IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #11

[cindysue]

The bikes were on the trail and the purse was on the lake side of the fence, 20 feet east of the bikes. It seems to me that the best explanation is that the girls went over the chainlink fence where their bikes were parked and Elizabeth lost her purse walking east.

If the girls were abducted on the path where their bikes were found, I think the perp would want to get them off the path as fast as possible, and that means straight over the fence, whether the girls wanted to go over the fence or not.

How about more than one perp handing the kids up and over? Or if there is a hole in the fence

 

[Copper]

bbm
I'm afraid that's true.
If Im remembering correctly the FBI
said there was proof the girls were alive.
The next day local LE said there was nothing
new and said no more pressers.
To me that said, they had nothing.
:moo:

The FBI and local LE have nothing, so they pick that moment to end their briefings (and the family too it seems went quiet about the same time). That doesn't make much sense to me. That seems like the point where they'd want really press hard, say "we need the public's help on this," get the word out that the search is starting to sputter.

This silence all around has me thinking they are silent for a reason.

 

[tlcya]

I am not sold yet on the girls being abducted from the lake/bike trail. I am still mulling over the possibility they were nabbed nearer to the Collins home and subdued secured somewhere while perp took bikes and purse for staging at lake.

I agree, if girls were taken where bikes found then the perp putting them over a fence seems less likely to me. more difficult to control two girls in that scenario :cow:

Maiden lane and the filter station turnout would be very handy for someone with familiarity of the area to use in dumping the bikes with least likeliness of being seen IF they had already grabbed and secured the girls elsewhere :cow:

 

[GateKeeper]

a bit of info from the parks commission on rules and regs at Meyers Lake and other parks/rec areas in Evansdale.

http://evansdale.govoffice.com/vert...ds/{55147538-DB11-4E16-B57A-9B276DF1DFAA}.PDF

http://evansdale.govoffice.com/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC={8EF62527-035A-4C03-B1B3-D588CCFD5E5E}&DE=

Wow...12,000 posts !!!
Youre such a show off!!

 

[GrainneDhu]

I thoughT I read a ways back the fence had an opening cut into it.. Does anyone know? I could be totally wrong tho

The fence on the interstate side of the trail has a hole in it due to a car accident a couple years ago.

However, I think the interstate can be ruled out as the place where the perp came directly from or took the girls directly to. It was under construction, both directions were using one side only and the shoulders in that area were of minimal width.

A vehicle that was pulled over for even 15 seconds would stick out like a sore thumb (and obstruct traffic with the first semi going in that direction).

 

[Strawberry Fields]

The fence on the interstate side of the trail has a hole in it due to a car accident a couple years ago.

However, I think the interstate can be ruled out as the place where the perp came directly from or took the girls directly to. It was under construction, both directions were using one side only and the shoulders in that area were of minimal width.

A vehicle that was pulled over for even 15 seconds would stick out like a sore thumb (and obstruct traffic with the first semi going in that direction).

I'm not familiar with the area but if the interstate was under construction, a vehicle from the highway department would not "stick out like a sore thumb". I have to admit I have only been lurking and have not read every single post and not sure if this scenario has been discussed, but seeing how thorough you all are, I feel pretty sure it has. JMO

 

[cindysue]

I am not sold yet on the girls being abducted from the lake/bike trail. I am still mulling over the possibility they were nabbed nearer to the Collins home and subdued secured somewhere while perp took bikes and purse for staging at lake.

I agree, if girls were taken where bikes found then the perp putting them over a fence seems less likely to me. more difficult to control two girls in that scenario :cow:

Maiden lane and the filter station turnout would be very handy for someone with familiarity of the area to use in dumping the bikes with least likeliness of being seen IF they had already grabbed and secured the girls elsewhere :cow:

I think the time the girls were seen on CCTV and the bikes were found laying on the trail wouldn't work with that theory, but if three perps were involved like the recent case. There could be one guy on the lake side receiving the girls one guy lifting a girl while the female perp holds the other girl til he lifts her over too. Then all go to waiting car.

 

[huckleberryhound]

I've considered the possibility that they have seen one or both of the girls on a *advertiser censored* site.

That possibility could explain the missing poster that said something like "WE FORGIVE YOU" and didn't Grandma make a plea to the kidnappers to let them go "even if they were hurt"?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

So true, but that was actually a multiple murder followed by abduction.

Not the same thing at all.

Further, the perp in that case had all the time and privacy in the world to do exactly what he wanted.

That is not the case here.

I do know what you mean but the point of the discussion was 'had more than one child been kidnapped at one time' and the answer would be 'yes.' I have a feeling if Duncan had not gone in their home he would have found another way to kidnap them when they were by themselves. Just like he was suspected of doing in Washington State when two little sisters went missing the very day he was at the public pool where they were and were later found murdered not too far from the pool. Which is another example of more than one child being taken at one time.

We dont know how much time went into planning this abduction either. Maybe it started when he began to see the girls riding their bikes everyday through the summertime.

More than one child can be abducted by a predator. It has happened even if you want to dismiss the Greone case. IMO, it has happened again in this case.

And even if it had never happened before never means it couldnt have happened in this case. The missing poster says both of these children were "Kidnapped."

IMO

 

[tlcya]

Wow...12,000 posts !!!
Youre such a show off!!

bwahah! Nope just opinionated, talkative and nosy.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The fence on the interstate side of the trail has a hole in it due to a car accident a couple years ago.

However, I think the interstate can be ruled out as the place where the perp came directly from or took the girls directly to. It was under construction, both directions were using one side only and the shoulders in that area were of minimal width.

A vehicle that was pulled over for even 15 seconds would stick out like a sore thumb (and obstruct traffic with the first semi going in that direction).

Would a highway construction company vehicle stand out if they were off the road or riding around the lake area close by?

IMO

 

[craftybatchy]

The fence on the interstate side of the trail has a hole in it due to a car accident a couple years ago.

However, I think the interstate can be ruled out as the place where the perp came directly from or took the girls directly to. It was under construction, both directions were using one side only and the shoulders in that area were of minimal width.

A vehicle that was pulled over for even 15 seconds would stick out like a sore thumb (and obstruct traffic with the first semi going in that direction).

Unless whomever took the girls was in a construction vehicle . A white chevy astro w/no windows wouldn't stick out like a sore thumb in that particular setting, would it ?

 

[lishac23]

I am not sold yet on the girls being abducted from the lake/bike trail. I am still mulling over the possibility they were nabbed nearer to the Collins home and subdued secured somewhere while perp took bikes and purse for staging at lake.

I agree, if girls were taken where bikes found then the perp putting them over a fence seems less likely to me. more difficult to control two girls in that scenario :cow:

Maiden lane and the filter station turnout would be very handy for someone with familiarity of the area to use in dumping the bikes with least likeliness of being seen IF they had already grabbed and secured the girls elsewhere :cow:

I've also debated this (with myself) over the last few weeks and while I want to believe GMA and the family (that they wouldn't have went that far on their own), I find it hard to explain why anyone would have took the time to stage the bikes and the purse. If the girls were taken while riding close to home, why take the extra steps in planting the bikes on the trail...in plain sight and risk being spotted. There are other places they could have been tossed and probably wouldn't have been found for days if not at all.

 

[superbee]

OK, that pump house question was bothering me so I called the Evansdale Parks and Rec and Iowa DNR. I was told that DNR stocks fish in Meyers lake and the "pump house" is not that at all, it is a SEWER LIFT STATION. THe lady I talked to said it is maintained by the city and locked at all times, there is now way the girls could have gotten in there or perp did something there to hide the girls....

I have been around several people in who have used locks in their private and working life. I have been told that there are very few locks that cannot be opened by one way or another if there is a devious mind that wants to. So the lock on the sewer lift station may not be all that secure. In the time it has been there, probably more than one person had the key, or more probably the workers have a master key that opens alot of the locks in town. If good people have master keys, then it is not much of a stretch to imagine that bad people have master keys too.

Pumps are pumps, whether they are moving water or sewage. And they are usually held in building to shield them from the elements, and tampering and vandalism. I sincerley hope the pump building was thoroughly examined for the girls, whom I am praying for every day.

 

[MNDad]

How about more than one perp handing the kids up and over? Or if there is a hole in the fence

Lyric is 4'11" and 145lbs. My daughter isn't even close to that and I can't lift her anymore.

I really think they could have gone through the gate to play by the waters edge and were escorted to the wooded area dropping her purse on the way.

 

[Marnie]

I recall one of our locals telling us that the fence had a broken area that had been caused by some sort of traffic accident and gone unrepaired for some months but honestly I can't recall who provided that info. I only know a broken area of fencing near where the bikes were found was discussed waaaay back in the days right after the girls were missing.

The fence on the interstate side of the trail has a hole in it due to a car accident a couple years ago.

However, I think the interstate can be ruled out as the place where the perp came directly from or took the girls directly to. It was under construction, both directions were using one side only and the shoulders in that area were of minimal width.

A vehicle that was pulled over for even 15 seconds would stick out like a sore thumb (and obstruct traffic with the first semi going in that direction).

Here's the pic of the broken fence. I agree with GrainneDhu, the girls and or bikes were not moved through this area. Too many potential witnesses.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I'm not familiar with the area but if the interstate was under construction, a vehicle from the highway department would not "stick out like a sore thumb". I have to admit I have only been lurking and have not read every single post and not sure if this scenario has been discussed, but seeing how thorough you all are, I feel pretty sure it has. JMO

Good point.

I could see that as a means for the perp to get there but not as a means for the perp to get the girls away. A 4 foot tall person is not going to look right getting into a highway construction truck and would attract attention, I think.

LE did say they had checked with the construction crews working on I-380 in that area.

 

[Copper]

The interstate isn't a viable option, IMHO. The south/away from the lake/eastbound lanes are the ones under construction. So I don't see how a construction looking vehicle could be parked on the north/close to the lake/westbound lanes without looking out of place. And as mentioned before, since the westbound lanes are carrying traffic both ways, there would be very little shoulder for anyone to park for any amount of time.

 

[Strawberry Fields]

It seems to me that the FBI or the local LE would be more vocal about things like asking people to search their own outbuildings, property, and also I think in the Holly Bobo case, they would say to the locals to try and observe if someone has suddenly left town or changed their normal routine or just to try to think about any unusual activity in their area. I did see the pressers in the early days of the Elizabeth and Lyric's disappearance and do not recall these things being mentioned. May have missed it though. Brittany Smith disappeared from the area where we live and the police chief tried to hold a presser every day and I was impressed that he would say he was only interested in bringing her home and would not discuss anything else until she was home safely. (Sadly, although she was found and returned to her family, her mother was savagely murdered). I know each case is different and I think LE and the FBI probably are working round the clock looking for these girls. JMO and thoughts.

 

[MNDad]

Authorities return to lake in search for cousins
"Evansdale Police Chief Kent Smock says officers were looking in a wooded area near the lake."

http://www.kwqc.com/story/19192207/authorities-return-to-lake-in-search-for-cousins