ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 61

[Twistinginthewind]

IMO, there's the possibility of kidnapping and sexual assault (SA) as a motive. Even though LE said early on that there were no signs of SA doesn't mean it wasn't a motive or underlying motive IMO, just that there wasn't obvious evidence it happened:

• BK became obsessed with Maddie through stalking on SM and maybe observing her in public or through the windows of the house.
• BK decided late at night was the best time to kidnap her (disable her first & pick her up from bed & take her out of the house for SA elsewhere -- she was very petite & he would be strong enough to carry her out, IMO).
• BK thought if he couldn't kidnap her (i.e., his plan went awry for carrying her out) he could SA her in bed with big hand/arm over mouth/hold her down & it would be quiet.
• Maddie fought him off before he could do either (kidnap or SA).
• Kaylee heard the struggle in the next room, said "Someone's Here" to the household (DM heard it and it says in the PCA she thought it was Kaylee's voice), and went into M's bedroom & saw a man attacking Maddie & tried to stop him.
• BK killed them both. IMO this is where rage came in & set him off into a killing frenzy because he was thwarted in the SA.
• Xana (eating her DD delivery food/on SM) & Ethan (asleep?) were aroused due to the noise (DM heard what she thought was Kaylee playing with the dog in the PCA) and Ethan started upstairs to check out the noise and BK came after him emboldened with knife raised & chased him into Xana's room.
• BK killed them both.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

I do not believe I’ve read any evidence supporting a forced entry. Likewise, I personally have not read anything which suggests a forced entry into MM’s bedroom.

Yes. And there is a photo of the forensic team dusting the window to the righting the kitchen slider for prints. We don’t know yet the details.

 

[10ofRods]

The issue of expanding it has become topical in the last few days because too many ' LE sources ' have made their way into the media
( the neighbours' trash bins stories, the glove-wearing in supermarkets, the ' Idaho lawmen' source at the weekend)

Topical here, yes. Gag order from ID isn't going to apply to PA, IMO. "Idaho lawman" is quite vague. A lawyer? (I dislike that form of journalism as so many of us do). Probably retired LE, just like we're seeing all the "former FBI" and "former profilers" speak.

 

[truecrimeallthetime]

~4am - DoorDash arrival
~4am - DM awoken by Gonclaves playing with dog
4:04am - BK parks his car (surveillance camera)
4:12am - Kernodle on TikTok
4:17am - security camera picks up audio of a "whimper"/thud and a dog beginning to bark
4:20am - BK leave scene at high rate of speed (surveillance camera)

From the time of parking to leaving there is 16 minutes.

For this to make sense, BK would have gone to the 3rd floor first. DM believing she heard Gonclaves playing with her dog was likely BK committing the murders. Kernodle was still active on TikTok at 4:12, so that leads me to believe BK didn't enter her room until after that time.

4:04 to 4:12 gives him 8 minutes to walk to the house and kill the two girls upstairs.
4:12-4:20 gives him 8 minutes to kill the two on the second floor, walk back to his car and leave.

This time frame is so tight, one would have to believe that he caught them all sleeping and/or not paying attention. Any amount of physical fighting or wrestling with BK would make this timeline untenable. However, at the very least Kernodle was awake based on her TikTok timeline, her "whimpering," the thud, and her being found on the floor near the bathroom. Maybe she was nodding off and BK killing Chapin woke her and she tried to run away? And that's why BK may have said "I'm trying to help him?"

And did the same thing happen upstairs? One of the girls woke and that's why she was found on top of the other one?

The timeline of this really gets to me and I can't put my finger on why...

I think he killed M & K on the third floor rather quickly because they were sleeping. Maybe, if one in fact was laying on the other, she woke up and tried to stand but quickly collapsed back into bed from her injuries. Then as he was exiting he encountered X in her doorway/hallway and she attempted to alert E. He stabs her and she falls (thud) and then he goes swiftly to E who was waking up from the commotion before he can get up and put up a fight. He then goes back to X to “help her” because she is still alive. They were both probably so confused and caught off guard about what was happening and didn’t put up a big loud fight. Then he panics because he hadn’t anticipated killing that many people and his flight response kicks in and gets out of there as fast as he can. He was probably unsure if X or someone else had dialed 911 and wanted to get out of the area. This is what makes sense in my mind but I am sure we will learn a lot more surprising details as the case moves through the court. MOO

 

[Boxer]

A forensic download of Kernodle's phone is described in the affidavit.

Read the FULL affidavit on Bryan Kohberger's arrest

Idaho police have released a bombshell affidavit laying out their initial case against murder suspect Bryan Kohberger.

www.dailymail.co.uk

MOO would help to know how the phone was found. Doesn’t Tiktok require you to swipe to move on? When her tiktok app stopped on a single video and it kept looping is likely when she was interrupted.

 

[SortaSleuthy]

On the discussion about forced entry, IMO:

Most locked sliding glass doors are easy to defeat.

Put on rubber gloves to get a better grip.

Place the palms of your hands on the glass and push upwards on the side by the latch.

The door will lift up about an inch … off of the latch.

 

[kittythehare]

"First day back at WSU after Kohberger arrest
Classes at Washington State University in Pullman resumed Monday for the first time since news broke of the arrest of Bryan Kohberger."

Powerful interview with SG.
I'm so glad to see this softening in him.
I think SG will have a role going forward helping very many people, he is raw and truthful.
Healing has commenced, I think. I hope. But it's still a very long road ahead.
a bit of a shock to learn that BK's phone actually was close enough to spark of their wifi.
Closer than I'd imagined..

 

[ReadySet]

An aside: May be helpful.
"Bullying" seems to be defined in many diffeent ways.
This is what was posted at my last school for students. It's helpful for adults too.

 

[minazoe]

On the discussion about forced entry, IMO:

Most locked sliding glass doors are easy to defeat.

Put on rubber gloves to get a better grip.

Place the palms of your hands on the glass and push upwards on the side by the latch.

The door will lift up about an inch … off of the latch.

this is why a lead pipe or metal pipe cut to size should be inserted into the free side on the bottom so that it cannot be slid open.

mOO

 

[WingsOverTX]

The Delphi case issued a gag order that included family members as well after the arrest of RA.

Precedent in other cases doesn't make a gag order the best thing to do IMHO.

Important rights must be weighed by judges when issuing gag orders. Every case is unique.

The public's right to know is the default legal assumption in all matters involving public resources.

Taking away that right to know should be limited to extreme need and be of short duration. Otherwise, judicial overreach may constrain rights equal to or more important than those the judge is seeking to protect.

JMHO

 

[10ofRods]

A forensic download of Kernodle's phone is described in the affidavit.

Read the FULL affidavit on Bryan Kohberger's arrest

Idaho police have released a bombshell affidavit laying out their initial case against murder suspect Bryan Kohberger.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I think the question some of us are trying to figure out is slightly different. Right now, I have about 10 apps open on my phone (I'm not using my phone or viewing any of them).

I can imagine that depending on the OS of the phone, a forensic download could include how many times I unlocked my phone. But I'd like to know that for sure. I'd like something that isn't just MOO.

If my phone records every time I unlock it, and all those apps are simultaneously open, but I'm just viewing them (like Tik Tok), does it record in a log somewhere when I actually interact with apps?

That's my question. Different phones surely handle this differently. I'm guessing college kids would have Androids or Apple phones, but no way of knowing.

I can view several apps simultaneously on my home screen - does Apple keep a record? I'm assuming a forensic download is via warrant, from the various providers. Perhaps TikTok itself can tell? So the forensic download would lead to contacting TikTok?

For sure, we need an expert on this one (we used to have an elecronics/forensic/security expert here). It's so weird to think that everything I might have done during the life of my phone is stored somewhere in the Cloud. In my case, since I preview tons of youtubes for class without actually watching them, just finding a timestamp for my own purposes, it would look like I'm on youtube a lot, when actually I usually only watch in class.

 

[CityKid]

I thought one of the parents said there was a connection but the family wasn’t ready to disclose that yet….

SG did, and now has walked that back.

Idaho victim's father says she had CONNECTIONS to suspected killer

Steve Goncalves, father of Kaylee, 21, said his family has found connections between the University of Idaho student and suspect Bryan Kohberger, who was arrested on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[CSIDreamer]

That would be a better bet for him (there are youtubes on how to dismember and clean deer).

He is supposed to be an extreme vegan, but maybe he did want to know more about the interiors of non-human animals.

I personally think the skills he gained in boxing/kickboxing transfer readily to using a knife. While I don't practice with a knife, I do carry one as personal defense in my car. I watched some military and other training videos. The key to using this style of knife for someone like me (not strong), is to use the saber grip and then one's body weight (no need to have strong arms although strong hands helps). USMC teaches its marines to lean into the target, using body weight, so that even my relatively tiny Marine cousin is able to dispatch someone with a KaBar knife. Momentum and body weight. Just like boxing.

Mr. G described a pattern of wounds on KG that is mentioned in the article posted on the last thread (and it has been posted several times). My personal view is that his "training" was entirely watching things online. He was probably so focused on which injuries would achieve his goals (silence and rapid death with no arterial blood spurt to get him overly soaked in blood) that he forgot his logistical issue (don't forget the sheath!)

When did he take kickboxing?

 

[10ofRods]

MOO would help to know how the phone was found. Doesn’t Tiktok require you to swipe to move on? When her tiktok app stopped on a single video and it kept looping is likely when she was interrupted.

Thank you for this. I don't speak TikTok so if you have any more insights into how it might have led to a time of 4:12 (ceased swiping?) that would be great. But this is a great clue.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

When did he take kickboxing?

This article says he took boxing in high school, and he turned "aggressive" at the time, and he's now 28 years old, so over 10 years ago, but he may have kept up with it. IMO, a boxer would have the skills to stab people with a Ka-Bar knife with enough strength to disable them without any practice : {

"Kohberger also began picking up boxing lessons and was itching to put his new skills to use, according to his former friend.

“He always wanted to fight somebody, he was bullying people. We started cutting him off from our friend group because he was 100 percent a different person,” Mcloughlin said, adding that the personality switch came as a total surprise and mystery to the friends."

Idaho suspect Bryan Kohberger turned ‘aggressive’ in high school: former friend

 

[tara83]

SG did, and now has walked that back.

Idaho victim's father says she had CONNECTIONS to suspected killer

Steve Goncalves, father of Kaylee, 21, said his family has found connections between the University of Idaho student and suspect Bryan Kohberger, who was arrested on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I suspect he fell for one of the fake BK social media accounts that falsely had him following Kaylee.

 

[Walela]

Some one here has posted knowledge of Idaho procedure. Apparently there are three options. Not sure what the ramifications of them are. He looks to have excellent representation so we have to wait and see what course is decided on.

I posted these links a few threads back...thread 46 I think.

Criminal Case Process
Criminal Rule 10

 

[IceCreamSundae]

I have read nothing implying that one of the girls was found on top of the other. All that was stated is that both Maddie and Kaylee were found in the same bed. If you have heard otherwise, could you provide a link? Thanks.

That is rumour from other social media sites. I don’t believe it.

 

[CSIDreamer]

SG did, and now has walked that back.

Idaho victim's father says she had CONNECTIONS to suspected killer

Steve Goncalves, father of Kaylee, 21, said his family has found connections between the University of Idaho student and suspect Bryan Kohberger, who was arrested on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I dunno. SG said one thing, and his attorney said another thing. What's up with this? JMHO

 

[IceCreamSundae]

IMO, there's the possibility of kidnapping and sexual assault (SA) as a motive. Even though LE said early on that there were no signs of SA doesn't mean it wasn't a motive or underlying motive IMO, just that there wasn't obvious evidence it happened:

• BK became obsessed with Maddie through stalking on SM and maybe observing her in public or through the windows of the house.
• BK decided late at night was the best time to kidnap her (disable her first & pick her up from bed & take her out of the house for SA elsewhere -- she was very petite & he would be strong enough to carry her out, IMO).
• BK thought if he couldn't kidnap her (i.e., his plan went awry for carrying her out) he could SA her in bed with big hand/arm over mouth/hold her down & it would be quiet.
• Maddie fought him off before he could do either (kidnap or SA).
• Kaylee heard the struggle in the next room, said "Someone's Here" to the household (DM heard it and it says in the PCA she thought it was Kaylee's voice), and went into M's bedroom & saw a man attacking Maddie & tried to stop him.
• BK killed them both. IMO this is where rage came in & set him off into a killing frenzy because he was thwarted in the SA.
• Xana (eating her DD delivery food/on SM) & Ethan (asleep?) were aroused due to the noise (DM heard what she thought was Kaylee playing with the dog in the PCA) and Ethan started upstairs to check out the noise and BK came after him emboldened with knife raised & chased him into Xana's room.
• BK killed them both.

JMO

I think this will turn out to be totally random. It was “targeted” because the back of the house sat open to a dark parking lot, the perfect site for BK to stalk from. With all of those windows on the back of the house, he could easily see that it was home to a bunch of young women, and this is what he wanted, imo. A kill that was not too difficult.