ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 16

[Lalalacasbah]

Let's think about the kind of confidence that it takes to go inside of a house in the early morning to kill a whole bunch of people in the dark, in their beds.

The perp is going to have confidence to get to the scene undetected and that confidence is going to match the confidence it takes to enter the house to do the crime.

I agree. One thought I do have though is the perp could have confidence but also might not care - a gamble in a way.

I have to wonder if the killer was at all feeling "what have I got to lose?" If feeling lost in life and maybe even dabbling with self harm but then decided to do a 'mass' thing and take it out on others he resents instead of himself, see if that helps him feel better.

He cares enough to not want to go jail but didn't mind the gamble either.

 

[IceCreamSundae]

Another thing we don’t know is the time from injury to death for each victim. I have to remind myself that just because it was a bloody scene doesn’t mean they died quickly. I hope for their sake they did but it could’ve been minutes or hours.

KG’s father said in most recent interview that the wounds were such that they (or at least she, since I’m not sure he’d be privy to any autopsy other than his own daughter’s) would have died quickly and not suffered.

 

[Nudgee]

First post & I’ve lurked from the beginning. (I like to be fully informed.) What a horrific tragedy. I can’t get it out of my mind. It’s one of my worst fears. My daughter also is involved with Greek life & resides off campus. (Not in Idaho)

I think Kaylee, Maddie or both were the targets. I don’t think the perp had a hard time seeing as they had fairy/led lights all over the house. I believe he entered from the sliding door & went to the 3rd floor, knowing that was Kaylee’s room as u could see in the windows. I think Ethan & Xana heard something, he went to investigate & encountered the killer. Then he attacked Xana. I tend to think he wasn’t aware of the 2 on the bottom floor. It doesn’t seem a frenzied killer would be charitable in that way, letting them live. Of course idk for sure & the surviving girls haven’t spoken to anyone to verify events.

I’m not sure about 3-4 am either. K&M were making calls until nearly 3 & unless they passed out immediately, I tend to lean more toward 4-5. ‍

Excellent theories & comments from all. Love this community.

I agree with what you are saying. It’s been my thought since I started following this case. As for the 2nd floor other bedroom, I tend to think it was a vacant room & either the perp knew this or the room door was open and he/she could see it was vacant based on lighting in the house. Or the girls used it as extra room for socializing and not as a bedroom.

I also agree with your comment regarding the excellent theories and comments you read here on WS.…you never know just where that one thing that breaks a case will come from.

 

[dgfred]

I don't know how somebody reasonably thinks that there would not be a male sleeping over on a saturday night in a house like that. I wonder how often he'd sleep over. Apparently e and x were going out for awhile.

If it was a spontaneous attack how would the attacker have any idea of that?

Someone stalking may would have an idea. It seems to me since one victim was likely out of their room... that victim was likely a surprise.

All IMO tho

 

[priyaya]

Blood is what I’m thinking, If there are 2 types of blood in the girls room and if there are 3 types in E&X’s room it would seem that sample would be the killer.

Jmo

yes, I had heard they can sort out the blood types and try to rule that out, but the sequencing of the death with one blade means they have to also figure out the order.
but blood is all mixed up which is 'comingling' of DNA... the blood isn't going to be able to show who the killer is.. it may help rule out people, but its still very questionable given the mixing whos goes with whos if they are all like o positive or again the killer didnt bleed., which is entirely possible.
The best bet would be fingernail clipping from the victims with defense wounds hoping they got some DNA

 

[whirrledpeas]

In the Eliza Fletcher case in memphis this past September it was back within hours.

In this case, I think if they have the perp’s DNA, it’s in a mixed sample and that can take a very long time. An expert posted the process a few threads ago.

They have tons of DNA; they just have to organize and process so much because of the number of pieces of evidence collected

 

[Father Dowling]

1. Its a college lease and the end of the semester. In theory before K moved out only one bedroom was open. Landlords in college towns know how to do rent out whats best. you have people on different credits or study abroad. I dont know why people keep asking about cost of everything has nothing to do with the case
2. Sororities go on probation all the time. Im not sure it has anything to do with the case, but usually its a hazing violation or a party where someone has to go to the hospital. It may also be just to suspend all greek activities which I've seen happen when any police get involved. I think this also protects them.
3. X and K can drop out as upper classmen and still get to party. there's no need to be in the sorority and discuss next year when you are on your way out. it can also be expensive and time consuming when you are like trying to get a job out of school
<modsnip>
5. E +X may have been at any number of parties, maybe they made dinner by a fire, who knows, but they must have been together if no one else saw them. not that weird, just a couple on a date
6. Ethan did no live in the house and neither did Kaylee so at this point we should accept it as literally they didnt live there and it was their bed.
7.yes no forced entry, sliding door was most likely still open because right by all the frats and communal house
8, we had thanksgiving in there, but yeah months and most likely there in nothing in a toxicology report other than they were drunk and maybe a little high possibly.
9. Dogs like people are very different... the dog needs to be stopped being discussed as any part of this. I assume it was out on the balcony where the dog beds were and wasnt a barker/was used to party and late night people in and out

Yes, one can find answers to all questions of this case individually, except “who murdered the victims”. In my experience, there are no coincidences, particularly when you view the LE statements through the lens of “how would they wordsmith to fit their agenda” and ”why are they choosing to be specific about certain aspects and vague about others.”

 

[Emerald1328]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1597682998203527170

Sigh.

To be fair, I don’t think they would say they have a name they aren’t revealing if they did have one, but that’s discouraging to hear.

 

[archisleuth]

If there really is no POI, wouldn’t they release some new info to see if they can generate more leads?
Also, just because they say they aren’t withholding a POI doesn’t mean they aren’t still looking at someone or multiple people and just don’t yet have the evidence to back up officially making them a POI.

I’m holding out hope that they are onto something.

 

[CaneDubs]

JMO If he’s local he’ll be there. I imagine killers get off on stuff like that. He won’t be able to help himself. If he could, he wouldn’t murder in the first place. It’s that urge that controls them.

Agree. I think he would have a strong compulsion to be on top of what people know and are talking about and would not miss that opportunity. MOO

 

[whirrledpeas]

How do you know? Do you have a link to that?

I posted last night/early this morning about it on the last thread. Coroner didn’t arrive on scene until 5pm that day and when she was asked about approximate time of death, she said she couldn’t know because so much time had passed.

I suspect that they may have forgone her coming in to do benchmarks to preserve the integrity of the crime scene. MOO

 

[cottonweaver]

Unfortunately, they didn’t do that in this case.

Do you know that no CSI took victims' body temperature at scene? ( One of the links explains what CSI does in field and how temperature is taken again after body is transported for examination)

Are Moscow police that different to others?

edited to add:

have already seen your reply thanks whiirledpeas

Just to note that the Coroner( an elected official) wouldn't take any temperatures in any case, as she's not qualified to do it - she orders investigations, doesn't perform them herself. I heard her interview too and yes she explained that LE didn't want another person on the scene

 

[priyaya]

Yes, one can find answers to all questions of this case individually, except “who murdered the victims”. In my experience, there are no coincidences, particularly when you view the LE statements through the lens of “how would they wordsmith to fit their agenda” and ”why are they choosing to be specific about certain aspects and vague about others.”

can you be more specific?

 

[stayclassy]

100%! My daughter was here for Turkey Day & she had the “find my friends” set to “on” in social media. Not thrilled but she said they all do. I understand Maddie & Kaylee had that as well. I’ll have to look for the article.

This is so good, and modern thinking, as opposed to old fashioned creeping/lurking...

I know for sure two social apps have this function. The killer would just need consult his/her app to see that the girls had both safely arrived home AND if he/she was also friends with the boyfriends of both upstairs girls he would see their locations as well and know they were alone this particular evening!

 

[JaimeInLA]

I think it is possible he took a shower at the home before he left. Especially if he was comfortable and had been there before.

The longer this goes on without any camera footage, foot prints, blood, trail, scent, trail, etc., I’m starting to think he never left the house.

New theory: he was a sleepover guest of one of the downstairs roommates. Casually rinsed off, hid the knife, climbed back into bed with her, and was there when 911 was called. Never even went outside until after noon.

 

[GRT]

The timing of the crime late Saturday/early Sunday makes me think the perp has a day job during the week. But, he could stay out late on Saturday night and sleep during the day on Sunday. JMOO

 

[JosephineRobert]

The fact that LE state they don’t have a POI points to a ’stranger’ to me. Someone local and aware of the victims but not someone they would have necessarily been aware of. Someone who has an escalating level of crime/violence but not anything that would’ve got them arrested yet (peeping tom/voyeur/domestic abuse/animal abuse).

I think if you have it in you to do something like this, the practicalities of if people are awake, is there a dog there, what if there are more people than I think, don’t come in to it. It’s a compulsion and while the perp may have thought about various scenarios and planned to an extent when they got going it was just adrenaline and luck.

From the survivors point of view I think the things that seem odd actually aren’t when you frame them in the context of young people who were very drunk. In my uni days after a big night out I would’ve passed out and not heard anything and if I’d woken up, very hungover, and been faced with the crime scene I can imagine it would’ve taken me a while to realise the severity, call the police etc.

My worry is that in a lot of stranger cases it’s luck that gets a lead, and if LE don’t get lucky this could take a while.

 

[ktm44]

Unfortunately, they didn’t do that in this case.

I don't believe that you can say that with any degree of certainty. I would consider it a routine part of an autopsy, used to extablish a realistic time of death but it isn't something that would be shared with the general public.

 

[SRWCF]

Could E and X have been the sorority based designated drivers and that's what they were doing during the blank hours? In which case, they weren't somewhere, they were everywhere.

it would fill in the gap.

Probably no one's favorite assignment either. Like KP duty. A way to earn back privilege?

JMO

This missing timeline of Ethan and Xana could likely answer a lot of questions about this crime.

 

[accordn2me]

How they knew where the girls lived though leaves me stumped..

Do you know if the photos they posted of themselves on social media contained a geolocation tag embedded? I think you can click on the photo and get a selection box that contains the location where the photo was taken. It maybe even drops a pin on a map....