IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #25

[otto]

ps - I will turn these photos over to several of our lab people and see they can come up with - give me a couple of days. In the meantime maybe someone else here can come up with something better.

<respectfully snipped>

It might be an idea to do the verification with Kimster if you want to credibly post things like lab people reports without providing sources ... something to think about. There's nothing more to it than a couple of emails with proof of credentials.

 

[Confusion]

Is it far from Evansdale?

East of Cedar Rapids. I just found his obituary, and it says he died on Dec. 8th from natural causes. Strange.

 

[otto]

East of Cedar Rapids. I just found his obituary, and it says he died on Dec. 8th from natural causes. Strange.

That doesn't seem like it's anywhere near this 20 mile radius crime scene.

 

[NWLady]

Is it normal for a person to call and report to a family member something you saw that seems so common for the area for which you saw it in, at the time you saw it??
For example, if I were driving down an interstate and I saw a vehicle parked on the shoulder, would I call my husband (or any family member for that matter) to tell him I saw a vehicle parked on the side of the road??

 

[Marilynilpa]

Just thought I'd post this since someone had asked. I haven't heard anything about autopsy results or anything other than this as follow up yet.

http://marion.patch.com/articles/hunters-find-body-under-squaw-creek-bridge-in-rural-linn-county

It was ruled to be natural causes.

http://thegazette.com/obituaries/ralls-james-w/

ETA: Oops, I see that's already been resolved!

 

[Snowbunny]

It was ruled to be natural causes.

http://thegazette.com/obituaries/ralls-james-w/

I hadn't heard anything so I had to ask. Thank you!

 

[Confusion]

It was ruled to be natural causes.

http://thegazette.com/obituaries/ralls-james-w/

Thanks, I did find and post that later, but don't think I included the link.

 

[Snowbunny]

Happy New Years Everybody! I'm calling it a night...I have to work today! My son said that this is the first time his county has gone through a New Years Eve without DUI/DWI or an accident. I talked to him just before midnight and he had pulled a vehicle over where the driver was going 32 miles an hour in a 65 mile an hour zone..the driver turned out to be a 85 year old taking his wife home and being cautious driving on icy roads so it looks like people are being smarter and not driving intoxicated.

 

[chelsea6]

Question for those who think CMF is the best suspect, his first offense was in 2006. What is your opinion on no other charges for the last 6 years?

I don't know him, but I'd hope it means he's stayed out of trouble. It's just SO many coincidences that could mean nothing, then again they could mean everything.

 

[chicagofa13]

Is it normal for a person to call and report to a family member something you saw that seems so common for the area for which you saw it in, at the time you saw it??
For example, if I were driving down an interstate and I saw a vehicle parked on the shoulder, would I call my husband (or any family member for that matter) to tell him I saw a vehicle parked on the side of the road??

Depends. Are they a normal person? Or a WS'er? (Sorry!)

OT: I'm visiting my family and was driving between houses when I saw a van with out of state plates behaving in what I considered to be a suspicious manner. As soon as I got to my Mom's I said if there are any murders or kidnappings I know who did it.

A normal person would just think they might be lost???

 

[GrainneDhu]

In my experience jurisdiction and who or what is running a case has direct impact on how cases get investigated.

Im just asking "who is in charge", as a point of information. Does he, she, and it have a
name? Example: I mean if samples get sent to the State Hygenic Lab for analysis then the
SHL is in charge and x,y,z, (named people) handle the samples/do the analysis, with Mr or
Ms. B. being in charge, ie the Director (and very likely those people will be testifying in any case which occurs ...). Happens all the time.

So who is in charge of this case? Does anyone know?

Chief Deputy Rick Abben appears to be the spokesperson for LE in this case, so I think the Black Hawk Sheriff's department is the lead agency.

Evansdale has a police department but it's not at all unusual for small towns to contract out part of their law enforcement needs to a larger agency with more staff and greater resources.

For instance, both of my own towns (I'm about halfway between two towns) do their own traffic enforcement but investigative work is contracted out to the sheriff's department. Since my entire county's population is less than 25K, it doesn't make any sense at all to try to maintain two (or more) crime scene technicians, investigators, etc. The county where the other town near me is located has less than 17K people, so again it makes no sense to duplicate functions.

 

[GrainneDhu]

What ever came of the body they found at 7 Bridges shortly after the girls were found? I believe it was a male and he was found under one of the bridges but I never did hear anything more about that situation.

I don't remember any other bodies being found at 7 Bridges. I do remember a body being found around the same time in the Des Moines River near Principal park; it turned out to be a homeless man and no foul play was suspected.

That would have been about 150 miles from Evansdale.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Is it far from Evansdale?

About 60 miles and there is no direct connection between the Cedar River and the Wapsipinicon River.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Is it normal for a person to call and report to a family member something you saw that seems so common for the area for which you saw it in, at the time you saw it??
For example, if I were driving down an interstate and I saw a vehicle parked on the shoulder, would I call my husband (or any family member for that matter) to tell him I saw a vehicle parked on the side of the road??

If you are referring to TG, it was my understanding that he didn't call his daughter to report seeing the bicycles on the trail, he called to talk to her about something else.

The reason the phone call was important was that his cell phone log gave him a firm time shortly after he'd seen the bicycles.

 

[jenandemmie]

I have these two images you posted. The two black areas you think might
be a bag are parts of a low light area the camera recorded which begins
at the girls right knee, travels back to her hips, then up to her right
shoulder ... in a kind of arc. The largest black spot is a low light area
at the knees, then another similar low light patch at her right shoulder.
No evidence of a black bag. This optical effect is common for low grade
video cameras...

The girls general outline from her right foot on the pedal, her leg back to
her hips then torso to her right shoulder, back wheel on the bike, and the
angle of her torso with arms reached out to the handle bars - are all
visible in this frame. But no evidence of a black bag or any other object
on her person that I can see -

The image you are looking at is a stretched enhanced negative of your
original image.

Well, I guess you (I) learn something everyday! Thank you for your explanation.

 

[SierraShelby]

Police have confirmed that the jogger saw the children's bike at the gate at 2:00. The gate wasn't open ... just not locked.

i cannt find that that jogger found the bikes at 200

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

What we know from MSM since the bodies were discovered, but from BEFORE the ME confirmed that it was the girls:

http://www.kcci.com/news/central-io...ple/-/9357080/17814122/-/12p6p9g/-/index.html

Above, Heather states that the police are looking at specific people, but won't share the info with family.

Also, Jon Lieberman from HLN states that the police have "solid leads", are looking into the "meth connection" and "RSO's. he also states that his police sources regard 7 Bridges as the dump site, that LE has info they will not release to the public, and that the bodies were found 40-50 feet apart.

Abben seems to deny all of that.

Keep in mind that Drew firmly believes a sex offender is involved as he stated as much in the TV interview he did. I've got to believe that they have good reason to suspect a sex offender even though LE isn't saying it. Lieberman's word alone wouldn't convince me of anything, but with what Heather and Drew have stated publicly, I think Abben is downplaying the info they have.

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=qHhuyRy20jo

Who killed Lyric and Elizabeth? - YouTube

 

[Tennlyn]

I think he must have seen something, but doesn't realize it, since he was at the corner of Elmer and Gilbert at about 12:28 -12:35, and the girls were in the area after leaving Brovan Blvd at 12:23 and possibly being at Elmer and Gilbert at 12:30 - 1:00. It has to be closer to 12:30, assuming the girls didn't zigzag through the streets on the way to the lake. They would have been cycling in the same direction on the same roads at the same time. Maybe they didn't see each other, but they were right at the same place at the same time.

What if TG's memory played tricks on him? Maybe the bikes (or 2 bikes) were lying near the restroom where he stopped, but when he heard where the bikes were found his mind pictured them there instead? He'd glimpsed bikes, maybe actually swerved around them, but at the time he didn't really process it. Then later, when he heard about the girls, he incorporated the information he heard about the location of the bikes into his own memory. kwim?

Would that shave a couple minutes off the ride and make his siting fit into the timeline better?

 

[cindersoot]

What if TG's memory played tricks on him? Maybe the bikes (or 2 bikes) were lying near the restroom where he stopped, but when he heard where the bikes were found his mind pictured them there instead? He'd glimpsed bikes, maybe actually swerved around them, but at the time he didn't really process it. Then later, when he heard about the girls, he incorporated the information he heard about the location of the bikes into his own memory. kwim?

Would that shave a couple minutes off the ride and make his siting fit into the timeline better?

He clearly told me, "the bikes were laying across the trail, facing the lake". I really don't think he is confusing on where he saw them.

 

[Bootsctr]

What we know from MSM since the bodies were discovered, but from BEFORE the ME confirmed that it was the girls:

http://www.kcci.com/news/central-io...ple/-/9357080/17814122/-/12p6p9g/-/index.html

Above, Heather states that the police are looking at specific people, but won't share the info with family.

Also, Jon Lieberman from HLN states that the police have "solid leads", are looking into the "meth connection" and "RSO's. he also states that his police sources regard 7 Bridges as the dump site, that LE has info they will not release to the public, and that the bodies were found 40-50 feet apart.

Abben seems to deny all of that.

Keep in mind that Drew firmly believes a sex offender is involved as he stated as much in the TV interview he did. I've got to believe that they have good reason to suspect a sex offender even though LE isn't saying it. Lieberman's word alone wouldn't convince me of anything, but with what Heather and Drew have stated publicly, I think Abben is downplaying the info they have.

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=qHhuyRy20jo

Who killed Lyric and Elizabeth? - YouTube

Thank you! I'm torn.... I don't know enough about "dump sites". Just know when I saw the picture from above that showed the "sheets" covering the 2 sites where the bodies were found I felt they were killed on the spot execution style. Does anyone who has followed enough of these type of cases know statistically how far a dump site would be from the kill site? Are we talking miles or can they be just feet apart? Curious as to how sanitized the picture we were shown was. The picture was from the day after the bodies had been found. I don't recall any trash or debris in the photo. The road, from the picture, looks well used as well as the immediate camp site area. It looked as if there was some type of fire pit very close to the road.