IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #15

[SapphireSteel]

I know that I don't believe that TG is untruthful or truthful. I really think only time will tell, and he is an important voice in this situation. I won't blindly rule him out or in. MOO

What's "blind" about it?

In every other case, witnesses have credibility.

In this case, simply because we know the guy's name, he seems to have lost some.

Not quite sure why this would be...

 

[Marilynilpa]

True. The cyclist did say he swerved. As for "definitely"...I dunno about that. He was definitely on his bike in the pictures and when he said that, but that was on a different day.

According to his daughter's FB page, TG was on his bike when he saw the two bikes.

 

[cindersoot]

I agree. I never thought the bikes were staged. However, after viewing the "virtual tour" MNdad posted, I'm thinking dang, that's a long way to ride!!! If in fact those bikes were staged.... I just can't believe it was a "stranger". A's far as far as comment on fishing boy, it was Aunt Tammy that said that. I believe on NG show.

I don't know why this is so hard to understand, but it's not along way to ride if they took the bike path off fayette st. I promise, I saw it.

 

[MNDad]

Yes, i did. You know what? Last night she was on fb and she got a friend of a friend request. She deleted it,where before she would have added that person.The personal so had no pic. She did not know this person. She is 15. Fifteen is different then when we were fifteen. She is aware now. But she handled it better than me. I still am horrified by that movie.

I know 15 is young for fb,but kids will make a fake account just to have one. I would rather know and monitor my kids fb than to not know and not be able to monitor her.

Actually 15 isn't young for FB. 13 is the minimum age to be COPPA compliant. It is my 10 year old daughter's friends who have a FB account that are too young. We haven't caved in, but we do check computer histories to make sure she hadn't lied on the age form and secretly set one up.

 

[Sunlight]

What's "blind" about it?

In every other case, witnesses have credibility.

In this case, simply because we know the guy's name, he seems to have lost some.

Not quite sure why this would be...

Nothing to do with his name. I, for one, am going to keep an open mind. Some people rule him out definitively, and I don't think one can until we know what happened. Hopefully, he is credible. I want him to be credible. The timeline is too tight for comfort, so I feel something is amiss, and it may have nothing to do with him. MOO

 

[Simp]

I don't know why this is so hard to understand, but it's not along way to ride if they took the bike path off fayette st. I promise, I saw it.

Excuse me. It just seemed like a long way to me. My child would be in some SERIOUS trouble if she ever rode that far without me or my husband.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Excuse me. It just seemed like a long way to me. My child would be in some SERIOUS trouble if she ever rode that far without me or my husband.

Don't forget the oldest of these kids hadn't been in her parents custody or control, for much of her life...

 

[cindersoot]

Did you guys see the latest news on the recent attempted abduction in Waukee Iowa? They said a black man wearing a long gold trenchcoat. Sounds like a pimp to me. Im not being racist, but I bet this attempted abduction cr.p is sex trafficking.

 

[cindersoot]

Excuse me. It just seemed like a long way to me. My child would be in some SERIOUS trouble if she ever rode that far without me or my husband.

I know it looks long on the map but it really isn't.

 

[nikb]

That's not how I read it.

I read it that Mr P believes the FBI is working with an 8 minute time frame.

It may be semantics...but Mr P does seem to be discussing how far the girls could've gotten in 8 minutes, rather than the difference in clocks, when he says this -

“It’s pretty hard for girls to get a mile and a half away ... in eight minutes,” Pahl said. “I don’t even think I could ride a bike a mile in eight minutes.”

As you stated, this was after a day and a half with the FBI. If Mr P thinks an eight minute travel time is being tossed around by the FBI, for whatever reason, I believe him.

:moo:

Thanks for the reminder. I do believe him with one exception - is it really THAT hard to bike a mile in 8 minutes? If the abduction was quick and/or they were riding somewhere they planned to leave their bikes, I just don't think it'd take all that long. MOO

 

[iamnotagolem]

Has anyone ever had to set the time on their cell phones? I certainly haven't. I think the time is automatically set with the phone and cannot be modified by the customer.

I'm not caught up, but wanted to comment on this, I'll delete if it's been answered.

My husband and I have iPhones, we can change the time on them, my phone was 6 minutes faster than his for the longest time until we changed his because mine was more accurate.

 

[Marilynilpa]

I wonder if Mr. Pahl is allowed to discuss this? I'd love to call him up and ask for an explanation re: the 8 minutes. But he probably isn't supposed to discuss anything he overheard/learned from the FBI. JMO

 

[Marilynilpa]

How can I do that when it has a bunch of stars in it?

tia

From what I can see of the post, there is a phrase "Missing Iowa Girl's Mother Searching for Tips". Seems to me if you Google that phrase, you'll find the article. JMO

ETA: I found it by Googling it just now. But I don't know how reliable it is, since it is from a source not allowed here on WS.

 

[otto]

I think that at some point, we have to accept the facts that we have as facts. The first witness we heard about was through a comment that was brought over from Facebook. A woman said that her father was cycling on the trail, came around a blind curve and had to swerve to avoid a bike, or bikes, that were lying on the path. To be questioning today whether he was riding a bike ... it just doesn't make any sense to me. If he wasn't riding his bike, he didn't swerve, a blind curve is meaningless and the timeline of traveling from where he saw the bikes to the bathroom is extended by at least 10 minutes ... meaning that if he was at the bathroom at 12:27, he saw the bikes before the girls were seen on video. But ... that didn't happen. He was riding his bike.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Thanks for the reminder. I do believe him with one exception - is it really THAT hard to bike a mile in 8 minutes? If the abduction was quick and/or they were riding somewhere they planned to leave their bikes, I just don't think it'd take all that long. MOO

Exactly my point.

Mr G's sighting fits perfectly, imo...

I also think the girls were still in the process of being abducted when he rode by, and possibly the bikes were staged afterwards.

All we need is the BIKES DUMPED at the lake by about 12.20...the abduction itself may well have still been ongoing at that time...the girls could still have been in the wooded area with someone, voluntarily or involuntarily, when TG actually rode past.

They could have even been moved/staged after he went by, too...

 

[Marilynilpa]

I'm not caught up, but wanted to comment on this, I'll delete if it's been answered.

My husband and I have iPhones, we can change the time on them, my phone was 6 minutes faster than his for the longest time until we changed his because mine was more accurate.

I have an iPhone and I can set mine, too.

 

[Sunlight]

I think that at some point, we have to accept the facts that we have as facts. The first witness we heard about was through a comment that was brought over from Facebook. A woman said that her father was cycling on the trail, came around a blind curve and had to swerve to avoid a bike, or bikes, that were lying on the path. To be questioning today whether he was riding a bike ... it just doesn't make any sense to me. If he wasn't riding his bike, he didn't swerve, a blind curve is meaningless and the timeline of traveling from where he saw the bikes to the bathroom is extended by at least 10 minutes ... meaning that if he was at the bathroom at 12:27, he saw the bikes before the girls were seen on video. But ... that didn't happen. He was riding his bike.

The first witness we heard about was in an article in the MSM with a picture. The FB hearsay was later.

 

[SapphireSteel]

From what I can see of the post, there is a phrase "Missing Iowa Girl's Mother Searching for Tips". Seems to me if you Google that phrase, you'll find the article. JMO

ETA: I found it by Googling it just now. But I don't know how reliable it is, since it is from a source not allowed here on WS.

Thanks I'll try but as I'm in another country it may not bring it up...

I don't absolutely rely on anything, God knows enough of what is considered "fact" can be debated after the fact (just look at JonBenet) but I do need a COMPELLING reason to rule out Mr G's sighting and I just don't see one.

Most of my sleuthing is made up of gut feelings combined with behavioural and statement analysis, body language etc. When the "facts" come together to support my ideas, it's hard not to be convinced I'm at least on the right track.

I don't like to read Mr G's sighting DOESN'T FIT, as to me, it does...very well.

So well that I think it will be one of the keys to solving the case.

:moo:

 

[otto]

Exactly my point.

Mr G's sighting fits perfectly, imo...

I also think the girls were still in the process of being abducted when he rode by, and possibly the bikes were staged afterwards.

All we need is the BIKES DUMPED at the lake by about 12.20...the abduction itself may well have still been ongoing at that time...the girls could still have been in the wooded area with someone, voluntarily or involuntarily, when TG actually rode past.

They could have even been moved/staged after he went by, too...

That only works if you take the comments made by the video owner, change the meaning and move the time on the video to 8 minutes earlier than the camera time. Since he said that the camera time was slow, not fast, we're left with the video time at 12:19.

 

[SapphireSteel]

That only works if you take the comments made by the video owner, change the meaning and move the time on the video to 8 minutes earlier than the camera time. Since he said that the camera time was slow, not fast, we're left with the video time at 12:19.

Follow my thinking here -

Ignore the clocks for one second, let's say they're all wrong and the FBI knows it, but they have blurred/hidden this fact for the sake of the investigation.

Taking our own personal attempts at synchronising clocks out, what do you have left?

Mr G sighting the bikes AROUND 12.20.

This we know as close to being a fact as it gets.

The alternative is, he is LYING.

We know he would be lying as his daughter has gone so far as to state she spoke to him, confirm WHEN she spoke to him, and WHERE he said he was when she spoke to him.

TG being incorrect about seeing the bikes implies that not only is he being WILFULLY INCORRECT (eg lying) about the sighting, it implies his daughter is lying/incorrect as well.

We know that TG is in no way suspect, is in fact a highly regarded member of the community.

So...his sighting is either truthful, or not truthful. It's as simple as that.

Common sense says it's truthful.