IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #41

[Hatfield]

How do we know he killed her in an uncontrollable rage?

Didnt he admit in the confession that he "blocks out" when he loses his temper.

Losing temper is equivalent to uncontrollable rage to an extent.

 

[rebel123]

Didnt he admit in the confession that he "blocks out" when he loses his temper.

Losing temper is equivalent to uncontrollable rage to an extent.

That could potentially be his defense - 'Diminished Capacity'.

 

[SharonNeedles]

LE stated early on during the searches that the last digital ping was near the pig farm. CR could've gone past the pig farm on his way to the cornfield, but it would have been going an mile extra south (470th), just to have to turn around and go back north before turning east on 460th. *Please somebody inform me if I have any locations wrong!

I have heard, but have no source, that fields close to where she was found had been searched. Had some digital signals happened around there, too? That I don't know.

Anyway, the location he left her was very close to an intersection (maybe the one he claims to have taken a u-turn) which takes a short jaunt south to 470th. If CR didn't want to backtrack on 460th for any reason, that would be a logical quick route out. The pig farm would be on his way home. If he still had her phone at that point, maybe that's where he turned it off or tossed it, thus the last ping.

Blue line is his route from near abduction site, and green line is his route home. MOO

Totally my speculation, but I don’t believe he proceeded directly to the dump site. It makes sense that he would continue out of town on 385th ave because that’s the only way out of town from where he was at without going back through town. In doing so he’s already on the backroads in rural Brooklyn. He lived on 400th ave and there are very few roads down there, he’s very familiar with those roads and very comfortable on them.

Consider this: he surely didn’t set out that night to just kill Mollie and dispose of her body. At some point he found himself with a body he needed to get rid of and needed to think of something fast. It makes sense that he would stick to backroads that he’s familiar with, and since there are just a few roads he’s going to be familiar to some degree with all of them. It makes sense to me that this is real close to the route he would take.

 

[Al Hoffman]

I guess I don’t understand why the dissection of what CR told LE...do we really expect perps to tell the complete truth, portraying themselves in worst possible light? Of course he will omit and minimize...the miracle to me is that he admitted anything at all, video or no. Your average hardened criminal just keeps his mouth shut, opening it only to say he wants his lawyer. Seemingly this guy pretty much spilled his guts, in his way, as soon as he sat down. Not exactly a seasoned serial killer, imo...

Yeah, you're right. CBR is uneducated, unsophisticated, inexperienced in dealing with LE, and not a hardened criminal. New fish learn this kinda stuff from Cons. This is why my ex-con next door neighbor always referred to his 20 years in Angola State Penatentary for murder as his time away at " college". So much time to fill, learning by the old fashioned Socratic method.

CBR likely spilled his guts to the Federalies because he was afraid of them, and did not know any better at the time.

NOW he will.

 

[The Farm]

I suppose that the narrative about what happened to MT has reached the wait and see what happens next stage. I think that short of a jailhouse conversation(s) with CBR leaked to MSM (Daily Mail anyone?), I think that it will be a while before we hear anything new about this investigation. For myself, I have a good enough "broad strokes" picture about this tragic crime to mostly satisfy my curiosity, but I will continue to follow this thread. The group mind on WS is a better source for breaking news than Google News!

Yes and now we wait and wait and wait and surmise and surmise and surmise. We go on to other cases eventually and kind of forget about the ones that we were so interested in because there is no such thing as swift justice.
When I hear of something tragic on the news I come to Websleuths also, better more precise reports than the actual news.

 

[MsBetsy]

Good morning T. Farm and Bravo. I thought I was out here lurking alone. Hope y'all are well. I brought the beer!

I suppose that the narrative about what happened to MT has reached the wait and see what happens next stage. I think that short of a jailhouse conversation(s) with CBR leaked to MSM (Daily Mail anyone?), I think that it will be a while before we hear anything new about this investigation. For myself, I have a good enough "broad strokes" picture about this tragic crime to mostly satisfy my curiosity, but I will continue to follow this thread. The group mind on WS is a better source for breaking news than Google News!

The current narrative in the news, concerning MT, seems to be mainly about her murder and how it is influencing the current political environment. So sad! There are even stories about a Neo-Nazi group who are making robocalls into Iowa talking about the murder of MT, and calling for the death of all Latinos in the US. (PLEASE no political debate). Again, how sad!

I only point this out to say that I think that if there is significant backlash on the Latino community, resulting from MT's murder, that CBR will have a significantly worse time in prison than other wise.

RT was a very class act, in his kind words for the Iowa Latino community.

Again, Good Morning all.

I see you are still enjoying your "refreshments!" I could go for a nice cold drink myself. It has been unseasonly hot where I am. I'm not surprised about the news, although I haven't been paying much attention. Good thing. If I have learned anything on this site is how inaccurately the news is reported! I have pretty much settled on what I believe happened as well. It is kind of based on Oscars razor, or Oshkosh, or whatever it is. Based on all the facts we have, the simplest scenario. Tried to analyze the importance of the earbud, why the phone wasn't turned off, etc. for too long. He stalked her, chased her down, and brutally murdered her in a fit of rage. That much we know. We may never know the details. I would be surprised if SA did not play a role, although the kill alone may have satisfied his needs. Not sure if this will go to trial, I hope not. I'm assuming life without parole would be the most we can hope for.

 

[The Farm]

I think that CBR was in denial about what he did, to himself, kinda lying to himself. That's why he used the blocked out excuse to not talk with LE about the worst of what he did. This is the same avoidance mechanism that I have sociopaths use before. The C in CBR should stand for Cleopatra, because CBR is the king of denial!

I am not thinking that way Al as far as denial but maybe after a couple of beers I will.

 

[Al Hoffman]

Until the autopsy was done they really had no way of knowing her time of death, they were going on what he told them at the time.

This is why I am leaning towards her being held....


Authorities have not revealed when, exactly, Tibbetts was killed.

Mortvedt tells PEOPLE that he can’t discuss whether or not she was held for any period of time after being taken.


All of a sudden he just does it,” says Mitch Mortvedt, assistant director of the Iowa Division of Criminal Investigation, referring to suspect Cristhian Rivera.

“Who escalates to abduction, kidnapping and homicide that fast?”

Cops Wonder: If Mollie Tibbetts' Accused Killer Has No Record — Who Jumps to Murder That Fast?

The problem with this theory is that the arrest warrant affidavit affirms that the murder was complete by 20:28 on the 18th, perhaps based on the FitBit data. This does not allow much time for CBR to have held MT for any length of time.

JMOO

 

[gliving]

"Law enforcement located the remains of a deceased female in the area Rivera took them to. The physical surroundings of her location and other factors at the scene matched his earlier physical description of the area as that where he placed her body. Based on the interview with Rivera, the clothing found at the scene where the body was located and the tentative identification by the medical examiner based on information about certain articles of her clothing, the deceased female is Mollie Tibbetts."

http://www.dps.state.ia.us/commis/p...-2018_DCI_ArrestWarrantComplaintAffidavit.pdf

"the area as that where he placed her body" makes it sound like she was already deceased. moo

"based on information about certain articles of her clothing"

That's odd wording. Which certain articles of clothing? It seems to be more than just a match to what she was wearing? It seems specific to a particular item. moo

 

[TL4S]

Totally my speculation, but I don’t believe he proceeded directly to the dump site. It makes sense that he would continue out of town on 385th ave because that’s the only way out of town from where he was at without going back through town. In doing so he’s already on the backroads in rural Brooklyn. He lived on 400th ave and there are very few roads down there, he’s very familiar with those roads and very comfortable on them.

Consider this: he surely didn’t set out that night to just kill Mollie and dispose of her body. At some point he found himself with a body he needed to get rid of and needed to think of something fast. It makes sense that he would stick to backroads that he’s familiar with, and since there are just a few roads he’s going to be familiar to some degree with all of them. It makes sense to me that this is real close to the route he would take.

I do agree that taking that route out of town is a plausible theory. It certainly would be on more familiar turf. My only question with it is why he would take 470 over, when 460 is a through road (looks like on the map, anyway). AND, when does the 430th and 200 intersection ping come into play?

Using your idea, couldn't he have gone east on 430th instead? Also, if he was familiar with that particular cornfield for some reason, do you think he would have likely taken 200 or hwy 21 there under normal circumstances? If so, he would know those routes, as well.

I guess it all really depends on CR's mindset that night!

 

[MsBetsy]

Until the autopsy was done they really had no way of knowing her time of death, they were going on what he told them at the time.

This is why I am leaning towards her being held....


Authorities have not revealed when, exactly, Tibbetts was killed.

Mortvedt tells PEOPLE that he can’t discuss whether or not she was held for any period of time after being taken.


All of a sudden he just does it,” says Mitch Mortvedt, assistant director of the Iowa Division of Criminal Investigation, referring to suspect Cristhian Rivera.

“Who escalates to abduction, kidnapping and homicide that fast?”

Cops Wonder: If Mollie Tibbetts' Accused Killer Has No Record — Who Jumps to Murder That Fast?

That was basically the point I was trying to make. That it all happened very fast, in a fit of rage.

 

[TL4S]

"Law enforcement located the remains of a deceased female in the area Rivera took them to. The physical surroundings of her location and other factors at the scene matched his earlier physical description of the area as that where he placed her body. Based on the interview with Rivera, the clothing found at the scene where the body was located and the tentative identification by the medical examiner based on information about certain articles of her clothing, the deceased female is Mollie Tibbetts."

http://www.dps.state.ia.us/commis/p...-2018_DCI_ArrestWarrantComplaintAffidavit.pdf

"the area as that where he placed her body" makes it sound like she was already deceased. moo

"based on information about certain articles of her clothing"

That's odd wording. Which certain articles of clothing? It seems to be more than just a match to what she was wearing? It seems specific to a particular item. moo

Yes, I thought the same thing about the wording (placed her body)! I feel there is a lot to be extracted from that affidavit. I wonder of a Fitbit would be considered an article of clothing?

 

[Al Hoffman]

JMO
I think he thought he was totally in the clear too.

I think when he approached MT I am guessing it was further down on the road where no houses were directly there so he thought there is no way he would be caught.

He must not have watched Forensic Files enough.

There are many ways to get caught for a crime and not just getting lucky to find a video.

His first mistake was not thinking people in town could also show videos of him while he was in town before the attack.

Then his other mistake was not even worrying about the Fitbit. I am guessing he thought it was a watch and I believe it was still on her body when LE found her. So even if phone got disabled then when LE gets the Fitbit they can download all current Fitbit info to get more evidence against him.

LE has so many ways to eventually find out who a killer is. Look at the recent Golden State Killer case. He was eventually found by some relatives DNA from a database used for entirely different reasons. Geneology type reasons.

Yeah, you right! There are a LOT of people out there still looking over their shoulders.

Show of hands please.....

 

[MsBetsy]

I wonder if he checked the body after news reports stated she had a Fitbit and LE was looking into the data and her Dad was saying he believed she was alive.

That had to make him very uneasy I would imagine?

Yes, I'm sure. I don't know if he would have dared check the body. Maybe drive by to see if there were any activity in the area, though.

 

[kpm]

The problem with this theory is that the arrest warrant affidavit affirms that the murder was complete by 20:28 on the 18th, perhaps based on the FitBit data. This does not allow much time for CBR to have held MT for any length of time.

JMOO

Moo.....

I get what you’re saying but I think they may have info that says differently.

I’ve been going over the press conference video question by question, it’s hard to here the reporters questions but LE is not giving any information on about her time of death or if she was held.

He states he’s waiting for ME report or he states he’s not going to discuss it at this point that’s it’s an ongoing investigation.

He was asked if she was killed at the abduction site, again he won’t answer that, he says we know she was abducted at that point

I think they gave a timeline to get the arrest warrant based on his story, obviously they need to now backtrack and put the puzzle together.

I’m just leaving the door open to the fact that she may have been held based on his answers and what was quoted in the People article.

I know he can’t answer the questions as the ME report was not done, but they saw the body and they have CR’s version, which is more than what was in the warrant.

 

[MsBetsy]

Yeah, you right! There are a LOT of people out there still looking over their shoulders.

Show of hands please.....

Speak for yourself!

 

[rebel123]

I think CR was aware of Fitness Trackers as such; but not the capabilities.

 

[Al Hoffman]

Yes. If his story about her grabbing her phone is at all true, she maybe did have it out of her armband and in her hand when he attacked her. Likely the phone and earbuds would have fallen. If he got her in the trunk, I could see him going back to grab them off the ground and getting into the car still holding them. They ended up on his lap or on the other seat (somewhere in the car). Maybe he was planning on keeping them to sell (risky), or he forgot about them in the process of what he was doing with her body, or he planned to burn them...whatever.

It makes sense to me that she might have had her phone in her hand when he approached her, as she might have been concerned about a car that passed her, a mile back, was now following her an a country road devoid of homes and people.

 

[Al Hoffman]

Speak for yourself!

I always do...tee hee!

 

[Sanz]

I don't believe there was an accomplice to the actual crime. LE saw the car on video passing by several times. IMO killer was visible and only killer.

Maybe I need more coffee but I don’t remember that LE was able to identify the driver of the vehicle or possible passengers. But only the car passing her several times.