Hannah Graham: The Search - #3

[hambirg]

You mean 250E, right? I live in Charlottesville, and we always refer to 250 in the following way:

*250W West from Charlottesville downtown, toward Ivy and the Blue Ridge
*250E East from Charlottesville downtown, toward Richmond

Yes, east. . .sorry. :doh:

 

[FindHG]

250 and 64 are four lane highways (though 64 expands near more populated areas). The other numbers are most likely 2-lane, 50-55 mph roads. The named streets are probably residential or commercial, 35 or 25 mph roads. Hope that helps.

And it's all pretty much rural. Fredericksburg is the biggest city in Spotsylvania. BUT I highly doubt he went north. South would be his comfort zone and much easier to hide something.

Sorry, I hadn't seen your information before. Thanks so much for your help. I think this perp is rubbing off on me, because I'm brazenly going to ask you one more thing. It would seem the quarry area in Buckingham located between Rts 60 and 15 has the advantage of multiple approaches. That would make him less remarkable to police going back and forth. Can you tell me more about the various roads between c-ville and Buckingham, please. Thank you.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Buc...86f096c38b74fc!2m2!1d-78.4766781!2d38.0293059

 

[FindHG]

(I feel like the answer is right here in front of us and we just can't see it yet. It's like a "on the tip of my tongue" kind of feeling...I do feel we are close, and I do feel like it has been mentioned here, somewhere...jmo)

from your lips...

 

[margarita25]

from your lips...

huh? lol, what do you mean? You think I might have mentioned it? tia

(I added "probably by a local" to my above post (post #840))

 

[FindHG]

We've been over this a zillion times. His car was a mark for a police pullover. His inspection was outdated. The car was in terrible condition, and likely had a missing taillight or headlight. Plus, LE was "driving while black," a risk in itself, I'm sorry to say. Unless he was asking for an arrest, he would have left Charlottesville on two-lane, poorly lighted roads in which police presence is minimal.

Whatever car or cars he may have used, he still sped with it a lot, as the speeding tickets show. He also did get that ticket as far Buckingham, and it does kind of fall in the center of things.

 

[margarita25]

Seems logical that if investigators have a last ping location of JM's cell phone. This would give them an indicator of JM's probable direction of travel and would have alleviated the need to do the radius searches. Due to JM's experience, escalation, lessons learned, and dependent upon the window of time that JM spent with HM in captivity. HG's remains may be located as far as 25 to 60 miles away.

An experienced escalated sexual predator/serial killer in GA that I have diligently researched disposed of his last abduction victim over 60 miles away from the abduction site; Herbert Reese hiking trail(AT) Blood Mtn., GA. She was decapitated and disposed of in two different locations of Dawson Forest State Park WMA... Bleach was poured over her torso and it was disposed of near a swamp due to water attracting animals/scavengers.. The head was placed in a white trash bag and buried under a fallen tree over a half mile away and 200 yards up a ridge on a food plot trail.

The emulator serial killer; Gary M. Hilton; the forest killer, was a collector as was T Bundy..jmo

There's the bleach again...(cleaning supplies removed from JM's residence?)

 

[margarita25]

(I don't see JM as a "dismemberer", but then again, how does one see one as that, lol)

Then again, he was in the medical field...

 

[margarita25]

(Around a year ago I was given a disc for some incredible government-type mapping software, arcgis, only to find out I was not able to use it (permissions). My intention had been back then to use it in situations like this. I really want to convert shutterbug22's awesome timeline into a visual map, with all of his/her notations plotted. I used to do google maps here, then they changed the format, blah blah blah. In other words, I need to get back into mapping, and learn how to do all that cool mapping staff like how Holly and Otto do here. So, I'm going to attempt to take off here and go learn some map stuff, with the hopes that my ADD doesn't get in the way).

eta: Yay, just found a tutorial:
https://support.google.com/mapmaker/?hl=en#topic=3180752

 

[FindHG]

Okay, looking at this very useful map, what about somewhere right off 1-95, smack dab in the middle there, maybe by Milford?

eta: ugh, just saw Mechanicsville; Iirc, I referred to that area when troubleshooting RAT...trying to remember why :lookingitup:

Based on this map, and your idea that he went back to what worked, and that he had left Spotsylvania on his Facebook page, and with the early missing victim from there never found, he may have gone back there.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Man...a79c95ae01!2m2!1d-78.5545165!2d37.5518299!3e0

But the quarry area in Buckingham seems like a perfect fit for his needs in terms of risk (various Rts there and back, access, isolation, not too far, not to close either.

 

[Foxfire]

We've been over this a zillion times. His car was a mark for a police pullover. His inspection was outdated. The car was in terrible condition, and likely had a missing taillight or headlight. Plus, LE was "driving while black," a risk in itself, I'm sorry to say. Unless he was asking for an arrest, he would have left Charlottesville on two-lane, poorly lighted roads in which police presence is minimal.

Yes Bryan9, I agree, less traffic cams, less traffic/witnesses.. Although I do disagree with the driving while black risk.. Many times LE is hesitant to trust their instincts due to being labeled a racist. The abduction/rape/torture/murder of 27 yr old Julie Love<Atlanta 1988>by multiple AA's is an excellent example of this. An APD cruiser pulled up next to her abductors car and although suspicious of the occupants' behavior did not intervene due to the fear of political consequences. Julie was held in the rear floorboard of their car with Hammond's foot on her neck.
Ironically, Emanuel F. Hammond, later took Julie Love to his grandmother's house while in captivity.

http://www.clarkprosecutor.org/html/death/US/hammond1238.htm
Emmanuel Fitzgerald Hammond
Executed January 25, 2011 11:39 p.m. by Lethal Injection in Georgia

 

[margarita25]

Ok, here's another thought:
(so much for my map tutorial---see how bad my ADD is, lol)

JM seems to me to be an impulsive type of killer, as opposed to one who maybe plans/stalks his particular victims well in advance. (For example, MH seemed to be a "crime of opportunity", as potentially HG was, and maybe his prior sexual assault victims.)

With that being said, would his disposal sites be equally as impulsive (less organized)? (And therefore easier to find?)

 

[FindHG]

Trespass was at a garage where JLM was upset about work done on his car and was asked to leave the premises four times.

Yes. The point being that somewhere in his conscience or sub-conscience behavior patterns there is something going on that he may have been getting tickets where he's most excited.

 

[margarita25]

I've been thinking about his escape route all day. What I keep coming back to is the thought that he probably didn't go too far for several reasons. Because he seems to be impulsive, I don't think he has the control to wait very long to get started. Also, unless he rendered Hannah completely unconscious soon after leaving Tempo, there's the chance she could have regained her wits. If she had been drugged, the effects of GHB last a very short time so he wouldn't have long to get where he was going. If she was drunk and fell asleep, he might have a bit longer but I don't think he would have taken the chance she would regain consciousness while he was driving, IMO.

Afterwards, he could then have taken her to a different location possibly, but I still don't think it would have been far away. And I think it was all done that night because he could not afford to be missing too long afterward or take a chance someone would see him.

With regard to being a regular downtown, I think he trolled that area because he saw it as the best chance to get lucky without people becoming suspicious. He obviously didn't think he was being videotaped because of the controversy in town about cameras and the lack thereof, thank goodness.

ETA: I hope that LE revisits some of the areas they have searched closer to town because it's difficult to cover every inch the first time.

(I just saw this post, how funny because right above (post 851) I just posted about him being "impulsive", as well as my own ADD as related to trying to take this online map tutorial, and guess what your name is: "Distracted", lol)

 

[FindHG]

(I feel like the answer is right here in front of us and we just can't see it yet. It's like a "on the tip of my tongue" kind of feeling...I do feel we are close, and I do feel like it has been mentioned here, somewhere...(probably by a local). jmo)

Yes, could you mean the "hidey hole" comment?

 

[margarita25]

It was probably 2-3am when he looked for a spot (assuming he killed her, of course). No traffic. He could drive in any direction and no one would notice him, even in that car, as most others on the road are probably intoxicated to some degree and just want to go unnoticed themselves. Why not drive a while? He had likely sobered up due to what had occurred and needed to think what he would do next. Maybe fifteen, twenty miles out, maybe more. It was dark for hours yet. And show up home in the morning sometime but way too tired or wired to attend football practice. Wherever Hannah is could be just so random, so outside of the local search area, that LE will never get there.

rsbm

Jmo

Agreed, I think he might have driven a further distance...

Also, one thing to note is sometimes killers do not always dispose of their victims that same day (I've noticed this often with predators who bring their victims back to their homes)...I've noticed in some cases there seems to be a time period of around 24 hours before they venture out and deal with the disposal aspect. I'm not sure if JM would have done that here in Hannah's case, but maybe he brought her home and left her in the trunk, or garage, or maybe even a cooler, or stored her elsewhere for a while before getting rid of her body?

 

[Piaget]

One thing we can be pretty sure of is that JM had five years after MH was found to imagine his next crime and to think about where he would leave his next victim. That's time to scope out, plan and even prepare a hiding place. While he might be impulsive and opportunistic in his victim selection, I suspect he was deliberate and well prepared for an efficient aftermath.

 

[margarita25]

One thing we can be pretty sure of is that JM had five years after MH was found to imagine his next crime and to think about where he would leave his next victim. That's time to scope out, plan and even prepare a hiding place. While he might be impulsive and opportunistic in his victim selection, I suspect he was deliberate and well prepared for an efficient aftermath.

I think this is a great post.

 

[SteveP]

One thing we can be pretty sure of is that JM had five years after MH was found to imagine his next crime and to think about where he would leave his next victim. That's time to scope out, plan and even prepare a hiding place. While he might be impulsive and opportunistic in his victim selection, I suspect he was deliberate and well prepared for an efficient aftermath.

BBM...this is true if we are to assume he had no victims between Morgan and Hannah. Neither I, nor many others here, are inclined to believe that is likely. JMO

 

[margarita25]

Foxfire, you are the serial killer expert here...what do you think about all of this in a nutshell? (Disposal distance, sites, technique, etc).

Tia

 

[margarita25]

One thing we can be pretty sure of is that JM had five years after MH was found to imagine his next crime and to think about where he would leave his next victim. That's time to scope out, plan and even prepare a hiding place. While he might be impulsive and opportunistic in his victim selection, I suspect he was deliberate and well prepared for an efficient aftermath.

BBM...this is true if we are to assume he had no victims between Morgan and Hannah. Neither I, nor many others here, are prone to believe that is likely. JMO

How about this then (a compromise between the 2 thoughts): He had 5 years to experiment with and improve his techniques.