IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #9

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Justice with Jeannie Pirro was on with WC and TB on the phone. WC said the girls had NEVER gone to the lake, ever. Later TB commented that yes, girls were friends with 3 girls who live across from the lake, they had been there before.
Now my question to you, you would think this famly would have discussed this as much as we have discussed all the possibilities. So are you telling me that through all the discussions, no one ever told Grandma (WC) yes, girls have been to Meyers Lake before. I just find this so baffling. How about you> Thanks

EXACTLY. And not only did Aunt Tammy have to correct Grandma, she had to do it on national television. Awkward Turtle , as my kids say.

And like you said, wouldn't the whole family have discussed the lake and everything concerning the girls and their connection to the lake?

Some of us had wondered out loud how it was that Aunt T. knew exactly where to go and look for the girls, if in fact they had never ridden their bikes to the lake before. She said she had a gut feeling but it was a little more than that, imo.
 
Justice with Jeannie Pirro was on with WC and TB on the phone. WC said the girls had NEVER gone to the lake, ever. Later TB commented that yes, girls were friends with 3 girls who live across from the lake, they had been there before.
Now my question to you, you would think this famly would have discussed this as much as we have discussed all the possibilities. So are you telling me that through all the discussions, no one ever told Grandma (WC) yes, girls have been to Meyers Lake before. I just find this so baffling. How about you> Thanks
Smiley, I have a feeling this family doesn't communicate well. And my gut feeling about Aunt Tammy is that she might like hearing herself talk a little bit? Is she the official spokesperson for her sisters? I'm just wondering why one or both of the girls' mothers wasn't part of the interview. I can understand the grandmother as she is basically Lyric's guardian, but Elizabeth's parents, I don't get.
 
Justice with Jeannie Pirro was on with WC and TB on the phone. WC said the girls had NEVER gone to the lake, ever. Later TB commented that yes, girls were friends with 3 girls who live across from the lake, they had been there before.
Now my question to you, you would think this famly would have discussed this as much as we have discussed all the possibilities. So are you telling me that through all the discussions, no one ever told Grandma (WC) yes, girls have been to Meyers Lake before. I just find this so baffling. How about you> Thanks

I agree with you Smiley..by the time she was interviewed and made the statement that the girls had never gone down to the lake ..I would think that it had been hashed out in the family. I have had many questions about statements and behavior of family members..so this is just one more.
 
Justice with Jeannie Pirro was on with WC and TB on the phone. WC said the girls had NEVER gone to the lake, ever. Later TB commented that yes, girls were friends with 3 girls who live across from the lake, they had been there before.
Now my question to you, you would think this famly would have discussed this as much as we have discussed all the possibilities. So are you telling me that through all the discussions, no one ever told Grandma (WC) yes, girls have been to Meyers Lake before. I just find this so baffling. How about you> Thanks

BBM

Just need some clarification on that. You say the girls live across from the lake, but others said across the street from Lizzy. Can you, or someone else, say for sure which it is? Thanks.
 
I assume the island has been searched? Likely a silly question, but one I needed to ask.

And now for a few thoughts: Just looked at a map of the area for the first time tonight. Trying to put myself back into my childhood and recall where I'd ride my bike in relation to where I lived. I don't recall ever really "exploring" all the roads within .5 sq miles of my house - at least not when I was 8 or 10. I certainly branched out as I reached high school - but for a "ride" not more than a half mile. So, to go 2 miles, although not really that far, was pretty adventurous, imho. They were on a mission.

Elizabeth does have a glint in her eyes - I could believe that she might be mischievious.

Edited to remove comment about skate park; I must have dreamed that?
 
Sorry for the O/T but how did TJ Hart get to Iowa from Ocala, FL? Is that common knowledge? Or is he just on location to report on Lyric & Elizabeth missing?

For those who don't know he was very heavily involved with the circus surrounding Haleigh Cummings. Not that he caused it but I think it almost did him in at one point. jmo

He kind of created a circus tonight because of two false things he stated with great emphasis. And it set Judge J. off on the wrong foot during the interview.

TJ misstated what Grandma Cook had said previously, and so when Judge J asked her about it, she denied it vigorously.

TJ said that grandma said Dan was being an informant, which was true, but then he said [ falsely] that Grandma also said that she thought that drug history is the reason the girls are missing. She never said that, imo.

So Judge J asked her and she denied it.

TJ also falsely said that Dan was arrested on weapons charges and apparently that was incorrect too.
 
BBM

Just need some clarification on that. You say the girls live across from the lake, but others said across the street from Lizzy. Can you, or someone else, say for sure which it is? Thanks.

I heard across the street.
 
Exactly. I remember when I first started looking into this case and joined WS, that was brought up - perhaps I saw it on a map. I had remembered it was pretty well obscured from view from Arbutus, but that I'd seen a city vehicle parked there once and wondered what it was.

When I went to check it out, I noticed the area around it had been cleared considerably since I'd first noticed it (that time period could be as much as a couple years). They drained Meyers Lake a couple years back, and I've steadily noticed small improvements that seem to have been done at that time: the jetty was built up - it used to be all but submerged (I remember my kids and I watching a turtle teeter on the edge of the drain pipe once, but there was no way to walk out there. It was just a weird, scary hole in the surace of the lake, draining like a bathtub. After the draining/refilling there was a jetty to walk right out to it.); the gate had been enlarged, but the lock had never been replaced; much of the undergrowth and trees right along the lake shore - all the way around - had been cleared away; the shoreline from the parking area around to the southwest corner had been covered with huge rocks, I assume to prevent erosion; the pump/lift house had been cleared around, so that it was no longer a mysterious building back in the woods, but was clearly visible from the road, and had a nice wide, clear driveway/parking area for 1-2 vehicles. Even noticing all this, I'd never seen Maiden Lane until I went looking for it.

Your insight about the area is so important to those of us who have to rely on aerial views. Thank you!!!!
 
Aye, 100% agreed. I was in there with my kids (9 & 4) and when I went to try to walk to the end of the fence, I told them to stay put in the clearing. I just had the feeling I was gonna see something in the underbrush that I wouldn't want them to see. Definitely one of the most bone-chilling moments in my life, knowing that those two girls could be lying anywhere nearby. Talking to the tipline, the lady made me feel sorta stupid, as if the entire area had obviously been scoured with a fine-tooth comb. Of course, when I asked if she was familiar with the lift/pump house (assuming she was - its a block from the police station), she had no clue what I was talking about.


I wonder if the pump house door has been opened and checked inside for the girls - what if a worker left the door opened, unlocked, or ajar - the girls go there open the door, both go in, door closes and they are trapped inside.
 
Justice with Jeannie Pirro was on with WC and TB on the phone. WC said the girls had NEVER gone to the lake, ever. Later TB commented that yes, girls were friends with 3 girls who live across from the lake, they had been there before.
Now my question to you, you would think this famly would have discussed this as much as we have discussed all the possibilities. So are you telling me that through all the discussions, no one ever told Grandma (WC) yes, girls have been to Meyers Lake before. I just find this so baffling. How about you> Thanks

I am as baffled as you. Surely Tammy must have realized she was dropping a bombshell.

Poor Grandma.
 
BBM

Just need some clarification on that. You say the girls live across from the lake, but others said across the street from Lizzy. Can you, or someone else, say for sure which it is? Thanks.

Pretty sure that she said they live across from Lizzie.
 
He kind of created a circus tonight because of two false things he stated with great emphasis. And it set Judge J. off on the wrong foot during the interview.

TJ misstated what Grandma Cook had said previously, and so when Judge J asked her about it, she denied it vigorously.

TJ said that grandma said Dan was being an informant, which was true, but then he said [ falsely] that Grandma also said that she thought that drug history is the reason the girls are missing. She never said that, imo.

So Judge J asked her and she denied it.

TJ also falsely said that Dan was arrested on weapons charges and apparently that was incorrect too.

Thanks Katydid. So it is the same TJ Hart, only in Iowa now.
 
The fact that so little has been found in terms of evidence (as far as we know), leads me to believe that the 'circle' surrounding this case is small and the net being cast is even smaller. From what has been shared here, the initial search for the girls and the gathering of evidence was sloppy (moo), meaning there are probably more than a few stones which have yet to be unturned.

My gut tells me that the girls are probably much closer to the location where they (not their bikes) were last seen than anyone realizes. Most searches focus on ground level evidence. What about looking up ? Trees , bushes ? Or viewing various points of interest ie. the drainage pipe we keep hearing about, the men's clothing store, even the front and back yard of homes the girls were known to frequent (grandma's, Aunt Tammy's, HC, ), from different physical vantage points . Have car trunks been searched (think those which have been parked or abandoned) ? LE is known to use infrared, heat sensing cameras during aerial searches. Has that type of technology been used in this case, not just wooded areas, but in town as well ?

Sometimes the answer is literally right infront or beside us and we don't even realize it.
 
The fact that so little has been found in terms of evidence (as far as we know), leads me to believe that the 'circle' surrounding this case is small and the net being cast is even smaller. From what has been shared here, the initial search for the girls and the gathering of evidence was sloppy (moo), meaning there are probably more than a few stones which have yet to be unturned.

My gut tells me that the girls are probably much closer to the location where they (not their bikes) were last seen than anyone realizes. Most searches focus on ground level evidence. What about looking up ? Trees , bushes ? Or viewing various points of interest ie. the drainage pipe we keep hearing about, the men's clothing store, even the front and back yard of homes the girls were known to frequent (grandma's, Aunt Tammy's, HC, ), from different physical vantage points . Have car trunks been searched (think those which have been parked or abandoned) ? LE is known to use infrared, heat sensing cameras during aerial searches. Has that type of technology been used in this case, not just wooded areas, but in town as well ?

Sometimes the answer is literally right infront or beside us and we don't even realize it.

I so agree with everything you say in your post. MOO
 
Agree. AND, she did not mention Lyric having gone to the lake. She only said Lizzie.

Yes. And wasn't Lizzie racing ahead of Lyric in the video? Maybe she was excited to show her older cousin that she knew how to ride to the lake.
 
BBM -

snip -

4 p.m. - The girls' bikes are located along the bike trail on the southeast corner of Meyers Lake by an Evansdale firefighter. Elizabeth's purse, which contained a cell phone, was found nearby.

snip -

The purse was on the lake-side of the fence, about 10 feet to the east of the bikes and about 2 feet from the fence, officials said.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/up...cle_18411a90-cd32-11e1-a656-0019bb2963f4.html

Wait.....the girls were reported missing hours earlier.
M. reportedly said something like "hey search the lake" and it STILL
Took until 4pm to find the girls bike,
the purse and the phone?

Somebody is lying! Imhoo
 
Sorry to say this, but if a local took them, their bodies are someplace, probably within ten-twenty miles, IMO. Very unlikely to be holding two girls of this age for over two weeks now. They would have no way of knowing if LE should knock on the door and ask to search, and besides, it just is not that easy to hold one person, much less two. Easier to take them and then be "rid" of them, I fear. Professional searchers really should be called in, IMO.

Sadly cluciano63, I think this *could* be true no matter who abducted them.

I spent over an hour looking at O's photos. After having things explained a little better and relooking at the pics, I think several here gave a likely scenario tonight. :moo:
 
I'm getting it.....hating it but I'm getting it.
That section is a trap....people ride to that point ....
and turn around because otherwise there is NO EXIT. :please:
:moo:

No, lol. Not at all. Reference any of hundreds of posts, including the map linked at the beginning of the thread.

The trail does not end in the SE corner of Meyers Lake. The northern terminus is on Lafayette Rd, about a 1.5 miles north. The other "end" is on the other side of the lake, at the parking area/playground. There is also an offshoot of the trail, and it intersects Gilbert Rd in two different locations (as well as following the road out of the parking area), which is considered a bike route which ends at River Forest Road to the west, or connects to the Cedar Valley Nature Trail to the west, which then leads south some 50 miles.
 
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