IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #28

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I'm 100% in favor of LE being accountable to the public they serve. And after an arrest is made, a trial is held, and a sentence is imposed in this case, the citizens of Black Hawk County have every right to question how the case was handled. JMO

So people aren't allowed to question how LE handled..say, the Ramsey case, because it never went to trial? Or any other unsolved case? Why do we have to wait until a case is solved before speaking out? At that point, everyone will be satisfied...
 
Chelsea, I'm not sure how it works in Iowa, but in many places, a prosecutor is assigned to a case as soon as it develops (Iowa may be an exception). If that is the case in Iowa, then there will be a prosecutor assigned to the case. Outside of the Evansdale police department, that would be the only other office that could provide information. You could probably contact the prosecutor's office and ask for the name of the prosecutor that is overseeing the case. That prosecutor may, or may not, be willing to talk with you.

I don't think that the mayor, or city council can do anything in this case.

Are you looking for some reassurance from the police department that they are still working the case? I'm still not really clear on what sort of police statement would make any difference.

(Thank you for the information, much appreciated.)

Yes, I'd like that, Otto. I'd like to hear that Police are confident there is no danger to the public, provide reminders to take the usual everyday precautions when it comes to locking doors, stranger-danger, and give us hope that they are and will do everything they can to find the suspect(s). Yes, all that. It does make a difference, Otto. Perhaps not to the case but to us, the public. That would help us feel better, if nothing else. :please:
 
The silence of the masses and unquestioning belief in "those in charge" seems to be quaint and naive behaviour in the 21st Century.

If we hadn't have had humungous and public LE/DA screw ups in the form of the Ramsey, the Anthony, OJ, need I go on, then cow-like public acceptance would be still understandable.

If we lived in Communist China or North Korea, ditto. They don't question their public servants either, or expect transparency or accountability from them.

However the the media savvy, suspicious public that we have today are not going to be satisfied for long with the "don't question us, we know what we're doing" attitude that LE tend to display in news-worthy cases these days.

Freedom of Speech applies to everyone...so if you're not happy with being treated like a mushroom (eg kept in the dark and fed bs) then speak up, to your local representative, your local government, your state or federal government, your Police Commissioner.

This case could easily end up like those above, floundering amongst gutless DA's and fumbling LE, plea bargains and lawyers.

The only way to prevent that happening is for everyone's motives to be transparent and above reproach...and the only way to ensure THAT is for the public to demand accountability.

The days of those "in charge" being above reproach or criticism are long gone in the West (fortunately), even though a few staunch individuals still apparently believe in their infallibility, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

Some folks believe in the tooth fairy too I guess. :waitasec:


:goodpost: :yourock: :thewave:
 
I'm seriously wondering if our posters have triggered this by calling their Mayor...????

Sadly, I note the girls aren't on the agenda.

You can guarantee it will be the top item in everyone's minds though.

:cow:

I wonder if they are taking comments from everyone (the public) or just Evansdale residents?:waitasec:

I'm seriously wondering if our posters have triggered this by calling their Mayor...???? :giggle:
 
So people aren't allowed to question how LE handled..say, the Ramsey case, because it never went to trial? Or any other unsolved case? Why do we have to wait until a case is solved before speaking out? At that point, everyone will be satisfied...

Please note that my post specifically referred to the citizens of Black Hawk County and the specific case of Lyric and Lizzie, which IMO is still an ongoing investigation. I was not attempting to address issues in any other cases, specifically cold cases such as JonBenet Ramsey.
 
As it's described as a "meeting" I would assume information is going to go both ways, by which I mean people will get a chance to speak.

There is probably an open question time scheduled in the agenda, at least.

Hopefully the media and concerned locals will attend and take full advantage. They may not get any answers, but at least they will be heard.

ETA: has BHCS ever held a town meeting like this before, in recent memory?

Yes, they have them occasionally.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
 
You Go Girl!!

Yes I hope that this will be the pebble in the pond..
I hope that it spreads!!!
Thank you for taking your heart and giving it a voice!!!!

There are LOTS of pebbles from here going into that pond, and lots of hearts here giving it a voice!! :yes:

~~~~~~~~~~~ :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: ~~~~~~~~~~~
 
I am still here every day, only lately in lurk mode. I find the lack of news or an arrest disheartening. That coupled with the rather circular debates of late leave me with nothing to post except I am still here, still hopeful that we will eventually know who hurt our girls and see them prosecuted to the fullest.
 
I'm 100% in favor of LE being accountable to the public they serve. And after an arrest is made, a trial is held, and a sentence is imposed in this case, the citizens of Black Hawk County have every right to question how the case was handled. JMO

Just like the Anthony mess?

My point, once again, is not to have LE share important investigative information.

I'm not quite sure where that keeps coming from and I'd like to put it to bed right now. No one is suggesting anything more than basic acknowledgement that the crime has not gone cold.

My point, everyone's point, is that a wall of silence is not the way to handle a concerned public, especially when LE appear to have made zero progress in the investigation in 7 months, despite having the bodies.

If LE need public help, they need to speak to the public. They need to show their faces, and ask, and keep asking. They need to reply to facebook posts and emails and phone calls.

We've heard reports all the way through of properties not being searched, locals not being questioned, possible evidence not being seized at the Lake and of course the famous "they're alive" statement from the FBI.

Then hunters found them and now we know they likely died on the day and it's "oops sorry" except without the "oops sorry" part.

Yes, on balance I think it's high time BHCS held a public meeting. It would have been nice had they listed the girls on the agenda, seeing they're having a meeting about local crime and all, but baby steps...
 
From the Black Hawk County Sheriff's Office website:

Sheriff Tony Thompson has scheduled a monthly series of meetings in order to provide a transparent look at the Black Hawk County Sheriff's Office, allow the community to voice concerns, and spotlight programs and services offered by the Sheriff's Office. Everyone is welcome to attend!

http://www.bhcso.org/

So I guess this isn't a one-time only thing. Locals may have an opportunity to get some of their questions answered.
 
Just like the Anthony mess?

My point, once again, is not to have LE share important investigative information.

I'm not quite sure where that keeps coming from and I'd like to put it to bed right now. No one is suggesting anything more than basic acknowledgement that the crime has not gone cold.

My point, everyone's point, is that a wall of silence is not the way to handle a concerned public, especially when LE appear to have made zero progress in the investigation in 7 months, despite having the bodies.

If LE need public help, they need to speak to the public. They need to show their faces, and ask, and keep asking. They need to reply to facebook posts and emails and phone calls.

We've heard reports all the way through of properties not being searched, locals not being questioned, possible evidence not being seized at the Lake and of course the famous "they're alive" statement from the FBI.

Then hunters found them and now we know they likely died on the day and it's "oops sorry" except without the "oops sorry" part.

Yes, on balance I think it's high time BHCS held a public meeting. It would have been nice had they listed the girls on the agenda, seeing they're having a meeting about local crime and all, but baby steps...

BBM

Wow, you didn't just jump off my post, you catapulted off of it. Bravo!:what:

SS, I am not referring to JonBenet Ramsey or any other cold case. My post was specifically referring to Lyric and Lizzie's case only which, IMO, is not a cold case just because LE doesn't issue periodic statements to the contrary.

As to your bolded comment - the Black Hawk County website clearly states that the community will be allowed to voice concerns at the town hall meetings. I imagine there will be plenty of questions about this case. I don't see why not having it officially on an agenda makes any difference. JMO.
 
I wonder how many media statements are all scripted by LE when it comes to the parents statements in cases of abductions.

It just seems like they all sound so much alike. First, the informational statement of what info they are allowed to release, then comes the pleading and begging for their return...then after the fact (if they are indeed killed), the thank you so much for all your help and pray for us, but respect our privacy statement. All of which are completely understood.

Where is the statement AFTER the fact that says "You SOB you are going to pay for this. I will not stop until I find you. I will make it my life mission to make sure I don't go a day without you looking over your shoulder wondering if today is the day the police come for you".

I guess it just amazes me that more parents don't outwardly show what I would consider a "normal" emotion in the entire grieving process which is anger. I don't think I've ever seen a media statement or appearance by parents of these children where they speak directly to whomever did it, and vow to make it their life's mission to find them and bring them to justice.

Is it because LE doesn't allow it? Is it yet LE controlling 100% of how things have to happen? Is it because LE is afraid that it's only going to cause the perp to do it again to make a point?

I think it would take me a VERY long time to accept what happened and get to a place of peace. I don't know that I would EVER stop the feelings of hatred, revenge, etc. I pray I'm never in their shoes...because this family has MUCH more forgiveness in their hearts than I ever would.

Hell...my Grandfather was murdered when I was 4 and I still to this day absolutely HATE the person who took his life so early. Not just for what he took from my Grandfather directly...but for what he took from our entire family. I can't even imagine what would happen if this happened to one of my own children.


BBM
I don't know why some parents are more vocal than others. Maybe one day Lyric and Elizabeth's parents will be able to speak but I think you will find the statement you are looking for in the Somer Thompson case.

Diena Thompson, Somer's mother, was very vocal when she gave a threatening statement to whomever murdered her daughter.

Here is a link to one video when she spoke to the killer. I think there was another video from the night before but I couldn't find it right off.
http://www.examiner.com/article/som...pson-speaks-out-warns-daughter-s-killer-video

Here is a link to Somer's first thread.
FL-Somer Renee Thompson, 7, Orange Park - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
 
I am still here every day, only lately in lurk mode. I find the lack of news or an arrest disheartening. That coupled with the rather circular debates of late leave me with nothing to post except I am still here, still hopeful that we will eventually know who hurt our girls and see them prosecuted to the fullest.

:goodpost:
Ditto. Same here.
 
Just because a parent or other family member feels an emotion doesn't necessarily mean they want to go around talking about it in the media.
 
What's everyone's opinion on this?

Just curious as it seems kind of premature to me especially since there has been no COD released and do we even know that the girls were at the lake for sure?? :waitasec:

I don't understand it either. :waitasec:
 
I like that it is called Angels' Park instead of using their names ala Jessica Ridgeway Park. I just feel like a park is for children, and they shouldn't have to be reminded (or find out about) about another child who was brutally murdered, kidnapped near that park, every time they go there. Plus Angels' Park can really apply to anyone who is no longer with us, instead of singling out one person who gets a park named after them.

(I was a bit nervous that they re-named it: "Cousins' Park")
 
I like that it is called Angels' Park instead of using their names ala Jessica Ridgeway Park. I just feel like a park is for children, and they shouldn't have to be reminded (or find out about) about another child who was brutally murdered, kidnapped near that park, every time they go there. Plus Angels' Park can really apply to anyone who is no longer with us, instead of singling out one person who gets a park named after them.

(I was a bit nervous that they re-named it: "Cousins' Park")

I like the name Angels' Park, too. I think it's a very appropriate tribute to Lizzie and Lyric.
 
What's everyone's opinion on this?

Just curious as it seems kind of premature to me especially since there has been no COD released and do we even know that the girls were at the lake for sure?? :waitasec:

I like it. Whether they were at the park or not. Its a public place used by
many. People will have an opportunity to remember the girls. I dont see
anything negative about that. Maybe I'm missing something - ?
 
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