IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #31

[Squeeze]

There isn't much to talk about with no new information so I think we are all just thinking of things that could have happened because we have no evidence. I was sleuthing a SRO that was a dead end. First I searched houses for sale near lakes or bodies of water. Found one on storm lake, the video was strange in that it had a run down swing set in the yard and something that looked like a doll house, several old bikes next to the shed, a bike on the back porch, none of these bikes looked new, they looked liked junk bikes for parts. Next the video of the inside of the house looked lived in but I found it strange because (from what I could see) there was nothing to indicate any children lived in the house. On top of that the background music was like music you would hear at a funeral parlor. From there I checked to see who had lived in this house for sale. Spoko gives you past and present owners. From that list I googled a first initial and last name. Ok, so now I have one that is a registered sex offender. He is on "ice", and I also notice his name on a class action suit at a factory that might be close to the area. I send a request to the site asking to be updated if there is any change in his status. There was, he was deported. So ok, that one did not pan out as a possible suspect so I move on......to ice cream trucks, someone with a boat who hides the body till he gets to seven bridges, someone who has been eying the day care center when the girls ride by, someone who abused animals, etc etc etc. None of us know so our minds wander to what could have happened. In either case if just one person posts something at least once a day these girls names stay at the top of the list. It keeps the thread going. Many threads tend to get lost on here, there are many to choose from and there are many new ones a person can move on to. Hopefully we can somehow keep this one going until they find who did this.

You are an excellent sleuther, Skeet!!

 

[Snowbunny]

I forgot about the Book Mobile. We had one here too, but I don't know if we still do. My kids are grown now.

 

[Snowbunny]

Its too bad they didn't turn that memorial park into what we have here. We have an outdoor campus which the parks and recreation people manage here and its open all year around with activities for the kids daily. Its wonderful and we also have a butterfly house at the same location.

 

[watcher9]

The murders could have been committed much later than we expected, if this guy felt safe at 7-Bridges until the beginning of deer hunting season (September). I would love to see a map of the areas this guy has traveled. . . .

I would also be interested in seeing the pictures and the areas he traveled. I would like to have seen the timeline too. On the Cody WY thread, there was speculation that he may have been in Missouri at one time because of relatives, maybe a funeral. Iowa could have been on the way home in Montana.

I don't think he would have hung around. I was thinking more in the line that he may have used the same story of the lost puppy to take the girls, maybe after they got off of their bikes. Later, he may have taken pictures of the girls, had his way with them and then killed them. It may have scared him or even excited him to have done two at once. I don't think he stayed around. I think he left and made his way back home, taking deep breaths all the way, saying I did it, I did it.

Then, two months later he was ready again. Why would he have tried to approach three girls when it would have been a lot easier to go after a girl by herself. Did he have a lot of confidence from a prior experience - maybe from our girls? His plan may have backfired when the other girls wouldn't get near him and he panicked knowing there were witnesses now. Up on the mountain, I do wonder why he didn't kill her after having his way and taking pictures. She fought back by kicking him in the nose which may have thrown him for a loop and he just left her in the middle of nowhere to die.

Now that I've written that, I'm wondering if he actually would have killed the girls? Maybe he just tied them up and left them there in the middle of nowhere and they died of exposure/dehydration after being unable to get free? Maybe they were separated because one of them tried to wiggle away? Evidence may be rope, chains or tape.

NOTE: None of this is true. All of the above is just me thinking out of the box and my imagination going wild.

 

[Indy Anna]

Well, isn't everybody a suspect???? Just trying to think of someone who may have been in the area, might be a potential witness, potential perp.... possible explanation as to why they left in such a hurry. Every scenario is worth discussing. Just because it hasn't been reported - that we know of - does not mean its not a plausable explanation. Obviously we, and LE, haven't thought of everything, since the case has not been solved. Although I hate the expression "think outside the box", our thoughts can't be confined to what has been released to us. Clearly the killer isn't inside that "box". We need to remove the box....

If we don't discuss our theories (and stay within the TOS, ahem....) what is the point of the forum???

This is very true. But, I think Otto's point was regarding a statement that the (hypothetical) ice cream truck driver wouldn't have done anything to the girls. Otto was implying that the ice cream truck driver can't be ruled out if we don't know for sure there was an ice cream truck or that it is the reason Lyric and Elizabeth ran outside in the middle of pouring juice; and, if the ice cream truck scenario is true, we don't know what the hypothetical vendor is capable of since we don't know who he is. At least, that was my understanding.

 

[alliemay]

I was thinking about how LE said this was a "unique" case. I initially thought maybe because it involved abducting two at one time. But I have read other cases where two children were abducted together so that is something that has been done before. It's a unique case for Evansdale because a double abduction has never happened in their town.

Maybe he means unique because it doesn't fit into any pattern of killing that they are aware of. With Beth Doe, letters and numbers were written on her hand, they don't know if she wrote this or if her killer wrote it, nor what it means. This to me is unique.
With Woodlawn Jane Doe, it was bandana's that were wrapped around her head with holes cut out for her eyes. That to me is unique. There are many more i'm sure but it had me thinking maybe something was left on or with the girls that would be a unique signature of the killer. Its hard to try and figure out the type of personality not knowing the manner of death. Recently I read a thread on here about a man in Texas who cut off the feet of a corpse. There was a linked article about a theory called the McDonald Triad, very interesting study trying. I know I was looking for recent articles about animal abuse but if I have time I'm going to look for old news articles of someone abusing animals in that area. This person was possibly abused as a child, just a guess, just more random thoughts.

 

[Salem]

Discussing moderation in the threads is against TOS. If you have a question, PM a moderator and we will get you an answer.

Thanks,

Salem

 

[otto]

If Lyric and Elizabeth were lured outside by something they heard, another possibility would be a book-mobile. A book-mobile goes through the area where I live in the summertime - or did in the past; I don't remember hearing it last summer, but maybe this has just been a long winter for me. Lol.

The book-mobile that came through here would play music, with voices and sound effects - e.g., the sound of someone knocking on a door and saying, "hello." In other words, it was very distinctive so that the neighborhood children would know it was the book-mobile.

If Lyric and Elizabeth were chasing an ice cream truck or a book-mobile that they heard in the distance, and it moved along before they reached it, they could have gone quite a ways on their bikes before realizing how far they'd traveled from home. When they started to head back home, they may have met up with the wrong person who lives in the area.

But, it's also possible that they were victimized by an ice cream vendor, book-mobile driver, etc. Often predators do work around children. After the person has engaged the child in conversation, even briefly, the child may no longer regard the person as a stranger. He becomes a quick friend; someone the child feels s/he can trust. Perhaps there is an ice cream vendor, book-mobile driver, or someone of that nature who lives near the lake.

RE a book-mobile driver: I don't know if Elizabeth would have need to take her purse in that case? Not sure if a book-mobile rents out books, or if a library card is necessary, supposing the local library sponsors a book-mobile.

If there was some sort of noise that attracts children outside the house at the time that the children ran out of the house, I would expect that Wylma or one of the other children would remember.

I doubt that the children left for any reason other than the fact that they had more time to play, and they decided to do exactly that.

 

[24Roses]

If I may say, there was an ice cream truck that went into the campground north of Cedar Falls last summer. There was a guy driving and he had a younger person helping in the back (I think it was a girl).
Since LE has released so little info. since the girls went missing and were found, I think anything could be possible.
They haven't released what else they saw on the camera or what Wylma may have heard or saw before they went outside because I think they want to compare what others say they heard or saw. :moo:

 

[Marilynilpa]

This is probably not connected in any way, but I thought I'd post it just in case.

An Independence man was arrested Monday for first-degree kidnapping, stemming from an incident in January.

According to the Buchanan County Attorney, Matthew Sargent Noack, 23, Noack forced his victim from a location at Ninth Street and Third Street SW in Independence and took him or her to another location next to East Elementary School.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/in...cle_b8f53aea-b11e-11e2-bd32-0019bb2963f4.html

 

[Bootsctr]

I would also be interested in seeing the pictures and the areas he traveled. I would like to have seen the timeline too. On the Cody WY thread, there was speculation that he may have been in Missouri at one time because of relatives, maybe a funeral. Iowa could have been on the way home in Montana.

I don't think he would have hung around. I was thinking more in the line that he may have used the same story of the lost puppy to take the girls, maybe after they got off of their bikes. Later, he may have taken pictures of the girls, had his way with them and then killed them. It may have scared him or even excited him to have done two at once. I don't think he stayed around. I think he left and made his way back home, taking deep breaths all the way, saying I did it, I did it.

Then, two months later he was ready again. Why would he have tried to approach three girls when it would have been a lot easier to go after a girl by herself. Did he have a lot of confidence from a prior experience - maybe from our girls? His plan may have backfired when the other girls wouldn't get near him and he panicked knowing there were witnesses now. Up on the mountain, I do wonder why he didn't kill her after having his way and taking pictures. She fought back by kicking him in the nose which may have thrown him for a loop and he just left her in the middle of nowhere to die.

Now that I've written that, I'm wondering if he actually would have killed the girls? Maybe he just tied them up and left them there in the middle of nowhere and they died of exposure/dehydration after being unable to get free? Maybe they were separated because one of them tried to wiggle away? Evidence may be rope, chains or tape.

NOTE: None of this is true. All of the above is just me thinking out of the box and my imagination going wild.

BBM - On second thought, he probably did not hang around very long either. I think a lost puppy would have worked on the enticing/luring the girls. He may have a map of Iowa. I think he's taking the pictures to remember the victims and maybe a record of where they were left. Maybe LE is hesitant to call it a homicide because the condition of the bodies could not rule out exposure/dehydration as a cause of death. . . yes, still a homicide, but he doesn't want to get up close and personal - he can still say if questioned honestly he left those girls alive.

ETA: My imagination is on overdrive too. I want the killer brought to justice. We have devoted a lot of great thoughts to Lyric and Elizabeth's case and I hate to just see it fade into the sunset. I believe we are sooo close....

 

[Bootsctr]

This is probably not connected in any way, but I thought I'd post it just in case.

An Independence man was arrested Monday for first-degree kidnapping, stemming from an incident in January.

According to the Buchanan County Attorney, Matthew Sargent Noack, 23, Noack forced his victim from a location at Ninth Street and Third Street SW in Independence and took him or her to another location next to East Elementary School.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/in...cle_b8f53aea-b11e-11e2-bd32-0019bb2963f4.html

Pure evil! :rage: First-degree kidnapping is a federal offense. Hopefully, the powers-that-be won't take it easy on this guy because it was his first offense and let him plea down. uke:

 

[Marilynilpa]

Pure evil! :rage: First-degree kidnapping is a federal offense. Hopefully, the powers-that-be won't take it easy on this guy because it was his first offense and let him plea down. uke:

BBM

It seems like that is what always happens.:stormingmad:

 

[watcher9]

BBM - On second thought, he probably did not hang around very long either. I think a lost puppy would have worked on the enticing/luring the girls. He may have a map of Iowa. I think he's taking the pictures to remember the victims and maybe a record of where they were left. Maybe LE is hesitant to call it a homicide because the condition of the bodies could not rule out exposure/dehydration as a cause of death. . . yes, still a homicide, but he doesn't want to get up close and personal - he can still say if questioned honestly he left those girls alive.

ETA: My imagination is on overdrive too. I want the killer brought to justice. We have devoted a lot of great thoughts to Lyric and Elizabeth's case and I hate to just see it fade into the sunset. I believe we are sooo close....

I hate for this case to go cold too. I wish we had a special looking glass to guide us in the right direction. I started to say to see what happened and then realized I wouldn't want to see that - well, maybe how they were taken would be all right.

I keep trying to believe that they could have been taken somewhere on their bike ride but what stops me is the bikes.
They almost had to have been at the lake when they were taken. I just can't see any person taking the risk to plant their bikes where they were found. Otherwise, he could have thrown them out anywhere or left them wherever he kidnapped the girls.

 

[Squeeze]

If I may say, there was an ice cream truck that went into the campground north of Cedar Falls last summer. There was a guy driving and he had a younger person helping in the back (I think it was a girl).
Since LE has released so little info. since the girls went missing and were found, I think anything could be possible.
They haven't released what else they saw on the camera or what Wylma may have heard or saw before they went outside because I think they want to compare what others say they heard or saw. :moo:

EXACTLY!!! As I've said million times, we have no way of knowing ALL of the information that was given to LE. This could be something they're holding close to the vest, as well as whatever other sightings of the girls there may have been. Do we know for sure there was an ice cream truck? No we don't. Is it a possibility?? Of course. And 24Roses, you remind me that there is a campground at Deerwood park, all the more likely that an ice cream truck COULD have been in the area on any given day.

The only sure thing that we know is that someone took the girls from Evansdale. When the truth finally comes out, I sincerely hope that it wasn't something that we dismissed because we thought it was an unlikely scenario.

 

[Marilynilpa]

Dan's trial on domestic violence delayed:

http://www.kwqc.com/story/22104473/davenport-trial-for-evansdales-morrissey-delayed

http://cedarfalls.patch.com/articles/daniel-morrissey-s-assault-trial-delayed

There's really nothing new . . .

 

[Marilynilpa]

EXACTLY!!! As I've said million times, we have no way of knowing ALL of the information that was given to LE. This could be something they're holding close to the vest, as well as whatever other sightings of the girls there may have been. Do we know for sure there was an ice cream truck? No we don't. Is it a possibility?? Of course. And 24Roses, you remind me that there is a campground at Deerwood park, all the more likely that an ice cream truck COULD have been in the area on any given day.

The only sure thing that we know is that someone took the girls from Evansdale. When the truth finally comes out, I sincerely hope that it wasn't something that we dismissed because we thought it was an unlikely scenario.

I doubt if anything has been dismissed. We've discussed paddleboats, feral hogs and scores of other topics. I'll talk about any topic as long as it keeps this thread from dying out!

 

[Dr. Know?]

Dan's trial on domestic violence delayed:

http://www.kwqc.com/story/22104473/davenport-trial-for-evansdales-morrissey-delayed

http://cedarfalls.patch.com/articles/daniel-morrissey-s-assault-trial-delayed

There's really nothing new . . .

Jason S's drug charges show the same for yesterday as DM's DV case, an order for continuance...talk about pretrial conferences, I've never seen so many before,

FOR CONTINUANCE LEKAR KELLYANN M 04/26/2013 04/29/2013 04/29/2013
Comments: FPTC 5/3/13 @ 9 AM & TRIAL 5/7/13 @ 9 AM

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TIndexFrm

Nothing new but it keeps the thread going!

 

[Bootsctr]

I doubt if anything has been dismissed. We've discussed paddleboats, feral hogs and scores of other topics. I'll talk about any topic as long as it keeps this thread from dying out!

Feral pigs run hog wild across the US

"Wild hogs are a far cry from the cute pigs you might see down at the petting farm, in both size and temperament. While some have ancestors that may have escaped from domestic captivity, others are descendants of Russian wild boars and other invasive species -- thought to have gotten away from game ranches or hunters who brought them in for sport. They also carry a variety of diseases.


And while most of the hogs are very shy, there have been numerous reports of them attacking people. In fact, according to the Texas A&M AgriLife Extension website, "U.S. newspapers report from five to seven human fatalities each year" from such encounters. That puts the hogs among some dangerous company: Shark attacks accounted for seven deaths worldwide in 2012, according to the University of Florida."

http://money.msn.com/now/post.aspx?post=87bc84db-d583-4640-b958-205196aa58d7

 

[Bootsctr]

If there was some sort of noise that attracts children outside the house at the time that the children ran out of the house, I would expect that Wylma or one of the other children would remember.

I doubt that the children left for any reason other than the fact that they had more time to play, and they decided to do exactly that.

I agree. If there was an ice cream truck Wylma might have heard, but more than likely the other children would have heard it. Kids are tuned in to hear those ice cream trucks. I do agree with the WebSleuther (sorry I can't remember who said this, but I thought it made good sense) that the girls saw something or someone as they poured their glasses of juice. Maybe the girls saw some other frozen delivery type of vehicle that maybe doesn't specifically sell individual ice cream treats, but might occasionally give some ice cream away to kids hoping to entice parents to purchase food from them. . . "Schwan Food Company" for example. Definitely not sleuthing the local frozen food delivery guy, but if the girls saw a truck and had gotten ice cream from a hypothetical person in the past they might have tried to catch up with the truck to see if might get lucky and be given a treat ? ? ?