ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 36

[annpats]

Something I noticed watching that bodycam footage... At the very beginning, the first officer on the scene is seemingly narrating the video.

Stop and watch.
Gotta wait for them to get up here anyway.
This is where we can stop, observe what's going on, see if there's any other activity we need to be aware of.
Now let's go make contact.

That just struck me as odd. I wonder if officers are beginning to treat bodycams as home videos, or some sort of performance art.

Or perhaps they give a running commentary to justify reasons for their decisions if it's ever played back by senior LE or in a court room....?

 

[Shamrock1]

IMO gag orders are administered at trial? Correct if wrong

Pending criminal prosecution. Idaho crim law isn’t my area so JMO. gag order

 

[drmrgrl]

Not a fact as far as I know, but if he said he thought he would marry her and she's moving to Texas, I suspect she was the one moving on.

IMO, perhaps J was with a new woman that night and didn’t want to say that, so he just came up with the “ I was home asleep” alibi to save face

 

[10ofRods]

Agree.

The assailant could be young, healthy, and possibly athletic. That was the victims' scene. At that age, one can run on pure adrenaline for a couple of days w/o sleep.

But not with improved judgment. Please remember that such a situation results in increasingly poor decision making. People can do this at many ages, but yes, young people may seek out this experience. Still, many of these functioning high adrenalin people who go for a couple of days without sleep are using, at the least, caffeine.

In short, running on pure adrenalin is not ordinary brain chemistry and often results in what I think of as minor brain dysfunction (including falling asleep at the wheel, despite having been hyper just 1-2 minutes before). Fugue states are more common.

with the additional bonus: he may not have been alone, so he'd be dragging someone else into it potentially as well. imo jmo

is it fact that she broke up with him or is that the assumption? IDK, so asking.

It's in the NY Times coverage. Her mother has talked about it on News Nation.

It's one of the things we can actually talk about here, as it's in MSM:

Parents of Idaho university murder victim vow ex-boyfriend's innocence in case: 'We stand behind Jack 1000%'

The parents of slain Idaho college student, Kaylee Goncalves, spoke out on 'Lawrence Jones Cross Country,' maintaining their daughter's ex-boyfriend's innocence in the case.

www.foxnews.com

Idaho Murders: What We Know

A man who was studying for a Ph.D. at a nearby university is charged in the stabbing deaths of four University of Idaho undergraduates. Many questions remain.

www.nytimes.com

Just two examples. It is not an assumption and both the sister and the mother have said it and keep mentioning it.

Now we also have the same fact (they were broken up) from one of his relatives and she says the break-up was recent (3 weeks before the murders).

Exclusive | Vilified ex-boyfriend of slain Idaho student Kaylee Goncalves is devastated: family

Speaking publicly for the first time, Brooke Miller said that her nephew, Jack DuCoeur, is devastated by Kaylee Goncalves’ murder.

nypost.com

 

[Stephen2022]

Not necessarily. They could still go into work later that morning. Commit killing at 03.00hrs - 04.00hrs, then church doesn't start until 08.00hrs or later.
That's enough time to get cleaned up and pretend like nothing happened. They'd be a bit tired, but could still get through the day.

MOO.

Yes that works if killer had no visible injuries scratches or cuts as most likely someone who saw that would have reported it. So he stayed hidden still and is a loner that lives far in outskirts of town that is not seen by neighbors much, and bolted out of area. If he lived close and had visible injuries that would most likely have been reported by witnesses and interviewed by police and not been a secret in that community. So to take this long before an arrest the killer if in and around others had to have been lucky and not be harmed or marked and was able to discard bloody clothing, and keep a secret he owned a large knife.
It is possible LE knows who it is but is awaiting dna and crime lab results. I doubt that they would wait due to risk of leaving a dangerous person out in public. Most likely no suspect yet.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

if he said he thought he would marry her

IMO that it's important to remember he said this after she'd been brutally murdered. I'd imagine that tilts things a bit JMO. This must be surreal for him. JMO.

 

[annpats]

He could have been with one of the unharmed roommates.

But weren't their doors locked? Would you keep someone else's dog in your bedroom while you slept in there at night? And lock the door?

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

But not with improved judgment. Please remember that such a situation results in increasingly poor decision making. People can do this at many ages, but yes, young people may seek out this experience. Still, many of these functioning high adrenalin people who go for a couple of days without sleep are using, at the least, caffeine.

In short, running on pure adrenalin is not ordinary brain chemistry and often results in what I think of as minor brain dysfunction (including falling asleep at the wheel, despite having been hyper just 1-2 minutes before). Fugue states are more common.

It's in the NY Times coverage. Her mother has talked about it on News Nation.

It's one of the things we can actually talk about here, as it's in MSM:

Parents of Idaho university murder victim vow ex-boyfriend's innocence in case: 'We stand behind Jack 1000%'

The parents of slain Idaho college student, Kaylee Goncalves, spoke out on 'Lawrence Jones Cross Country,' maintaining their daughter's ex-boyfriend's innocence in the case.

www.foxnews.com

Idaho Murders: What We Know

A man who was studying for a Ph.D. at a nearby university is charged in the stabbing deaths of four University of Idaho undergraduates. Many questions remain.

www.nytimes.com

Just two examples. It is not an assumption and both the sister and the mother have said it and keep mentioning it.

Now we also have the same fact (they were broken up) from one of his relatives and she says the break-up was recent (3 weeks before the murders).

Exclusive | Vilified ex-boyfriend of slain Idaho student Kaylee Goncalves is devastated: family

Speaking publicly for the first time, Brooke Miller said that her nephew, Jack DuCoeur, is devastated by Kaylee Goncalves’ murder.

nypost.com

I knew they had broken up, but didn't know she had done it. I see it in the ny post article. (can't open the NYT one). Thanks! edited b/c I messed it up the first time

 

[10ofRods]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> ... men, all over the world, go right ahead and kill their wives, girlfriends and lovers even though it's well known that the intimate partner will be a main suspect?

Women, btw, are more likely to kill their own children. When a child disappears or is murdered, the mother comes under intense scrutiny (especially if child is under 4). As the child gets older, the father becomes an equally likely suspect.

But parents do kill their children.

We are not dealing with an ordinary person here. This is not a normal person. This person killed 4 people while they were in their rooms, in their beds. With a fixed blade knife. And apparently left very little blood trail outside (judging from evidence markers).

KNOWING that one is going to be suspected is not a deterrent in these kinds of crimes. I don't see how the phone calls figure in, one way or another. Being brazen is a feature of all of the people who kill in this manner. Whether they are ever convicted or not (Ms. Anthony, I'm looking at you).

<modsnip>

 

[Ozoner]

Yes, a lot of us have had break-ups. However, when looking at the study of crime, we look at statistical factors associated with violent crime. And some of us have had break-ups go down really badly, as most women have had.

If "break-up" is not a direct motive, why is that one of the most dangerous times in a woman's life? Trying to break up is probably the number one risk factor for being murdered, as a woman. Second is, sadly, being pregnant (many places). Holidays seem to trigger both sexes to kill. Statistically speaking. Alcohol makes everything worse, of course (and there are many other correlations on this overall pattern).

In my opinion, this was not a break up or a case where one of the victims tried to leave an abusive boyfriend. There is no evidence pointing to either of those scenarios.

Whoever did this was probably not capable of maintaining a relationship in the first place. This could be someone who fantasized a relationship with one of the women and then retaliated when reality smacked fantasy in the face and she rejected him unequivocally.

To me it seems like revenge for some kind of narcissistic injury. Perhaps one of the girls laughed at an awkward male who approached her that night. The perp need not have been someone who had interacted with any of the victims over a long period of time.

“Narcissists suffer from what the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders defines as narcissistic injury:

‘... vulnerability in self-esteem which makes narcissistic people very sensitive to ‘injury’ from criticism or defeat. Although they may not show it outwardly, criticism may haunt these individuals and may leave them feeling humiliated, degraded, hollow and empty. They react with disdain, rage, or defiant counterattack.’”

Source: The Destructive Force of Narcissistic Injury

 

[NuttMegg]

But weren't their doors locked? Would you keep someone else's dog in your bedroom while you slept in there at night? And lock the door?

1. We don't know, but probably yes. 2. Yes I would take a beloved house dog into my bedroom if it wanted to come in, I have 2 with me as I speak. I can't imagine crating a dog unless a trip to the vet is in order.
3. If one of those 1st floor bedrooms were mine, I would always lock the door.
But, as I suggested, if the dog was hiding in the bathroom, and if I had to go, that means I would have to unlock the bedroom door.

 

[taylorss]

I am curious if the general consensus is that one person alone carried out the attack ?
Idk what to think ..
it seems like so much work for just one person IMO and also at the same time too much hate to be shared as motive JMO

Unless it is some kind of hate crime or “statement” ….. ? like a knife version of our now-routine mass shootings
Strange
MOO

 

[NuttMegg]

I am curious if the general consensus is that one person alone carried out the attack ?
Idk what to think ..
it seems like so much work for just one person IMO and also at the same time too much hate to be shared as motive JMO

Unless it is some kind of hate crime or “statement” ….. ? like a knife version of our now-routine mass shootings
Strange
MOO

One, imo.

 

[Lamima]

One, imo.

Agreed

 

[drmrgrl]

WADR....


The police have not said he is cleared. They said they do not believe he and some others are involved. That is an open ended statement and it also could be a lie. They may think it's someone on their list but don't want them to know that. We don't know.

Also I understand that he does not have to give anyone an alibi or answer any questions, including the police's btw. He does so voluntarily until he is arrested.

If you want to point out that it's unfair that he is in the position of being asked to explain his whereabouts because of the circumstances, I can agree with that.

However telling people it's none of their business isn't really true. This crime is of public interest and the details surrounding it are also public interest. That includes his relationship with the victims and his actions that night. I don't think anyone would tell people to stop asking about the murders because it's none of their business.

JMO

When this murder first happened, I will freely admit that JD was the first person that popped into my head- means, motive, opportunity, proximity etc. what I have come to learn over the last six weeks is that sometimes things are not the way that they appear, especially on the surface IMO. I believe that there is something that does not add up in this case, thereby, one needs to take a deeper look.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

1. We don't know, but probably yes. 2. Yes I would take a beloved house dog into my bedroom if it wanted to come in, I have 2 with me as I speak. I can't imagine crating a dog unless a trip to the vet is in order.
3. If one of those 1st floor bedrooms were mine, I would always lock the door.
But, as I suggested, if the dog was hiding in the bathroom, and if I had to go, that means I would have to unlock the bedroom door.

As a former big dog person (rainbow bridge ) I did crate train my big dogs as pups, and they used their crates for R&R, but were always with me and slept with me - crates weren't jail time. As a former big dog person, IMO & JMO I can foresee a situation where Murphy could have ended up alone in K's bedroom with the door shut. Potentially. If she put him in there and told him to go to his bed (or whatever training terms she used), and then she went into M's bedroom to call J and then she and M drifted off while waiting for J to call back, then that would explain it. IMO JMO.
And heck yeah on locking those doors!

 

[NuttMegg]

As a former big dog person (rainbow bridge ) I did crate train my big dogs as pups, and they used their crates for R&R, but were always with me and slept with me - crates weren't jail time. As a former big dog person, IMO & JMO I can foresee a situation where Murphy could have ended up alone in K's bedroom with the door shut. Potentially. If she put him in there and told him to go to his bed (or whatever training terms she used), and then she went into M's bedroom to call J and then she and M drifted off while waiting for J to call back, then that would explain it. IMO JMO.
And heck yeah on locking those doors!

I shouldn't diss crating, but living alone and with a big yard, and in a very sunny, warm area, there just is not a need for it. I just took a poll, both said "no way, Mom"

But my other post was in the discussion re which area not related to the murder Murphy might have been in. I think it's probably like you say, K's room, but he could have been traumatized and slunk down to the 1st floor.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

When this murder first happened, I will freely admit that JD was the first person that popped into my head- means, motive, opportunity, proximity etc. what I have come to learn over the last six weeks is that sometimes things are not the way that they appear, especially on the surface IMO. I believe that there is something that does not add up in this case, thereby, one needs to take a deeper look.

I never thought it, but that's just mostly gut reaction (normally, ex bf would be my go-to, just not in this case) BUT IMO JMO the thing that I'd have done if I were the killer and I'd gotten all those phone calls, I'd have returned them in the middle of the night, and said I just woke up, saw the calls, called her back, yada yada. IIRC that was a total Chris Watts move (among many others -- call so as not to look guilty). Not returning the calls looks far less guilty, to me, but again JMO

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

I shouldn't diss crating, but living alone and with a big yard, and in a very sunny, warm area, there just is not a need for it. I just took a poll, both said "no way, Mom"

IME it's very handy for big dog training, and of course, if i put them in a yard alone, they thought it was punishment. they needed 'together' time 24/7. Our pack was slightly dysfunctional lol.

But in whatever way Murphy was trained, it's a reasonable scenario that could explain him in a different room.

 

[drmrgrl]

One, imo.

One, MOO. Hiding in plain sight.