IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18

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Otto,
From the beginning, it has been my understanding that Lyric is the taller of the two girls at 4'11". I have confidence that LE is not committing any major omissions. I do have a lot of faith in and respect for LE. Far, far superior to my measly armchair sleuthing~LOL. Their frustration must be high though, to know that someone out there knows exactly where these two little girls are.

Let's hope and pray that he/ she will weaken and allow Lyric and Elizabeth to come home.

Great info and pics, btw! As usual. :)
 
GrainneDhu said:
The opposite. Think bipolar on an upswing.

People on meth tend to get an idea and become really obsessive about carrying it out but they substitute energy for planning.

For example, say someone high on meth decides their bathroom is too depressing for words and would look a lot better if re-painted. They might start by throwing everything in the bathroom that they can see into a box. Then they realise they don't have any paint the colour they have in mind and it is 2 am. So they go to an all night Wal-Mart but the paint department is closed so they decide that rather than rolling on the paint, they'll spray paint.

So they buy spray paint but no tape or tarps. They get home and start trying to spray paint the largest empty wall area, that only has a towel rack in the way. They don't take the towel rack off the wall, they just try to spray around it.

Then they realise the towel rack is all spattery and that won't do, so they wipe off the towel rack and smear the spatters. Then they have an idea, look in the box of stuff from the bathroom, pull out someone's toothbrush and sit there for two hours obsessively scrubbing the paint off the towel bar.

And so it goes. By the time they come down, the bathroom is still only half painted, wholly spattered and a total mess. Unusable because all the stuff is in the box in the living room, including the toilet paper.

My stepson was an intermittent meth user when I first met him (he was 16). I am so glad and proud that he got off that stuff and has stayed off for over 14 years now.
Click to expand...


Thank you.... GrainneDhu

I really need to make my self more clear, I put the little giggle guy there meaning that was a joke, sarcasm.

Next time I will write that it is a joke.

Yes, Meth- amphetamine is a Psychostimulant, AKA SPEED, Crank and the others are one of its components.

Thank you again for your clarification on it though :hug:
 
Bootsctr said:
Interesting that the poster shows the bikes leaned against the fence too. More things that make you go hmmmmmm??? :
Click to expand...

<snipped respectfully>

That poster was put together based on photos of the missing children, bike color, and fences at the SE tip of Meyers Lake. The place where the bikes were found has never been identified, but seems like a really freaky place for an 8 year old ... are we supposed to believe that an 8 year old child wanted to go to an isoalated part of the lake?

I'm inclined to wonder if the girls were abducted near the parking lot.

Here comes my baby - Cat Stevens - YouTube
 
Bootsctr said:
Thank you otto! Lyric is 5'11"!!?? That is tall!!??

Interesting that the poster shows the bikes leaned against the fence too. More things that make you go hmmmmmm??? I find a huge disconnect between what the FBI was saying and what Mr. Abben said. Abben was vague about where the bikes were found and didn't really answer the question of where they found. Sandy Breault is quoted as saying the bikes were found close to the water as well as the purse and Lyric's father himself said they were found right there by the gate. I know the earliest quote I remember from the bicyclist was that he swerved to miss hitting the bikes and now I can only find that a bicyclist saw the bikes laying along the path. It's very confusing. I don't discount what the bicyclist is saying, but as far as we know he did not identify the bikes for the FBI to include him in the timeline. I think if he could have identified them then the FBI would have definitely have included him in the time line. The same for Mr. C. He was certain he saw Elizabeth (I believe him), but he was not familiar with Lyric and he also said he could not identify the bikes.

Note to self: If I ever see bicycles that look abandoned anywhere without children or people around definitely make sure I can identify the bikes for future reference.

Thinking about abduction cases in general, there are all details in all abductions that set them apart from other abductions. Not every abductor will have the modus operandi although the reasons people are abducted are usually limited to sex, money, jealousy or revenge. Then a few that say they just wanted to see what it was like to kill someone (Alyssa Bustamonte).

Thanks again Otto for your great pics and your thoughts regarding the girls' disappearance. You always make me :waitasec:
Click to expand...

We discussed a little bit last night about articles being updated/changed regarding this case. There was a quote by Abben about the bikes leaning against a fence, IIRC, but now I can't seem to find it. And there was a reference to TG having to swerve to avoid the bikes, but I can't find it either. Admittedly I haven't spend a huge amount of time searching for this info, but usually I have no problems quickly finding what I'm looking for.

I agree with you about Abben being vague regarding questions about the bikes' location. And it seems to me that LE and FBI aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this case. JMO

I also agree that TG probably was not able to positively identify the two bikes he saw, which is why IMO he isn't included in the timeline.
 
Reverie said:
Otto,
From the beginning, it has been my understanding that Lyric is the taller of the two girls at 4'11". I have confidence that LE is not committing any major omissions. I do have a lot of faith in and respect for LE. Far, far superior to my measly armchair sleuthing~LOL.

Their frustration must be high though, to know that someone out there knows exactly where these two little girls are.

Let's hope and pray that he/ she will weaken and allow Lyric and Elizabeth to come home.

Great info and pics, btw! As usual. :)
Click to expand...

I suppose it has been everyone's understanding, from the beginning, that the taller of the two girls is 4'11". Lyric is the taller of the two, but how does that factor into their disappearance?
 
otto said:
I sure hope the police are on top of this ... that they are looking at the possibility that the 4 day earlier meeting wasn't where one guy met the cousin while another guy met Lyric ... kind of along the lines of two creepy guy and two young girls pairing off. If the cyclist saw their bikes, then there was a reason why the girls were at the lake in 9 minutes. Was she 5'11" or are police on top of this?

meyerssillypolice.jpg


Elizabeth_Collins_Lyric_Cook_July_13_2012.jpg
Click to expand...


Lyric's height is correct now at 4' 11". Someone from WS contacted them and had it corrected.

http://www.iowaonline.state.ia.us/mpic/Controller.aspx?cmd=personDetailCommand&id=29696
 
CN2Souls said:
Thank you.... GrainneDhu

I really need to make my self more clear, I put the little giggle guy there meaning that was a joke, sarcasm.

Next time I will write that it is a joke.

Yes, Meth- amphetamine is a Psychostimulant, AKA SPEED, Crank and the others are one of its components.

Thank you again for your clarification on it though :hug:
Click to expand...

Argh, caught once again. It isn't a problem with your communication, the problem is that I don't get a lot of jokes. I'm very literal minded, to the point of being a little out of it in most social situations.

I apologise.
 
GrainneDhu said:
Argh, caught once again. It isn't a problem with your communication, the problem is that I don't get a lot of jokes. I'm very literal minded, to the point of being a little out of it in most social situations.
I apologies.
Click to expand...


:blowkiss: NO need to apologies, :therethere:

As most know here, I am profoundly Dyslexic and you need a decoder ring some times to figure out my post...

All is Good, I love your post... You help so much with your knowledge of Dog Training, Thank you for all you do..

:hug:
 
Bootsctr said:
Thank you otto! Lyric is 5'11"!!?? That is tall!!??

Interesting that the poster shows the bikes leaned against the fence too. More things that make you go hmmmmmm??? .........<snipped for space>
Click to expand...

Don't put too much credibility into the poster showing the bikes leaning against the fence. That poster was made by someone here on WS. I don't remember when or by whom, but I do know that someone here did it. I remember because I thought at the time that, althought a nice gesture, it could be deceiving because of the bike positioning and the generic bike art showing the wrong style bikes.
 
Marilynilpa said:
We discussed a little bit last night about articles being updated/changed regarding this case. There was a quote by Abben about the bikes leaning against a fence, IIRC, but now I can't seem to find it. And there was a reference to TG having to swerve to avoid the bikes, but I can't find it either. Admittedly I haven't spend a huge amount of time searching for this info, but usually I have no problems quickly finding what I'm looking for.

I agree with you about Abben being vague regarding questions about the bikes' location. And it seems to me that LE and FBI aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this case. JMO

I also agree that TG probably was not able to positively identify the two bikes he saw, which is why IMO he isn't included in the timeline.
Click to expand...

Here is one from TG...

As the group searched, a bicyclist stopped the officers to say he saw the two kids bikes on the trail at about 12:20 p.m., but no sign of the children.
TG of Waterloo said he rides the trail often.
“I saw the bikes laying on the path and had to swerve to miss them,” Gamerdinger said. He then went to the Evansdale Police Department to report the sighting.


And Some of what Abben said.

We just don’t have much to go on,” Abben said. ” There’s two bikes and a purse that was found. ... There’s nothing really more to tell you than the search is continuing.”
The bikes were found in the trail by the gate leading to a rock jetty and water outlet on the lake. The gate wasn’t locked at the time, Abben said.
There’s a chain link fence on both sides of the trail. The purse was on the lake-side of the fence, about 10 feet to the east of the bikes and about 2 feet from the fence, officials said.
The bikes and purse continue to be the best finds so far, Abben said. That’s why six off-duty Cedar Rapids police officers searched the tall grass and trees along the trail and Highway 20 again Monday.

http://globegazette.com/news/iowa/r...cle_7dbadcc0-cfd1-11e1-b097-001a4bcf887a.html
 
There&#8217;s a chain link fence on both sides of the trail in the southeast corner of the lake. The bikes were sitting off the side of the trail between the fences, but the purse was on the lake-side of the inside fence.

&#8220;We&#8217;ve checked the lake. (Firefighters are) confident no one is in there,&#8221; Abben said.

&#8220;For a lack of a better word, it&#8217;s just like they vanished. There&#8217;s just nothing,&#8221; Abben said.
Police collected DNA samples from belongings of the girls if needed.

http://globegazette.com/news/iowa/o...cle_1ea3f86e-cea7-11e1-9586-001a4bcf887a.html
 
otto said:
<snipped respectfully>

That poster was put together based on photos of the missing children, bike color, and fences at the SE tip of Meyers Lake. The place where the bikes were found has never been identified, but seems like a really freaky place for an 8 year old ... are we supposed to believe that an 8 year old child wanted to go to an isoalated part of the lake?

I'm inclined to wonder if the girls were abducted near the parking lot.
Click to expand...

I'm inclined to agree with you especially if the girls went willingly. People would normally assume everyone had come to the lake together and were leaving together. Nothing would stand out.

What do you think about them being abducted at the end of the bike trail, going on past the double gates?

P.S.: I love Cat Stevens' music. I have a request....if you have a chance.... Wild World. TIA.
 
CN2Souls said:
Here is one from TG...

As the group searched, a bicyclist stopped the officers to say he saw the two kids bikes on the trail at about 12:20 p.m., but no sign of the children.
TG of Waterloo said he rides the trail often.
&#8220;I saw the bikes laying on the path and had to swerve to miss them,&#8221; Gamerdinger said. He then went to the Evansdale Police Department to report the sighting.


And Some of what Abben said.

We just don&#8217;t have much to go on,&#8221; Abben said. &#8221; There&#8217;s two bikes and a purse that was found. ... There&#8217;s nothing really more to tell you than the search is continuing.&#8221;
The bikes were found in the trail by the gate leading to a rock jetty and water outlet on the lake. The gate wasn&#8217;t locked at the time, Abben said.
There&#8217;s a chain link fence on both sides of the trail. The purse was on the lake-side of the fence, about 10 feet to the east of the bikes and about 2 feet from the fence, officials said.
The bikes and purse continue to be the best finds so far, Abben said. That&#8217;s why six off-duty Cedar Rapids police officers searched the tall grass and trees along the trail and Highway 20 again Monday.

http://globegazette.com/news/iowa/r...cle_7dbadcc0-cfd1-11e1-b097-001a4bcf887a.html
Click to expand...

BBM

"in" the trail

Breault used "laying" also, as opposed to leaning, or standing, or upright. Maybe the bikes were never moved at all. MOO
 
Can Anyone point me in the direction of where I can find Videos of all the press conferences?
 
CN2Souls said:
Here is one from TG...

As the group searched, a bicyclist stopped the officers to say he saw the two kids bikes on the trail at about 12:20 p.m., but no sign of the children.
TG of Waterloo said he rides the trail often.
&#8220;I saw the bikes laying on the path and had to swerve to miss them,&#8221; Gamerdinger said. He then went to the Evansdale Police Department to report the sighting.
Click to expand...

Ok...let me preface by saying I am NOT bashing TG...just trying to understand the reporting versus what I thought I knew about TG's report to police. I'm sure I missed something along the way...

It states "TG stopped the officers to say he saw the two kids bikes on the trail." We know officers/firemen didn't arrive until later in the afternoon and found the bikes SOMEWHERE between 3:30 and 4 (even though they were there before that). Was TG there riding around the trail this entire time or did he come BACK around the time officers got there? I thought he had stated he gagued the time he saw the bikes based on the phone call he made. I thought I read he had left, went to wherever he went to the bathroom, and then called his daughter.

So after speaking with "officers" (who could have maybe been the firemen who found the bikes??) he THEN went to the actual police department to report what he'd seen?

I swear I read a report where it was said that he went to the police dept. in the following days (maybe even Monday) because he didn't feel they were taking his sighting seriously.:waitasec:

Either I'm confused, or this report conflicts with other reports that have been given.

It's no wonder people are looked at like suspects, because if I am only allowed to follow MSM as far as "facts" then everyone who has been a reported "witness" to this crime has either changed their stories time after time, or the reporters just decide to change it up as they please.

URGH!:banghead:
 
threecrazykids said:
Ok...let me preface by saying I am NOT bashing TG...just trying to understand the reporting versus what I thought I knew about TG's report to police. I'm sure I missed something along the way...

It states "TG stopped the officers to say he saw the two kids bikes on the trail." We know officers/firemen didn't arrive until later in the afternoon and found the bikes SOMEWHERE between 3:30 and 4 (even though they were there before that). Was TG there riding around the trail this entire time or did he come BACK around the time officers got there? I thought he had stated he gagued the time he saw the bikes based on the phone call he made. I thought I read he had left, went to wherever he went to the bathroom, and then called his daughter.

So after speaking with "officers" (who could have maybe been the firemen who found the bikes??) he THEN went to the actual police department to report what he'd seen?

I swear I read a report where it was said that he went to the police dept. in the following days (maybe even Monday) because he didn't feel they were taking his sighting seriously.:waitasec:

Either I'm confused, or this report conflicts with other reports that have been given.

It's no wonder people are looked at like suspects, because if I am only allowed to follow MSM as far as "facts" then everyone who has been a reported "witness" to this crime has either changed their stories time after time, or the reporters just decide to change it up as they please.

URGH!:banghead:
Click to expand...

Re your bold --- IIRC --- the scene with TG talking to officers during the search is not from Friday. We've discussed it and think it was Monday.
 
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