We follow that in every instance, and that has been the process in place since I&#8217;ve been here.&#8221;

Liberty said it does not keep athletic transfer forms for longer than a decade and could not say what questions or follow-ups CNU might have asked in Matthew&#8217;s situation.

But after hearing CNU&#8217;s account to The Post, Liberty officials asked CNU for a copy of the tracer forms sent during the 2002-2003 period and said they were told that CNU no longer had the records. A CNU spokeswoman said the school could not provide additional documents or further information on that point.

<sniped - read more>

 

[margarita25]

He received the tickets below after Morgan Harrington was found.

3/17/10 Trespassing after Forbidden &#8211; Keswick, VA 22947

3/24/10 Traffic Charges &#8211; Speeding &#8211; Keswick, VA 22947

he was in court the day she was found

~~1/26/10 Morgan Harrington body found at Anchorage Farm in Southern Albemarle County
1/26/10 Hearing: RE: 10/2/09 Traffic charges - dismissed

from the timeline post #10
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...h-Graham-MAPS-amp-TIMELINES-**NO-DISCUSSION**

Good stuff. Keswick, huh?

I wonder where he was tresspasing specifically and what the circumstances are re: this charge?

Also, I know speeding is a common charge not necessarily related to anything, but I can not help but think of Arron Lewis who killed Beverly Carter, how he was speeding shortly afterwards (near where BC was buried), which caused a crash and helped lead up to his arrest.

So, I can not help but wonder, was he trying to get away from somewhere fast for a specific reason?

 

[Emaa]

Good stuff. Keswick, huh?

I wonder where he was tresspasing specifically and what the circumstances are re: this charge?

Trespass was at a garage where JLM was upset about work done on his car and was asked to leave the premises four times.

 

[zapped]

Trespass was at a garage where JLM was upset about work done on his car and was asked to leave the premises four times.

Took me some digging but the info you asked for earlier is in post # 828.

 

[margarita25]

Considering where he raped women at universities;

the potential forensic evidence tying him to the Fairfax victim;

(then add to that, not for any reason at all and certainly none that I know of)

if there may be a tie to just some of the other missing women listed on the timeline (post #10)
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...h-Graham-MAPS-amp-TIMELINES-**NO-DISCUSSION**

Then his awareness space may have been pretty broad.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Man...079042!1m3!2m2!1d-77.5877652!2d38.1979096!3e0

Okay, looking at this very useful map, what about somewhere right off 1-95, smack dab in the middle there, maybe by Milford?

eta: ugh, just saw Mechanicsville; Iirc, I referred to that area when troubleshooting RAT...trying to remember why :lookingitup:

 

[zapped]

Seems Liberty University and CNU is in CYA mode... "Silence is the predators most lethal weapon".. Heads should roll, imo..
If Liberty administrators had involuntarily withdrawn a student during 2002, the student&#8217;s record would show &#8220;official withdrawal&#8221; &#8212; a term that covers expulsions and suspensions for discipline but also would be used for a student who chose to withdraw for a medical reason or bereavement.
__________________

<sniped from article link above->

&#8220;Other than death or a student in a coma, though, Administrative Withdrawal is generally used for disciplinary separations,&#8221; Liberty officials wrote. They said that they cannot say under what terms Matthew left the school.

When CNU dismisses students for academic or disciplinary reasons, &#8220;that is always placed prominently on the student&#8217;s transcript,&#8221; CNU President Paul S. Trible Jr. said. &#8220;Tragically, we have recently learned that is not done by many schools.&#8221;

But there was a second avenue for delving into Matthew&#8217;s history on campus.

As a transferring football player, Matthew faced a review of his eligibility to play under NCAA rules. The two universities appear at odds over what was presented about Matthew in &#8220;tracer forms&#8221; for athletes.

Trible said that before CNU accepts a transferring athlete, it requires signed statements from the athlete and from the athletics department he is leaving that say the player is in good standing with regard to academics and disciplinary matters.

&#8220;They would not be in uniform here otherwise,&#8221; said Trible, who has led CNU for 18 years. &#8220;We follow that in every instance, and that has been the process in place since I&#8217;ve been here.&#8221;

Liberty said it does not keep athletic transfer forms for longer than a decade and could not say what questions or follow-ups CNU might have asked in Matthew&#8217;s situation.

But after hearing CNU&#8217;s account to The Post, Liberty officials asked CNU for a copy of the tracer forms sent during the 2002-2003 period and said they were told that CNU no longer had the records. A CNU spokeswoman said the school could not provide additional documents or further information on that point.

<sniped - read more>

IIRC someone said in an earlier thread that JLM "rode the bench" at CNU. Perhaps this was the reason?

Maybe they allowed him to be a part of the team but not actually play until they received his records from Liberty?

More than one person has said that JLM could appear very likeable and persuasive and I can see a school bending the rules a little for a football player with talent.

 

[Bryan9]

...250W...

You mean 250E, right? I live in Charlottesville, and we always refer to 250 in the following way:

*250W West from Charlottesville downtown, toward Ivy and the Blue Ridge
*250E East from Charlottesville downtown, toward Richmond

 

[SolVol]

Seems Liberty University and CNU is in CYA mode... "Silence is the predators most lethal weapon".. Heads should roll, imo..
If Liberty administrators had involuntarily withdrawn a student during 2002, the student’s record would show “official withdrawal” — a term that covers expulsions and suspensions for discipline but also would be used for a student who chose to withdraw for a medical reason or bereavement.
__________________

<sniped from article link above->

“Other than death or a student in a coma, though, Administrative Withdrawal is generally used for disciplinary separations,” Liberty officials wrote. They said that they cannot say under what terms Matthew left the school.

When CNU dismisses students for academic or disciplinary reasons, “that is always placed prominently on the student’s transcript,” CNU President Paul S. Trible Jr. said. “Tragically, we have recently learned that is not done by many schools.”

But there was a second avenue for delving into Matthew’s history on campus.

As a transferring football player, Matthew faced a review of his eligibility to play under NCAA rules. The two universities appear at odds over what was presented about Matthew in “tracer forms” for athletes.

Trible said that before CNU accepts a transferring athlete, it requires signed statements from the athlete and from the athletics department he is leaving that say the player is in good standing with regard to academics and disciplinary matters.

“They would not be in uniform here otherwise,” said Trible, who has led CNU for 18 years. “We follow that in every instance, and that has been the process in place since I’ve been here.”

Liberty said it does not keep athletic transfer forms for longer than a decade and could not say what questions or follow-ups CNU might have asked in Matthew’s situation.

But after hearing CNU’s account to The Post, Liberty officials asked CNU for a copy of the tracer forms sent during the 2002-2003 period and said they were told that CNU no longer had the records. A CNU spokeswoman said the school could not provide additional documents or further information on that point.

<sniped - read more>

You need to move this great comment to the thread, what is known about JLM or the thread about charges against JLM, since it's not about the SEARCH. We need to only talk about the SEARCH on this thread.

 

[margarita25]

Ok, here's a thought. (Bare with me, I hope I can make sense here).

Sometimes serial killers have a couple or few favorite spots where they choose to dump their victims (for example Dean Corll, probably one of the sickest guys to ever walk the earth, warning on the link, extremely graphic).

So, if JM is potentially tied to the murder of any individuals prior to MH, he may have used a different location(s) than MH for that victim(s).

So, when MH was found, he might have thought, well maybe he should go back to the "other spot(s)" (or at least the proximity), since that seems to have worked and has not been discovered yet.

So, in other words/addition, perhaps if there is an earlier victim whom we KNOW we can tie to JM, if we find her, maybe we can get closer to finding Hannah. (JM would have been a younger predator, less experienced in his disposal techniques, so maybe it would not be as challenging here to troubleshoot one of his earlier disposal sites?)

 

[Bryan9]

...He could drive in any direction and no one would notice him, even in that car, as most others on the road are probably intoxicated to some degree and just want to go unnoticed themselves....

This was discussed quite a bit way back in this thread... His car was a mark for a police pullover. His inspection was outdated. The car was in terrible condition, and likely had a missing taillight or headlight. Plus, LE was "driving while black," a risk in itself, I'm sorry to say. Unless he was asking for an arrest, he would have left Charlottesville on two-lane, poorly lighted roads in which police presence is minimal.

 

[Foxfire]

briefed respectfully

I have no idea if this information is credible, but I recall a while back in a thread a person mentioning that LE had his phone records and that he'd killed it soon after leaving the Tempo area. Again, you may find it in the thread, but it sounded like good info to me.

Seems logical that if investigators have a last ping location of JM's cell phone. This would give them an indicator of JM's probable direction of travel and would have alleviated the need to do the radius searches. Due to JM's experience, escalation, lessons learned, and dependent upon the window of time that JM spent with HM in captivity. HG's remains may be located as far as 25 to 60 miles away.

An experienced escalated sexual predator/serial killer in GA that I have diligently researched disposed of his last abduction victim over 60 miles away from the abduction site; Herbert Reese hiking trail(AT) Blood Mtn., GA. She was decapitated and disposed of in two different locations of Dawson Forest State Park WMA... Bleach was poured over her torso and it was disposed of near a swamp due to water attracting animals/scavengers.. The head was placed in a white trash bag and buried under a fallen tree over a half mile away and 200 yards up a ridge on a food plot trail.

The emulator serial killer; Gary M. Hilton; the forest killer, was a collector as was T Bundy..jmo

 

[margarita25]

(I feel like the answer is right here in front of us and we just can't see it yet. It's like a "on the tip of my tongue" kind of feeling...I do feel we are close, and I do feel like it has been mentioned here, somewhere...(probably by a local). jmo)