IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #29

[foxbluff]

Something else bothers me about this case, the police chief and one of the families being good friends. Not that there is anything wrong with them being friends. It is a small community after all. I just hope the family has not placed all bets on one member of LE.

Hmm - BBM - "Not that there is anything wrong with [that]"

OMG, Boots, please tell me that you don't watch Seinfeld reruns, too! :great:

 

[foxbluff]

Well...I do find it quite odd that the same day Drew magically finds this voice mail that was supposedly from "the day before they went missing" that the FBI comes out with the first statements of strongly believing the girls to be alive, won't disclose how or why, and aren't discouraged by the passing of time since their disappearance:

http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/national_world&id=8744458

Coincidence? Or was the information about the message somehow leaked and then they SAY it was from the day before they went missing as to not set off the abductor.

As far as WE know it's amounted to nothing...but we are not privy to any of the behind the scenes information, so maybe it WAS something.

Really good post imo!

 

[jn0920]

From the beginning I always thought for those girls to disappear without basically a trace, other than the bikes and cellphone at the lake, I believe they were taken by someone that they know. It would be easy to dump the the cellphone later on. I do believe the bikes were left by the girls, someone convincing them there was an emergency of some sort. Telling them don't worry they'll be back for the bikes later. I believe it would be too difficult to move two girls bikes to the other side of the lake without anyone noticing anything, just like I find it hard to believe someone stopped on the side of the interstate and swooped them up. I remember there being heavy construction on that side of the interstate at that time and traffic moving slow. It would be too risky.

As a child I would have no problem leaving my bike in Edale for a short amount of time. It's a fairly small community and someone stealing your bike would be pretty obvious.

Also Lyric was larger for her age so I would think she would have at least put up some sort of fight.

I realize that was all just thrown together without flowing but Im just doing what I do, thinking out loud.




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[Mjskit]

It has been speculated that the girls knew their abductor because it seems they went willingly. I was wondering if the perp were dressed as a police officer or a uniform of authority the same would happen. I think if I were approached today by a person wearing a police officers uniform I would not put up a fight. IMO

 

[Marilynilpa]

Regarding Lizzie's purse - I've wondered if there might have been a note left in there from the abductor. Maybe telling LE he had the girls, they wouldn't be hurt if certain things were done?:waitasec:

LE stated they had evidence the girls were alive, and sent that evidence to the lab. So at least, in the beginning, it wasn't just lack of bodies that made LE feel the girls were alive - there was something more definite. JMO.

 

[Considering]

At Eddyville Elementary in Mahaska County, Iowa on Tuesday...

Four male students said during recess a man in a white minivan with a gold stripe invited them to go see puppies.

http://whotv.com/2013/03/20/school-warning-attempted-enticement/

 

[jenandemmie]

At Eddyville Elementary in Mahaska County, Iowa on Tuesday...

http://whotv.com/2013/03/20/school-warning-attempted-enticement/

Don't like this one bit, especially since my theory involves two males working together, and there was a ruckus about a white van in the beginning... Ya know, I know the SuperBowl is a big day for the sex trafficking industry.They even had a big ad campaign with a slogan something like "Real Men Don't Buy Girls". I wonder if NCAA March Madness causes the same stir in that industry....Hmmm.

 

[jn0920]

At Eddyville Elementary in Mahaska County, Iowa on Tuesday...




http://whotv.com/2013/03/20/school-warning-attempted-enticement/

Honestly there have been several kidnapping attempts in the months following the girls disappearance. There was one in Cedar Rapids, one in Little Rock, one in Dubuque, one in Spencer, one or two in Marion, the one you mentioned and several more. Those are just the ones close to me. Unfortunately it seems that the girls disappearance started this chain of attempted kidnappings.


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[SapphireSteel]

So...can anyone tell me how many times a case like this has happened before?

Someone is able to abduct 2 girls at the same time (assuming to be in a vehicle of some sort)

leaves no sign of a struggle at the scene

leaves behind their bikes and a purse, but no other discernable evidence to get a lead

murders them SOMEWHERE

and leaves them in a park about 20 miles away, again, leaving not enough evidence behind to warrant an arrest (let alone a conviction)

For cryin' out loud...this is quite the crime to pull off.

This person has (so far) pulled off a double murder of 2 little girls in broad daylight...off their bikes, at a park, on a bike trail next to the 2nd busiest interstate in the entire state (that was at a standstill with construction), drove these girls to an "undisclosed" location and murdered them, then dumped their bodies at a public park. OR he took them to the public park and killed them there and left them for dead.

If the people around this community are feeling safe and trustworthy of LE, they shouldn't be...because I can't seem to find cases (online) where this circumstance has ever happened before...this person is quite the murderer. :banghead:

Yep.

The statistics (and common sense) tell me at least that a "sexual predator" type scenario in this case just doesn't fit.

 

[Indy Anna]

Honestly there have been several kidnapping attempts in the months following the girls disappearance. There was one in Cedar Rapids, one in Little Rock, one in Dubuque, one in Spencer, one or two in Marion, the one you mentioned and several more. Those are just the ones close to me. Unfortunately it seems that the girls disappearance started this chain of attempted kidnappings.


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Do all of the incidents involve a white van? Maybe there were kidnapping attempts before Lyric and Elizabeth disappeared, too, but their disappearance made people more aware and less dismissive of anything unusual.

On HLN, Wylma said that the girls "would always ride up and down the street and go only as far as a parking lot across the street." It's not a direct quote from Wylma, but I've been thinking about the parking lot. If someone in a van encountered the girls in the parking lot, they could have abducted the girls, tied them up inside the van, and then placed the bikes in the van. So, Lyric and Elizabeth may not have rode their bikes to the lake, but rather the kidnapper(s) dropped the bikes off there to plant a false lead for LE.

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2012/10/22/whatever-happened-elizabeth-collins-lyric-cook

 

[georger]

I know it is a big stretch, but there are quite a list of unsolved murders of young woman and children in the area from the 70's on. Most of these cases involved the dumping of the body in a remote wooded area.:what:

That's a span of 43 years. I wonder if that stat is compatible with the
(urban) area and other crime stats? Its an interesting observation if true.

 

[georger]

I think the COD tests are back, but they just aren't releasing it:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_...ns-death-details-kept-confidential-by-police/

will be kept confidential in order to protect the investigation.

That is an admission there is an investigation. :rocker: That to me, is progress!

 

[Bootsctr]

Do all of the incidents involve a white van? Maybe there were kidnapping attempts before Lyric and Elizabeth disappeared, too, but their disappearance made people more aware and less dismissive of anything unusual.

On HLN, Wylma said that the girls "would always ride up and down the street and go only as far as a parking lot across the street." It's not a direct quote from Wylma, but I've been thinking about the parking lot. If someone in a van encountered the girls in the parking lot, they could have abducted the girls, tied them up inside the van, and then placed the bikes in the van. So, Lyric and Elizabeth may not have rode their bikes to the lake, but rather the kidnapper(s) dropped the bikes off there to plant a false lead for LE.

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2012/10/22/whatever-happened-elizabeth-collins-lyric-cook

Thank you! Love your avatar btw! Love squirrels! Have raised several. They have a special place in my heart!

Okay, back to your post, "Maybe there were kidnapping attempts BEFORE Lyric and Elizabeth disappeared too!" I would love to know if there were attempts prior and basically disregarded, never made the news (although I believe they did) because the attempts were unsuccessful. I love your thought process. I've been thinking along the same lines - thank you for saying it outloud! :rocker:

 

[Bootsctr]

Hmm - BBM - "Not that there is anything wrong with [that]"

OMG, Boots, please tell me that you don't watch Seinfeld reruns, too! :great:

Oh Foxbluff! You see right through me! Guilty as charged! :floorlaugh: :blushing:

 

[Bootsctr]

I think they mean 1 cause of death per person would be plural = causes of death.

I agree! I adore your "Grumpy Cat" avatar! Grumpy Cat makes me :great: :floorlaugh: but in no way reminds me of "stinky cat" (for foxbluff ykwim)!!

 

[Bootsctr]

I have noticed this too. It's all very bizarre how the tides have changed.

Bizarre is a very good descriptor for how this whole case went down and how it continues to unfold. . . or not unfold. :hills: :desert: :ufo:

 

[Bootsctr]

I thought they played the Vmail on the video interview with drew and heather.

One thing that has always puzzled me but I have no opinion on since I'm just baffled by it.....is the first few days Misty, Dan, Wylma, Dan's mom, Tammy, etc were right out front giving interviews and speaking with the media. We heard nothing from Drew and Heather those first few days. But now we only hear from drew and heather, the rest of the family has been silent. It's just odd to me, I don't know why.

I'd be curious to hear from Dan and Misty again and their thoughts on the investigation. Surely there is an investigative reporter who could interview Dan. . . or maybe he doesn't have anything to say. I'm curious though. Aunt Tammy where are you?

 

[threecrazykids]

Well...this interview certainly puts some new twists on things; ESPECIALLY the timeline that has been released from LE.

Pt 1:Tania Fiolleau interviews parents of Iowa Missing Cousins - YouTube Part 1
Pt:2 Tania Fiolleau interviews parents of Iowa Missing Cousins - YouTube Part 2

*****This interview was done the day before Black Friday, so Nov 22nd, 2012 - per Heather****

So, with that said...Heather KNOWS the timeline that has been released...and yet this is the timeline SHE gives.

Heather leaves for Dr. Appt that morning

Heather arrives home at 12:00 and Wylma told her the girls had "just left" on a bike ride.
So...this puts the girls OUT of the house riding their bikes BEFORE 12.

At 1:00 "they" become concerned because the girls aren't back.
***So this means that those girls were gone BEFORE 12 and had been gone a full HOUR before anyone became concerned enough to go look for them...and this is Heather talking, NOT WYLMA.

(I now don't think it was THAT uncommon for them to be gone on longer trips.)

Kelly (her son who is 13) goes out and looks for the girls. (this is at 1).

Kelly comes home, and hasn't found the girls.

At 1:20 HEATHER LEAVES TO LOOK FOR GIRLS (very specific time given).

She can't find them, and goes to police station to report them missing.

****Keep in mind, records show that the police report of the girls missing was opened at 2:48pm on July 13th.

****************************************

Other things I noticed (between the 2 videos):

Watch the look on Heather's face when Drew states that this is a "faith tester". She appears to me to be very disgusted that he's even mentioning that this has shaken his faith...she looks down and won't look at him.

Heather states that she believes the enemy throws things at us to test our faith, and HE tries to do things to test us. Who is "he"? Is she referring to the devil?

Heather mentiones that the school has implemented a "secret #" that a person would need to pick up a child from school, and if you don't have that number, you can't get your child. **Would this be necessary if the general concensus of the community was that their abductions had a familial connection?**

Drew mentions that he is working on posters, notifying the community of missing sex offenders to help locate offenders that haven't registered, etc. However, at the 9:10 mark, the interviewer specifically asks if LE has given any profile or indicator that this would be a sex offender - and he immediately pipes up "NOPE!" **I don't know why, but this strikes me as odd as well. The way he says "NOPE!" and looks at Heather just has my hinky meter going off...not sure why, but it does.

In the second video - at the 2:40 mark, the interviewer states that she's read on the internet that there has been speculation about the parents involvement. Heather answers, and IMMEDIATELY takes the focus to Misty and Dan, saying that she is "stopped in the grocery store all the time and asked about Misty and Dan's involvement." **The interviewer didn't ask about Misty and Dan, and weren't interviewing Misty and Dan. THEN at the 4:00 mark, the interviewer mentions that "you both have been cleared as suspects" and they both nod YES.

3 different times (between the 2 videos) this interviewer asks them what they would like to say to the person who took these girls. Once in the first video it's at the 4:54 mark - and they speak only of forgiveness. In the second video it's asked TWICE as to what they want to say and they bring the focus back to them, and who is alive and how bad it's hurting THEM and their children who are home with them. Again at the 6:14 mark they are asked for the 3rd time to speak TO THE ABDUCTOR and they then say they pray for them every day, as well as "the person who knows something", state they have no judgements, they forgive them, want to speak to their inner child about how hurt they had to have been as a child, etc. They do mention to drop them off somewhere safe, but it's almost a side note, not really a personal plea of "these girls deserve to be let go...please don't harm them, etc".

Also...who is this other man whose daughter was raped and murdered - who lives in Evansdale that he is working with? Was she an adult, a child? Could there be a conncection there?!!
**************

However, the big factors for me in these interviews is again, the TIMELINE.

This interview is AFTER the release of the 12:23 "sighting" on Brovan that was released in September.

If these girls were seen at 12:23 on Brovan then there is no way in hell the family wouldn't have seen them. They were caught on the video at 12:11/12:19, and 2 the second time at the 12:23 mention. All they would have had to do (before the 1:00 mark when they became concerned) is to walk outside and look down the street and they'd be there if the 12:23 sighting was valid!

Heather was HOME before 12. Those girls didn't leave the house at 12:15. They left (according to Wylma) at 11:30, and had been gone 1 and 1/2 hours before Kelly was sent out to look for them. Heather was home at 12 and wasn't concerned until 1. Plus, I thought DREW was home around the noon hour as well (maybe 12:30).

Why is there no mention of anyone else going out and looking for the girls? No mention of what Wylma did, as she said she took Kelly with her to look. Never has their been a mention of Kelly going and searching by himself and coming back empty handed. No mention of calling Misty to have her look. No mention of Tammy and Wylma going to look. Nothing.

Something isn't right. And if we are to trust LE, and just simply believe that LE's word is factual, blah, blah, blah, then I want to know this: Why would Heather and Drew have reason to lie about their own timeline when it completely contradicts what has been released by LE?

This timeline is JACKED, period. Someone is lying.

It's pretty sad when I don't know whether to doubt the police or the "cleared" parents of one of these missing girls. Pisses me off (sorry for the language).:furious:

 

[iamnotagolem]

Threecrazykids, thanks for posting those vids. I can't watch them but hope to one day. Thank you for discussing the content.

I would really like to see LE say they have cleared the parents.

 

[carbuff]

Just because there are discrepancies doesn't automatically mean anybody is lying.

People are inaccurate. People make mistakes. They misremember times and locations, they misidentify faces, they remember things wrong and have to go back to correct themselves, they disagree about what they saw or maybe heard. You think you remember what time something happened because you looked at your watch just before, and think only a few minutes had passed but really it was half an hour.

I think that in all these interviews with family members, the timelines are inconsistent because nobody was paying that much attention to the clock. It was a lazy summer day. The girls were out playing; nobody thought too much of it. They didn't know something bad was about to happen. Going back to try to reconstruct the time is going to be difficult at best.

I would be far more suspicious if the times were consistent and coherent, because that would seem to indicate collusion. Inconsistency is the norm.